The Missing Scientists and the clue that nobody saw until now/ Plus two Law Enforcement Officers share their thoughts on the mystery

Summary

UFO Talker – Episode Summary

Episode Title: The Missing Scientists and the clue that nobody saw until now / Plus two Law Enforcement Officers share their thoughts on the mystery
Air Date: May 6, 2026
Host: Michael Ryan (B) with co-host Christine Scott (C)
Guests: Lynn Rule (D), Law Enforcement Officers Rick Prescott (G) and Rob Furlong (E)

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Episode Overview

This episode delves deep into the growing mystery of missing and suspiciously deceased scientists and military personnel—many of whom were working on advanced technology connected to anti-gravity and UFO research. Host Michael Ryan and Christine Scott explore recent cases, offer updates, and share a major potential clue connecting high-level research and unexplained events. The episode also features significant insights from two experienced law enforcement professionals, and the unique firsthand account from Lynn Rule, whose own UFO encounter uncovered a link between scientific research and real-world anomalies.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Podcast Announcement & Programming Notes

• YouTube Channel Launch: UFO Talker will launch a YouTube channel beginning in June, providing both full podcast episodes and new 10–15 minute “That Human Said What?” video shorts. (03:40–06:00)
• Listener Engagement: Listeners are encouraged to send ideas for short segments or to propose their own participation.

2. UFO Conferences & Events

• William Henry’s Non Human Intelligence Summit: Nashville, May 16, with Dr. Travis Taylor and Dr. Riz Verk.
• Red, White and Whoa UFO Festival: Annual event in Roswell, New Mexico, July 2–4. (08:40–10:38)

3. News: Earthquakes at Area 51

• Notably, 16 earthquakes and aftershocks have struck near Area 51—an area not usually associated with seismic events, leading to speculation about their origin and possible connection to secret activities at the site. (10:38–12:49)

4. Case Updates: Missing Scientists & Military Personnel

Notable Cases Discussed: (18:58–27:40)

• William McCaslin: No updates.
• Dr. Amy Eskridge & Monica Reza: No new developments. In Reza’s case, DNA is being tested from shoes found near her last known location.
• Monica Cassias: Family hired a private detective; possible evidence (shoes) undergoing DNA testing.
• New Additions:
  • Anthony Chavez – Retired Los Alamos National Laboratory; disappeared on foot, left personal items behind.
  • Steven Garcia – New Mexico government contractor, high-security nuclear role; also left all personal items except handgun.
  • Frank Maywald – JPL/NASA, died July 2024, with unexplained cause of death concealed.
• Pattern Identified: Multiple cases involve leaving behind phones, wallets, keys, and cars—a highly unusual commonality. (23:00–25:30)

5. Featured Case: Dr. Ning Li

• Background: Key researcher in anti-gravity and YBCO superconductor technology; vanished from public view ~2003 after a DoD grant.
• Later Found: Suffered brain injury in a 2014 car accident, lost ability to speak—later died after being cared for by her son.
• Clues Raised: Her classified work, her silence, and odd circumstances around her accident (potentially a classic method of covert murder, per declassified spy manuals). Chinese government interest noted. (27:41–35:39)
  • “Never ask me that question again and never wonder about what I'm doing or what I've ever done before.” – Dr. Ning Li to her son (32:55)

6. Major Clue: The Alloy Connection – Lynn Rule’s UFO Encounter

• Incident: In March 2023, Lynn had a close encounter in the Australian outback and later discovered unexplained copper barium dust on her vehicle—components of the YBCO alloy.
• Scientific Significance: This alloy does not naturally exist in Australia and is only industrially produced in a few locations worldwide.
• Link to Scientists: Many missing scientists, including Prof. Nuno Larrero, worked with YBCO and related anti-gravity research. (38:22–46:24)
  • “This alloy is kind of like a fingerprint, especially when it's in its alloy state, its manufactured state.” – Michael Ryan (41:00)
• Additional Oddity: Strange “spycraft-like” phone call to Lynn after her encounter, possibly indicating surveillance or sophisticated monitoring. (47:19–49:53)
  • “This is kind of a typical spycraft kind of a tool.” – Michael Ryan (49:53)

7. Law Enforcement Perspective

• Featuring: Rick Prescott and Rob Furlong (54:32–74:37)
• Key Points:
  • Pattern Recognition: Both agree the frequency and similarity of cases rules out coincidence. (55:19–56:22)
  • Investigation Gaps: Accidental deaths (falls, car crashes, poisonings) rarely trigger deeper background checks unless a specific pattern is noticed—a “God view” or eagle-eye perspective often missing on the local level. (58:20–59:37)
  • Case Analysis:
    • Noting unusual behaviors (leaving phones behind, taking guns) raises investigative red flags.
    • Multiple victims factory reset their phones prior to disappearance—highly suspicious behavior. (65:53–66:16)
  • Scientific Evidence: The unique alloy found on Lynn’s vehicle is potentially “as unique as you can get…basically a fingerprint.” (70:34–70:36)
• Notable Quote:
  • “This is incredibly significant…There’s absolutely no reason for that substance to be in Australia unless it got there from above.” – Rob Furlong (68:13)

8. International Dimension: China’s Missing Scientists

• Christine Scott: Reports at least nine Chinese scientists in cutting-edge fields (AI, hypersonics, space defense) have died in odd car accidents, “medical episodes,” or unexplained circumstances—often with no public cause of death. (77:11–82:13)
  • Example: “He was considered the star of China’s AI defense sector and had been working on Taiwan invasion scenarios until he died in an unexplained car crash in Beijing…An obituary…said he was sacrificed.” – Christine (77:11–78:10)
• Parallels: US and China experiencing similar patterns, leading to speculation about espionage or covert international operations.

9. Pop Culture Reference: Alternative 3 Documentary

• 1977 British TV Documentary: Fictional, presented the idea of a “brain drain” of missing scientists for a secret space program. Its plot parallels current real-world discussions about unexplained disappearances among scientists. (85:48–88:42)
  • “It is funny how art imitates life.” – Michael Ryan (87:48)

10. Final Thoughts & Urgent Need for Investigation

• Law enforcement guests stress that only a dedicated, centralized and professionally driven investigation ("a driver") can hope to unravel the mystery for the sake of families and national security. (88:47–89:56)

  • “There has to be a driver. There’s got to be one person or one agency involved to try and find out what has happened.” – Michael Ryan (88:47)

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• “Never ask me that question again and never wonder about what I'm doing or what I've ever done before.”
  – Dr. Ning Li to her son, relayed by Michael Ryan (32:55)

• “This is kind of a typical spycraft kind of a tool.”
  – Michael Ryan on Lynn Rule’s strange call (49:53)

• “Even if it was just copper barium, how did that get into the Australian outback? Because copper barium as an alloy…doesn't occur naturally anywhere on earth.”
  – Michael Ryan (43:44–46:07)

• “There's a lot of clues here that indicate an impropriety…there’s implication that could easily be speculated on…but you know what? We have to follow the science.”
  – Rick Prescott (66:23)

• “This is incredibly significant…This substance is not found in Australia anywhere...It has to be manufactured in order to create that.”
  – Rob Furlong (68:13–69:16)

• “At least nine Chinese scientists have their similar stories…”
  – Christine Scott (77:11)

• “It is funny how art imitates life.”
  – Michael Ryan on the Alternative 3 documentary (87:48)

• “There has to be a driver. There’s got to be one person or one agency involved to try and find out what has happened.”
  – Michael Ryan (88:47)

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Additional Highlights

Pattern in Disappearances

• Unusually, many missing persons left behind all personal effects (phones, keys, wallets, cars), suggesting either coordination or a sinister pattern.

International Scope

• A mirrored pattern is seen not just in the US but now across China, with missing defense, technology, and space scientists.

Scientific "Fingerprint"

• The discovery of copper-barium (YBCO) alloy—directly linked to anti-gravity research and almost certainly not natural—left in an unexplained event ties victim cases together.

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Important Segments

| Time | Topic | |---|---| | 18:58–27:41 | Cases of the missing scientists & military, including Dr. Ning Li | | 38:22–46:24 | Lynn Rule’s sighting and the alloy “fingerprint” | | 54:32–74:37 | Law enforcement interview and investigation discussion | | 77:11–82:13 | Chinese missing scientists recap | | 85:48–88:42 | “Alternative 3” documentary and parallels | | 88:47+ | Calls for an investigation “driver” |

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Summary Takeaway

This episode convincingly argues that a disturbing pattern stretches across continents: high-level scientists, many involved in secretive or advanced propulsion research, are disappearing or dying in bizarre circumstances. The show highlights a concrete scientific clue—the presence of a rare alloy—potentially linking a UFO encounter in Australia to the missing and dead scientists. Experienced law enforcement guests underscore that these patterns far exceed mere coincidence, and only a robust, centralized investigation could cut through the fog of speculation, espionage, and international rivalry now shrouding the fates of these innovators.

Transcript

[A]

You are listening to the UFO Talker podcast. Come with us as we explore UFOs from the past and the present. With insightful discussions, interviews and reviews, we will add our voice to the mysteries that have been seen in our skies and oceans for all of human history. Now, here is our host, Michael Ryan.

[B]

Welcome, everybody, to the podcast. This is season four, episode 34, coming to you from Studio 7H, overlooking the beautiful Trent river here in Ontario, Canada.

[C]

And I'm Christine Scott, coming to you from the beautiful warehouse district in Regina, Saskatchewan, Studio 9B.

[B]

And on today's show, we are going to add another scientist to the growing list of missing scientists and military personnel. And we are going to have someone on who talks about a clue that could unravel this entire mystery. Yes, that's for real, not made up. Plus, we're going to have two law enforcement officers on who are going to give their opinion on what's happening to all these people. Oh, I love it when coffee is made and the room smells like coffee. But however, I'm having today because it's getting warmer here in southern Ontario, I'm having a glass full of ice with cherry cola and Christine, what are you having?

[C]

Well, when I talked to you beforehand, I said I was having a lime buble. But, you know, I realize our non Canadian listeners wouldn't get that joke because we've got a line of fizzy drinks here called bubbly that are pretty tasty, sparkling, you know, flavored, sparkling beverages. But because one of our most famous singers is Michael Buble, he does ads for it, so everybody calls them bubles. So I'm having a buble.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. And the great thing about these things is that it has the flavor of whatever it is, like cherry or lime. There's absolutely no sugar, no sweeteners of any kind. So it's just the essence of whatever fruit they put in, plus the fizzy water. So it is a very good alternative to sugary soda drinks.

[C]

Very much so. And we weren't getting paid to say buble,

[B]

even though I do like saying buble.

[C]

Me too. His ads are great.

[B]

Yes. Yes. Okay, Christine, it's time for the drum roll. May I have it, please? Yes. We have finally made it. We have made it to May 6, the day that we don't have to keep promises or make sure we don't break our NDAs or anything like that. We are going to announce this new change in UFO Talker. And believe it or not, in the next month or so. I don't have an exact date yet. UFO talker is going to have a YouTube channel. Yay.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

Yay.

[C]

That was my Muppet.

[D]

Yay.

[C]

Jump up and down. Yay.

[E]

And

[B]

believe me, this took a lot of prep to get this up and running. It's not actually up and running yet, but lots of preparation. And so we're just going to go over what does this mean? Because I'm sure all the listeners are going, wait, what, what's happening? What's. The universe is crumbling before our eyes. So in a nutshell, what will happen is this podcast that you've been listening to for four years. So this will continue on exactly like it has in the past. And of course we're also going to mention there will be a season five. Yay.

[C]

We've been renewed.

[B]

We've been renewed. Yes.

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

Six seasons in a movie.

[B]

So there will be a season five. And in this, starting probably in June, I'm going to say somewhere in June, we will be launching our YouTube channel. And what will happen is the podcast will be released just as it is today on podcast platforms everywhere. And at the same time, it will be released on YouTube. So that is pretty great. There's of course, there's a lot of preparation to do in that, believe it or not. And also it frees us up to do this next little thing that I'm really or we're really excited about is we are going to start making the summer these little short bits that are about 10 to 15 minutes long and they're going to be standalone segments not connected to the podcast. And these 10 or 15 minute long shorts are going to be called that human said. What? Just because we're those kind of people and we are going to have all manner of things on there topics that wouldn't be quite long enough for a podcast, but would fit into this format. All kinds of different kind of guests, just a lot of things that we would just never attempt on a full podcast show. And once these get up and running, they will also be released on our Facebook page as well. So they'll be in two different spots. And also if anybody out there has an idea of what they would like to see on these 10 to 15 minute segments, feel free to send those in. And also if there's any of you out there that have always thought, you know what, I have an idea that for 10 or 15 minutes I would be really great on doing something like a podcast. Well, now is your chance. Now is your chance to step up to the plate and send in your thoughts and ideas and what you would like to do with maybe one or two or more of these little segments, and we will talk about it and think about it and that kind of thing. So we're throwing that out there for you to think about. And so this will mean that traditionally in the summertime, we release two new podcasts throughout the summer. So because of these little segments, we won't be releasing those full segments anymore. So throughout the summer, we will be releasing, like normal, the best of our podcasts. But a lot of people have written in over the last few years and they say the summer is such a drag because they look so forward to hearing us talk about stuff. So this was a way to fix that problem as well, because you're always going to hear these little short segments. You'll be hearing from both of us throughout the summer. So there you go. You'll get your fix of, of hearing us and tidying you over till season five, which will start sometime in September. I don't have an exact date yet, but probably the middle of September, I'm thinking. And now we are going to read two UFO shows and conferences that are coming out. And the first one is a little bit unusual, and this one actually sounds very interesting. I wouldn't mind at all going to this one. It's a little bit different. And what it is, is William Henry is presenting a special event in Nashville, Tennessee on May 16th. And this is going to be a conversation called Non Human Intelligence, and it's limited to only 130 guests.

[D]

And.

[B]

And the conversation will be between William Henry, Dr. Travis Taylor, and he's of Skinwalker Ranch fame, and Dr. Riz Verk. And that sounds really. I could go for that. And also the night before the 16th, the 15th, they are going to have dinner with these three guys and those guests at somebody's house. Fun, I know. Yeah. So you will get to rub elbows for sure with these guys. That will be, if you're interested in Dr. Travis Taylor or Dr. Riz Verk, boy, this would be. This is your moment. This is your moment to shine. Because that actually sounds like it would be very good. Now, the second UFO show is actually a festival. And this one is called the Red, White and Whoa UFO Festival. And it will be taking place in Roswell, New Mexico, on July 2nd through the 4th. And they do this annually. Now, this, this festival, they're saying they're going to have lots of vendors. Those vendors are going to have lots of merchandise. There's going to be lots of food. Most of the restaurants in Roswell will be turning out for all this now they are going to have speakers as well. But this has not been announced yet. But as soon as they make that known, we will pass that along. But this, we've announced a different festival, I think last week or the week before. And this is probably going to be more on the side of having a good time than really finding anything out. But it looks very interesting and it is in Roswell in Mexico. And I will be posting links to these events in the show Notes. Now, Christine has a bit of interesting news that she's going to read for us now.

[C]

Yeah, there's been something strange going on at Area 51. Lots of activity, but maybe not what you think. Sixteen, count them, 16 earthquakes have struck near Area 51.

[D]

Wow.

[C]

It's not an area you think of for that, but apparently Nevada is one of the most seismically active states in the country. It's crisscrossed by faults linked to the basin and range, geological province, and earth's crust is stretching and breaking apart. I did not realize earthquakes are pretty common in the region. However, people are going, why area 51? An earthquake and 15 aftershocks.

[A]

Wow.

[C]

Have struck since last week. There was first quakes happened Wednesday morning. I think that would have been April 29th. Then there were more than a dozen weaker tremors occurring roughly 28 miles east of the classified test site northwest of Las Vegas. You know, like Seinfeld would say, what's up with that?

[B]

Now the one thing that makes me a little bit worried is because these could be natural things happening. But I remember reading, and this was many years ago that I can't remember the president, but they signed an executive order that made Area 51 exempt from all EAP rules, any rules to do with hazardous goods, anything. So like anything goes. And I did hear one of the guys that worked there is, I think he was saying that they would just dump totally toxic liquids just right into the desert.

[C]

Yeah, that's in the Area 51 book. And that's why a lot of people, they dump all these paints and substances. A lot of people come down with bad health conditions because of being around it. Yeah. Like you say, it's a walking OSHA violation.

[B]

Yes. And they. So that makes me worried that they might be doing something. Whereas in other areas of the country they would have be prohibited from causing earthquakes. But maybe in this area, like as anything goes, who knows what is actually happening there. And now it's time for our shout out to a small town or city where we have listeners. And this week our shout out is to Marble Falls, Texas. And they have a population of 7,037 people. And the town is located on the banks of Lake Marble Falls.

[C]

Is this our first Texas shout out? No, no, we did one, at least one before.

[B]

I think we had two or three before, actually.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And it's located kind of in the center of Texas and maybe a little bit to the right. And it's about 50 miles northeast of Austin, Texas. Now, of course, I watched several videos like I always do, and I have a big announcement to make. The last two weeks, we have run into shout out towns that had no Main Street. It's odd to run into one, but we had two in a row. So I'm happy to announce that Marble, Texas has a very, very nice Main Street. It is lovely. Everything you would expect in a small town. And also something that has rarely happened before in the four videos I watched because I had picked a place to highlight for their baked goods before I watched the videos. And as I watched all four of these videos, all four of the videos mentioned the bakery.

[C]

Oh, wow. You know, you hit a winner.

[B]

That's right. That we're going to talk about. And, and not only did they mention it, they said this place has some of the best pie in Texas. So from four different people, I'm thinking, well, there might be a. A field trip involved one day because

[C]

you don't mess with Texas.

[B]

Yeah, that's right. To Marble Falls.

[C]

In 1917, Marble Falls elected Ophelia Crosby Harwood as the first woman mayor in Texas. Now, that's pretty cool on its own, but why? It's really significant. It was three years before women were allowed to vote. Wow, that's super progressive.

[B]

That is. So now we're going to talk about the bakery. Well, it's not really a bakery, but it's called the Bluebonnet Cafe. So they have baked goods and also food. Now, it has been around since 1929 and the building looks great. They have a big neon sign. And of course, like we've mentioned, they are known for their pies far and wide.

[C]

Oh, they look amazing.

[B]

Yes. And they have, in their literature, they say they have mastered the art of meringue. And I can tell you their meringue pies. I think the meringue is. I don't know, it looks like a foot tall. Like it's the tallest meringue I've ever seen on a pie. But I will just mention a few of the flavors and there's many, many. And of course, I wanted to eat every single one of them with Just the fork and the pie and myself. They have a cherry pie, a peach pie, pecan pie, and I can imagine how great that would be. And then they have a coconut meringue pie.

[D]

Oh, yum.

[B]

Yeah. And a lemon meringue pie that just looks totally out of this world. And of course, all three videos or four videos I watched, it's always busy. And a couple of people said, this place is always busy. It doesn't matter.

[C]

I believe it.

[B]

Yeah, it doesn't matter when you show up, you always have to wait. But yeah, the pies look really, really good. So that is our shout out for today. And we will be right back after this message.

[F]

In 1966, there were 385,000 U.S. troops fighting in the war in Vietnam. Nha Trang Air Force Base was home to the 14th Air Commando Wing. The AC 47 Spooky Gunship and the AC 119G Shadow Gunship flew out of Nha Trang. The night of June 18, 1966 was hot. The temperature hovered around 90 Fahrenheit. There was a clear sky tonight at Nha Trang. The GIs were watching a movie at the outdoor theater. At approximately 9:45, Sergeant Wayne Dalrymple notices what looks like a bright flare approaching the base. Within seconds, the object approaches at a very high rate of speed, then stops dead 500ft above the soldiers. The object appears to be 50ft wide and has lit up the entire base as if it were daytime. The object doesn't move for four minutes. During this time, the generators go out. The engines of trucks and jeeps go silent. The movie stops suddenly. The object flies straight up and disappears from sight within three seconds. Once the UFO had left the area, all the generators, trucks and jeep's motors all turned back on. The soldiers were never told what happened that night. There were many UFO sightings during the Vietnam War. Many of them are still listed as unexplained to this day.

[B]

So now, Christine, we are going to start the show. And boy, this is the mystery that just won't go away. And there's a big appetite from the listeners. They want to know more and more about all of these aspects. And this mystery with the missing scientist and military personnel, it just starts. It just keeps getting bigger, like it's not going away. Everyone keeps adding more to the list. And on today's show, we are going to actually add someone to the list. And we are shocked that no one talks about this person, but we'll get to her a little bit later. Now I just want to Go over some of the more important ones, and that is William McCaslin. And believe it or not, there is nothing new on his case. There are no updates. They say they're still looking for them, but you know, as to what level this is happening, who knows? Then there's Dr. Amy Eskridge, and there's no new developments in her case. Then there's Monica Cassias. She's a missing person. Now, there is a slight update in her case. And you'll remember she is the woman that left everything in her house and walked away. You know, she left her phone, her wallet, all that stuff. So her family has hired a private detective and he's been on the case for several weeks now. Now, they did find some shoes that looked like they matched, you know, what she was wearing at the time that she disappeared. So this was found in a forested area not far from her home. And so now as we speak, they're testing the DNA from the shoes just to prove if they were hers or not. But that is one new development for them. Now in the Monica Raza case, she's the scientist that was on that hike in the California mountains near Los Angeles. And there is no new news on her. Nothing like another one. It's just. It's almost shocking, right? Like, the problem is they say they're working on these cases, but, like, how is this like one person or like a team or, you know, you have no clue in the background about what's really going on. Now, in the meantime, since we did our last show, there's been several more people added to this list. We are going to mention three of them. Some of the people they add a little skeptical of it, right? I think some of the news agencies are just adding people to make the list look bigger and make it sound more like an epidemic or something. One of the. We're going to add three people to the list that they talk about. And one is Anthony Chavez. Now, he was a former employee at the Los Alamos National Laboratory. He disappeared on May 20, May 2025. So just about a year ago. And this is the part that really, I just think what is going on, because he also lives in New Mexico. That's where William McCashlin lives. And again, the last time anyone saw him, he left his home on foot and he left behind his wallet, his keys and his car. And you just think, what is going on? This sounds like a bad science fiction movie. Like, there, it's like there's zombies and they're all just doing the same thing. Now he Was retired from Los Alamos. But that one's a mystery. Now the next one, his name is Steven Garcia. And he disappeared August 2025. And he was a government contractor at a facility in New Mexico. Now he also left on foot from his home at about 9am in the morning. Now here's another one. That boy. Like it makes you seem like they're all going from the same playbook. So he left with his handgun, but he left behind his phone, his wallet, his keys and his car. Now he worked in a very high security nuclear related role at what he did. And again, you know, he lives in New Mexico. So there's at least three people. They all lived in New Mexico. They all vanished and left behind weird things that you would think no one would leave behind. Like in today's day and age, you just don't leave your cell phone behind. I think most people, they take it with them wherever they go. Like it just doesn't, that part doesn't make sense. And this thing where they're all leaving their, you know, leave their phone, their wallet, their keys, that is too weird. If you wrote this into a script, like no one would believe it. They would think that they were all being blackmailed. And the blackmailer was saying now leave your phone, your wallet and your keys. It's very odd that they would all do the same thing and all walk. They all, they all leave walking. That part is very, very mysterious. Now the third guy on our list, his name is Frank Maywald. He passed away in July 2024. And he was a principal researcher at the Jet Propulsion Laboratory and He died on July 4, 2024. He was, like I mentioned, he was a senior engineer at NASA. Now here's something that I think this is why he made the list because his cause of death has never been publicly released. He was 61. So let's say he died of a heart attack or something like that. Why would that be a secret? It only makes everyone that's thinking about these lists and thinking about the people on these lists, it only makes them more mysterious. It just makes them more that people want to talk about them, put them on lists, try to figure it out. So now we have a person that to my knowledge, we are the first people to put her on this list. I have never seen her name mentioned with any of the missing scientist or military personnel list. So her name is Dr. Ning Lee. Now if you've heard that name before is because in the late 90s, her name was connected to every single anti gravity experimental research program that was out there. And she is originally from China and then she moved to Huntsville, Alabama area. And so she had been working on this with some other people at the University. And in 1997 she co authored a paper that was titled Static Test for Gravitational Force coupled with type 2 YBCO superconductors. Why that is interesting is because as I found out later, there are several scientists that are working with YB Co and what that stands for. And I had to look this up because of course I had no clue what that meant. It stands for atrium barium copper oxide. And these are three things that when manufactured together, they can be used as a, like a superconductor. And this makes it possible to work with these anti gravity experiments. Now these are only small experiments. They're not levitating, you know, full size craft or anything. But the small discs that they were levitating, not only would they levitate, but they would lose weight, they would lose some of their mass. So these were very, very exciting experiments. Now she was the kind of scientist that she liked co authoring and writing these scientific papers and she also liked going to, you know, a lot of the professional conferences, speaking before people. That was what she liked. That was, that's what she was all about. And so somewhere near the, the early 2000s, she got a grant from the United States Department of Defense and they got interested in her work. And so she continued on. You know, she, everybody knew her, she was appearing all the time, everybody was interested in her work. And so then around 2003, she really disappeared. So there was no more, she was no more in the papers. No one talked about her scientific papers, they didn't see her about town. She, everything just dried up totally. And so right around that time, there was a investigative reporter that worked for one of the Huntsville newspapers. And so he started to look for her and he was asking, you know, some of her friends, places that she normally would be seen at, and she, he was coming up with nothing. Like nobody would talk, no one had seen her. So he actually began to think that like she had disappeared, she'd been kidnapped, or who knows what had happened. He could find nothing on it. So then it was somewhere around, I think it was 2016, something like that. He happened to see in the newspaper that she had passed away. And so he was totally all over that. And eventually he made friends with her son. And I think it took him a year to get into his son's good books. And what he learned from the son was in 2014, she was walking into her laboratory. And as she was crossing the street, she got hit by a car and she suffered severe brain damage. And from that she no longer could talk. She couldn't function very well. She definitely couldn't go back to work. And she had severe brain damage that prevented her from really doing much of anything. So her son had cared for her the last six years of her life before she passed away. Now, something the son told the reporter was before this accident, he noticed that his mom was no longer going to these conferences or speaking before people or making papers. And he said to his mom, like, what kind of work are you you're doing for the Department of Defense? And she looked at him very sternly and she said, so never ask me that question again and never wonder about what I'm doing or what I've ever done before. And that's the last he ever heard of anything about what she was doing. And he said to the reporter, that sent a chill up his spine, because whatever she was doing, it was very, very secret. And so the reporter said that that's the little bit of information he learned, is that what she was working on was highly classified. No one talked about it, and nobody had no clue about what she found or what she uncovered or anything like that. The only thing we know is that she had been working on anti gravity. So that causes you to pause for a moment and think about what actually happened. Now they say that a younger woman hit her in the car. And I couldn't find anything about this younger woman. Maybe someone else has found out something, but I could find out nothing. They just said she was a student, but. And so we're not saying that this person was involved, you know, doing something sinister, but absolutely that needs to be investigated because it's quite a coincidence, right? I mean, these things do happen. People do get hit by cars and all that kind of stuff. But it's just very, very odd, you know, some such a crucial person. One thing the reporter did uncover is during this time where she was still active, but underground, there was a team of Chinese people from the Chinese government who had visited, visited her. And they wanted her to come back to China for probably obvious reasons. But she did not want to come back. I think she just enjoyed doing her work in the usa. So there you go. We have now officially we have put Dr. Ning Lee on the list. And I can't understand why no one else has put her on the list. I guess they're just accepting the police report that it was all just an accident. But you know, if Anybody has looked into so many strange, mysterious deaths over the years, and not just with these scientists, but in the JFK assassination and so many others, there are a lot of strange car accidents or people fell down or people took overdoses. It's just kind of odd, right, that all of these people, that's the way they meet their death. And we're going to mention this a couple of times on the show, but something I looked up for doing my research on this is in North America, the three major causes of accidental death are falls, car accidents, and poisonings. And poisonings include overdoses. And I thought, isn't that interesting? And so when you do further research on it, there were intelligence agencies in the early 50s. Some of them wrote manuals on how to kill people and make it look like an accident. And so in some of these files that have since been released, it says the best way to do it is make it look like a fall, a car accident or a poisoning.

[C]

Yeah.

[B]

And you know, when you think about it, that makes perfect sense because these are very common ways of, to have an accidental death. So if you're a police officer or medical examiner or any of those people, you're seeing this on a routine basis. So if the next person comes in and that's how they died, that's just one more of like the last thousand. So none of their, they have no reason to doubt it or anything like that. And you know, they don't know that the person was working in a highly classified area or anything like that. You know, they're just doing, trying to do their, their normal job. So this is something to ponder. It leaves a lot of unanswered questions for sure. So now we're going to do something. I don't think we've ever done this before, but in the body of our main show, we are actually going to play two shorter clips from other people I've interviewed and their audio will work perfectly with what our, our show is. Our topic is about today. Now, the first person that you're going to hear this is Lynn Rule and she is the author of the book Redirected in Five Seconds. Now, I interviewed her this season and it was on episode 26. If you would like to listen to the full episode on this show, we are going to listen to something that Lynn discovered on her own is she made a connection between the alloy that was found on her motorhome and some of the missing and murdered scientists. And she discovered that some of these people, they were working with the alloy that was found on her Motorhome. And so when she emailed me and told me about this, I had to sit down because I thought, okay, so this is really interesting because this alloy is kind of like a fingerprint, especially when it's in its, in its alloy state, its manufactured state. It's not found anywhere in Australia. So let us listen now to Lynn Rule. We're back with Lynn Rule again and she is going to give us a recap of what she saw that day in the Australian outback.

[D]

In March 2023, I was traveling alone in the Australian Outback in my motorhome heading from Adelaide to Lara Station in central Queensland. It's about a five day drive covering around 2,000 kilometers. On day three, it was a hot 37 degree day with only a few clouds and not much of a breeze. 54km south of Charleville, something happened that changed my life forever. At one o' clock in the afternoon, I noticed out of the corner of my eye a large mint green cloud like mass appear in the sky. Sky. It looked like it was a balloon full of gas. Take away the balloon skin and it was thick. It seemed to hang there above the gum trees on the left hand side of the road. And it had some kind of tail behind it and a bulge coming from the left hand side of the shape. I couldn't see through it, but it felt like it was coming my way, heading straight for me. I looked at the bottom of the mass and I could see little pieces of something in the bottom part floating. And as I looked up the top part of the shape, I felt like it was looking at me. It knew I was there and it knew I knew it was there. I decided I should get out of its way before it came across the road in case it engulfed me. There was a loud double thump on the left hand side of my motorhome and the force pushed me about 10ft over to the wrong side of the road. I was looking to the right looking down towards the gutter on the side of the road. Seconds later I heard a strange fizzing sound over the roof on the right hand side of my vehicle. And I wondered whether it could be a meteorite or meteorite dust. Then I looked to the empty paddock on the right hand side of the road expecting to see a whirlwind or an explosion. But there was nothing. No sound, nothing. No flames. I was thinking it must be a meteorite. That was the only explanation I could think of at the time. The next morning I awoke early and collected a sample of dust from A motorhome, hoping to eventually find a laboratory in Australia to test it.

[B]

So about a few weeks ago, Lynn reached out to me and she came up with this connection. And the more I thought about it, the more I thought, wow, I thought, you have come up with something that has the potential to be a very important clue in the missing and murdered scientists and military people who are connected with these UFOs and experimental research. And I wonder if you could tell our listeners how you made this connection and why you made this connection.

[D]

Well, it was Phenomena Research Australia who tested my dust sample from my vehicle and they identified copper barium particles on the roof of my vehicle and they described them as having an unknown origin and unusual composition. Curiosity took over and I began investigating, looking for a clue to what I had seen that day. In January 25, I came across a Sky News video about nuclear fusion that mentioned the use of copper barium, the same elements found on my vehicle. And of course my ears pricked up. Much of the plasma science went over my head. But what was interesting was the subject of magnetic levitation and the mention of a machine called a tokamak which uses powerful magnetic fields to contain plasma. It made me wonder whether the green thing that I saw that day involved some kind of anti gravitational propulsion or whether it had some kind of magnetic field. Recently, I listened to a podcast about the missing or murdered scientists, including Nuno Larrero, Neil McCasland and Monica Reza, and I decided to look a little bit further into it. I learned that Professor Nuno was a leading plasma physicist working in fusion energy, the same field mentioned in the Sky News video. Then I heard the word tokamak and something clicked. I wondered whether there could be a connection between his work in plasma physics and the copper barium found on my vehicle and my UFO experience, which until this day remains unexplained. I keep coming back to the same question. What did I encounter that day? It comes down to a few possibilities. Something top secret or classified, something alien or something else we don't yet understand. I can remember Phenomena Research telling me that ufology comes in pieces rather than as a whole. And I'm still searching for that vital clue.

[B]

So once I start started to research what all these scientists were looking into, and because they were all working on anti gravity and superconductors, they kept mentioning this compound called ybco. And of course I have no idea what that meant, so I had to look that up and it was yttrium, barium, copper oxide, and that one, that's when it Dawned on me that's what Lynn had, a version of that, that she was taken from her truck and her motorhome, and it got analyzed. I started going through what John Ocatello was saying, and I'm going to paraphrase what he said. And he said the quantities that they detected may be below the sensitivity threshold of the equipment they were using to try and detect it. So that leaves the door open that that element could have been there as well, but they just couldn't detect it. So for me, this is a big, big clue. Because in the end, like the end of the day, after you've looked at this and researched it, you have to ask yourself, even if it was just copper barium, how did that get into the Australian outback? Because copper barium as an alloy, which is what John Ocatel foundation, it doesn't occur naturally anywhere on earth. It has to be manufactured. And just to point this out again, there could have been yttrium in this combination of alloys. So it could have had yttrium barium and copper in it. But as John Ocotel pointed out, they were using. The equipment they were using may not have been sensitive enough to find it. That's very important. And that, of course, leaves the door open. So, Lynn, when you think about those things, do you think about that, like, how did that make it onto my motorhome?

[D]

Yes. I wonder how it got there. I think it was in a turbulent wake. Whatever it was had a force. And if it was a pressure wave and the turbulent wake was behind it, then that copper barium came from up above.

[B]

I know, I know. In it, it's. You know, it's. The thing is, in these kind of clues, sometimes it's a clue that it means nothing, but sometimes it's a clue that means everything. And definitely this needs to be investigated further because this could be the clue that unravels a huge mystery. So Lynn is going to tell us about a very strange phone call that she received shortly after she saw the object in the sky. And Lynn, when she talks about the company that this guy worked for, we're going to call that company Company X, because we don't want to give the real name of the company. So, Lynn, if you could tell us about that part of the story.

[D]

Just after my encounter, when I was in shock, I was driving, thinking to myself, driving on auto autopilot, I just couldn't think straight. I was numb. And my Bluetooth had a phone call come through and I didn't want to answer it at first. I thought, no, I'll answer it, get it out of the way. And I pushed the button to answer the call and this man said he was so and so from Company X and that I had called him and he was returning my call. I told him that I didn't make any call. I was in the middle of the outback and there's something had happened out there and I had to get off the phone. And he was insistent that I'd called him first and I was insistent that, no, I did not, and I hung up on him. It was a few days later that I decided to apologise to this man and I looked up his telephone number on the Internet and I gave him a call and apologised for hanging up on him. And he told me that I called him and he was on another call at the time, so he was returning my call. I explained to him that I didn't make any calls because of what had happened and explained to him what had happened out there on the side of the road near Charleville, and he was interested to know what happened to me. He sounded very interested, but he was going to give me some more details about his missed call that he had from me. And when I asked him to look up his calls list and his recent calls or missed calls, he said to me that they weren't there. It didn't go back that far in time, but it was only about four days afterwards that I gave him that call and I thought it was a bit odd that those calls weren't recorded on his phone. So we left it until 21 April, when he would get his telephone bill. And he rang me very early in the morning and told me that he was definitely on another call and that call was six minutes before he called me. So I wondered whether it was interference on my Bluetooth that made that call, whether it was a scam call or whether it was something else.

[B]

Now, what I thought originally, when Lynn told me this and I read it in her book, I thought it was probably just a random mistake call. But I mentioned this to some people that know about such things and they said this is kind of a typical spy craft, kind of a tool. And that really shocked me because I thought, no, this is just random. And they were saying there's a possibility that this wasn't random, that this was actually thought out for a whole bunch of reasons. And that got me looking into this Company X. Now, unfortunately, at press time, the person who's looking into this wasn't hasn't Been able to figure it out yet, but they are going to be able to tell if this is a legitimate company or is this a front company that is actually masking an intelligence operation. So definitely the plot thickens, as they say. Okay, so that is Lynn. And I can tell you, Christine, the first time that she mentioned that to me, that she had made the connection between that alloy and what the scientists, like, what had she got off the top of her motorhome and what these scientists were working on. The same thing. I just thought, wow, like, this could be a major connection and, you know, this could be the thread that starts the whole mystery unraveling.

[C]

Yeah, I thought the same thing when you told me this. This could pull everything together.

[B]

It is just one of those things. And I don't read a lot of true crime books. I remember reading the Vincent Bugliosi book Helter Skelter and there were then I saw the Charles Manson murders and there was some weird coincidences in there about finding evidence and things that just seemed to drop out of the blue. And then, you know, where did that come from? So I don't think we can underestimate what Lyn is talking about and kind of what she discovered. You have to give her a lot of credit. And if you've read her book, she is very tenacious in getting facts and finding out information. She's the right person to have on your team if you're trying to find something that is for sure.

[C]

Oh, she's like a dog with a bone. She is not going to rest till she gets all the answers.

[B]

That's right. That's right. That's exactly right. So now we're going to listen to another short audio clip. And these. And these are from two law enforcement officers and they had been on the show before in I think it was season two. And I'll just read their little introduction here before you you hear their audio clip. So Rick Prescott, he spent six years as a U.S. marine, serving both as an instructor and as part of the Marine Embassy Guard program protecting American embassies around the world. In 1986, he transitioned into policing in Dartmouth, Nova Scotia, going on to serve 15 years with the Halifax Regional Police. And Rick also holds a bachelor's degree from St. Mary's University in Halifax. And also speaking is Rob Furlong. And so Rob began his policing career in 1985 with the Kentville Police Department before moving on to the Dartmouth Police and then eventually the Halifax Regional Police, where he served 28 years. Over the course of his career, he worked as A patrol officer and. And later specialized in forensic identification, explosive disposal, chemical and biological and radiological and nuclear CBRN response. Following his operational work, Rob went on to share his expertise, training others in CBRN techniques. He retired in 2016 after a distinguished career in public safety. And now we will hear their audio. With us now is Rick Prescott.

[E]

Hi, Michael.

[G]

How are you?

[B]

And I'm fine. And Rob Furlong.

[E]

Hi, Mike. Pleasure to be here.

[B]

Now, this is, as you guys know, this is just a total mystery what is happening to all these scientists and military personnel. But what I would like to do is I would like to step back and take kind of an overview of all the missing and deaths of scientists and military personnel that have happened over the last few years. And I want to get your thoughts on this. When you step back and look at these cases, I want to know, when does coincidence stop being coincidence and when does it start looking like something more sinister?

[G]

When I'm looking at that particular case, I believe there's like 11 scientists, researchers that are missing or gone. Monica Reza, Anthony Chavez, Melissa Cassias, Steven Garcia, General William McCaslin. All of those, they just walked out of their homes. And what's interesting is that they left their devices at home. And so there's a pat in there just in that alone. Some of them were murdered at home and some just simply went missing. I'm with you, Mike. I just look at this and say that I don't believe in coincidence. I just don't see it.

[E]

Yeah, I think as an investigator that's. I'd agree there are no coincidences. You know, it's just. And maybe one or two things kind of raise an eyebrow and you get a hunch as an investigator. But when you started getting into those numbers, it's obviously not a coincidence, and you just have to set up an investigation.

[B]

Now, in North America, the three leading causes of accidental death are falls, car crashes, poisonings, which include drug overdoses. So in your opinion, if you were in a jurisdiction where a person died of a drug overdose, let's say, or was in a car crash, at what point in a typical investigation did the police look into the person's background, like their job or where did they work? And I think what I'm trying to get at is if that person had a top secret clearance, would that make any difference in the investigation? Or would you even be thinking along those lines when you first are in an overdose or a car crash situation? I think, like,

[E]

when you're getting into the accidental deaths, it takes maybe a little bit more to find some commonality. And an investigator would kind of have to see this is becoming a coincidence. And there you have to start looking at a commonality, a thread there. Are they all linked to someone or some business or some entity that would want to do harm to them? Like you're looking for a background, a commonality thread that can really stand out and develop into a lead, really. And so it's like any other investigation. It sets up in a war room. There's a big board goes up, the victim's names go on it, and you set up like a, basically a flowchart. And is there a commonality that is going on with all these people? And that's basically how you start it.

[G]

You know, in my view, in policing we always rely on coroner reports. And usually if there's a suicide, for

[E]

example,

[G]

they already know the cause of death. They'll examine the body in most cases, but usually that's where the investigation stops. Other than the officers themselves, the detective themselves, they will look in the background, they'll try to get a reason behind it. You know, a note goes a long way. And in modern day, what they say online goes a long way. What their parents have to say, family members and friends, all of that, but they see the pattern in that particular regard. They look for patterns and they look for data and they collate that data and then that correlation of data leads to an understanding. But in many cases, look around at the situation here where we lose these 11 scientists and researchers. That element where you make those type of connections, that's an overview. That's, that's the God view, if you will, you know, from looking from the top, the eagle view, that's, that's something a little bit different that usually doesn't take place, not on a local level.

[B]

Yeah, that's because that's kind of what I thought. Because if this just happened with a few people, I can't imagine that, you know, if you have a dead person in a car crash, for example, that is probably not at the top of the list about where they worked or if they have a security clearance or anything like that. That would be more of a, you know, it just happened to be a coincidence or something that someone looked into that, I think.

[E]

Well, it's not for a medical examiner, you know, as you said, Rick, they usually know the cause of death and the autopsy just confirms it. And if it's not suspicious and it doesn't raise an eyebrow for they may not even call the police if it's a straight out accident. But when you start getting to missing persons and, and that body showing up and then you're into police actual investigations with it.

[B]

Right, right. I want to, I want to ask a question now about some missing military people and one specifically, and I want to get your thoughts on the General McCashlin incident. And specifically I would want to ask about the post that Mrs. McCashland made a few days after he went missing. I'm not going to quote the whole post, but at the end she said maybe he was beamed up by a UFO and he's been taken to the mothership. Now if you had read this and like you were just looking at it as a missing person's case, would that be a red flag? Or you just think, you know, people handle stress differently. It's kind of an odd thing to say. Your husband's missing about two or three days.

[G]

I'm looking at that particular post

[E]

if

[G]

you've, if you've dealt with military personnel, particularly those that have been long term in their careers. And so, and on that level, I remember following this a little bit in, where she, she was frustrated at one point and she was a little irritated with the idea with, with the UFO community insisting that that really had that connection. She's the wife of this guy and I take that post as being sarcasm to say, you know, okay guys, maybe he just got beamed up. So she's a little angry at the UFO community. That's the way I took that comment.

[E]

Yeah, I found it a little odd out of the ordinary. But I mean, if you, if you were an investigator and you were looking into all these missing persons and deaths and you're looking at like in a war room, as I said before, and you're looking at a flowchart and you happen to look at it, and I followed it online a little bit. When someone makes a statement like that and you look into the background, well, Jesus. Guy's working at Ray Patterson Air Force Base and he's involved Air Force Research Lab, you know, like that, that's kind of reaching into that territory. But it is an odd statement.

[B]

Now, just as a missing person's case, and it's a pretty odd missing person's case. What are your thoughts on it? Because he did some, some very odd things. Like he had a very typical pattern when he would go for a hike, he took his phone, he took his, his watch, all these things. And then this time he left all those things behind, but he took his gun and apparently he never took his gun when he went on a walk. So he's Doing something completely not normal. Is that. What does that mean to you? If anything, if it's out of the

[E]

ordinary, it does raise an eyebrow for sure. I mean, if you're taking your phone, you. Almost everybody takes her phone when they leave their home just because it's, it's a habit now and to leave that behind, like he can't be traced, it can't be anything.

[G]

And it's suspicious.

[E]

Taking a gun with him for sure.

[G]

Okay.

[E]

To me it's indicating that he's aware of something going on. Maybe he didn't want to be traced and he didn't want to leave his phone. Or, you know, like your investigative mind starts to think of all these different things. So, hey, I just found it weird

[G]

in, in my view, I, I look at this like I'm trying to analyze the totality of circumstances in this particular case. He leaves his keys at home, leaves his phone at home, leaves his stuff at home and takes his firearm with him. Out he goes, never to be seen or heard from again.

[B]

That.

[G]

But that in itself is a missing person's report. His wife indicated he was having some, some medical issues and some even some mental issues. So, you know, and that doesn't, that's nothing surprising was in the military for that long. But I think where I make the connection is it's not just him. There's 11 other individuals, the researchers, scientists and other individuals, all of which were high level research, something to do with national security, something to do with technology and military advancement. And these people knew a lot. And all of these guys. And then along with General McCathlin, he, he knew more than probably all of them. Combined with his job, this guy was in it to win it. And for him to go and just be in this particular case, it raises my eyebrow. There's a lot of suspicion here.

[E]

I agree. And he's not the only one to leave his phone behind. Two or three of the others, I believe, also left their phone behind, which like, is unusual also.

[B]

So, yeah, there. One of the. In another funny thing is not all of them, but I think there's at least two or three. They all are from New Mexico. And one of the women, Cassias was her last name. I can't. Yes, Melissa. Melissa Cassias. She's the one where she had two phones and they were left at home when she left. And they were factory reset, which means they're completely wiped, which is very, very odd.

[G]

Why would anyone in their right mind do that and just leave their phones at home and then simply disappear?

[B]

And also because she had a daughter even she, even if she didn't like her husband, I mean, she has her daughter. And just to disappear, you'd have to know that would be devastating for your, your child. It's a very odd, very odd case.

[E]

Yeah, it makes no sense. I mean, when was the last time someone wiped their phone that, you know.

[B]

Yeah, never.

[E]

Right.

[G]

There's a lot of clues here that indicate an impropriety. There's implication that could easily be speculated on. And, but you know what? We have to follow the science. We have to wait. This definitely, absolutely, positively needs an investigation. And I understand that the federal government in the United States right now, through the FBI, they're take, they're, they're highly concerned about some of this. And as, as a result of that, they're, they're initiating an investigation in this, on all this.

[E]

Yeah, there is some science to follow and there's difficulties too. Multiple agencies and lack of witnesses and lack of some evidence. But you know, like technology these days doing an investigation, they can check on some of these people like whose, whose phones were active on cell towers at the time they went missing. Like there's a lot of technical data that can be harvested from, from the technology now that that's out there that they use car, car technology, phone technology. Hopefully the investigators are working together and trying to figure it out.

[B]

I want to shift gears a little bit now and as we heard a few minutes ago, we hit on Lynn Rule and I want to talk about her incident a little bit and her clue, which I think is pretty dramatic. And if you are investigating this and I'm talking, you know, from a big picture perspective, what do you think of this clue? Especially since a lot of these scientists were working on this alloy, yttrium copper, barium oxide, with their anti gravity experiments. How important a clue do you think this could be?

[G]

This is incredibly significant. I mean, think about it. This, this substance is not found in Australia anywhere, just not manufactured. They have no manufacturer capabilities to be able to create the substance. And here she is in the middle of the outback, her camper gets pumped up by something and then she has the state of mind to take paper towel or whatever and to wipe it down and secure that, send it to a lab that's phenomenal and in its own right. And then he come up with this, I forget what it's called. Yttrium barium substance. And it's not manual, it's not manufactured. It's very rare product on earth and it has to be manufactured in order to create that Particular side of substance. How did that get on her? On her camper in the middle of the desert in Australia, where this substance doesn't even exist?

[D]

That.

[G]

That is absolutely amazing to me.

[E]

I agree. Yeah. Just, you have to follow where that comes from. Which lab. Can you break that substance down into different qualities of amounts? And is the lab working with a certain amount of that? Like, can you. It's almost like counterfeit. You can tell which machine it came from. So can you tell which lab, which people were working on it? Like they're doing their investigations. You could really try to hone in on where it comes from and the people that are working on it and then just try to follow the stream where it goes from there.

[B]

Yeah, because I. I actually didn't think of that before, but you're absolutely right, because I believe. Now, don't quote me on this, everybody, but I believe there are only, like, two companies on earth that actually make this. I believe they're both in the. The US So it's the kind of a clue that if you found, you know, if it was anything else and you found it in a murder crime or something else, you. It would be significant because it's a piece of science. Like, you can't deny it. Like, if you found someone's fingerprints somewhere where they shouldn't be, well, you know, what. What does that mean? Like, it's.

[E]

Yeah, it's. It's basically a fingerprint.

[B]

Yeah.

[G]

It's about as unique as you can get. It is.

[B]

Now, the other thing, because her story has is a little bit more complex than normal, is she also received a phone call on her cell phone about 10 minutes after this event happened. Now, I kind of thought that this was just probably a random event. What are your thoughts on this phone call which she said she never placed and she never called, but this guy swears that he was returning her call.

[G]

When I heard that in the interview, I almost fell out of my chair. I mean, I was just fascinated by that particular side of it. Look, anyone that reads material on Spycraft, that's watched any of the episodes on YouTube, et cetera, on Spycraft knows that this is a normal routine in terms of setting up a phone to be able to monitor the individual's conversations, to track them and to follow them wherever they go, and you get to watch the individual forever until you decide to shut it down. It's an element of Spycraft. That was the first thing I thought of, but then I thought, why? Why her? Who is she? You know, what makes her a target or you know, why is this unique to her? So I'm kind of betwixt in between about it. I, but then again, like I said earlier, I do not believe in coincidence. I see patterns and that's, that's, that's usually what solves crimes and solves missing person reports and this and that. And this is just one of those things that really opens up a lot of questions.

[E]

Oh yeah, 100%. I mean you, and you fall back into the coincidence again. Here she's out in the middle of nowhere in a motorhome, that incident happens. All of a sudden your phone rings and that's just weird in itself. But I mean, it does gain access to a phone if that's what was going on. And again, a good investigator will try to find out where that phone call came from because you can mine all that information off a stage. Cell towers and technology. So it all depends on how deep the investigation goes and they're willing to go with it, I guess.

[B]

Now my last question is kind of an all encompassing question is, is there anything that we haven't talked about yet but you think should be mentioned in this case?

[G]

Look, you know, there's a lot of material, a lot of speculation through the UFO community, through the podcast community, through the news because it's, it's hit national news at this point. And really, you know, there, there's what we have right now, truly, if you boil it down, is simply simple speculation. We need to get an investigation where they can scientifically analyze the data, actually dig into each and every sequence of events. And then like Rob said, look at the technology, follow the towers, et cetera, collate all of the data you can in order to scientifically analyze this, in order to determine like these missing scientists and so forth, we gotta determine what the facts really are. Instead of the Internet ruling the ruling

[E]

the narrative, no question, you need a quality driver. Somebody has to really drive the investigation, be willing to push forward with it. And I don't know which agency is going to come forward or if there is one at all, but it needs a driver to take everything, the whole scope of what's going on.

[B]

So I have to say, Christine, that is, is to me fascinating to hear from Rick and Rob on how important Lynn's connection to this alloy that was found on her motorhome and the missing scientists and also that strange phone call that she got, which. Yeah, which originally I didn't think much of that at all. But as it turns out that could be very, very important. Yes, one thing that was kind of an eye opener after I'd interviewed them is definitely in a case like this, obviously you want to have professionals. So hearing them talk, you just think of so many things that you never would have thought of because, you know, we're not cops, we're not investigators, but you just think all the tools that are available to all of these agencies, especially in the US like the FBI and higher, there are a lot of things that we probably don't know about, about what they can do and look for. It's very, very interesting. And like right now, we will never know where all of these cases, where they're at, but it leaves you thinking definitely, what, what are they finding out?

[C]

And I mean all law enforcement agencies, even if you have a casual look at them, they all admit none of them talk to each other.

[B]

Yes, that's the problem. Right?

[D]

Yeah.

[C]

There's no information sharing and sometimes they can't, but a lot of times they just don't and won't.

[B]

I know. And you see this all the time over the years, like it's, you know, each one of them, they have their bosses and they have their, their, their pride and what they do and you know, we're not sharing and we want to be the first. And it does make you think there should be a lot more synergy between all of these groups.

[C]

Yeah. More cooperation.

[B]

Yeah. So now Christine, like if this didn't have enough, if these, this big picture mystery didn't have enough things going on, Christine is going to bring in her looking into. On the Chinese side, a similar thing is happening in China.

[C]

Yes. At least. Are you ready for this? At least nine Chinese scientists have their similar stories about what's happened to them. Here's. This is one of the most interesting ones. There was a chap named Feng Yong he who is a professor at the National University of Defense Technology. He'd won national competitions with his pioneering war skull platform. I'm not sure what that is, but he was considered the star of China's AI defense sector and had been working on Taiwan invasion scenarios until he died in an unexplained car crash in the early hours of the morning in Beijing. He was only 38 years old. This was July 1, 2023. But here's what's interesting. An obituary in the state run Science News website ScienceNet CN said he was sacrificed.

[D]

Wow.

[C]

In the obituary and Newsweek asks, why was the brilliant scientist from Gansu province buried in a special cemetery in Beijing for the Communist Party elite state heroes and revolutionary martyrs? He was one of just many a Similar situation as in the US Many unexplained deaths of top flight scientists. And they were all working on ultra sensitive fields like military AI, hypersonic weapons and space defense. And so you know, they're thinking, is there, is it because of competition between the US and China?

[D]

China.

[C]

And deepening with the Chinese and Russian leaders? But in China, media and social media reports and obituaries have all attributed all these deaths to either traffic accidents, unspecified accidents, or no cause at all.

[B]

Wow. Yeah, but that's what, that's what we've just talked about. It's the good old traffic accident in the falls and the accidental poisonings. Yeah, it seems to be something that is good around the world.

[C]

Yeah. And here's. But wait, there's more, More, More car accident Deaths. Zhang Yaojing, 62 years old in December 2024. A space expert of the National Satellite Meteorological Center. He specialized in weather monitoring and early warning Systems. Then in 2018, Chen Xuming, he was 57. Chinese military scientist, microelectronics expert at the National University of Defense Technology. He was considered the leader of China's high end weapon chip research and development team. Died in a car accident. Then when you were talking the earlier no cause of death given. The chemist Zhu Guangyang died age 51, December 23rd. No cause of death given. And in one of the aforementioned obituaries on ScienceNet, CN said after years of study, Zhou had developed a more profound sense of doing what the country needs.

[E]

Wow.

[C]

No cause of death given. He was an expert on materials, especially polymers. Worked with organizations, practical applications for his research. Member of the Chinese Academy of Arts and Sciences. And then there was a hypersonics field. In the hypersonics field, Fang Dining, age 68, died after an unexpected medical episode. South Africa, February of this year. Studied Are you ready for this? Super strong materials for spacecraft and advanced engines. At the Beijing Institute of Technology, which is a key Defense research University. Lu Dong Hao, age 51, March 2024. Again died after an unspecified accident. Data management and security scientist. Then we have Zhang daibing, who is 47. January 2025. Died of unexplained causes, January 2025. He was the top drone expert. Former deputy director of the Unmanned Systems Research incident at the National University of Defense Technology. And the list goes on. Yan Hong, 56, worked at Wright State University in Ohio. Died reportedly following an illness. He worked in hypersonics and it's all unexpected illnesses, car crashes, medical episodes, as you said, you know. And again, no official connections have been confirmed. Among the recent cases Unquote, in China. But it sounds pretty similar, doesn't it?

[B]

Well, it also makes you wonder, and I'm not the first person to think of this.

[D]

Yeah.

[B]

Is wonder if the Chinese are knocking off all the major players in the US and then the US is knocking off all the major players in science in China.

[C]

Well, it's funny you should say that because this is. Newsweek has actually been reporting on this. And Newsweek kind of quotes Representative Eric Berlinson saying in US the string of missing or deceased scientists. With attention and speculation, Berlinson thinks it could be connected to a foreign operation and is being investigated by the FBI.

[B]

So it's so many possibilities, it's just gigantic. Right. Who knows what is really happening? I guess at the end of the day, it's one of these things where you just look back and you say to yourself, what is going on? What is really happening? And I think for our episode and the listeners, you really can't dismiss the connection that Lynn Rule made between her alloy that she found and her finding. All of these scientists that were working with the same or similar alloy. Like as Rob mentioned during my interview with him, Rob said in a lot of these cases with chemical compounds and alloys, if the right person is looking into it, they can find out where these, what factory these compounds come from. You know, like kind of like the FBI looking up paint chips and seeing what paint company made up a paint chip that came off of a car or a weapon or something like that. You can really find, kind of find out like the, the DNA of that alloy. And I had never thought about that. So there is so many layers to what you could really do and then how important this clue would be. Because as Rob also mentioned that this alloy does not exist in Australia anywhere. There's no, no manufacturer for it and certainly no reason whatsoever for it to be in the outback. So that really makes you wonder for sure. And it makes you think about this compound, ybco, the atrium, barium, copper oxide. And like they mentioned, like Lynn Rule, they just found copper barium as the components in her samples. But they also mentioned that their equipment may not have been sophisticated enough to find any of the other alloys that were there. So they left the door open that those other, the full YBCO could have been there. And it just makes your mind definitely wonder. So, Christine, you have a very interesting kind of odd, coincidental documentary that was made in Britain years ago.

[C]

Yeah, it was. The documentary is called Alternative 3 and it was made for Anglia Television in 1977 in the UK. Now it was made broadcast as a portion of the television series Science Report. And here's something I have to mention. At the outset, it was supposed to be originally broadcast April 1st. We all know what day that is. April Fool's Day, 1977. But the broadcast was delayed to June 20th for various reasons. There was strike action at labor disputes, so they couldn't slot it when it was supposed to be. Now, documentary had interviews with supported scientists, astronauts, and it was talking about a mysterious brain drain where scientists were disappearing. Not just scientists, physicists, engineers, astronomers, everybody in related fields. And the documentary said the missing scientists were supposedly involved in a secret American Soviet plan, that there had actually been interplanetary space travel possible. And then it was revealed. According to the documentary, since the 1950s, scientists had determined the Earth's surface couldn't support life much longer because of climate change. And then in 1957, three solutions were proposed, hence the title Alternative 3. First, drastic reduction of the human population. The second was the construction of vast underground shelters to house government officials in a cross section of the population until the climate stabilized. Kind of like Dr. Strangelove. And the third alternative was supposed to be, and this was supposed to have already started, the colonization of Mars.

[B]

Wow.

[C]

Via a way station to the moon. But according to this documentary, scientists were mysteriously disappearing everywhere and being funneled into this project.

[B]

It is funny how art imitates life. So the one thing we should mention, that this was a fictional documentary, but it reminded me, because when you brought this up, it reminded me of there was a book written, I think, 10 years or 20 years before the Titanic sunk. And it was called, I think it was called the Wreck of the Titan. So it was almost the word Titanic. And the book was eerily similar to what happened to the Titanic, but it was in a fictional book 10 or 20 years before it happened. So this documentary reminds me of that. It's just very strange.

[C]

Yeah, it's like you say, kind of. But I mean, also, the missing scientist at Element.

[B]

Yes.

[C]

Matches exactly.

[B]

Yeah. Yeah. It is weird, isn't it?

[C]

Yes.

[B]

So now, Christine, we're going to wrap this up, and I have to fall back on something that Rob Furlong mentioned at the end of his audio clip. And that was he said, for this mystery, there has to be a driver. There's got to be one person or one agency involved to try and find out what has happened. And I wholeheartedly agree with this. If just for the sake of all these families that don't know what happened to their. Their loved one, like there's that element, which is super important. And then there's also the element of why are these people who a lot of cases, they have top secret clearances? Why are they disappearing? And we really have to find out. So I think I'll leave it like that. As Rob Furlong has said, there has to be a driver

[H]

Here are the Canadian Civil Aviation anomalies for the week of April 27 to May 1, 2026. On April 27, a perimeter aviation de Havilland aircraft flying from Cyth to CZAC reported smoke in the cockpit upon takeoff on Runway 06. No emergency was declared and assistance was declined. The flight requested to return and landed safely. One delayed departure. Also on April 27, on departure at Mississippi Air Care beach flying from CYWG to CJR3 reported a traffic alert and collision avoidance system resolution advisory for a target 1500ft below them. No targets were observed on surveillance and no remotely piloted aircraft. Aircraft system reports in the area were

[F]

received

[H]

on April 30. A report from February 26 was added to the Cadore's report. In the vicinity of Edmonton, Alberta, a bystander on the ground along with two other individuals observed a large dark gray to light black triangular object in the sky with no defined edges. Due to a blurring effect, they could not determine whether it was tilted forward or backward and it appeared to use thin cloud to obscure itself. The object was large, approximately thumb sized at arm's length and at high altitude FL180 or above with no visible vapor trail. The bystander looks located on the east side of the Queen Elizabeth 2 Highway near Red Deer. Observed the object heading west for approximately seven to eight seconds before it suddenly disappeared. The sighting occurred on February 28, 2026 at approximately 2000 Zulu time. The object appeared slow moving, but was also described as covering a large distance across the sky. At the moment it disappeared, its direction of travel could not be determined. Traffic synchronization notified the Operations Duty Manager. No impact on operations There was an impact on one flight, but all other flights proceeded to their destinations without further Inc.

[B]

Well, that's our podcast for this week. Please share, subscribe and do all those great things to help spread the word about UFO Talker. And until next time, this is Michael Ryan. Keep watching the skies.

[F]

You have been listening to the UFO Talker. If you have any questions or comments on this episode, you can email us at ufotalker or visit our website at ufotalker ca. You can support UFO Talker by using the Buy Me a Coffee app with links on our website and in the show notes. We appreciate every listener. Thank you for your support. This has been a Michael Ryan production.

[B]

30, that's a wrap.