Ask Us Anything: Chloe Redmond Warner on establishing processes that fit your firm

Summary

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Trade Tales: Ask Us Anything—Chloe Redmond Warner on Establishing Processes That Fit Your Firm

Podcast: Trade Tales
Host: Kaitlin Petersen (Business of Home, Editor in Chief)
Guest: Chloe Redmond Warner (Interior Designer, Author)
Date: March 18, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode of Trade Tales, host Kaitlin Petersen opens the floor to a candid conversation about finding the right operational structure for your interior design practice. Prompted by a listener’s concerns about her own flexible, client-driven workflow, the central theme explores how establishing robust processes can foster creativity, preserve professionalism, and earn clients’ trust. Special guest designer Chloe Redmond Warner—who rebuilt her own firm’s operations after nearing burnout—shares practical advice on building systems that fit not just the firm, but the designer’s character and creative goals.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Why Structure Matters

• Listener’s Dilemma:

  • A designer questions her ad hoc approach, noting that tailoring each project to client needs often feels inefficient and potentially unprofessional, despite her intentions to be accommodating.
  • Quote: “One of my fears is that my process could come off as maybe confusing or disorganized.” — Listener, [01:45]

• Chloe’s Perspective:

  • Structure is fundamental both for clients’ confidence and a designer’s ability to focus energy where it matters most.
  • Customization remains important, but too much flexibility can lead to wasted time and decision fatigue for both designer and client.

2. Chloe Redmond Warner’s Process Evolution

• Learning From Burnout:

  • After reaching burnout, Chloe completely overhauled her firm's systems—tightening protocols not as a constraint, but as a means to unlock more creative stamina and preserve her team’s and her own well-being.
  • Quote: “Tightening up her firm’s process was actually the best way to preserve her own time and creative energy.” — Kaitlin Petersen [03:30]

• Process Foundations:

  • Chloe’s approach centers on limiting choices: two distinct conceptual paths rather than endless options.
  • She sets the stage with a “style guide”—a mood board informed by client interviews, architectural context, and sometimes even a custom playlist for atmospheric inspiration.
    • Quote: “I personally love one or two micro choices between amazing options. Like, I feel oppressed by no options, and I feel beat down by too many.” — Chloe, [10:02]

3. Process in Practice: From Onboarding to Presentation

• Style Guide as North Star:

  • The first deliverable is a style guide that sets a project’s mood and direction but is not for decision-making—usually circulated FYI to the client ([14:14]).
  • Playlists are occasionally included to support the mood ([12:13]).

• Client Touchpoints:

  • Chloe’s team limits direct meetings: after the initial kickoff, the next in-person meeting is a presentation of two distinct palettes and key furniture pieces ([14:48]).
  • Feedback is incorporated, then a single, fully developed scheme is presented.
  • Internal reviews within Chloe's team ensure presentations are clear, digestible, and tailored—“the process we do in the office is changing two good options into two different options.” ([23:14])

• Three-Stage Meeting Structure:

  • 1. Choices: Present two distinct directions
  • 2. Final Solution: Present the selected scheme, fully fleshed out
  • 3. Value Engineering: Collaboratively trim the final scheme as needed to meet the budget ([19:53])
    • Chloe: “You’ve made all your beautiful choices and they add up... You gotta trim some fat.” ([20:48])

4. Balancing Flexibility and Authority

• The Responsive vs. Dictator Spectrum:

  • Designers must find their place—total control isn’t always best, nor is full client-led flexibility.
  • Chloe favors offering guided choice, seeing the designer’s role as “a clear and safe and fun bridge” rather than a “meandering path through a meadow.” ([16:06]-[17:36])
  • Quote: “The value that interiors give in this world where there’s now infinite choice... is clarity and taste and the edit.” — Chloe, [17:16]

• Communicating Clarity and Confidence:

  • Chloe prefers to “telegraph clarity” over confidence, embracing honest enthusiasm and flexibility over rigidity.
  • Quote: “There’s not just one way to do it well... the minute you’re like, I’m so confident that this is right, is when you kind of shut that collaboration down.” — Chloe, [25:12]

5. Money Conversations & Buying Process

• Presenting Holistically vs. Piece-by-Piece:
  • Presenting an entire scheme at once (rather than item by item) allows for budgeting and purchasing all at once but requires upfront conversations about the total spend ([21:20]).
  • Chloe observes that a piecemeal “breadcrumb” approach may ultimately cost more and provide less design cohesion.

6. Internal Processes for Accountability

• Team Collaboration:
  • The team stages mock presentations to each other, refining clarity and distinction in options ([23:14]).
  • Constant search for inspiration is channeled into “personal baskets” for future projects, preventing project scope creep ([24:17]).

7. Evolving Client Relationships

• From Involved to Delegated:
  • Over the years, Chloe noted clients became less involved, shifted by demographic and budget changes—moving from clients needing hand-holding to clients seeking results with minimal time investment ([30:35]-[31:06]).
  • Initially, this was disheartening, but ultimately freeing: “A lot of my clients are really fun and funny... but a lot just don’t care, and that’s fine. I realize now I have friends for that.” — Chloe [31:41]

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Memorable Quotes & Moments

• On Overwhelm and Decision Fatigue:

  • “I feel oppressed by no options, and I feel beat down by too many.” — Chloe Redmond Warner, [10:02]

• On Systemizing Value:

  • “The value that interiors give in this world where there's now infinite choice... is clarity and taste and the edit.” — Chloe, [17:16]

• On Collaboration vs. Dictatorship:

  • “The minute you’re like, ‘I’m so confident that this is right,’ is when you shut that collaboration down.” — Chloe, [25:12]

• On Client Touchpoints:

  • “When we started... clients wanted to be more involved. In the second half of my practice, clients are relieved to know things are moving forward without a big ask on their time.” — Chloe, [30:35]

• Advice on Inspiration Overload:

  • “You can't put everything into the project you're working on.” — Chloe, [24:30]

• Personal Wisdom:

  • “Make it count.” (Advice on prioritizing family time during your kids’ high school years.) — Chloe, [33:36]

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• 00:04–01:25 — Kaitlin frames the episode and introduces the listener’s dilemma
• 04:54–08:48 — Chloe’s journey: book writing, previous burnout, process shifts
• 10:02–13:54 — Chloe’s client presentation process and limiting choices
• 14:14–15:26 — Style guide creation, playbooks, and first meeting with clients
• 19:53–21:49 — Setting timelines, meeting structure, and value engineering explained
• 23:14–24:17 — Internal reviews, creating legible presentations, and option distinctiveness
• 25:12–26:46 — Clarity vs. confidence discussion
• 27:00–29:43 — Project example: balancing multiple client aesthetics, finding a unifying thread
• 30:35–33:36 — Evolving client relationships, personal advice, and maintaining balance

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Takeaways & Actionable Advice

• Establish clear, repeatable processes—but allow for (and clearly define) points of flexibility to keep your work both efficient and personal.
• Limit client options—all proposals should be well-considered, distinct, and curated to avoid decision fatigue for both client and designer.
• Communicate project roadmaps to clients from the outset, including key meetings and expected decision points.
• Internally, rehearse and refine presentations to guarantee clarity, cohesion, and confidence in what’s presented.
• Hold space for your own creative inspiration, but avoid overloading a single project—save good discoveries for later.
• Recognize that different clients want different degrees of involvement; adapt communication but stick to a process that allows the project (and your time) to be respected.
• Don’t confuse clarity with egotism—enthusiastic, open collaboration often achieves the best results.

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Closing Thought

Chloe’s experience demonstrates that a well-designed process is not a creative straightjacket, but rather a foundation for both better work and a healthier, more sustainable business. As firms grow and change, so too should their processes—while always keeping client clarity and designer well-being front and center.

Transcript

[Caitlin Peterson]

Hi, I'm Caitlin Peterson, the editor in chief of Business at Home. Welcome to Ask Us Anything where we're tapping your favorite Trade Tales guests to answer all of your questions about building a better design business. Some weeks we'll be workshopping a crisis. In others, we'll take a step back to talk about the big picture. Things like embracing change, hiring, or how to level up. No question is out of bounds. No question is large or too small. And we're keeping it confidential so that this is always a safe space to air your frustrations and share your fears. This week we're hearing from a designer who was in the audience for a panel that I hosted last fall. The topic was about how to structure the design process. And when one of the panelists explained her client workflow, our question asker was shocked by just how much structure there was. Months later, she's still thinking about it, and she recently reached out to talk.

[Question Asker / Designer]

I was like, oh, my gosh, somebody's finally talking about it. Because in all the podcasts that I listen to, nobody really talks about that part of our business. When you've acquired the client and you've done your whole onboarding process, then what?

[Caitlin Peterson]

Our question asker doesn't have a standard operating procedure. And for her first decade in business, she's seen that flexibility as an asset because it allowed her to tailor her approach to each client. But now she's wondering if stronger systems could lend her firm a greater sense of professionalism.

[Question Asker / Designer]

I've known forever that my process is a little. It's a little looser because in my opinion, there are so many different clients out there, so many different types of clients, so many different types of projects. And then working in New York, most clients have full time jobs. And so I feel like I'm personalizing my process to their needs, but I don't feel like that that's the best way to go about it at all times. One of my fears is that my process could come off as maybe confusing or disorganized.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Okay.

[Question Asker / Designer]

I'm not a disorganized person. It's just how I work. Yeah.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Yeah.

[Question Asker / Designer]

And I also feel like I waste a lot of time.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Yours or the clients, mostly mine.

[Question Asker / Designer]

But it could be both because I search too much. I'm always looking for more. As you know, there's so much out there.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

There is.

[Question Asker / Designer]

And just when you think you've seen it all, you read an editorial in El Decor or, you know, cottages and Gardens or whatever it is, and you're like, oh, oh, I hadn't I've never heard of that website or I didn't think about reaching out to them about this and that. I'm not a loopy person and I don't want to come off that way. And again, you know, when you're dealing with professionals themselves, you don't want to come off as some flighty designer. I think having a system is really important. It's just finding the system that's unique to you and that works for all types of people.

[Caitlin Peterson]

One of the challenges of developing stronger systems is that it's hard to wrap your head around a different way of working while you're elbow deep in your current process. But in the months that have passed since that panel, our question asker can't stop pondering what a more hands off approach might mean for her business. As we ended our call, I knew

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

just who to connect with.

[Caitlin Peterson]

Someone who discovered that tightening up her firm's process was actually the best way to preserve her own time and creative energy. All that and more in just a moment. Today's question is all about strengthening your firm's process, but it's also all about trust. It's about the client's confidence in your recommendations as well as your confidence in the direction of the project to find the furnishings that bring your ideas to life. It's time to start shopping at Fourance. With thousands of products in its catalog, including more than 500 new arrivals across living room, dining room, bedroom, office bath and outdoor, fourhands offers solutions for every corner of your floor plan with pieces featuring the kind of thoughtful, unexpected details clients fall for instantly. Find the perfect fit for your next [e-mail] trade deals today I'm joined by Chloe Redmond Warner as a guest on Trade Tales in 2024. She told a story of nearing complete burnout and how a dramatic overhaul of her firm's processes brought her back from the brink. I thought she'd be the perfect person to answer today's question.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Hello, thank you so much for joining me today, Trade Tales listeners. Heard from you here about a year and a half ago. How have you been?

[Guest Designer / Author]

I've been great. That was such a fun podcast to do and I feel like I got to talk about all of these plans I was making and now so many have come true. I moved my office, I wrote a book that's about to come out and yeah, it's funny to like be all those dreams came true. Boom.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

It's funny. A year and a half really is an interesting cadence to sort of look back and reflect cause It's. It's enough time to have seen something really come to fruition.

[Guest Designer / Author]

I mean, it's incredible. I feel like we. When we spoke, I had had a book proposal accepted, and that was a really fun achievement. And then what was ahead of me was actually the writing of the book and the. And the photographing and the designing of it. And I actually really loved. I loved that process. I was a little bit alarmed at how fast it went. You know, I signed the agreement in the summer, and then I turned it in about a year ago. So I feel like I only had eight months to do it all.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

And to say, this is who I am in a book.

[Guest Designer / Author]

And that was so interesting, too. Somebody was like, why did you do a book? And I was like, well, my inner baby was like, wah, wah. I want a book. I feel like I couldn't quite articulate it at the beginning. I just kind of felt this feeling that I needed to progress and that I had a ton of progress and I wanted to do something with them. And then it was through the process of writing, like, I wrote the book where I realized I had something that I wanted to say. And it was about, you know, interior design as a practice and how I think historically, it's been marginalized compared to architecture and even art in some way. And I think it might be my calling to lift up this beautiful profession and make it kind of get the respect that it deserves. So that was fun, to kind of, like, get some clarity around that. And now I'm like, oh, yeah, I'm not just a baby. I'm a baby with some ideas, some big ideas.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

So I've gotten to see the book. The book comes out in May. I've seen it. It is beautiful. It's a great read. You are sitting in a funny space about to let the world see this thing you've written. How are you feeling?

[Guest Designer / Author]

I'm psyched. I got a copy, like, a real copy, in my little pause last week, and I thought I was gonna. I was kind of surprised by how emotional I felt when I opened it, because it's not new to me. I'm familiar with the words. I feel like I've edited it many times. But, you know, working with Abrams, who is a professional, you know, a huge company, like, there's just sort of a. I think interior design has, like, a. A very civilized cadence. And I would hear from them, they'd be like, we need all of this back in three days. And I'd be like, oh, my God, I will die if I have to turn this around that fast. And that surprised me where I was like, wait, do they think that I'm not doing anything in this? Like, my days are very full. And like, it was that back and

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

forth around editing for stuff like, oh, could you write all the Captions to all 400 pictures in 3 days? In my experience making books, it was sometimes not a small ask.

[Guest Designer / Author]

That's exactly it. I'm like, that was 10 words that you described. But that, that is a full time job for two weeks to her credit. My editor warned me. She was like, don't leave this for last. And I was like, okay.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Yeah, the captions.

[Guest Designer / Author]

Yeah, the captions.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

The captions are killer. Yeah, I love that in some ways, you got to immerse yourself in, you know, a different kind of process and see what it's like to be the recipient of someone else's timeline. Um, I think that actually flows really well into what we're going to talk about today and the question that we have. So with that in mind, are you ready to give some advice?

[Guest Designer / Author]

I'm so ready.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Amazing. This week we are fielding a question from a designer who is looking for feedback on how to fine tune the presentation process. She's got a real, like, let's land on the rug, let's land on the this, let's land on the that kind of thing going right now. She kind of got a taste of seeing how some other designers present and I think has really been sitting with this idea that maybe there's a different way to organize the flow and the way that a client moves through her process. Can we start with your process? How has it evolved? How do you think about guiding a client through the design process?

[Guest Designer / Author]

I would say my process is based on, you know, what works for me and the psychology that I respond to. And I personally love one or two micro choices between amazing options. Like, I feel oppressed by no options, and I feel beat down by too many. Like, I am a person who believes I have 25 good decisions in any given day, and I would rather, you know, spread them out over the day and not have to, like, use them all during one design presentation. And so we in general present two packages and are able to talk about why they are different in kind of, like, meaningful ways. Like, this one is. This one will feel fancy and will give a sense of shock and awe. And this one will feel humble and will have, like, an understated grace that won't register to everybody. And then we will kind of talk about what feels more natural and then the Answer. Hopefully will present itself for the client.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

I want to back up for a second. How do you get to those presentations? You know, you've signed a client, you start to understand what they're looking for. They maybe fill out a questionnaire. You're interviewing them. How does that turn into design direction?

[Guest Designer / Author]

So our first step is to make a style guide, and that's informed. It's a pretty abstract document, informed by the house, I feel must be a consideration in the architecture, kind of what it is. If it has window. Like, wood windows or metal windows, if people lean a little bit modern or traditional, it's kind of like this idea of, like, what's the best, most appropriate thing we can get out of the house? What overlaps with the client's Pinterest? What do they respond to? You know, what is their fantasy of how they want to live? And we will make a style guide, which is, you know, a mood board.

[Caitlin Peterson]

It has music on it, right?

[Guest Designer / Author]

I do. I make a playlist to make the style guide. And so I feel like it usually has to do with kind of how old the clients are. And I'm like, what did you listen to when you were in college? And is that even, like, wanted? Like, it doesn't always.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Do you want to tap into that energy? Yeah.

[Guest Designer / Author]

Be like, do you want your house to feel like Bob Marley in the dorms? But there's something there, you know? Like, my parents played Dire Straits when they would have parties, and I. I'm like, oh, that's a good. There's something about that where I can build that into a little world. And sometimes I don't share it with clients because I'm like, they're not gonna.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

This isn't for everybody.

[Guest Designer / Author]

Yeah, this isn't gonna serve us. But it helps me to kind of, like, conjure the atmosphere, conjure the world. And I think because it is so abstract, I don't usually. There's not usually a lot of back and forth, and there's no decisions to be made unless the client is like, I genuinely hate that image. But I'm not giving them anything that they haven't that is, like, overly experimental. Like, I've researched what they like at this point, and I'm like, this is. I reflect it back to them through the lens of what's appropriate for the house. And so we establish that, and then from there, we do palettes, and I do two palettes for people, and then we do floor plans. Sometimes there's one floor plan that is definitely best, and if there's two Options, we'll show that, but we won't show infinite options. If you show infinite options, it makes it harder to get clarity at each phase.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

So you have a mood board, you're touching base with the client at that point to kind of get their feedback, to get more inputs for the palates you're reconnecting with the client, then to get their feedback, get their input. Is that right? Like at each sort of touch point, they get a chance to sort of interact with you and the creative process again.

[Guest Designer / Author]

So I issue a style guide and I issue it, I don't present it. It's kind of FYI, this is what we're using to move forward. And if it's a good playlist, I'll issue that as well. If it's not, I'll keep it, I'll keep it private. And then we don't, we don't meet again until we present those two options.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

So the intermediate steps are internal and more for you?

[Guest Designer / Author]

Yes.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Do the clients know that those steps are happening?

[Guest Designer / Author]

Yeah. So the first meeting would be pallets and key furniture. And so it's not every piece of furniture, but it's kind of the pieces that are going to have like the most visual weight and have, carry a lot of character and are kind of pulling the room together. And then the clients are giving feedback on those and then from there we will fill in based on what they seem to like, what they prefer. And then we'll give a full baked in one option based on that.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

I think one of the things that this question asker has really held onto tightly is this idea that, you know, she's a one person shop and I think that sort of texting, hey, like I have these couple options with her client. Is there, there's a, there's a joy or a sense of purpose sort of in that connectivity or in having them really be able to reflect back to her, their choices along the way. I love the way you're talking about sort of having a little bit of a check in before you present the whole house. And I wonder if there's a way to maybe give her what she's looking for with that approach as opposed to like doing it item by item by item.

[Guest Designer / Author]

I mean, what I heard in her voice and her question was like, you know, I can feel her angst and you can tell she cares so much about her job and that she just feels stuck between wanting to be responsive and wanting to be a little dictator and like wondering what's right. Yeah. And I actually, I think that's a good sign because I think it shows she cares what works for her clients. But then you pick up on that frustration where she's second guessing her edit and maybe she's feeling like her clients are second guessing her because she doesn't, you know, she's not projecting certainty. And it's interesting cause I was just listening to, you know, your other great podcast about Timothy Corrigan and Vicente and how like, Timothy Corrigan is like, so responsive and Vicente Wolf is so, so like dictatorial. Both can be legit. And I think you just kind of have to like, find it. Sounds like she hasn't found her sweet spot yet. And like, I think my take is like the value that interiors give in this world where there's now infinite choice and infinite access is clarity and taste and the edit. And I see our value as providing a clear and safe and fun bridge from point A to point B. And more of a bridge than a meandering path through a meadow.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

It is the most efficient route.

[Guest Designer / Author]

Exactly. And I feel like I know some designers who only give one bridge and that's like the Vicente Wolf model. And I was like, oh yeah, that does work if you have an aesthetic that's like super defined and people come to you for that. But I do think there's value in being responsive. And you know, in our case, we, we like to give two bridges in the beginning and then later on, you know, it's pretty much one bridge. And I think we're all like figuring out if we want to be responsive or be. I think she should, she should just try being a little bit more edited and clear and enjoy. Enjoy moving it forward. I think.

[Caitlin Peterson]

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[Chloe Redmond Warner]

How would you suggest that she start to tack in that direction. What work are you doing at the outset to really expect your clients to work your way? You know what I mean? Like what is set in stone because it is important for your process? And then where are you able to flex a little bit to accommodate the quirks of an individual client?

[Guest Designer / Author]

Oh, this is very interesting. We started issuing project schedules with an anticipated move in date, and once you work backward from that, your design phase window decides itself. And then you meet during that window, and you have to be ordering at a certain time in order to get things in, in 9 months or 18 months or however long your kind of production phase is. But you meet three times in that window, once with choices, once with a solution, and then once to value engineer, and then you just move it forward.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Talk to me about that third meeting. The value engineering.

[Guest Designer / Author]

It's everyone's favorite phase.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

I was gonna say that sounds like the fun one.

[Guest Designer / Author]

It's not my favorite phase, but often good things do happen here. And, you know, scrappy things happen. Yeah, it's not always terrible, but it always feels terrible as you're about to start it. It's just when you know you've made all your beautiful choices and they add up and, you know, you gotta. You gotta trim some fat and hopefully it's not too hard, but we. We always do it at least a little bit.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

One thing that's interesting to me about helping this designer potentially pivot to more of a, like, present all at once model, as opposed to sort of present one thing at a time, is that you're also pushing into a model where you're purchasing all at once. And that. That maybe has to change the way you talk to clients about money versus sort of like, okay, we bought this thing over here, we bought that thing over there. You know, they're a little bit more left to add things up on their own that way.

[Guest Designer / Author]

Yes.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Or to assess the value of each object by cost that way.

[Guest Designer / Author]

That is a very interesting point. And I think that people who kind of do more of like a breadcrumb approach, like following, following the trail, following their heart, probably end up spending more in the long run and probably avoid that value engineering phase as well. Because if you're just buying things that you love, as you love them, then great. I'm not sure why I landed on this. I think maybe the way you present in school is holistically, and I enjoy it. I enjoy creating a full world and a vision with drawings and elevations and renderings. And I think if you just do things, like, one bit at a time, you know, you deprive yourself of the opportunity to design a full room or a full house or full anything.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

What is the process behind the scenes? Right, because you have a process that is outward facing. The clients know what their touch points are, what the next deliverable will be. But what kind of process do you have internally to keep you accountable, but also to help you really move through these spaces that you need to design?

[Guest Designer / Author]

So my office has senior designers and junior designers, design assistants, and they're all very talented and wonderful. And we present to each other. You know, they present to me kind of rough drafts of things. I will mark things up, refine their presentation. I would say a lot of the work that we do together goes into making a presentation feel legible and digestible. And when we are giving multiple choices to make those choices distinct from each other. You know, one choice will be like Hansel and Gretel's cottage, and another will be like, this is Wes Anderson's bedroom. Like, they have to feel distinct in order to be. Be useful for anyone. And oftentimes I feel like the process that we do in the office is changing two good options into two different options.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

This designer talks a lot about that constant quest for new right that she kind of can't help herself, and she keeps searching. How do you decide when you're done and just turn off that curiosity for this project?

[Guest Designer / Author]

Oh, I mean, it's so wonderful that she has the appetite and things cross her eye. And I think that happens to me also. But they go into my personal basket. And I'm always, like, saving images and saving swatches, saving beautiful samples, and that is like, my sourdough starter for the next project. You can't put everything into the project you're working on.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

You know, you mentioned something earlier about really kind of telegraphing clarity and confidence to a client. How are you thinking about that as you guide a project through from start to finish?

[Guest Designer / Author]

I think I said clarity. I don't set out to broadcast confidence as much. I think I am excited about things, but. But I'm very aware that a lot of this world is subjective. And, like, I think in the beginning, I would be crushed if somebody was like, you know, I don't like navy blue. And I'd be like, what do you mean? And I would take it personally. And so, you know, it hasn't served me to be, like, overly confident. And instead, I do feel comfortable projecting, you know, honest enthusiasm. But it can always, if people feel a different way, like, that is okay. And I'm trying to think about, like, why I bristled against the word confidence. Maybe it's just because you, you know, you do this job long enough and you're like, there's not just one way to do it. Well, there are different ways. And what's fun is, like, being curious about the appropriate way for these clients, this house, these architects that you're working with, and figuring that out, and the minute you're like, I'm so confident that this is right, is when you kind of shut that collaboration down. And in a way that I don't think you shut it down. If you say, I'm so excited about this and are open to the idea that somebody might say, that's great, Chloe, but it's not quite right for this house.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Right, right, right.

[Guest Designer / Author]

And, you know, I think that's. Yeah, I think that's a more fun way to. To work, is to allow yourself to be excited but not get too locked in.

[Caitlin Peterson]

Talk to me about the Clarity piece.

[Guest Designer / Author]

Okay. I have a perfect example. We are doing a house. It's a beautiful shingle, traditional rambling house. And the clients have two different aesthetics. And the husband, like, loves really clean, modern, Bel Air, sexy Japanese architecture. And the wife loves kind of, like, soulful JD Blunk wood, Big Sur soulful architecture. And, like. And I was like, I don't know how we're going to be able to move this forward. Like, the three of you, the house, the husband and the wife, are not on the same page.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Somebody is going to be disappointed here.

[Guest Designer / Author]

Exactly. And, you know, we have a tight deadline. And I was just like, whoa, this is a huge challenge. And I feel like the value that we brought to this process is looking through, not kidding, like, 300 images that they have been saving in a shared folder with, you know, husband and wife contributing equally, and then the house itself. And so I was able, at some point to be like, okay, there is a thread here of English, like Cotswold's cottage. And it is defined by wood, windows, shingles, ceramic tile, running bond brick. So these ingredients that add up to a certain atmosphere. And then I pulled the images that were, you know, kind of the sexy Bel Air images. And I'm like, plaster everywhere, slabs everywhere, really limited palette, arches, swooping staircases. Like, beautiful, elegant. This would require touching every single part of your new shingle house that you bought. And then kind of this hybrid where I was like, there is refinement, and it's a little bit like maybe like a. A Danish house by the sea. There's a tiny bit of Cotswolds There's a color palette that's, like, pulled back a little bit, but kind of like these three paths, they were the images that they had. But I was like, you guys have to kind of choose one of these. And if it's going to be the plaster, metal window situation, it's expensive. Yeah. And you need to give us more time because these are the ingredients that you need to change if you want to insist on an aesthetic like this. And so just, like, the clarity of seeing what ingredients go into certain, like, final images, I think was useful for everybody.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Also, I want to know what they picked, but desperately, they.

[Guest Designer / Author]

I think they're. We're going with the. It's a hybrid that I didn't think of, but it's going to be okay. I think it is going to be really beautiful. And I think that they appreciated it. It felt really hard to grasp, I think, for everyone, the architect, me, the clients. And then now I think we have a handle on it, and, yeah, we can move it forward.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

We've talked a lot about getting a client sort of through the design phase, but how does that. That same sort of sense of clarity or that same sense of really moving someone through a process continue to show up in your relationship with that client through the end of the job?

[Guest Designer / Author]

When we. When we started, maybe the first half of the practice, clients were. Wanted to be more involved. And I feel like in the second half of my practice, clients are relieved to know that things are moving forward without a big ask on their time.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

How do you make that transition? Is that something you actively pursued? Is it something that just happens as budgets get bigger? What drives that shift for someone who wants to make it?

[Guest Designer / Author]

I don't know. I started noticing it, and I think that when I started my firm, I was in my 20s and my clients were younger. And it's happened as I've gotten older. And I think my clients are older and busier and more trusting, but it's not something that I even knew to look out for. I just sort of started noticing it, and at first my feelings were hurt. I was like, oh, my God. They don't even care to, like, flirt with me on email.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

That's amazing. And then at some point, was it freeing?

[Caitlin Peterson]

Like, is it a.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Is it a. Is that different way of working ultimately better for you creatively?

[Guest Designer / Author]

I think there are some things that are great. I do like to, you know, chop it up on email with people. And I'm like, some people just don't. Don't care. And that's fine. I realize that I have friends. I have friends for that. But a lot of my clients are really fun and funny, and so I do like it when I. When I get that. But I know now that, like, it's just like a little meerkat, like, popping up from its hole. It's like one little joke and then they'll go back down and I'll go back down, and then, you know, we'll meet again at the install.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Before we wrap up, I wanted to ask you, what is the best piece

[Caitlin Peterson]

of advice you've ever received?

[Guest Designer / Author]

I recently went on a retreat with my forum group, which is some colleagues that have become amazing friends. And the advice that we all like, as we left our retreat, we all gave and got one piece of advice from each other, which was, oh, I love that. Oh, it was wild. I thought it was going to be, like, superficial and, like, you should get

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

bangs, but it was like, that's some serious advice.

[Guest Designer / Author]

Actually, no, it was actually, like, incred. Incredibly profound. And every piece was amazing. And I've tried to, like, incorporate it, but the one that's jumping to the front of my mind is to, like, you know, prioritize your kids as they are in high school. And I have two high school kids, and it does feel all of a sudden like I'm going to blink and they will be in college. And I appreciated, you know, the women who have kids that are a few years older than mine are like, make it count.

[Caitlin Peterson]

That's our show for today.

[Chloe Redmond Warner]

Thank you so much for being here

[Caitlin Peterson]

and for everyone listening with a question of your own. I'd love for you to ask us anything. Don't worry, we'll keep it anonymous. Please start the conversation by sending me an [e-mail] if you're enjoying Trade Tales, please leave a review on Apple Podcasts to help others discover the show. And if you're looking for even more great business advice, head on over to businessofhome.com Trade Tales is produced by me, Kaitlyn Peterson and Caroline Burke. This episode was edited by Carolyn Burke and Michael Castaneda. Our theme music is by Kyle Scott Wilson. Thanks again for listening. Can I see you here next next week?