Ep 1136 | Jase Suspects Uncle Si in the Mailbox Hit-and-Run & When Doing Right Pays Off

Summary

Podcast Summary: Unashamed with the Robertson Family Episode: Ep 1136 | Jase Suspects Uncle Si in the Mailbox Hit-and-Run & When Doing Right Pays Off
Release Date: July 31, 2025
Host: Tread Lively
Guests: Phil Robertson, Al Robertson, Jase Robertson, Zach Robertson

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1. Introduction to the Episode

The Robertson family gathers once again on the Unashamed podcast to delve into their latest experiences and reflections on living out their Christian faith authentically. Hosted by Jase Robertson, this episode intertwines personal anecdotes with profound theological discussions, emphasizing integrity and the "now and not yet" aspects of the Kingdom of God.

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2. Jase's Sermon and the HVAC Incident

Timestamp: [00:06] - [06:16]

Jase begins by referencing his recent sermon titled "Doing the Right Thing, Even When Others do the Wrong Thing," inspired by Joshua and John 12. He shares a personal experience involving a deceptive HVAC contractor who attempted to scam his family:

Jase Robertson [01:43]: "I was a bit naive, but I've noticed in the H Vac world... someone left a flyer saying they'll check your unit. Turns out, it was a bait-and-switch, demanding exorbitant fees."

The situation escalates when the unscrupulous contractor even attempts to demean Jase's wife, Lisa, by stating he needs to speak with her husband:

Jase Robertson [02:40]: "He mansplained her a little bit by saying, now, look, I can talk to your husband if I need to."

Phil Robertson interjects to highlight the manipulative nature of such tactics:

Phil Robertson [01:46]: "Most people who do that, it's got a hook in it."

Breaking away from the negative interaction, Jase and his family decide to seek a second opinion. Enter their trustworthy, long-time HVAC contact, whose intervention not only resolves the issue efficiently but also exemplifies genuine integrity:

Jase Robertson [05:37]: "Your family has been a blessing to me for many years... this guy had been looking for a moment to be a blessing to us."

This heartwarming resolution reinforces the episode's core message about the rewards of doing right, even when others falter.

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3. The Mailbox Hit-and-Run Incident

Timestamp: [08:00] - [17:05]

Transitioning from HVAC woes, Jase narrates another mishap involving Uncle Si, who inadvertently destroys their mailbox in a hit-and-run:

Jase Robertson [09:59]: "Someone hit and ran, decapitating our brick mailbox. No one has claimed responsibility."

Despite initial suspicions pointing towards a familiar delivery person, the lack of evidence leads to uncertainty. This incident serves as a segue into discussions about trustworthiness and handling unforeseen challenges with grace.

Phil and Zach Robertson further reflect on maintaining good relationships despite such setbacks:

Phil Robertson [17:05]: "Sometimes you're a victim of other people's [actions]."

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4. Product Endorsements (Skipped)

Note: Advertisements and product placements mentioned in the transcript have been intentionally omitted from this summary to maintain focus on the episode's core content.

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5. Deep Dive into Theological Discussions

Timestamp: [18:47] - [54:28]

The podcast takes a profound turn as the Robertson family engages in a theological discourse prompted by a question from a new Christian listener regarding judgment in John 12:48:

Phil Robertson [25:22]: "He said, 'The very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day.' Is Jesus referring to Judgment Day?"

Jase and Zach explore the complexities of Biblical interpretation, particularly the "now and not yet" concept of God's Kingdom. They emphasize that understanding Scripture from both a human and divine perspective is crucial:

Zach Robertson [30:31]: "It's both [the present and future aspects]."

The conversation navigates through various scripture references, including John 12, John 5, John 4, and 2 Thessalonians 2, dissecting the intertwining of present realities and future expectations in Christian eschatology. They challenge the dispensationalist eschatology—a view often popularized by the "Left Behind" series—arguing for a more integrated understanding of the Kingdom being both a present and a future reality.

Phil Robertson introduces Greek lexicon studies to elucidate the use of time-related terms in the Gospel of John, arguing that Jesus' messages about judgment and glory are deeply rooted in both immediate and ultimate contexts:

Phil Robertson [27:37]: "Whoever this man of lawlessness is... how did they last 50 years if they're hooking and crooking people all the time?"

Zach counters by interpreting the "temple" metaphorically as the church, allowing for a contemporary application of eschatological events without confining them strictly to future physical structures.

The discussion culminates in affirming the necessity of faith—"believing the invisible is real"—as essential for navigating these complex theological landscapes:

Jase Robertson [53:16]: "It is now and it is later."

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6. Practical Applications and Faith in Action

Timestamp: [54:28] - [62:00]

As the episode nears its conclusion, the Robertson family ties back their theological insights to everyday living. They underscore the importance of integrity, community trust, and the role of faith in overcoming challenges, both mundane and spiritual.

Phil Robertson emphasizes the definition of faith from Hebrews 11, highlighting its role in sustaining believers through unseen realities:

Phil Robertson [54:28]: "Faith is being sure of what we hope for... and being certain of what we do not see."

The family also touches upon the sanctifying work of the Holy Spirit, as outlined in Ephesians 1:13 and Colossians 3:1, reinforcing the podcast's overarching theme of living an unashamed, faith-driven life.

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7. Conclusion and Teasers for Next Episode

The episode wraps up with reflections on faith, integrity, and the continuous journey of understanding God's Kingdom. The Robertson family hints at further exploring the "now and not yet" paradigm in their next episode, encouraging listeners to deepen their faith and trust in God's eternal perspective.

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Notable Quotes

• Phil Robertson [25:22]: "Is he talking about Judgment Day?"

• Jase Robertson [13:42]: "My thinking was, if I hit somebody's mailbox, I would stop my car, go to the door, knock on it, and say, I just hit your mailbox, but I'll make it right."

• Zach Robertson [30:31]: "It's both [the present and future aspects]."

• Phil Robertson [54:28]: "Faith is being sure of what we hope for... and being certain of what we do not see."

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Key Takeaways

1. Integrity in Everyday Actions: Jase's experience with the HVAC contractors exemplifies the rewards of choosing honesty and trustworthiness over deceit.

2. Handling Adversity with Grace: The mailbox incident underscores the importance of maintaining faith and composure when faced with unforeseen challenges.

3. Understanding the "Now and Not Yet": The theological discussion illuminates the present reality of God's Kingdom alongside its future fulfillment, urging believers to live faithfully in both dimensions.

4. Faith as Assurance: Emphasizing Hebrews 11, the podcast reinforces that true faith involves confidence in the unseen and trust in God's overarching plan.

5. Community and Support: The Robertson family's interactions highlight the value of a supportive community grounded in shared faith and values.

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For those seeking a faith-filled, honest, and engaging exploration of living out Christian principles, Unashamed with the Robertson Family continues to offer inspiring stories and deep theological insights. Subscribe and tune in to stay connected with their journey of faith and family.

Transcript

[Phil Robertson]

I am unashamed. What about you?

[Jase Robertson]

Welcome back to Unashamed. We were. We were talking about my sermon in the last podcast, and we're recording, of course, back to back, so same day, so still fresh on my mind, Jace. And, you know, the. The name of the sermon was Doing the Right Thing, Even When Others do the Wrong Thing. It was kind of based on the Joshua text I mentioned last podcast, but I mentioned about jury duty. But there were a couple other instances that happened last week that just, you know, I don't know. I guess when you get into sermon mode, I don't know, maybe y' all are like this or not, but you tend to view things that are happening in real time through the prism of what you tend to be studying. So you just kind of see things clearly. And there were a couple of instances where I just felt like people were not, like, stepping up to do the right thing. And I was. Maybe it's just because I was reading this text. One of them was an H Vac situation that I had down at the Southern Layer where there's some dripping in my air conditioning unit. And I don't know anything about anything in terms of fixing stuff. I mean, I'm pretty much, you know, a novice. I don't know how to do much, and so I'm pretty much dependent on people doing the right thing. So I admit I'm a bit naive, but I've noticed in the H Vac world, and I'm sure there's some listeners out there that are probably H Vac folks, there's a lot. There's kind of a wide interpretation of what's needed and what's not needed. And some person had left, like, a flyer hanging on our doorknob and said, hey, we'll come check your unit. We'll do regular checkups. And I was some. A company I'd never heard of.

[Phil Robertson]

I hate to tell you this. Most people who do that, it's. It's got a hook in it.

[Jase Robertson]

Well, you're. You're. You stand correct, sir, because. So I told Lisa, she said, we got this trip. And I said, well, didn't somebody just hang a flyer on the thing? This was not the right. This is what happens when you're an ignorant person like me about these things. So just call them. Sounds like this perfect timing, bad call. So guy shows up and says, well, let me look at it. And he says, well, it needs this, it needs that, and a couple of things here, and it'll be 500 a day, but it needs to be Cleaned the coils. That'll be 2,000. Now he's telling Lisa all this, and then he says, but you know what? We're really just delaying the inevitable. You need a new unit. $12,000. So that's the. That's the word to Lisa. And then he even mansplained her a little bit by saying, now, look, you know, I can talk to your husband if I need to.

[Phil Robertson]

He did what to her? Would you.

[Jase Robertson]

He mansplained, man.

[Phil Robertson]

What does that mean?

[Jase Robertson]

That means that, like, well, you're a woman. So let me just. If I need to talk to the man, let me. Let me explain it to him.

[Phil Robertson]

So she would say, oh, no, I'll do it.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah, exactly. I don't know what he was getting at. Like, you're like, oh, no, I run.

[Zach Robertson]

The show around here.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, Maddie's giving you a thumbs down. I don't even know what that means, man.

[Zach Robertson]

Man.

[Jase Robertson]

She does Maddie say, we don't approve. We don'. Be. And say, let me just talk to you, man. So that. Yeah, so he was a little bit insulting. Anyway, she tells me, and I said, look, don't do anything else. She had already spent the 500 because the man did something. You know, I don't know what he did, but he did.

[Phil Robertson]

They show up at your house that they'll send you a bill. Just if they look around, they did something.

[Jase Robertson]

He did some Freon or something. Anyway, so I said, don't spend any more money. Let's, let's. So I did at least know this. I said, let's get another set of eyes.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah.

[Jase Robertson]

On the situation. Let's get another bid or another person. So I said, didn't we have a guy that used to work on our old system down there and seemed like he was a fan of the Little Duck show and seemed like he did some work and it wasn't that expensive.

[Phil Robertson]

Was his name Mountain Man?

[Jase Robertson]

Let me tell you what, Think about that, too.

[Phil Robertson]

I would have called now. It would have been a 30 minute conversation with 5 minutes of content. However, he would do you right.

[Jase Robertson]

So here's what I didn't. I didn't think about Matt. I should have. So I call. So Lisa said, oh, yeah, yeah, yeah, that guy. So she looks on her phone, she finds the guy. She calls him. Yeah, I'll come right over. She comes over, he walks in. I'm there. Now, I wasn't there when Lisa had the first guy. And so he comes in. I remembered him. I said, hey, how's it going? How's the family? You know, like we're catching up. We know each other. I'm feeling way better already. And. But I told Lisa, I said, don't tell him anything about what's happened, because I want fresh. I don't want him knowing, like, somebody came in that we're questioning, because I want him to just say what he thinks by looking at the same situation. He looks in there stripping. Yeah, it's dripping. That's not good. It's probably the coils, which is what the other guy said. And so he said, these coils need to be cleaned. Well, that's what the other guy said, of course. He said, oh, that was going to cost me two grand. And I said, well, can you do that? Can you clean the coils? Is that a big deal? He said, I can knock that out just a few minutes. I said, really? He said, yeah. He said, let me go get my tools. He comes back in and he's going.

[Phil Robertson]

To charge you two grand?

[Jase Robertson]

No, no, no. He's just saying I can knock it out. I didn't even. He didn't say a price. He took.

[Zach Robertson]

You didn't tell him two grand, did you?

[Jase Robertson]

I didn't tell him anything. And so he. So. But. But again, this guy's worked on my stuff before. So look, he. He takes a picture of it, then he cleans it. Then he comes back and shows me the picture. He said, here's what it looked like before. And I said, oh, that looks nasty. He said, here's what it looks like now. Ooh, that looks good. I said, well, so what about the unit itself? What do you think? My whole unit? He said, oh, that unit's great. No problem. So then he said, here's the. Here's the money. Literally the money question. So I said, so what? I owe you. But I said, man, you've done me a great service today. He said. He looked at me, teared up. Really? When I asked him the question, he teared up. He said, you don't owe me anything.

[Phil Robertson]

He just did it for free? Yeah.

[Jase Robertson]

And I said, I don't owe you anything. He said, your family has been a blessing to me for many years. Your dad, you know, he totally turned my life around. I've been following you guys for years. I used to be this guy, and he explained his old life. Now I'm this guy, and he's. In fact, I'm leaving the whole H Vac business. I got something else. My grandkids. He said, this is my parting gift for you and your family. And I was like, what a Blessing, like, the whole thing was me just trying to get a second look. And this guy had been looking for a moment to be a blessing to us. And so again, back to my sermon. I was like, a little bit of due diligence.

[Zach Robertson]

Yeah. What would he have charged, though? What do you think he would have charged?

[Jase Robertson]

I don't know, two grand. I don't know. It wasn't two grand because it took it. You know how long it took him? 15. 15 minutes is how long it took him.

[Zach Robertson]

You got to have. You got to have a plumber in your friend group.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah.

[Zach Robertson]

And you got to have an H Vac guy in your friend group.

[Jase Robertson]

Correct.

[Zach Robertson]

You have to. I mean, if you don't have a guy, you have to have a guy. I mean, that's a. It's such an important role.

[Jase Robertson]

I tell these mechanics, own your car mechanics.

[Zach Robertson]

I advise young people right now, like everybody, not every. Look, you'll make more money going into a trade than you will if you go to college and get a degree right now. I'm telling you, there is a. If you live around, like, where I do. I mean, these guys are getting. A plumber gets about $200 an hour, and they got them stacked. I got appointments stacked up like cordwood. I mean, I'm telling you.

[Jase Robertson]

Well, especially somebody trustworthy. I mean, there's like, not trying to get with that. But what I do.

[Phil Robertson]

My. If we don't know a guy, I look and I got this from a guy who owns a plumbing business and heating and air, who's kind of in my inner circle. He's outside of our family, but he loves Jesus. But he told me, he's like, when you can't find somebody, you need to go look at who's been in business the longest. You find somebody who's had the business for 50 years. He's like, how did they last 50 years if they're hooking and crooking people all the time? So there's your tip, Al.

[Jase Robertson]

That's good.

[Phil Robertson]

That's.

[Jase Robertson]

That's good.

[Zach Robertson]

Wow. I'll give you another tip, too. In this day and age, if you're in a trade and you're handing out flyers, well, I mean, that. You can't find a tradesman anymore.

[Phil Robertson]

That's what I mean.

[Zach Robertson]

Like. Like. I mean, you got to be.

[Jase Robertson]

I mean, I thought that's why they were, like, hungry for business. I took it all the wrong way. I was a bit naive, which to back to my sermon. So, Jace, here's the other part. I didn't tell this at all yesterday. Yesterday in my sermon. And I don't know if you've noticed this. When you passed by my driveway today, did you notice my mailbox? Have you noticed it?

[Phil Robertson]

I noticed. I didn't notice it today because I noticed it a few days ago, but I figured it had something to do with psy, because when SA was on.

[Jase Robertson]

That's a good maybe.

[Phil Robertson]

Well.

[Jase Robertson]

Oh, man. You may be.

[Phil Robertson]

Cy was in the neighborhood while you were gone, and he destroyed Willie's bridge and his truck in about 30 seconds.

[Jase Robertson]

Which we talked about on the podcast.

[Phil Robertson]

But I was wondering.

[Zach Robertson]

He destroyed his bridge?

[Phil Robertson]

Oh, yeah. You'll have to listen to the podcast there. Vacation.

[Jase Robertson]

He thought he could drive across a walking bridge in his truck.

[Phil Robertson]

I don't think he thought he could. He just didn't want to wait.

[Jase Robertson]

And he followed Christian.

[Phil Robertson]

I mean, I didn't want to. You know, everybody thinks we're already at each other's throats. I've had a lot of people come up and say, what is your. Well, you're too mean to Zach. And I'm like, we're. That's how we show our love for one another. We have the big stuff down. Right. Our whole show that we do, we make fun of each other because the big stuff is fine. So if you can't laugh at yourself, we all make mistakes or whatever. SA was on here. And what my point was, I wanted to say I know because I know how SI is. He couldn't find where he was supposed to go, and he was panicking, and so always shows up early. And he's. He thought, I'll just drive across this bridge, even though it's big enough for a golf cart, not a full size vehicle.

[Jase Robertson]

Well, here. Here's what happens. So I get a call last week again, during this sermon prep for do the right Thing. And it's from my yard guy who says, look, you know, I got to the end of the driveway, and your ma, someone has hit your mailbox.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah, I saw it.

[Jase Robertson]

You know, and. And it's a brick. It's a big brick. We all have these brick ones in the neighborhood. And so it's big, and someone has hit it, and it literally just, like, decapitated it. Like, the top of it came off.

[Phil Robertson]

And they didn't even put it back on?

[Jase Robertson]

No, it's just laying there. They hit it and run and they ran. So the. The yard guy said, and these are people we go to church with for years, so I trust them.

[Phil Robertson]

You sure it wasn't them?

[Jase Robertson]

I don't know, because Some people have said it was them, but. But I asked him point blank and he said, no, I trust him. He said he blamed it on a certain one of the major delivery people. I won't call them out by name because I don't know if it happened or not. But one of the guys that works for this same company is one of our golfing buddies, a very close friend of yours, Jace. And I called him, I said, look, here's what happened. The yard guy said he thinks one of your guys hit my mailbox because he had just been there. And they got a big truck and I got a big mailbox. And so I said, but I don't know what happened. There's no camera. He didn't see it happen. So I call this company, I get this guy, very nice, very professional. And he's like, well, I'll check it out. You know, our trucks have cameras. I said, well, great, just look on there and see. I'm not trying to get anything. I mean, I just want to hit my mailbox. It would be nice because it's going to cost me a little money to fix it. Finally, they say, he says he didn't do it. Okay, I take him as where maybe didn't, but somebody did it.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah.

[Jase Robertson]

And no one has claimed responsibility. But now you brought in another possibility. I think about Sack, because he wouldn't even know if he did hit it. Probably, yeah.

[Phil Robertson]

He'd say, oh, well, hey, you should have moved it a little further from.

[Jase Robertson]

The river so it's still broken. No one has claimed responsibility. And so I guess I'm going to have to put up a new mailbox.

[Phil Robertson]

It's life. You were sinned against.

[Jase Robertson]

I was sinned against.

[Zach Robertson]

So did you guys know that all chips and fries used to be cooked in beef tallow? Up into the 1990s when the big corporations switched over to the cheap processed seed oils. Did you guys know that?

[Jase Robertson]

Did not.

[Phil Robertson]

I did not know that.

[Zach Robertson]

Well, there was a drastic change. I'm telling you, I love beef tallow. I like it because I think it tastes better. Snacking on masa chips is nothing like eating regular chips. You feel satisfied, light and energetic without the gross sluggish feeling afterwards.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, I know that. I love these chips. Actually, we had a porch full of people when they were delivered and everybody loved them. Let me test this for you. It's all about the crunch. Let's just see.

[Zach Robertson]

That's got a crunch.

[Phil Robertson]

Intense. Can you hear that, Jace?

[Jase Robertson]

The whole world can hear that.

[Zach Robertson]

The three ingredients are organic. Naxtimalized corn, sea salt, and then 100% grass fed beef tallow. Our family devour them, we can't keep them in stock. These are the best tortilla chips that I've ever had. Best on the market. I'm telling you, you're going to taste the difference. They're crunchier, they're tastier, they're sturdier than any other chip out there. Which means they don't break in your guacamole, which I hate that, you know, you dip in there and it breaks off.

[Phil Robertson]

Oh, it makes me mad.

[Zach Robertson]

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[Jase Robertson]

No one to. You know, my thinking was if I hit somebody's mailbox, I would stop my car, go to the door, knock on and say, I just hit your mailbox, but I'll make it right. That's what I would do. Because that's the right thing to do. But I don't know. Apparently not.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, our life is full of trouble. Sometimes it is your own making. That's right. Sometimes you're a victim of other people's.

[Jase Robertson]

So my bottom line was from my sermon yesterday, do the right thing, even if other people don't. So all right.

[Phil Robertson]

And do the right thing if nobody's watching.

[Jase Robertson]

That's exactly right. What if nobody sees it? Does that mean you should do the right thing? You should do the right thing. That's. That's being a person of integrity. So. So we're in John chapter 12. Last time we were together, we talked about the triumphal entry, which was Jesus coming into Jerusalem. And by the way, I didn't mention this in the last podcast, but Matthew 21:1 11, Mark 11:1 1 and Luke 19, 28, 44. All the other gospel accounts tell the same story. And we didn't go through the other accounts. We read a couple of excerpts. But if you read all of them together, you get a little more flavoring from all the different kind of eyewitness accounts of it. So I would encourage you guys to do that as well as look up some of those texts that Jase read from Psalm 118, Zechariah 9.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, he quoted them, right? And I think within this story you're like, why are they not getting this? But when you have a perceived view of God coming in to who God is, that can be dangerous because God became a human and was on our earth. But the religious people of the day, since he didn't fit into their narrative, which people do the same thing today, it's like, I believe in God. But then when you start listening to their thoughts, it's like, well, I believe in a God that I've created. Because when he looked the way he did, a lot of people, even to this day, they say this Jesus couldn't be God.

[Jase Robertson]

Right. I did want to bring up one thing before we leave, this thing about the triumphal entry about the king. If there's anything else you guys had to say too. But it was A point that N.T. wright brought up and I read his stuff along with this and he made an interesting observation that, you know, Jesus is coming into Jerusalem at the Passover, which we know, of course, is the festival that celebrates the Exodus, which, Zach, you spend quite a bit of time preaching on that from the book of Exodus. And the idea about this sacrificial lamb and this delivery and the establishment of the tabernacle later, the temple, the whole nation of Israel, the kingdom, all those things, that's kind of the celebration of that. But it's interesting because Jesus and NT Wright pointed this out. Even though the Hanukkah festival, which was back earlier, which is the celebration of the Maccabean kings that restored the temple after the Greeks had done what they had done and defiled it. He said Jesus is really taking two ideas and putting them into one entrance, which I thought was interesting. I never thought about for in other words, his coming in is both a celebration of Hanukkah and Passover. I am the king, I am the conqueror. I'm the builder of the ultimate temple, but I'm also the ultimate sacrifice. And so it's a kind of a combination of that.

[Phil Robertson]

It gets into the humility, love.

[Jase Robertson]

Right.

[Phil Robertson]

That's why I read the same two quotes, kind of have two different aspects of what Jesus is.

[Jase Robertson]

Right.

[Phil Robertson]

Which is true. It's not like we think, oh, he's a king, which. What is a king in a kingdom? They. They're kings of everybody else. And they do that through death and fear, right? Basically, yeah.

[Jase Robertson]

And you serve them. And he said he came.

[Zach Robertson]

And I mean, he is in a way. I mean, not in a way. I mean, he is Ultimately restoring the temple. I mean, that's what he's doing. So I think. I think that it's not like when we. It's a wrong theology, or I guess I should say it's a wrong eschatology. To view the Bible as the old way was bad and a failure. And like God of the Old Testament, that's mean God, God of the New Testament, he's nice God. Yeah, that's not really what's going on here. And I think you see it in what I mentioned in the last podcast that you have to understand that Jesus is the God from the Old Testament. And all those prophecies, all of that stuff, it's all in the Old Testament. So what's happening here is, no, this isn't a replacement theology. Like, we're not replacing the old way. This is actually a covenant that's continuing, a covenant of grace that continues to kind of expand and grow. And then when Jesus arrives in this moment, even this moment isn't the fullness of it. Even what we're in now is not the fullness of it. It's why we access the not yet now kingdom. Right? Yeah, it's here, but we're still waiting on the second coming of Christ.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, let's do that vein first, because I picked up on that vein what you just said and did a couple of little word studies from the Greek lexicon. And so let me lay this on you, Zack, see what you think. One, I would like to read the last verses of John 12. Hopefully we'll get through John 12 today, but if we don't, we'll get the last two. Just to go in with the point of what Zach just said about he didn't go from mean God to nice God. When he gets to the end of this dissertation about, you know, he predicts his death, the Jews continue in their unbelief.

[Jase Robertson]

He also expanded it to the whole world because you got that little instance where the Greeks are trying to find him. So, you know, you get that concept.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, right. So he gets down to verse 49, and he says, for I did not speak of my own accord, but the Father who sent me commanded me what to say and how to say it. I think that's interesting.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah, Yeah.

[Phil Robertson]

I know that his command leads to eternal life. So whatever I say is just what the Father has told me to say. So to give that connection, this is the same Father in quotations, that is the God of the Old Testament. And now you're even going back to Jesus the way John started this Whole letter. In the beginning was the Word. The Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. And then he goes on to say, through him, all things were made. Without him, nothing was made that has been made, which includes the evil one, which we talked about in the last podcast. I mean, God made him this celestial being, right? Who he then speaks of in John 12, saying, now, this is John 12:31. Before I get into the the now. What did you say, Zach?

[Zach Robertson]

The not yet now kingdom.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, look at this word here in 31. You see the first word. Now is the time for judgment on this world. Now the prince of this world will be driven out. Well, I had an interesting conversation that led me down this rabbit hole. So you remember a few podcasts ago, I told you about this guy. He was 18 years old. He lives right on the Texas Mexico border. His mom drove him up eight hours. I shared Jesus with him and I felt like, you know, he didn't have a father figure in his life for some reason. I agreed to do it because I just felt like it was a God orchestrated encounter and I have the Holy Spirit. I mean, it was nothing, you know, mystical. Ooh, what is going on? I just, I read the email and thought, yeah, I think I need to do this. Well, what happened is he confessed Jesus as Lord very tearfully and powerfully. I baptized him, went on his way. I gave him my number because I thought, doesn't have a father figure in his life. So I said, read the book of John and shoot me your questions. So that's been going on for, I guess, 10 days now. Well, one of the questions he asked me was this. And I think, Zach, you hit on this. He was reading the book of John, and when he read 48 of chapter 12, he asked a question. He said, there is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words. That very word, which I spoke will condemn him at the last day. So here's this new Christian, 10 days old, young fellow. So you realize he has immature qualities. He's only been in 10 days, and he's just young overall. Well, he read that, and I'm reading between the lines. Why would he ask me this question? Well, because it scared him. Yeah, he read that last day.

[Jase Robertson]

He didn't want to be that guy.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah, he thought, he said. So here was this question. He said, is he talking about the final day? Which. Or. Let me look at this now. What are the odds of this? This same fella just sent me a text. I Was going to look up our text thread.

[Jase Robertson]

Since we've been talking.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah, since we've been talking. So let me back up where he asked me this question. I want to get it exactly right.

[Jase Robertson]

So I've been on a health kick this last year. It's much needed. Zach, you and I decided we need to lose some weight, get our energy levels up. And, you know, we just needed some good nutrition to fuel our day. Right?

[Zach Robertson]

No, absolutely.

[Jase Robertson]

And look, we want it for ourselves. We also want it for our pets. And that's where our friends at Rough greens come in. So, you know, at our compound, sometimes I'm there by myself, and so I get the job of feeding the dogs. And so they just line up. Libby, who is. Who's the little Australian shepherd healer. And then you got Emmy and you got Rue, you got even Meatball, my next door neighbor dog, shows up at meal time. And even my cat Linda, down here at the Southern Layer, they all love their rough greens. It's America's number one dog supplement. It's packed with all the live nutrients that your dog or cat needs to keep them healthy and happy. You get a shinier coat, you get less scratching, better digestion, more energy. You can start your dog's day by adding a scoop of rough greens to their breakfast. My animals love it. They line up and they say, give us our rough greens. They don't say it out loud, but I. I could tell that's what they want. So here's what you do. You fetch a free jump start trial bag for your dog today. Just cover shipping. Call them at 214 R U F F dog. Or you can go to roughgreens.com and use the discount code unashamed. That. That's ruff greens.com discount code unashamed. Rough greens. So good your dog will ask for it by name.

[Phil Robertson]

Hey, sorry for the late message. He's actually sent me this message at 11:15 at night. Was wondering, in John 12:48, which I just read, is Jesus referring to Judgment Day? So you're like, well, how would you answer that question? So I just read you the verse. How would you respond to that?

[Jase Robertson]

I was just curious, is he referring to Judgment Day?

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah, that's what he said.

[Jase Robertson]

I would say, yes. The last.

[Zach Robertson]

I would say, yeah, yeah.

[Phil Robertson]

So here's what I said. I said, first of all, I said, we're actually in John 12 right now in the podcast, so wait a week and I'll give you the full answer. But I said, but to give you a shorter answer than an Entire podcast. I said, read John 12:31 and then read John 12:48, because something interesting happens. What? Jesus, he discusses in 31. What happening now? Well, I just read John 31. It says, now is the time for judgment on this world. Now, just. I want y' all to think about this. Well, why is he saying 15 verses? No, I can't add 17 verses earlier now. And he says it twice. Now is the time. Now the Prince of this world will be driven out. And then 17 verses later, he's saying, let me explain to you why I'm speaking, you know, about. With the Father who sent me. Oh, that's in 49. There is a judge for the one who rejects me and does not accept my words. That very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day. Well, which is it? Is this going to happen in the last day or is this happening now? We're talking about judgment in both cases, right?

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah, I'd say the answer is yes. But.

[Phil Robertson]

But look, my point is, see why this is so confusing. So. So what I could have answered him was, well, absolutely. It's talking about judgment day of the last day. But I felt like that would have been a bad way to answer that.

[Jase Robertson]

Question because he wouldn't have understood the moment that was happening there.

[Phil Robertson]

He just skipped over. I'm like, why didn't you bring up 31? Yep, this is confusing.

[Jase Robertson]

It is a good point.

[Phil Robertson]

Is it happening now? I mean, he's pretty emphatic, says now is the time for judgment. So you kind of have to back up, though, because we are taking these verses just out of the middle of nowhere. So when you go back to where Jesus started this whole thing, in verse 23, it says, the hour has come for the Son of man to be glorified. Well, when you back up to there, from there. So listen to this. You just back up after this triumphal entry, and he quotes the passages from zechariah and Psalm 118. Watch what John does in verse 16. At first, his disciples did not understand all this. Only after Jesus was glorified did they realize that these things had been written about him and that they had done these things to him. Well, you see, the connecting word there is glorified.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah.

[Phil Robertson]

So then a few verses later, Jesus predicted his death back to 23. The hour has come for the Son of man to be glorified. So what. What's that in the context of his death, burial, and resurrection? So my point is, I did a little rabbit hole on the word. The hour has Come and now. So you remember how many times he said something about the hour? Where does that start? Remember in John 2 when his mom said, hey, help me out here. Remember the.

[Jase Robertson]

She said, dear woman, why do you bother me? My hour has not yet come or my time is not yet come?

[Phil Robertson]

Why is he saying that? And there's other verses that he alludes to that I think John 4 says it. Yeah, John 4. Listen to this. Remember the woman at the well. So you have the John 2. That's verse 4. It's actually translated in the NIV. My time has not yet come. But it's the same word for hour. Yeah, because I looked it up in the Greek. Well, look at John 4.

[Jase Robertson]

21.

[Phil Robertson]

21. Jesus declared, Believe me, woman, a time is coming. Same word for hour. An hour is coming when you will worship the Father, Neither on this mountain nor in Jerusalem. Verse 23. Yet an hour is coming. And watch what the next phrase says. And has now come. Well, which is it? Is it coming or is it now here? What say you, Zach?

[Zach Robertson]

It's both.

[Phil Robertson]

I think this is amazing because people don't realize this is in the Bible. And like I said, it took a new Christian sending this to me for me to realize, oh, we've missed something here that's very important because we made it either or.

[Zach Robertson]

Well, and what happens is when you have to pick one or the other man, you're going to have a really hard time of making sense of the kingdom because you're going to get to certain passages. This is one I've been chewing on. I'm debating whether I should throw this out internally right now, but I'm going to throw it out there.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, you're not throwing it out internally. Oh, you're debating internally.

[Zach Robertson]

I was like, should I say this.

[Phil Robertson]

Outwardly, Zach, Go ahead and say it, and then I'll. Me and Al, we'll shoot you down. No, we'll judge on whether Maddie should edit out whatever you're fixing to say.

[Zach Robertson]

What I. Well, okay, so you get to a passage like Second Thessalonians, chapter two, and there's this reference to this man of lawlessness.

[Phil Robertson]

I like where you're going. We're not throwing this out. We're not editing this because I've been doing some study on this, and I have.

[Zach Robertson]

I've had trouble with this passage for years because I don't hold to what's called a dispensationalist eschatology. I don't hold to that.

[Phil Robertson]

Just use. Use phrases that I can participate in the Conversation with man, I thought this was so good.

[Zach Robertson]

Well, I'll just say this, that I.

[Phil Robertson]

Don'T know what dispensationalism means. So tell me. Just.

[Zach Robertson]

Well, it's like the, you know, like, like the Left behind series, the Rapture, all that, you know, what, what you see in a lot of kind of.

[Phil Robertson]

Pop culture simplified even more.

[Zach Robertson]

Zach simplified more that there is going to be at the end of time.

[Jase Robertson]

Thousand year reign, the last day.

[Phil Robertson]

It's not the last day. There's more days.

[Zach Robertson]

The church will be raptured up and there'll be this period of time where, you know, it's like another thousand year reign. Anyways, so. But you read this text. I mean I clearly do think that the text is talking about the end times. And I think that you can hold that position in 2nd Thessalonians 2 and believe in a real antichrist and a real apostasy of the church, a real figure coming up who will lead people astray and still hold that the kingdom is here and now. I don't think it. But I think the problem is if you try to fit everything into our box of like it's either all here or none of it's here, you're gonna have issue when you get into some of these passages.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, even, even though, even though I cannot interject because even though I disagree with, with some of the ways that you're understanding that I do agree with your overall principle. So we're on the same page. So like to me, I don't think that that's talking about the last day. Although when you do the not yet now application to doesn't upset my apple cart at all.

[Jase Robertson]

Because I think the last day came when Jesus was glorified is ultimately that's when it starts.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, what I was going to say is I think the problem with all this, all these arguments, boy, we're getting in the deep water here. I think where you have man's view of it, which is more understanding of the now because we're living it. The Bible writers wrote to real people. Did he write to people in Thessalonica who evidently somebody had come to them saying the resurrection's already taken place, so.

[Jase Robertson]

Quit your jobs, quit everything and then all of us next week.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah, well that's true. People who, because you have to suspend that sort of. If you're like, well, all of a sudden we're talking about something that's happened at least 2,000 years from now. And so. But I believe so you have man's perspective, but you also have God's perspective. Well, what is God? What is God? He's eternal. So I don't have a problem and nor do you with reading Ephesians 2. 6, saying that Jesus and he's talking about our conversion there. He's talking about, you were following the evil one, you were following your all these sins, but God, who is rich in mercy, and you have a conversion story here, we're talking about salvation. And then all of a sudden he drops in this weird verse that says he seated us with him in the heavenly realms. And you're like, well, I feel like I'm sitting right here in West Monroe in this chair talking about Jesus. How could that be? And people said, well, that's. Well, they don't have really anything to say about it.

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[Phil Robertson]

But I'm saying from God's perspective, I think he views the resurrection as already occurred because once you have the Holy Spirit. So it's very confusing to people because like Zach said, they're trying to put everything in a box from their perspective. So to get to my point before you, I didn't even say the parts I disagree with. The reason I don't think it's necessarily talking about the end, although it has the end of day consequences, is because he says one, whoever this man of lawlessness is, and he didn't call him the Antichrist, that was one of he said he's the man of lawlessness. Antichrist is never mentioned here. It's a man of lawlessness. That's one argument I had. Number two is whoever this was, he would set himself up in the temple. That is verse 4 of 2 Thessalonians 2. He will oppose and will exalt himself over everything that is called God or his worship, so that he sets himself up in God's temple, proclaiming himself to be God. So the reason I think it had to be somebody prior to A.D. 70, because the temple that is being referred to was destroyed in AD 70 and it's never been rebuilt. So what happens is people who have this, what do you call it? Dispensational view. They then have to make up a narrative saying, oh, evidently he's got to build that temple again at a date coming near you at. When he comes back so that he can reveal the man of lawlessness. Well, unfortunately, you just made that up. What the verse says is, whoever this man of lawlessness is, he's going to set himself up in the temple. So from my view, there were some Roman emperors who did set themselves up as God in that very temple. All you got to do is, I mean, look up AI, search and just say, Roman emperors who set themselves up in the temple of God. You'll be fascinated how many people fit that criteria. So that was going to be my small argument.

[Zach Robertson]

Yeah. Not to get too distracted by the argument that there is a position that I think is a valid position that would say that the temple is the church.

[Phil Robertson]

And so wholeheartedly believe that so.

[Zach Robertson]

So the man of lawlessness can set himself up in the church as a.

[Phil Robertson]

As a. Oh, I see what you're.

[Zach Robertson]

Church.

[Phil Robertson]

Oh, okay.

[Zach Robertson]

And so he comes, as I'm saying, you can interpret this as a future reality.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah, that would be a more consistent argument on that. If somebody had that argument, I'd say, okay, well, that makes more sense. They would be.

[Zach Robertson]

Well, but I think what the point here, though, because this, you said getting in the weeds or getting deep. But here's the truth, though. Where does it.

[Phil Robertson]

Where.

[Zach Robertson]

This is where I think it really matters. Like, really, really, really matters. Going back to John 12 and John 12, when he says that the disciples did not understand what he was talking about. They didn't understand any of this. Only after Jesus was glorified did they realize that these things have been written about him and that these things have been done to him. What things? These are Old Testament prophecies. And so. Well, then the question is, well, when did they figure it out? Well, he says when he was glorified. But when exactly is that recorded in scripture? And it actually is recorded In Luke chapter 24, when Jesus is on the road to Emmaus after his resurrection. He had experienced the resurrection. And then he meets with the disciples. And in three different occasions in the text. Well, first he rolls up on these guys and they're just completely destroyed because they thought, according to the verse here, that we had hoped. This is Luke 24:21. We had hoped that he, meaning Jesus, was the one to redeem Israel. And yes. And besides all this, it's now been three, the third day since these things happened. In other words, we thought that Jesus is talking to him. They don't know it's Jesus yet. And they're like, we thought this guy was going to redeem Israel and he's been dead for three days. And Jesus hears how they had interpreted all of it. They were so centralized on the DNA of Israel that they missed the eschatological accomplishment that Jesus was going to bring to bring the nations to himself. And so what Jesus does is he said to them in verse 25, O foolish ones and slow of heart to believe all that the prophets have spoken. What? They say that in the Old Testament scriptures. It's what they didn't understand in John 12. Was it not necessary that the Christ should suffer these things and enter into his glory? And beginning with Moses and all the prophets, listen, what Jesus does, he interpreted to them all of the scriptures, the things concerning himself. So this is the moment where they're like, getting it, and they're like, wait a second. Well, you're telling me that that guy in the Old Testament is Jesus and Jesus. Yeah. So then he leaves them and they say, did not our hearts burn within us while he talked to us on the road, while he opened to us the scriptures? That's what they said. Well, then Jesus goes up and he appears to the disciples. And this is skipping down to verse 45. It says that, well, verse 44, he said to them, these are my words. That I spoke to you while I was with you, that everything written about me or where was it written? In the law of Moses, where else? In the prophets. Anywhere else? Yep. And the Psalms. It must be fulfilled. Then he opened their minds to understand the scriptures and he said to them, thus it is written where in the Old Testament that the Christ should suffer and on the third day rise from the dead, and that repentance for forgiveness of sins should be proclaimed in his name. To who? To all nations, beginning in Jerusalem. That's the gospel. Paul says that. The gospel. First for the Jew, then for the Gentile. That's what he says. It's the whole name of this podcast, Unashamed. It's a quote from Romans, chapter one. First for the Jewish than for the Gentile. So this is where it matters is if your eschatology is leading you to not fully trust in the fact that God brought the temple to all the nations like we are the temple, then you have the wrong eschatology. That's the whole point of the entire thing, is that God takes up his residence with humans now. Which humans? All kinds of humans. Jewish Gentile, slave free, male, female, all of us, we're all caught up into the eschatological kingdom of God that's here and now, and we wait for its full fruition.

[Phil Robertson]

Can I, can I comment on this? So I think you're right and I want to show you how in John, what you just said is true. He's going to do this and we're going to get to these verses, but I think if you read them in succession, you're like, oh, so I started this off reading John 12, 49, 50, when Jesus said, and it's in the context of the hour has come for the Son of Man to be glorified. Now is the time for judgment. Now the Prince of the world be driven out.

[Jase Robertson]

And again, the context is he's summing up everything he's been teaching for three years because he's about to do it.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah, but he throws this in about the very word which I spoke will condemn him at the last day. There are consequences, what you're calling eschatology of what's going to happen later, but it's more focused on what's happening now. But Even in John 5, remember, when he's like, I'll raise him up at the last day, he keeps going through both narratives. So when you compare John 12, 47, 50, where he says, for I didn't speak of my own accord, I spoke exactly what the father said. And then you Skip to John 14 and I'll read the verse that Zach basically just quoted, which is verse 23, where it says, if anyone loves me, he will obey my teaching. My father will love him and we will come to him and make our home with him. Now you think he was talking about now or later? Well, that was in the context of him pouring out his spirit, which would be a now thing for him. Right? But watch what verse 29 says. I have told you. Well, there's our word now. I told you now before it happens, so that when it does happen, you will believe.

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[Phil Robertson]

So let me back up. So what's he talking about so verse 28, he says, you heard me say I am going away and I'm coming back to you. If you love me, you would be glad that I am going to the Father, for the Father is greater than I. So he's predicting him going to the Father and pouring out his spirit, right?

[Jase Robertson]

Yep.

[Phil Robertson]

I have told you now before it happens, so that when it does happen, you will believe. I will not speak with you much longer, for the prince of this world is coming. Well, I thought this prince of the world had been condemned. We just read that in John 12, you see, but he was saying that in the prediction of him dying, being buried and being raised and going to the right hand. So it's all making sense. He has no hold on me. But the world must learn that I love the Father and that I do exactly what my Father has commanded. Which is the same thing he just said in John 12:47, 50, which is why I'm going here. So there's one other place in John 17 that he seems to say the same thing. So turn to John 17, and in verse 5, it says, and now he's praying for himself. Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory. Which is what John 12 is about. Then look at verse 7 now, same word. They know everything you have given me comes from you, which is the same thing he's been saying. For I gave them the words you gave me, and they accepted them. It's the exact same terminology, John 12. So now come to verse 13. And this is where I wanted to get. I am coming to you. Here's the word again now. But I say these things while I'm still in the world, so that they may have the full measure of my joy within them. I have given them your word, and the world has hated them, for they are not of the world anymore than I am of the world. My prayer is not that you take them out of the world, so your rapture view would come into play there. You know, he's like, I'm not praying for that right now, because watch. But that you protect them from the evil one. They are not of the world, even as I am not of it. Sanctify. Set them apart by the truth. Your word is truth. And here's where I want to get to verse 18. As you sent me into the world, I have sent them into the world. For them I sanctify myself that they too may be truly sanctified. So you probably see my point, and.

[Jase Robertson]

The Holy Spirit is the one that does the sanctifying Because Paul tells us.

[Phil Robertson]

That, yeah, he has a plan, he has a purpose. And the purpose is, look, I'm fixed to save you. Yes, we all agree with that by his death, burial and resurrection. But he's also adding this point of, I'm going to give you my spirit. We're going to come and make our home with you now. And then what are you going to do? Just like the Father sent me to do what I'm doing, we're going to send you and we're going to be with you through your spirit. The ramifications of that later, like the new Christian asked, of course, of course, on the last day, you're going to look up. But it's more like a sentencing because he said, you know, now the evil one stands condemned. Well, why is he praying here later that we need protection? Well, he's still going to be fighting, just like he's fighting me. And we're going to use that for the greater good by his destruction.

[Jase Robertson]

And you're right, though you said it earlier, what makes it confusing to people is because you got to understand, you said it. That God's perspective. You're talking about a God outside of time and space. Exactly. That now comes into time and space. And so when he uses language like we've been reading, like you've been reading in the Book of John, or the I am language, which is all over the Bible, that's a being that can do that because he is outside and yet now he's inside and yet he's going back outside.

[Phil Robertson]

And that's why Zach wasn't here on our last podcast. But I thought dropped a drop mic moment. When Jesus became a man and he died and he was buried and he's resurrected since he's a member of what we call the Trinity and he is now forever a man.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, that did something that we don't talk about it then entered humanity.

[Jase Robertson]

Yeah. Into that realm, into the Godhead.

[Phil Robertson]

So the problem for us mere humans who haven't had that happen with a new mode of being, post resurrected body, imperishable body, body like he is, we have a very hard time understanding his perspective. That's right. And so when you read the Bible, like 2 Thessalonians 2 that Zach read for years, I had a problem with that also, but now I get it. I'm like, oh, wait a minute. He's looking at the accomplished resurrection, because first Thessalonians 4, he's talking about Jesus coming back, the dead in Christ rising first and the people still alive, being Changed, you know? Well, trying to make all that work in your human box is very difficult.

[Jase Robertson]

Very difficult.

[Phil Robertson]

But I think if you look at it from God's perspective and your perspective, and you have the Holy Spirit, he's.

[Jase Robertson]

Already seeing you as I made the same point in the Old Testament from Joshua, that we understand the word justice. It's hard for us because in our limited view of justice, we have no way to look into the future.

[Phil Robertson]

Yeah.

[Jase Robertson]

So we can only look at evidence of the past. Well, God knows it all well. So when he says something over 400 years of time, he's like, I got it.

[Zach Robertson]

And it's not just that, that we could only look at evidence from the past. We could only look at a limited amount of evidence.

[Jase Robertson]

And I witness again, knowledge.

[Zach Robertson]

And it's, it's. But I was thinking though, get kind of going back to where Jesus is headed with the core of his entire argument or story in John, the way John's Gospel plays out, that it really is about God making his home with us. When he's like, we'll come and make our home with you.

[Phil Robertson]

Amen.

[Zach Robertson]

It really is the central piece of the entire thing that the Holy Spirit will now live in the body of believers. Like your body is a temple of the Holy Spirit. And you think about just the incredible truth that that is. It is the most incredible thing that you could ever possibly imagine that the God of the cosmos would take up residence in a human body. And so that's so big that I just don't understand how like to me, like focusing on another temple being built somewhere in the Gaza Strip just seems so small.

[Jase Robertson]

And Remember, remember Ephesians 1:13, Zach. And that holy Spirit you just described is a deposit guaranteeing our inheritance of then our own glorification. So it is now and it is later.

[Phil Robertson]

Well, I want to say this because I know we are out of time. You got to remember what the definition of faith is. And I think we should lead into this for our next podcast. Faith is being sure of what we hope for. We figure that out and we argue about what's going to happen when Jesus comes back. But that next little phrase, and it's being certain of what we do not see. That's Hebrews 11 and part of the Christian life and having the Holy Spirit and realizing that God is sending us out just like he did his disciples before. All that goes down is believing the invisible is real. And so that's why you get to passages like Colossians 3:1 that says since you've been raised with Christ and this is coming off being baptized in Colossians 2. Since you died with Christ there, since you've been raised with Christ, you set your hearts on things above where Christ is seated at the right hand of God. Set your mind on things above. These are invisible things, not on earthly things. For you died and your life is now hidden with Christ in God. When Christ who is your life appears, you will also appear with him in glory. It's the now and the not yet. But to do that you got to believe in the invisible with assurance.

[Jase Robertson]

So Zach, I'd say you need to start a podcast and call it Not yet now, but we'll talk about that next time on Unashamed. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcast and don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube and be sure to click the little bell and choose all notifications to watch every episode.