Ep 1129 | Willie Mistaken for Bigfoot by Jase’s Grandkids & Love Is God’s Greatest Power

Summary

Unashamed with the Robertson Family: Episode 1129 Summary

Title: Willie Mistaken for Bigfoot by Jase’s Grandkids & Love Is God’s Greatest Power
Release Date: July 18, 2025
Host: Tread Lively

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1. Navigating Family Dynamics and Podcast Challenges [00:31 - 08:40]

The episode kicks off with Jase Robertson affirming his unashamed faith, setting a heartfelt tone for the discussion. He introduces the metaphor of steering a ship, symbolizing the family's journey together. Jase shares the recent challenge of balancing podcast production with having grandkids visit, leading to increased distractions and sleepless nights.

Jase Robertson [00:31]: "I am unashamed. What about you?"

Jase Robertson [02:19]: "We got a line that caused humor... my wife has become an expert in creating an atmosphere where difficulty thrives."

The family humorously acknowledges the chaos, highlighting the real-life obstacles they face in maintaining their mission beyond the church walls.

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2. Discovering Overlooked Insights in John 11 [12:24 - 31:08]

Jase reflects on their ongoing study of John 11, admitting that they missed a crucial element in their previous five podcasts. This realization sparks a deeper exploration of the passage, focusing on the theme of love as depicted in the Bible.

Jase Robertson [12:24]: "We missed something crucial in our five podcasts of John 11. Finally, that we missed something."

The discussion delves into the nature of God's love, referencing John 3:16 and Psalm 136 to illustrate how love is intricately woven into God's actions and attributes. Jase emphasizes that love is not just an attribute but the foundational reason behind God's power and actions.

Jase Robertson [14:25]: "He brings up love because... he is coming to take on the enemies and save humanity."

Phil Robertson adds depth by connecting love with other divine attributes like wrath and mercy, explaining that these aspects flow naturally from God's loving nature.

Phil Robertson [37:07]: "Everyday of my life... you can't separate God's love."

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3. Exploring God's Love as the Core of His Power [31:10 - 43:38]

The Robertson family engages in a profound theological discussion about God's love being His greatest power. They analyze Psalm 136, breaking down each verse to understand how love is the underlying force driving God's mighty acts, such as creation, redemption, and delivering His people.

Jase Robertson [31:10]: "His love endures forever. So thoughts of where we're at here, because you basically have the power displayed in creation and redemption..."

Zach Dasher contributes by highlighting that love transcends fear, referencing 1 John 4:18 to explain that perfect love dispels fear, further solidifying love's paramount role in God's nature.

Zach Dasher [42:33]: "Think about Hebrews 12. God loves those he disciplines."

Phil elaborates on the interconnectedness of love with other attributes, illustrating that understanding God's love enhances the comprehension of His justice and mercy.

Phil Robertson [40:35]: "Love means nothing without a lover and a beloved... if your God is three persons in one being, now you can actually say God is love."

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4. Willie’s Bigfoot Encounter: A Lighthearted Family Tale [08:40 - 11:08]

Amidst the theological discussions, Jase shares a delightful family story where his brother Willie was mistaken for Bigfoot by their grandkids. This anecdote brings levity to the episode, showcasing the family's playful side and the joys of family interactions.

Jase Robertson [10:06]: "He looks like Bigfoot, you know, to a kid... but it's actually my brother. It's Willie."

The family laughs over the misinterpretation, emphasizing the warmth and humor that characterize their family life.

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5. Integrating Faith and Daily Life [43:38 - 52:27]

As the episode concludes, the Robertsons tie together their discussions on love and faith with everyday experiences. They stress the importance of embodying God's love in all interactions, drawing parallels between divine attributes and personal conduct.

Jase Robertson [40:35]: "It's the why? It answers the one question everybody can't answer. It is the why all these other attributes are being displayed."

They also preview the next episode, promising to delve deeper into the concept of "perfect love" and its implications for overcoming fear, encouraging listeners to continue exploring their faith alongside them.

Jase Robertson [51:05]: "I would like to go down that rabbit hole in our next podcast on the word perfect."

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Notable Quotes:

• Jase Robertson [00:31]: "I am unashamed. What about you?"
• Phil Robertson [40:35]: "Love means nothing without a lover and a beloved."
• Zach Dasher [42:33]: "Think about Hebrews 12. God loves those he disciplines."
• Jase Robertson [12:24]: "We missed something crucial in our five podcasts of John 11."

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Conclusion

Episode 1129 of Unashamed with the Robertson Family seamlessly blends heartfelt family stories with deep biblical insights, centering on the theme that love is the greatest manifestation of God's power. Through personal anecdotes and theological discussions, the Robertson family invites listeners to explore and embrace their faith in both spiritual and everyday contexts.

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Enjoyed this summary? Subscribe to Unashamed with the Robertson Family on Apple Podcasts, YouTube, or your favorite podcast platform to stay inspired and connected with the family's journey of faith and love.

Transcript

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[Jase Robertson]

I am unashamed. What about you?

[Zach Dasher]

All right, Maddie. I think I'm ready to get this ship going.

[Jase Robertson]

Go it. Let's start steering this ship. I feel like we need a sound effect. You know how when the ship leaves that, like, foghorn.

[Zach Dasher]

Maddie, put that in.

[Jase Robertson]

We need foghorn. Foghorn.

[Zach Dasher]

The ship is now pulling away from the dock. Welcome back to Unashamed. We've been having quite the pre podcast conversation with Jay's because Jace has not been sleeping, apparently.

[Jase Robertson]

No.

[Zach Dasher]

And so I don't know that he's wired together by caffeine and whatever, but he's.

[Phil Robertson]

He's in rare form.

[Zach Dasher]

He is in rare form in the priest, the cruise ship leaving the dock or whatever.

[Phil Robertson]

He came in hot, wanting confrontation. He's already told me. I've missed the boat on John 11. I mean, we missed it.

[Jase Robertson]

No, we all missed it. Hey, we're in the boat together. We. They say, you know, there's a. There's a saying in our family that all ships rise together because we got. Our family got so big. And God gave us this opportunity as a platform. Just. He put us on tv despite me and my dad saying, this will never work. Mark my words. I was. I was actually the amen guy.

[Zach Dasher]

Yeah.

[Jase Robertson]

Phil was like, this will never work. I was like, amen.

[Zach Dasher]

If only you had said, well, well.

[Jase Robertson]

But he's given us opportunity. But on this case. Yep, we missed it. And it's. But we found it last night, so. And I'm going to. Well, first of all, tell us what I'm even going to say.

[Zach Dasher]

We have no idea, but we're weighted with bated breath.

[Jase Robertson]

Well, I made a line that caused humor. Yeah. Going to tell you because my wife has become an expert in creating an atmosphere where difficulty thrives.

[Zach Dasher]

I so wish she was here.

[Jase Robertson]

And you got to remember, this is. This is my. We're one. This is me, me and her are one. We're 34 years into this creates an.

[Zach Dasher]

Atmosphere where difficulties flourish.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah. It just.

[Zach Dasher]

I'm gonna write that down.

[Jase Robertson]

Write it down. I don't know. I've never heard it before, but it popped into my Brain.

[Zach Dasher]

I'm gonna use it in marriage counseling.

[Jase Robertson]

Because this week, because one member of our. What are we, what are the people all together in a ship. What do they call that? Sailors. One of the three sailors, which is us. I'm talking, we're now sailors because the ship's pulling out here.

[Zach Dasher]

The ship's pulling out.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah. And we, we missed something in John 11. And we, a lot of people probably are like, this is going too slow, you're too bogged down. But all of a sudden we missed the forest for the trees in John 11. And so we're going to get into that today. If y' all would divulge me, if you disagree with me at the end of this, you can say, okay, but in the meantime, one of our sailors, I don't know which one of you, they have to have a week off because they're going somewhere or something. So every time we have that happen, we have to do an extra day of podcasts during the week. So it goes.

[Zach Dasher]

Because we love our sailors so much, don't we, Zach?

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah, we do four podcasts a week. I think this is interesting. This is how the sausage is being made. But so this week we're doing six. And I had my second trip to the great state of Arkansas and spoke to the Bible school. I don't know what that, what would you call them? Bible school. They're thinking about going to the Bible school.

[Zach Dasher]

You. Sounds like a camp for potential preachers.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah, I think that's what it is. And the first round was last week, you know, and I thought it was fantastic. I mean, I was. Because my philosophy is to gauge the audience. It's only about three dozen of them. And so I ask questions, they give answers. And I thought that first bunch, I thought, okay, yeah, I mean, because the questions that I was asking were just, you know, basic human questions. How'd you get on the earth? What do you do in here? And you know, what, what's next? How are you? How are you leaving? Or what happens after?

[Zach Dasher]

Did you get this style from Jesus and all the questions he asked?

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah, that's the Al. That's my ministry, you know, I think I call it doing Jesus stuff. Yeah. And so, and I asked another question. I was like, when you close your eyes and picture God, what do you see? Well, the first, first round, awesome answers. Because they pretty much got it right off the bat. It was some version of a 30 year old Jewish carpenter. I'm like, yes, yes. Because think about it, if we didn't have Jesus, would we really know what God is like.

[Zach Dasher]

Mm. It's true.

[Jase Robertson]

Think about that. That's very profound, I think. But anyway, this round, the answers that they gave, it was. They were thinking of the word. Well, I'll say what I said. They. I went around because they kept giving me answers, and I was like, anybody else? Anybody else? Because they were strange answers. And I said, well, that was embarrassing. And they were looking kind of bewildered. And I was like, oh, I'm not embarrassed. I'm embarrassed for you that that is how you're summing up life and you're part of it and your vision of God. I mean, it was embarrassing. Oh, my goodness. So I was like, but good news is, now I know why I'm here. And so it was just way more intensity. And there was a couple guys on their cell phones, you know, had none of that the whole time. And it took probably 30 minutes for them to put that cell phone down. Because I kept looking at them and I'm like, are you. Are you coming up with a better idea? I went Phil style on that than what I'm giving, which everybody's looking like, who's he talking to? I was looking at them two guys on their cell phones. I was like, are you coming up with a better. I'd raise my voice. Well, then they would look up and they'd look at me. I'd say, are you coming up with something better on that box than what I'm giving you about life and how they receive that? Well, they went back to their phones for the first 30 minutes, and finally I just kept raising the intensity, raising the bar, and they finally put it down. I thought, well, we've connected.

[Zach Dasher]

Then I'll be watching cat videos or something.

[Jase Robertson]

You talking about annoying. But anyway, so the reason I said about the difficulty is because you have all these things going on. And then Missy, which is beautiful, but it's difficult, she's like, oh, hey, by the way, I decided to take all the grandkids and. And they're going to stay with us this week. Well, let's throw that into the mix. You know, day one was exciting. You know, day two is I miss my mommy. You know, Day three, when are we leaving? You know, it's been that kind of train. And there we've just done various adventures and all that. But it's very difficult to sleep with all that going on or study, you know, prepare. So that's what I meant by the atmosphere of difficulty. But good difficulty. Just because it's difficult doesn't mean it's not great, but it's filled with distractions, and it's hard. It's hard to take a nap is what I'm getting.

[Zach Dasher]

Well, Jase, I want to just say on the record that thank you for, you know, diplomatically articulating my everyday life, because I never realized what Lisa was doing. But you. You have nailed it, my friend. It is creating scenarios where there are difficulties. They flourish.

[Phil Robertson]

That's every day of my life. Yeah.

[Jase Robertson]

I mean, because last night when she finally put him to bed and she came down. Because usually I take a nap because I don't sleep at night much. I take a nap every day. Well, we're getting on to the later part of the week here. There's been no naps. No. Because, you know, we have a handoff system because we have little man that we get, you know, frequently and often, and we just have a routine where it's like, I can tell when it's time for me to take over and take them on an adventure. So we go. We go all over, you know, the neighborhood, and we do various things. You know, I took. Yesterday, I took them fishing. We went to various playgrounds, and, you know, we. We just. We had an adventure. And so we saw Uncle Willie, which, you know, the little. Little. Little David. He was terrified, because I was like, he looks like Bigfoot, you know, to a kid. And they're like. I said, yeah, I know what you're thinking, because he was. I said, you think we found Bigfoot? I was like, but it's actually my brother. It's Willie.

[Zach Dasher]

But it's not just that. It's kind of new people, because he acted like that with me the first two times. But then once he warmed up to me, we were.

[Jase Robertson]

We were. Well, he never warmed up to Willie. I was like, we're on his property.

[Zach Dasher]

Warm.

[Jase Robertson]

I was like, you need to be nicer, David. We're on his property. These fish, he thinks they're his. You know, they are. So we're catching them. Funny. It was good times. So, yeah, that was kind of where we started.

[Phil Robertson]

Jill, what is the last thing you bought that you're like, I cannot believe the price is this high.

[Jase Robertson]

Oh, my. Everything. Corn. Corn. Corn. Okay.

[Phil Robertson]

I was gonna say carton of eggs, but.

[Jase Robertson]

Oh, yeah. No, that.

[Phil Robertson]

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[Zach Dasher]

So you discovered in your now whatever state you're in with the constant difficulties and you're not sleeping much and apparently you stayed up until the wee hours of the night and you have, you have told Zach and I this morning before we started that we missed something crucial in our five podcasts of John 11 as we're getting near the end of it, finally, that we missed something.

[Jase Robertson]

Crucial, or we, myself included.

[Zach Dasher]

The sailors.

[Phil Robertson]

The sailors, yeah.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah, we all missed it. So what I did, you know, because. Because what we do, Zach, is, you know, we tend to categorize things and try to sum it up and yeah, we do that, but, you know, I just actually did something that's, you know, simple, yet was revealing. I just said, let me just read it again. The actual Bible.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah.

[Jase Robertson]

And so when I read John 11, I thought, I think it came from me. You remember when we talked about why Jesus wept and. Yeah, because you don't really know. We just have all these theories. And I think the theories are probably accurate. You know, the question is, why is Jesus crying when he knew he was fixed to raise him up and had.

[Zach Dasher]

Actually even said it already like he'd been. Yeah, saying it.

[Jase Robertson]

It is a strange.

[Zach Dasher]

It's an odd.

[Jase Robertson]

So people, you know, oh, I know what it is, you know, and they say, whatever, but, you know, we really don't know. But I think just me thinking about why. Why did he wait two days? You know, they're like, the one who you love is sick. Well, that should have been the first clue. But, you know, I've said many times, when you read the Book of John, there's three aspects of God, kind of like his DNA, and they all start with the letter L. Do you remember what those are?

[Zach Dasher]

Love, life and light.

[Jase Robertson]

Yep. Well, what I found fascinating is I'm putting sunglasses on to try to read. You need reading glasses. You got dark, which just shows you right there, the difference between light and darkness and seeing and being blind. So I read this when it says in verse three, I guess so the sister sent word to Jesus, Lord, the one you love is sick. Well, there hadn't been a whole lot discussed about love up until this point. Would you agree?

[Phil Robertson]

You talking about in the Book of John?

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, you got John 3. 16.

[Jase Robertson]

Well, and John 3, 35. That's why I'm bringing this up. I think I have this pulled up somewhere because I did a little Google search on that. But.

[Zach Dasher]

And even. Even John 1, he mentioned more life and light. To your point.

[Jase Robertson]

Exactly. So John 3 is. Well, what I think there's. I don't think it's an argument. It's probably the most famous verse in the Bible, John 3, 16. For God so loved the world that he sent his son. And John the Baptist kind of doubled down on that. When he says, kind of in that. In that little riff he gave in the end of John 3 about the baptism, you know, he's like, well, hey, he's baptizing more people than you. Which actually, it wasn't Jesus baptizing, but. And so John the Baptist, like, pulled back, and all of a sudden he starts giving this vision between him being God's representative on earth, but him being from the earth, and then Jesus being from heaven. So it's a crazy narrative, but he brings up this aspect of love. You remember when he said in verse 31, John 3, 31, the one who comes from above is above all. The one who's from earth belongs to the earth. The one who comes from heaven is above all. Verse 32, he testifies to what he's seen in her, but no one accepts his testimony because they're like, God became a man. What the man who has accepted it, has certified that God is truthful. For the one whom God has sent speaks the words of God and gives the Spirit without limit, the Father. And then so he brings this up after he says, for God so loved the world. Jesus said that in John 3:16. Well, here John the Baptist says the Father loves the Son and has placed everything in his hands. So it's mentioned a couple of other times, I think, before chapter 11. But what I'm going to tell you is this was a shift, because all through John, you had these little theme lines that keep coming up like light and darkness and truth versus lies and life versus death. You know, light versus darkness. But you also have this love aspect of the kind of that DNA. Because after this, this conversation, this story, Love is mentioned 31 times from here to the end of the book. 31. That's a lot. There's not many. Yeah, we're almost at the end of the story here.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah.

[Jase Robertson]

So I think this is kind of that from John's literary style. All of a sudden, he brings up love. Because I want to bring up the verse that when I went, oh, I think we should have talked about this. Y' all tell me what you think about that. Yeah, it's verse five. So then in verse four, he says, when he heard this, Jesus said, this sickness will not end in death. Notice for God's glory, so that God's son may be glorified through it. And here we go. This is the one thing that we should have said. This is a big. From John's writing, this is what this is about. Jesus loved Martha and her sister and Lazarus. And so when you think about the attributes of God, this is the rabbit hole I went down through this. So most people. Which I think is actually a mistake, because I'll just tell you what I came up with and then I'll get your comments on it. We're fixing to see a display of God in human form, his power. He's going to raise a dead man from. From the dead, and he come back to life. Well, so when you think about God's power, there's a lot of things you could talk about, but we tend not to think about love as powerful. You know, when we think of God's power, what do you think? He's healing creations. Yeah, there you go. Al creation. We're like, oh, there's the power of God, you know, and then over here we have the love of God. Well, that. That thought is where I thought. I think we're missing something here. And the More I studied, and the more I read, the more I was like, oh, my goodness, I think we've missed something. Here's what I came up with. When you look at God's power, and I'm going to. I'm going to show you the verses that prove this, you do see the creation, you do see redemption. But you also see, even in Israel's history, where other nations who tried to take on God's chosen people, the Israelites, you saw God's power where he gave them the ability to overcome despite being outnumbered. I mean, think David versus Goliath. You're like, well, that's God's power. He's given them into his hand.

[Zach Dasher]

What I remember. Remember when he told Gideon, he used to. Gideon said, I'll take 3,000. He said, Nah, you just need 300.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah, same. Same point. And I think the. What I'm fixing to present here is when you talk about love. And I think the reason we missed it is, is it's kind of like what we do when we tell our loved ones, you know, I love you, or, you know I love you, or you think about the world's definition of love, which is usually either sex or, you know, I love this book. Or, you know, we say these statements like that. But just think about, how can you really love a book? I mean, the book's not going to love you back. We're just using that word. And that's not what that means.

[Zach Dasher]

I love fried chicken. You know, I mean, it's like, well, yeah, that's good. But how does that really help in the long run?

[Missy Robertson]

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[Jase Robertson]

So then you think of, like, things like First Corinthians 13. Well, see, these people had. The apostles had laid their hands on them and they had this power to do miraculous gifts, and they got hung up on the displays of the power. And what did Paul do in First Corinthians 13? He starts talking about, oh, you think you have all this special knowledge and you have all this. These displays of the powers of God and he gives them a definition of love, does he not? And he's like, you don't have that. You know what? You have nothing. And so I started thinking, what is love's. Why is love being introduced from John's point of view in a relational way? And I'm like, you know what? We're answering the why question in love. So you have. I know you have other verses where it says God is something, but when you look at love, when it says God is love, First John 4, God is love. And when you read passages like, I want to read this is. I missed this, but I'm going to read it to you in Psalm 116. I'm going to read this. And look, I read this before and I thought, oh, isn't this cute? You know, I'm being sarcastic of myself. So if y' all turn to 136, you're going to see my point about this power, how power displays and why God displays power and how as humans, we can miss. We can, like, categorize God with all these qualities because people love to do it. You know, if you start naming the qualities of God, they start. Just start naming them. What do they say?

[Zach Dasher]

He's eternal. He's omnipotent.

[Jase Robertson]

He said omnivor. We have all these qualities. Well, look, guess what? They put love in there with all the quality. Oh, yeah, he's loving also. And. And they'll say, oh, he's also. You know, he gets angry. And that's another quality. You know, he's. Well, I think we missed something with that mode of trying to discuss God. And I'm going to try to prove it from First Corinthians 13, John 11, and Psalm 136 and a lot of passages like that. So Psalm 136, it starts off and it's like, give thanks to the Lord, for he is good. And then there's a line. I'd love to know what Zach's translation is on this little phrase. There's various ones I look up. Sometimes it says, his faithful love endures forever. Then I've just says, his love endures forever. What does yours say?

[Phil Robertson]

His steadfast love endures forever.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah. Or his faithful love. What does yours say?

[Zach Dasher]

Al mine's Niv. So it just says, his love endures.

[Jase Robertson]

His love endures forever. So it says, give thanks. And it's like, oh, this is like a song or something, you know, it doesn't really have a title. Some of them have give you the details. Then it says, give thanks to the God of gods. Well, we've talked about that before. His love endures forever. Give thanks to the Lord of Lord, his love endures forever. We're talking about power now. He's the God of all gods. He is the Lord of all lords. And he's good, which would mean better than anybody else since there's no sin, there's no, you know.

[Zach Dasher]

But this would include heaven and earth, you know, because of his description.

[Jase Robertson]

Why does he keep saying his love endures forever? Now, look, he's going to do that 26 times because there's 26 verses. But watch where this goes. Verse 4, to him alone does great wonders. Well, we're. We're getting into God's display of power. Well, how does God display his power? Which is another question I probably should have asked because it's not like us. We have to, you know, we'll go work out or, you know, pump some iron and then we'll say, hey, watch this. I'm fixing to display some power. We, like pick up a. You know, you see these guys doing, you know, these.

[Zach Dasher]

Tear the phone book in half. Yeah, exactly.

[Jase Robertson]

Oh, look at me. Powerful, powerful. Well, how does God do that? Because we have an eternal being who doesn't. He's not made up like us, obviously. How does he do it? And I'll go ahead and answer it, because if you find the rabbit holes on. He wills it. All he has to do is will it just, like, let there be light. He just wanted light and there's light. I mean, it's pretty crazy if you think about it. But. But we get hung up on the results of him willing things in powerful ways, and the list is long. So who by. By his understanding made the heavens. But then you see the next. What does it say? His love endures forever. Why does it keep. Well, why does this keep happening? I mean, have you ever thought about this? Why does he keep repeating that? I mean, it's crazy. Who spread out the earth upon the water? His love endures forever. Who made the great lights? We're definitely into creation now, you know, thanks to. His love endures forever. The sun to govern the day. His love endures forever. The moon, the stars go. His love endures forever to him.

[Zach Dasher]

It's funny, J. Last night we were sitting out on our dock here, full moon, and we were marveling at God making the moon, reflecting from the sunlight and how beautiful. We're all taking pictures on our cell phone to. To prove your point.

[Jase Robertson]

Exactly. So look, then. So in verse 10, we start feeling uncomfortable because so far it's like, oh, he's his love. He's doing this all in love, which is the point, I think you have to. But then verse 10 is like, to him, we struck down the firstborn over Egypt. You're like, well, wait a minute now. His love endures forever. That doesn't seem very loving. Yeah, but you start thinking about the context of that. And enemies arose by their own choices who were not acknowledging God and not believing that he is the God of all gods.

[Zach Dasher]

And by the way, had 10 chances before this happening to do the right thing.

[Jase Robertson]

So then you can take a quality of God that God is just, or He's a protector, or he's going to do what's right. And so all of a sudden, enemies start doing really bad things to other people that God has made, and he moves in. So we think, okay, we're getting it. Love is the root of God taking on his enemies. So we keep going. And brought Israel out from among them. His love endures forever. With a mighty hand and outstretched arm, which is again, all this powerful language to him who divided the Red Sea. Remember how powerful that was? Imagine the greatest sea and all of a sudden it parting and brought Israel through the midst of it. His love endures forever. But swept Pharaoh and the army into the Red Sea. His love endures forever. We're like, you know, little uncomfortable, but we're like, I'm just going to trust him that it was love. To him who led his people through the desert. His love endures forever. Who struck down great kings. His love endures forever. And killed mighty kings. Another uncomfortable moment. His love endures forever. The king of the Amorites. His love endures forever. The king of Bashan. His love endures forever. And gave their land as an inheritance. His love endures forever. An inheritance to his servant Israel. His love endures forever. To the one who remembered us in our low estate, which I think is very profound verse. His love endures forever. And here we go and freed us from our enemies. His love endures forever.

[Phil Robertson]

It's a.

[Jase Robertson]

And who gives look and look. And who gives food to all creatures. His love endures forever.

[Zach Dasher]

That's the cycle of life there. Yes.

[Jase Robertson]

Well, to all, even though these ones that just died because he was taking on his enemies and the enemies of other people, but at the same time, he's given food to all creatures. Well, that includes all humans. Give thanks to the God of Heaven. His love endures forever. So thoughts of where we're at here, because you basically have the power displayed in creation and redemption and freedom of people in that section. But the theme line that the psalmist wrote was his love endures forever. And that's why I said, there's the why. Why did God do all this? The whole creation, the people. Exactly. And that is the thread. And I think when you get to something like John 11 and you're like, well, what did you miss? Well, I know from other verses that we've already read, the last enemy to be destroyed is death.

[Lisa Robertson]

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[Jase Robertson]

But I know one thing from reading Psalm 136 and all over the place about enemies who take on God, whether it be celestial powers or people who are in cahoots with celestial powers, acting like their powers, or bowing down to other gods and all this, God takes them all on because of that relational aspect of him with people in love. And it's deeper than just, oh, I love you. I mean, it's a love that while we're in low estate, while we're steeped in sin, while we're being oppressed, you know, whatever the context is, he's coming to take on the enemies and save humanity. It goes back to John 3:16. And I think that's why he introduced it here. Just the whole scenario about God being relational at its core and wanting to have this family of humans, him dwelling in their presence forevermore. And here he's become a human, you know, and got into these situations. Not only what I'm saying now, but it would be a pattern that all his disciples who got to see this, that's why that little section is, he said, I'm glad you're going to get to see this, Remember? And Thomas was like, oh, well, we'll go die with him. But he was wanting them to see this. Because when you fast forward this and get to Peter, you remember what he says at the end. He's like, do you love me? Do you love me? This post resurrection, do you love me? And then they start talking about the death that he was going to die. I mean, he's showing them, this is going to be extremely difficult. There are going to be tears, there's going to be suffering. But this is the crux of why I'm here. Because God's love endures forever. And I am God. Me and the Father are one.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah, it's hard for people, I think, for us humans to get our mind around that. And you can look at a lot of the debates over the centuries had centered around what you call the DNA of God. Another term for that is attributes, the attributes of God. And there are. You get. When you think about God's attributes, love being obviously one of them. There's others. You mentioned wrath, justice. You mentioned those two. His invisible qualities. You know, Romans calls it his invisible qualities. Power, omnipresent, meaning he's everywhere at the same time. He's not located in one place, he's everywhere. He's omniscient. He knows everything. There's all these attributes of God that are the DNA of what God is. And different confessions have tried to sum that up. And one of them is the Westminster Confession of Faith, which then they wrote some shorter versions of that. And I always had a problem with the definition that they used of God, primarily because the word love is nowhere to be found in when it says what is God? It doesn't say the word love. And I think I always found that to be troublesome. And I kind of understand why they may have left it out in some regard. But I don't think you can separate to your point. I mean, it's such a beautiful passage in Psalm 136, because the Psalmist is attaching the attribute of God's love to all these other things that God does, like justice and wrath and mercy. And for me, it's been helpful to understand even wrath as a function of love. Because why would God. Because I had the question, why does God have wrath? I mean, well, I think about my own family, and if you hurt one of my children, then you would experience the wrath of Zach. Because I love my children. And so my wrath, if I walk in and you're hurting one of my kids, then you're going to experience wrath. Where's that wrath coming from? It's coming from an intense love for my children. Right. I love them deeply. And you've hurt them. And I think that's one of the ways that we're made in God's image and we actually reflect his character and his nature, that if you mess with God's people, he's going to be upset about that.

[Jase Robertson]

Why?

[Phil Robertson]

Because he loves his people. But then there's this other problem that also flows from love, is that the people that are hurting God's people, guess who they are. They're God's. People, right? So then there's this whole thing about mercy where God, now he's going to levy out mercy, which is these are communicable attributes that God like. They only kind of make sense in the context of how God interacts with his creation. And so why does God give mercy on those that he gives mercy on? Because he loves them. So mercy and wrath both flow naturally from who God is. And I think that's why that first John passage where it says two times in 1 John 4, it says that God is love. And I think that that's what he's talking about. The centerpiece of who God is is love. And to your point, you can love fried chicken, but the problem with that is fried chicken can't love you back.

[Jase Robertson]

Exactly. Well, you went the same place I was going to go. I was going to. I discovered a couple things. But that first John 3, 16 says, this is how we know what love is. Jesus Christ laid down his life for us. Well, that's what we just read in chapter 10 when he said, no one takes my life from me, but I give it, and I lay down my life for the sheep. And so then in First John, it says, and we ought to lay down our lives for our brothers. And so here I think he's using that moment with Lazarus because he loved them. And it was really the crux of the whole reason why he's here is this is all based on love, and we've defined it. And I say we as in God being one with Jesus and the Holy Spirit. Because then when you read First John 4, it says this. This is 4, 9. I mean, really, I feel like I need to start in seven. I'll start in seven. Four, seven. Dear friends, let us love one another, for love comes from God. So just think about everything that is love on this planet. If you believe the Bible is the inspired word of God, you know where that came from. And I'm saying the definition of love, like 1 Corinthians 13, not the way we use it. You know, love is patient, love is kind. I think we should read it. But it says, for love comes from God. And you're like, well, how could it come from Him? Well, he answers it, everyone who loves has been born of God and knows God. Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah, he is love. I think the.

[Jase Robertson]

You can't make it, Zach, to your point, you can't make it an attribute alongside the other attributes. And I try to explain that because it's the why? It answers the one question everybody can't answer. It is the why all these other attributes are being displayed that you're like, oh, look at this power. But the greatest power is why he did it, because he is a lover. And love means nothing without a being displaying it.

[Phil Robertson]

And love. Love means nothing without a lover and a beloved. Which is. So then we're getting into the very nature of God now, because now you're thinking about, well, how can God love, but how can he be love? Who's the lover and who's the one that's beloved? Well, if your God is one person, then, yeah, God's not love. But if your God is three persons in one being, now you can actually say God. So rooted in the very framework of the triune God is this concept of that God is love. And I would say this, that I've heard people push back on maybe God's attribute of love because they fear. The fear is this is that if I over emphasize God's love at the expense of his wrath, injustice, then you end up with some form of like universalism, which is basically, hey, everybody's going to end up with God, doesn't matter where all roads lead to him. Kind of this post modern, you know, relativistic thing. Right? And all we're all on the same journey, different pathways, but God's love. But the way that. But the problem with that, it might.

[Jase Robertson]

Well, the problem is that, Zach, is that would be the same as me saying I don't want to go fishing because I might catch a gar. What do you mean? Well, I'm saying it's like you said, they come up with this idea of love. Yeah, they're scared that it's going to lead to something else. And I'm like, well, I love fishing. I'm going to go catch an opalous cat. But I can't go because what if I catch a garbage? Yeah, well, it's also bad logic is what I'm saying.

[Phil Robertson]

It's bad logic. And it's like this is the exact.

[Zach Dasher]

Think about Hebrews 12. God loves those he disciplines. So it's a very narrow understanding of love if it doesn't include discipline and wrath as you described earlier. And every aspect of who God is.

[Lisa Robertson]

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[Phil Robertson]

It also flows from the problem that Jase is mentioning and I've actually had this discussion with a lot people who are a lot smarter than I am, but I disagree with good people on this. But if you set. You can only have that problem if you separate these attributes from each other, if you separate God's love.

[Jase Robertson]

That's my whole point. That's my whole point.

[Phil Robertson]

That's the only way you have that dilemma. If wrath is necessarily flowing out of love, you can't separate them. So there's no such thing as overemphasizing love. It's just that, I mean, no, you emphasize it to the furthest degree that you can. And what's going to happen is you're going to actually increase your understanding of God's wrath, too, but you're also going to increase your understanding of God's mercy as well. So it's all of it. It's who he is. It is. It is God.

[Jase Robertson]

Well, that's why I think Psalm 136 addressed that subtly. If you read it again, all of a sudden he starts taking down kings, but his life forever. It's like, well, find that. You're not going to find a Psalm with 26 verses and say, his wrath endures forever. His wrath endures. Why is he picking love? Well, you see what I mean? And I'll tell you why I think this. I'm going to give you a silly illustration after I read this, but it's not. I'll let you decide whether it's silly, but I heard it somewhere, but I think it's good. So when you go to Ephesians 1, where he, you know, kind of goes back to the whole scheme of redemption and he starts off, I mean, y' all are familiar with it. I know, but I just want to pick, point out those two words when it says Ephesians 1:3. Because there's been so many doctrines come out of this that I just disagree with, because I think they've detached different aspects of God, kind of to fit a narrative. But if you just read it, and when he says, praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, who has blessed us, he's taught, you know, he's writing to people who are in Christ, Jews and Gentiles, and he makes a whole point about that in Chapter two. But it says, we've been blessed in the heavenly realms with every spiritual blessing in Christ, and he chose us in Christ, which is the display in human form of his love, which we wouldn't grasp who God is had he not come. But then he says, before the creation of the world to be holy and blameless in his sight. This is the plan. But then there's two words there right in the middle of this. In love, he predestined us to be adopted as his sons through Jesus Christ. Well, there's the overarching, which lines up with Psalm 136. Makes total sense. You're like, yeah, but what about all what had to happen for that to happen? Well, it doesn't matter to the point we're saying right now. But I know why he did it. And there's two words. I know why he did this from the beginning. Would you agree that it was in love because he was loved?

[Phil Robertson]

Well, let me read these three Old Testament verses. That to your point? Because the idea Is there a verse that says his wrath endures forever? I don't think there is one. There are?

[Jase Robertson]

No, I meant is there a psalm where it says it in succession? Don't you think that's a weird psalm?

[Phil Robertson]

I think it's weird.

[Jase Robertson]

Why would he say the same thing 26 times in a row?

[Phil Robertson]

Listen to Psalm 35. For his anger is but for a moment, but his favor is for a lifetime. Or Micah 7:18, who is a God like you, pardoning iniquity and passing over transgression for the remnant of his inheritance. He does not retain his anger forever because he delights in steadfast love, which is what my translation said in Psalm 136. And then Jeremiah 3:12 returned faithless Israel, declares the Lord, I will not look on you in anger, for I am merciful, declares the Lord. I will not be angry forever. And so I think the Scripture is pretty clear when it talks about the thing that is enduring is God's steadfast love. And that is so true even you see it in the New Testament. He says these three remain. What does he say? Faith, hope, and love in the Corinthian letter. Right.

[Jase Robertson]

The Paul says, oh, we're going to read it. We're going to read these three remain.

[Phil Robertson]

And the greatest of these, this one's the greatest.

[Jase Robertson]

Why would he say that? Why would he say that? Why would he say the greatest? Look, this rabbit hole. We're going to have to have a part two, because I know we don't have much time, but I want to get out this illustration because I heard it. I'm going to apply it. And look, it's an illustration. It's not found in the Bible, so you can take it or leave it, but I'm going to give you, like, a riddle. So, and I use I use fire on purpose here. So let's just say a fire station. A group of people at a fire station who. They make money, you know, to put out fires. And do we love and need. And I'm using the word love. Do we love and need these people? Yes. They're doing sacrificial acts. They're not worried about who the people are, what they go in there and go rushing and put their lie. They're willing to lay down their life to save others. And you're like, well, they get paid.

[Zach Dasher]

They don't ask what political party they are. They don't ask what race they are. They don't ask.

[Jase Robertson]

So that's not minimizing. We love firemen. Right. So I'm going to make an illustration with that vein. Let's say a firehouse full of firemen, they start going out and setting fires so that they can then go to them and put them out and get paid to do it. Now, what would you call that?

[Zach Dasher]

Not love?

[Jase Robertson]

What would you call that? Corruption. You could use the same illustration with a police force. Police force, same thing. They go out, encourage people to do crimes so that they can then go and lock them up. It's corruption. And I feel that's the same narrative. When you start off with the quality that, you know, anger or wrath from the beginning, it's like, because you have to go back to who's creating the scenario.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah.

[Jase Robertson]

So if God started the fire and then said, oh, and now I got to come down so I can put it out. Well, now, how is our view of God? Well, that seems corrupt. He's not a very nice person.

[Zach Dasher]

Isn't that what's the good? Maybe he's not good.

[Jase Robertson]

You know, isn't that what Jesus said.

[Zach Dasher]

When they said, you have a demon? And he says, well, how could I have a demon if I'm casting out demons?

[Jase Robertson]

Absolutely.

[Phil Robertson]

And what was blasphemy was. Yeah, that was what he called blasphemy. You're saying that I'm actually doing the work of. Of God. I'm performing miracles, and you're attributing the work of God to the work of the evil one. Yeah, we never want to attribute, you know, evil to God. That's not our God to evil. That's. That's a dangerous.

[Jase Robertson]

So that. I think it's a good illustration. I don't know if y' all agree, but I think looking at it like that, you're like, okay, because what you said is people are scared to focus on love being the driving force Enduring forever through all situations. And then Jesus comes and explains God. John 1:17. He makes him known. But all of a sudden, when you start reading about Jesus, you start seeing moments like John 11, and you're like, wow. And it makes people feel uncomfortable because they're like, well, how can it say the Lord is a warrior? And now all of a sudden he's over crying. You know, us as men. You know, when I first read that, I thought, ugh. I didn't really like that. Because Al, you know, how we were raised, you know, you don't cry.

[Zach Dasher]

Never.

[Jase Robertson]

Never. Which is so funny because years later, you know, the spirit indwelled, filled, and.

[Zach Dasher]

It took a while to keep us from crying.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah. And all of a sudden, you know, the last 10 years of his life, you know, I saw a lot of tears, you know, and not because of necessarily sad things. I would see him just. Just get teared up over something joyous happen, happening, you know, Remember that?

[Zach Dasher]

Remember the episode where we gave the home to the lady that we all loved and knew growing up? Dad just broke down, no doubt out of generosity, which was very powerful.

[Jase Robertson]

All right, but I wanted to say this one last thing before you close us out. When we get to the part two is when, while ago, when Zach made that argument about people that are fearful that if they focus on what the Bible says is what I'm saying, that love is flowing out from God. But later on in First John 4, he says there is no fear in love. That's verse 18. But perfect love drives out fear because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love. And I would like to go down that rabbit hole in our next podcast on the word perfect. It's mentioned 18 times in the New Testament.

[Zach Dasher]

That's where we're headed. And I agree. We missed something big. Jace was right. I'll give him credit. So we'll pick it up next time on Unashamed. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcasts. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube. And be sure to click the little bell and choose all notifications to watch every episode.