Ep 1240 | Dave Ramsey & Willie Robertson Share Money Lessons Learned the Hard Way

Summary

Podcast Summary — Unashamed with the Robertson Family

Episode 1240 | Dave Ramsey & Willie Robertson Share Money Lessons Learned the Hard Way
Release Date: January 5, 2026
Host: Tread Lively
Guests: Dave Ramsey, Willie Robertson, Robertson family (Phil, Al, Jase, Zach)

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Overview

This episode kicks off the new year with finance expert Dave Ramsey joining the Robertson family for an honest, humorous, and relatable discussion about money, faith, family, and the hard lessons learned along the way. The group dives deep into real-life stories, biblical principles behind financial wisdom, generational challenges, and what it takes to build wealth God’s way while maintaining humility and perspective. The episode is rich in candid family banter, storytelling, and practical insights that transcend finances and speak to emotional growth, stewardship, and legacy.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Dave Ramsey’s Introduction & Connections with the Robertsons

• [00:01–02:33] The episode starts with light banter, humorously establishing that Jace barely knows who Dave is and has just begun to understand his impact. Both families connect over their shared Southern roots and faith journeys.
  • “Common sense is so rare now. It’s like having a superpower.” — Dave Ramsey [01:17]
  • The Robertsons reminisce about early talk radio influences and local church events Dave hosted in West Monroe.

2. Stories from the Duck Blind

• [04:31–06:12] Dave shares about his second-ever duck hunt with the Dynasty family, relaying his awe and fun, and the classic joking about who got the best shots.
  • “I’m hunted with the Dynasty. I mean, come on.” — Dave Ramsey [04:44]

3. The “Dave Ramsey Envelopes” Story

• [06:03–09:06] Willie and Zach tell the now-legendary origin story of how Zach, early into Dave’s method, paid Willie from categorically labeled cash envelopes. At the time, Willie was hustling odd jobs and unimpressed—until years later, success shifted and the lesson hit home.
  • “Let me just tell you what. Right now, you do what you do, I’m gonna do what I do. We'll see who comes out ahead, okay?” — Zach (via Willie) [08:38]
  • “Behold, who was cleaning the yard? Who built the house?” — Willie [08:56]
• [09:36–10:19] Later, when Willie’s success grew, he’d call up Zach playfully (“remember that time you said...?”), reinforcing how early financial principles paid off in the long run.

4. How Dave & Willie Met & Became Friends

• [12:21–13:45] Through mutual friend Adam LaRoche and chance encounters at media events. They highlight shared values (faith, people, hunting, golf).
  • “We’re just cut from the same cloth. We love people, love Jesus, and love talking to people about it.” — Dave Ramsey [13:23]

5. Golf, Trash Talk, and Lessons in Humility

• [13:45–16:44] Shared adventures in golf and good-natured trash talk, including tormenting Dr. Henry Cloud during a round. This leads to a greater discussion about competition, character, and learning from reactions (winning vs. growing).
  • “I just want to see him either rise up or just fold up. Either way is equal joy to me.” — Willie [16:31]

6. Dave Ramsey’s Testimony and Financial Ruin

• [17:47–22:27] Phil prompts Dave to share how he started. Dave recounts his early life: marrying while broke, being inspired to faith by his Baptist wife, reaching riches ($4m real estate, $250k/year at 26)—and then losing everything in bankruptcy due to poor stewardship and debt.
  • “I met God on the way up. I got to know him on the way down.” — Dave Ramsey [20:19]
• Afterward, learning and applying biblical money principles became his new mission.

7. Starting the Show & Ministry

• [22:27–23:57] Dave discusses how he began doing financial counseling at church, then launched his radio show “out of a double wide” which grew due to his plainspoken, biblical-based advice.

8. Financial Growth, Wisdom & the Power of Looking Back

• [25:30–28:12] Discussion shifts to spiritual maturity, gratitude, and the perspective that comes with age and setbacks. They touch on how God’s providence is more visible in hindsight.
  • “Our efforts are so multiplied by the great I Am... Any time you multiply something by the infinite... the answer is infinite.” — Dave Ramsey [26:40]

9. Delayed Gratification & Countercultural Wisdom

• [27:07–29:09] The conversation highlights America’s “affordability crisis,” the dangers of credit traps, and why delayed gratification is a rare but vital virtue.
  • “Don’t trade what you want most for what you want right now.” — Willie (on Dave’s principle) [27:27]
  • “The ability to delay pleasure is a sign of emotional and spiritual maturity.” — Dave Ramsey [27:37]

10. Banks, Debt, and the Modern Rigged System

• [29:09–31:29] Dave explains how modern consumer debt (credit cards, car loans, student loans) preys on younger generations, and why banks are the real villains—not just market forces or inflation.

11. Callers, Counseling, and the Hardest Money Lessons

• [31:44–33:04] Dave recounts common listener predicaments, most of which stem from poor spending and car debt. The advice is blunt: Get on a budget, get more work, sell the car—don’t spiritualize irresponsibility.
  • “God gave us this car.”
    “Absolutely he did not. ...Your car payment is half your take home pay. ...This car represents sorrow. It’s 100% a curse.” — [32:19]

12. Parenting, Generosity, and Teaching Financial Wisdom

• [36:04–38:23] The family discusses how they guided their children regarding college expenses, cars, and work ethic—balancing support, generosity, and the importance of “struggle.”
  • “We had our kids growing up on commission, not on allowance. Allowance sounded like welfare to me.”— Dave Ramsey [37:56]
  • Matching kid’s savings for first car: “401 Dave.” [38:13]

13. Humility, Sharing Wealth, and Biblical Parallels

• [38:23–41:04] The group unpacks the stories of the rich young ruler and Zacchaeus, connecting biblical examples to financial integrity and generosity. They highlight the joy of giving and lessons learned through hardship.
  • “I don’t own anything. ...What do you want to do today, God, with this?” — Dave Ramsey [41:04]

14. Family, Fairness & Succession

• [44:06–51:53] Open discussion on raising kids in family businesses, navigating jealousy, fairness, and imparting values. Dave shares how his own children work at Ramsey Solutions, are paid according to role, and have been coached to celebrate each others’ differing successes.
  • “Fair is where the tilt-a-whirl and the cotton candy is. So we don’t have fair.” — Dave Ramsey [48:11]
  • “You get paid for your role. Stay in your lane.” — Dave Ramsey [51:10]

15. Final Words and Encouragement

• [53:14–54:54] Dave closes by inviting listeners to RamseySolutions.com and reassures them they’re never too far gone. Applying biblical wisdom on work, spending, giving, and stewardship will always lead to freedom and purpose.
  • “God has a plan not to bring you harm, but to bring you hope. And when you do, this is His love letter to a kid like me, and when I live this way, it changes everything.” — Dave Ramsey [53:55]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• “Common sense is so rare now. It’s like having a superpower.” — Dave Ramsey [01:17]
• “I met God on the way up. I got to know him on the way down.” — Dave Ramsey [20:19]
• “Don’t trade what you want most for what you want right now.” — A Ramsey motto, repeated by Willie [27:27]
• “The ability to delay pleasure is a sign of emotional and spiritual maturity.” — Dave Ramsey [27:37]
• “Fair is where the tilt-a-whirl and the cotton candy is. So we don’t have fair.” — Dave Ramsey [48:11]
• “I don’t own anything. ...What do you want to do today, God, with this?” — Dave Ramsey [41:04]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:01–02:33] — Introduction, Dave Ramsey meets the Robertsons
• [04:31–06:12] — Duck hunting stories
• [06:03–09:06] — “Dave Ramsey envelopes” and learning about budgeting
• [12:21–13:45] — How Dave and Willie met
• [17:47–22:27] — Dave’s backstory: riches, bankruptcy, and faith
• [29:09–31:29] — The systemic debt trap for young people
• [31:44–33:17] — Hard advice: Sell the car & take responsibility
• [36:04–38:23] — Teaching kids the value of money
• [44:06–51:53] — Family fairness, succession, and working with children
• [53:14–54:54] — Final advice and encouragement

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Tone & Language

The episode is warm, unfiltered, full of southern humor, and marked by direct, common-sense wisdom. There’s a clear emphasis on humility, faith, family loyalty, and the importance of learning from mistakes. The speakers mix biblical language and life experience, creating an accessible and motivating message for listeners of all backgrounds.

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For Listeners

If you’re struggling with finances, feeling stuck, or just want time-tested advice—practical, faith-based wisdom is here. For more, check out RamseySolutions.com and dig into Dave’s books and resources. Remember: “You do not have to stay in the soup just because you found yourself in the soup... God has a plan... to bring you hope.” [53:36]

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Summary by Unashamed Podcast Summarizer — covering faith, finance, and the funny stuff in between, so you don’t have to miss a moment.

Transcript

[Dave Ramsey]

I am unashamed. What about you?

[Jace]

So welcome back to unashamed, as promised. Jace, we have promised, and now we have delivered. We said we were starting the new year off with a bang. The very special guest.

[Willie]

Thank you, guys. Thank you. Thank you. I appreciate it. It's good to be back. I'm so glad to have Willie. It's good to be back.

[Jace]

And Willie brought somebody with you.

[Willie]

Who's this guy just kicked the hoop? Who is this guy? Well, we've been trying for 30 minutes to explain to Jace who Dave Ramsey is.

[Phil]

I have apologized. I told you. My line on that was my dad.

[Willie]

Jay's like, who's the other guy here?

[Phil]

My dad told me that I had fallen through a crack in society, but that was okay. I'm surviving.

[Willie]

You fell through a crack, all right. You fell through a crack out of that Volkswagen. We used to drive around and hit the pavement by a hole in the bottom.

[Phil]

My son showed me one clip of your show. Cause he said you had a radio show. Which then I said, are they still doing radio? But you explained to me that it's the same kind of thing we're doing.

[Jace]

You have radio or podcast, Internet, where everybody is.

[Phil]

He showed me one clip, and I thought, yep, common sense and blunt. I see how this guy has been successful. So I'm hooked.

[Dave Ramsey]

There you go. Well, common sense is so rare now. It's like having a superpower.

[Jace]

So that's true. Yeah.

[Willie]

Well, Dave, I'm just glad you got validated by Jay. So I'm glad because I know you're often wondering, did it work?

[Dave Ramsey]

Is this all going to work out?

[Willie]

Now, here was Jason's question today.

[Jace]

Dave sits down here at our table and he says, do you use the Bible?

[Phil]

No, I said, do you use the bible?

[Willie]

Any of your Q and a's?

[Jace]

That's what he is.

[Phil]

I was just curious.

[Willie]

I finally made it to Jay. This is like a tribe in South America who finally gets the word of God. Jay's finally understands who Dave Ramsey is.

[Jace]

I knew it was a long time ago.

[Willie]

Larry the cable.

[Jace]

Lord bless all those guys down there in New Guinea.

[Phil]

My wife said that we would agree almost everything. And she listens to your show.

[Jace]

So, Dave, I have. I listened to your show back in the talk radio. I was a huge talk radio guy.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Jace]

And I was a ditto head. So it was Rush Limbaugh.

[Dave Ramsey]

I was on local here, and there was a guy named Griffon. Moon.

[Willie]

Griffon.

[Dave Ramsey]

Griffon. I was on Moon show several times. We came down here and did an event in West Monroe. God, 25 years ago.

[Jace]

So this was one of your early markets. Big probably.

[Dave Ramsey]

It was. It was an early market.

[Phil]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

25 years ago. Yeah. I mean, it was a long time. We probably had 100 stations.

[Willie]

This really moved the.

[Dave Ramsey]

It was early. But I remember Moon because he's a character and he's a lot of fun. And the state. We filled that Baptist church up downtown, whatever it was, it's real nice. First Baptist and that pastor ended up over in Orlando.

[Willie]

Oh, that's huge.

[Jace]

David Youth. David Youth. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I ran into David. I was actually using that church as a venue, too, 20 years later, and I look up doing our mic check, and he's walking down the aisle and went, that. Look at this guy comes out.

[Jace]

We did go full Crimson Gospel there.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, he's a great guy.

[Jace]

Davis Church.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Phil]

Well, Louisiana is full of characters.

[Dave Ramsey]

Kind of like Tennessee.

[Willie]

All right, so.

[Jace]

So we have to open and we told. I don't know. Have we told this story on the podcast?

[Willie]

Not. But we never, never listen.

[Jace]

Well, sorry, sorry.

[Phil]

You tell the stories that you do.

[Dave Ramsey]

A pod.

[Phil]

I'm beginning to think that Zach and Willie have the same wardrobe creators. Because, look, he's wearing, like, a big, thick vest. Zach, for you. Because Zach, it's 65 degrees.

[Willie]

It's cool. Well, Jason just walked out of the duck blind. Didn't really have bring the wardrobe. It was 65 degrees over. First time I did the podcast, I got the first question at about minute 72, so I figured there wasn't even a camera on me. Were you moving Mike to that? Yeah.

[Phil]

That is true.

[Willie]

First time we had that was back.

[Jace]

When we were down.

[Willie]

I go duck hunting today. And that I'm in the back of the blind, too, so.

[Jace]

Oh, you got the back.

[Phil]

Yeah, we had it great. Hot.

[Willie]

And we had it. I think we had it worked out. And then SA last night said, hey, I'm in, boys.

[Phil]

Invited himself.

[Willie]

And I don't get anywhere near 4ft of side of that line. So, yeah, just sat back and watched the action.

[Jace]

So let me ask you about.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, I was sitting beside him. You didn't tell me this.

[Willie]

Better for you to learn the hard way.

[Jace]

Before we tell the. The Dave Ran Dave story, I want to hear about your duck hunt. That your experience. That's the first time you've ever duck hunted.

[Dave Ramsey]

Only the second.

[Jace]

Second.

[Dave Ramsey]

It was incredible. I mean, I'm hunted with the Dynasty. I mean, come on.

[Jace]

You were in a place I get.

[Dave Ramsey]

To tell people I hunted. Well, I hunted. And while Willie wrote his memoir sitting on the back bench, but. Yeah, but it was a lot of fun. It was a lot of fun.

[Jace]

He actually.

[Phil]

I was an eyewitness to this. That's why I was asking you about the Bible earlier, because we had downed a teal, and it was real pretty, that teal, and I was. Even though he didn't look like, I just knew it was a vital heart shot, and so I took off to go get him. Well, when I was coming back, as I was entering the blind, I heard somebody say, shoot him, and. And so I just came up and watched the action, and it was just.

[Dave Ramsey]

Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom.

[Phil]

Boom, boom, boom, boom, boom, boom. I thought, boy, they're ripping them. And I look out. Then there's two ducks still flying. And my son shot one, and you shot the other. I was looking right down your gun barrel.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, wow.

[Willie]

Si said he shot both those.

[Phil]

Well, he did after they hit the water. When I looked at Si. Hey. When his gun went off and Reed shot, I looked at Si, and he was already reloading, so. So he wasn't a part of that.

[Jace]

So his first. His three went by real quick.

[Phil]

Yeah, he went boom, boom, boom. Look how many I got.

[Jace]

Well, I'm glad you got the experience, so.

[Dave Ramsey]

It was incredible.

[Jace]

So, Willie, do you. Willie, you got to tell this story. It's a. It's a one we've told a lot of many times, but I don't think we've ever told them.

[Willie]

You know, I've never brought it up since it happened. Yeah, I get.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

I hear this at least 12 times a year, Dave. So this is.

[Dave Ramsey]

Okay.

[Jace]

It's the famous day. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, no.

[Willie]

So when I was. You know, I'm hustling, trying to make money, and so I was. I would go clean up people's yards and construction debris, and Willie was an.

[Jace]

Outside guy, and he's a. He was a bit of a pyromania. He liked to do fire.

[Dave Ramsey]

Love to burn from.

[Jace]

From an early age, always been a burner. Always raking and burning. Raking.

[Willie]

And so this is probably when I met Duck command. Right.

[Jace]

Probably early.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Willie]

She probably just started the company. And then I'm. So my cousin Zach built. Built this nice house in a country club, you know, and so he calls.

[Jace]

He's a pharmaceutical guy.

[Willie]

So he hires his cousin to come clean. So I've been out there all day, and he finally walks out there, you know.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Yeah.

[Willie]

With his robe on, you know, exactly. His gold chain pipe. To me, he's like, hey, hey, come Here, you know? So what's your name?

[Dave Ramsey]

What's your name? Willie? Is that your name?

[Willie]

So he's like, you know what? They were still calling you Jess B. He goes, what's your plan, man? What are you going to do? And I said, I think I'm good. And he said, man, I'm on this Dave Ramsey. Dave Ramsey. He has changed. I went to pay you. I went to pay you.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

And I pulled out the. I pulled out the envelopes.

[Willie]

Dave and I went to pay. Pulled out the envelope, and it had yard work.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

And he's like, what is that? And then I.

[Dave Ramsey]

Getting money. And he's going to try getting money.

[Willie]

He pulls 100. He slips that back in. He's digging, fishing for something smaller. And, you know, how many hours you work back here?

[Dave Ramsey]

You know?

[Willie]

And he says, I'm on this Dave Ramsey plan. I'm telling you, it's. You know. He said, in five years, I can't remember what you told me in five years you were going to have. But he said, in five years, I'm going to have this. Now he's just. I mean, he's preaching your message.

[Jace]

Yeah, it's like, right off the radio.

[Willie]

Unlike he had actually heard your message. And so he says, what about you? You need to get on this plan. And I said. I said, I'm all right, you know, I'm just. I think I'll be okay. And he said, no, I'm telling you, man, you're gonna end. What, you want to clean yards the rest of your life. You know, I'm just wearing it. You know, I'm wearing it. And right before we leave, he said, let me just tell you what. Right now, you do what you do, I'm gonna do what I do. We'll see who comes out ahead, okay? And I loaded the train.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

That's not exactly how it happened.

[Jace]

You.

[Willie]

You were killing me.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

You weren't quite as humble as you're coming across.

[Willie]

And behold, who was cleaning the yard? Who built the house?

[Dave Ramsey]

Tell me who you were trashing. The guy with hundreds and an envelope.

[Willie]

I'm doing the yard work, so don't be saying I'm acting like I'm humble. I was the one cleaning the yard.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh.

[Phil]

And so. And now.

[Willie]

So what happened was, So I worked really hard. I had done Dave's plan, actually. So I knew the whole plan myself and worked hard, ended up growing the business. The show came along, and then I remembered. I remembered that when he told me that, and so I called him just.

[Dave Ramsey]

To see how he was doing.

[Willie]

How exactly he was. Yeah, I just wanted to see who. Where we were in the race, you know.

[Phil]

Wow.

[Willie]

And then I called him again. And then I call it just stuff would happen and I would call him. And it was actually when I spoke at your event, I was at the. The Gaylord, and they have a two story. They'd have a two story room at that. At that hotel. I never seen anything like it. And so Zach got an. Actually, you got a video that one. I did, yeah. You got a FaceTime from me on that.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Hey, remember that time?

[Willie]

Remember that time you said, remember that? Remember I was hitting golf, I was chipping golf in the room, and I said, zach, tell me how exactly where are we at still? So y' all brought that up a few times. And now Dave here, Zach.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

So that's.

[Dave Ramsey]

Hey.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

But to be fair, Dave, I've never been in debt because of you, so that's worth something, right?

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm honored.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

So after the holiday craziness, the last thing I want to do is overthink dinner. I don't know about you guys.

[Phil]

Well, what I've noticed as I get older is that Missy and I are doing a lot of cooking for a lot of people.

[Jace]

Well, and. And you have to be practical, right. Because we're also cooking extra for mom now that we're, you know, providing food for her. That's why our friends at home Che are a big help, you know, and I've tried their. Their dinners before they come. They're ready to go. We had the kickin chicken recently. It's really good. It's really creative. It's really fresh.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

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[Jace]

I love to hear that story. It's so good. He tells the same story about his father in law. Too similar. When I would hit your event. Yeah. All right. So how did y' all get. How did y' all meet?

[Willie]

Because we met online. It just said man seeking another man's friendship.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah. Said wild and woolly bearded guy looking for companionship. But the.

[Willie]

This is sounding weird now. Unashamed after dark.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm gonna blush this on Adam Laroche.

[Willie]

Yeah, Adam.

[Dave Ramsey]

Adam and I have been buddies and so Adam, I've been doing a pheasant hunt with about 10 guys that I'm close to that all solid dudes. And Adam had gone with us a couple times and I don't know, we were doing something. He said, hey, you need to include Willie. I said, yeah, I never met Willie. Let's do it.

[Jace]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

So the first time I met you, I picked you up here at the airport. Yeah. And we flew up to South Dakota and actually it wasn't the first time we met. This first time we hung out. We actually met in the green room at Fox two or three different.

[Willie]

That's true. That's true.

[Dave Ramsey]

Rachel and I were doing a book tour.

[Jace]

Rachel.

[Willie]

Was that her book?

[Dave Ramsey]

Was that her maybe like her first book? Probably her first book about 15 years ago.

[Willie]

Yeah, we did. We met at the.

[Dave Ramsey]

Probably could pull up the picture. But yeah, long time ago. And Hannity's. We were getting ready to do Hannity and that was the first time. But. And you guys, that's when you guys were like white hot right then that, that first show, first round, it was going crazy. And anyway, we were on that trip and hung out and we're just cut from the same cloth. We like love people, love Jesus and love talking to people about it.

[Willie]

Shot a lot of pheasants and killed.

[Dave Ramsey]

A lot of birds.

[Willie]

Dave's gotten into golf, so we played.

[Jace]

How's that go?

[Willie]

Several rounds of golf. I'm, I'm trying to teach in the art.

[Jace]

Has he got into your gray matter?

[Willie]

That's what we're teaching the art of the trash talk.

[Dave Ramsey]

I'm so bad, he leaves me alone.

[Jace]

Oh, okay.

[Dave Ramsey]

It's the other people he messes with.

[Willie]

Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

Some of your friend, actually. Yeah. He's trying. The only thing he doesn't make fun of me occasionally. Like I was doing a practice swing on a tee box and I hit the dirt pretty hard, and he's like, you know, eight, one, one, call for a day.

[Willie]

Dave Ramsey has the swing. I can see it from 500 yards away. And if you didn't tell me, I know his swing every time. He has a unique.

[Phil]

Probably not good.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's not good. That's not. That's not a compliment, but, yeah, but that's okay. It's good. I'm still having fun. And my. I have a. I'm too wired up and too intense a person to play golf, and so I never played Till I was 58 years old, seven years ago. Oh, wow. I just picked it up because I'd be that twerp throwing his clubs in the pond and all that stuff. So my wife said we need to do this. And we're always sitting on these super fancy resort things when we're traveling, and it's like having a Ferrari in the driveway and not knowing how to drive. So you need to learn how to do this, at least not be embarrassed completely. So we started learning to play, and I just said, okay, I'm not going to be that guy. I'm going to vow. I'm just going to be. I'm just going to be disciplined. And the secret to happiness is low expectations, and that's my golf motto. So I just don't care. And I just have fun. So get to hang out with cool people.

[Jace]

That's why you have to.

[Dave Ramsey]

And Willie's. Willie's a really good golfer. And the last time we went on the trip, though, there was eight of us and some good golfers on that trip and some weren't. And we make it. Yeah, we had a good time.

[Willie]

Yeah, the first time. So when Adam and I, we were. We were together and we were setting up the golf bet. So Adam and I were like, oh, we're going to hustle these guys. So we got. We said, you and Dr. Henry Cloud. That we were going to play y'.

[Phil]

All.

[Willie]

But y' all definitely.

[Dave Ramsey]

Henry played at SMU with Payne Stewart.

[Phil]

Yeah. Oh, wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

So Henry's a good golfer, but they sniffed through that.

[Willie]

They knew they were, you know, but.

[Dave Ramsey]

He had messed up knees. And so Willie's line was, I'll take the cripple messing with. Starting to mess with Henry already working on him.

[Willie]

And then we went so far one.

[Dave Ramsey]

Of the world's best known psychologists and completely pissed him off.

[Willie]

And how mad did he get at.

[Dave Ramsey]

Me on the golf course? I've never seen Henry that way. I've known Henry 20 years. I've never seen him close.

[Willie]

If I get in, the guy written a book about and then of Henry Cloud.

[Dave Ramsey]

The problem was though, he activated and he kicked Willie's butt, which was he just destroyed.

[Willie]

That's all I was looking for. I just wanted a reaction and I wanted to see. I like seeing.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, you wanted to win.

[Willie]

No, no, no, no, no. That's what, that's what you miss. It doesn't matter if I win. I want to see him either rise up or just fold up. Yeah, either way is equal joy to me. It's so fun watching people do that.

[Phil]

See now, while we fought every day for about seven years, we had one fight in the last seven years. It just.

[Willie]

It just would pick up where it left off. The seven year war.

[Phil]

My dad one time pulled over, we were like two miles from the house. We were pretty young and he's like.

[Willie]

More than two, maybe three or four.

[Phil]

He was like, get out now.

[Willie]

Both we were like, what?

[Phil]

He's like, walk and gone.

[Willie]

He just took off, left us in the highway.

[Phil]

But back then you could do that. Now everybody's back.

[Willie]

Can you imagine?

[Jace]

You just. Dad's life was when you hear the meat popping boys, that's when. That's when the discipline comes in.

[Phil]

Meat had enough, you know, said that's it.

[Dave Ramsey]

So my mama used to say, the worm has turned. I didn't know what that meant except the beatings were about to begin.

[Phil]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Found out later Shakespeare. Who knew? Mom knew Shakespeare.

[Phil]

Well, for my tribe of people. I want to know how you got started doing this. Is that. Is that sure a dumb question?

[Dave Ramsey]

No, it's not a dumb question at all.

[Phil]

How do you become a list?

[Jace]

Oh, you never got to.

[Phil]

Yeah, yeah, I never. I never.

[Dave Ramsey]

But the I don't know make it. It can be a very long story and I don't want to do that. But when I got out of school, Sharon and I were broke and she. About two weeks after we got married, she remembered she was a Baptist and we had not. I grew up hell raising beer drinking character. And so that's who she married. And then she comes in and says, we're going to church. And I said, we ain't doing nothing. You can go to church. It's football Sunday, and I'm going to be watching football and drinking beer is what I'm going to be doing. So she cried and went off. In Nashville, there's more Baptists than people. So it didn't take her long to find her tribe. And so she starts going to church and praying. Her and those Baptist people praying for her heathen husband. And so I went to this sales conference and the guy said, if you're going to win at business, you're going to have to meet this guy named Jesus, because you will never learn how to treat people until you know him. And you'll never treat people right. You'll be a taker rather than a giver. And everybody can smell a taker a mile away. And I was, I like this guy. It was a good line. So I came home, me and my beer drinking buddy were at the conference. We go back to the hotel room and got out the Gideon Bible, which is useless because it's blind leading the blind, because it was King James. I mean, it's like Shakespeare and Jesus. So there's no way this redneck's getting through this. I'm just saying. So we go back, I told my wife we're going to church. And she's like, who are you and what did you do with my husband? And I wandered in the back door of Church at 23 years old and met God radically. And I was the dumbest guy there because I didn't know anything. And the preacher would say, and you know when they threw Joseph's brothers, threw him in the hole. And I'm like, nope, don't know Joseph, don't know the hole. But I don't like being the dumbest guy in the room. And by midnight, I will know everything about Joseph and I will stay up until I read it and learn it and read it and pull it out. I'm going to take it apart. So that was 40 years ago and 45 years ago almost. That's been the process. So I'm telling you that because I met God. And then right as I was doing that, I started buying and selling real estate. And I got rich. I had $4 million worth of real estate when I was 26 years old. A million dollar net worth. And in 1984, I made $250,000. Back when that was a lot of money.

[Phil]

Were you thinking at that point, boy, this following God thing?

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah, I'm thinking, this Jesus stuff's great.

[Willie]

That guy was right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Those big hair people may have something, but. No, but I had violated everything in this book about money. I had borrowed money up to my eyeballs. I was spending everything I make. I was shallow. Jaguars and Rolexes and all this crap. And God says, I don't think I can use him in this condition. So we're gonna have to do a little work here.

[Jace]

So humility training.

[Dave Ramsey]

Banks called Our notes. And we spent the next two and a half years losing everything we own. And so we were sued, we were foreclosed. And finally, at 28 years old, we were bankrupt. And so, with a brand new baby and a toddler and a marriage hanging on by a thread, we got to start over. And so we've got it on the side of the. And come in our building. It says, I met God on the way up. I got to know him on the way down. And so when we hit bottom, somebody said, the Bible says some stuff about money. And there's a guy teaching it named Larry Burkett on Christian radio. Would you. You know, And I'm like, the Bible talks about money?

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

What?

[Dave Ramsey]

I've got a finance degree. Who would have thought? And so I'm like, okay, I want to know. Because obviously the stuff I learned didn't work. I mean, who taught me to borrow money? My finance professor who was broke. What's wrong with that picture? It's like a shop teacher with missing fingers, right? So we get the opportunity to start again and start learning God's ways of handling money and start applying it in our lives. And then pastor called up one day and said, hey, there's a guy in my office in foreclosure. Can you help him? I'm like, yeah, I used to buy him, and then I was one, so, yeah, I can help him. And so I went over and once you do something at church to help somebody, it's like every night you're there after that. So we suddenly had a financial ministry at the church helping people that were hurting. And. And a guy on a local radio station, back when talk radio was just getting started, rush Limbaugh was one year in, 36 years ago, 1992. So whatever that was, 34 years ago, the station was in bankruptcy and the guy quit. And one of my buddies said, we ought to go over and do that talk radio show. And I'm like, there ain't any money in radio. And he goes, yeah, but we could get some leads. And I'd written this little book. And he said, you might even sell some of that stupid little book you wrote. And little did he know.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

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[Dave Ramsey]

We started on that station and it took off. I mean, and we were really bad. I mean, it was like Darrell and his other brother Darrell doing talk radio. It's like, you know, wwtn, we're talking Nashville. Y' all call in right now. We'll help you with Yin's money. I mean, it was. It was nasty.

[Jace]

But yeah, he had young ones like.

[Willie]

Zach out there, just early adopter.

[Dave Ramsey]

And then, you know, and. And, you know, five years later, you know, I had voice coached and cleaned up enough. Cause people in Boston couldn't even understand me. So. And they wouldn't put me on the radio anywhere because it wasn't credible. It sounded like I was broadcasting from a double wide or something. And so they. Nothing wrong with it. But if you want to reach Boston, you know, you're gonna have to work on this. You gotta get better at your craft. So five years later, we're probably owning Monroe. You know, seven years later, we're probably down here doing that first of some of those first few events that we did. And then we started doing events and selling books and. But it basically started because, as my friend Larry Crabb says, I don't trust a man doesn't walk with a limp. And so God uses wounded healers and he talks through donkeys. And I signed up, so here I am. Send me. So it spent my whole life now. So now there's a thousand Folks at Ramsey doing all kinds of things. And 50,000 churches have now taught 10 million people. Financial Peace University. 48% of the high schools, including your boys, have gone through our high school curriculum. Six million kids in high school have gone through it. Wow. And the numbers on the broadcast are just staggering. They're mind blowing. I can't even get my head around it. But it's just like God can do anything if you just yield. And he said, feed my lambs. And so we went with it. We went for it.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

That's awesome.

[Jace]

Don't you think, Dave? It's like, because I relate so much to your story, going through really hard times to learn. I love the message, I wrote it down, that as you now get older and have that chance to look back over the scope of what you just told our audience, that you can really appreciate and see so much more of what God was doing through the process of. Instead of just like, when you're in the moment, you're just doing it right and you're just trying to. One thing leads to the next. But I don't know, when we look back over the scope of how big God is and what he accomplished, it just. I don't know. It's so much sweeter to me when.

[Dave Ramsey]

You'Re in the middle of it. It's, you know, Isaiah, I'm a lamp at your feet. So you can see three feet at a time. And then when you look back because you're old, you got perspective and you start to see the providence and the sovereignty of God that his hand. He really, you know, I kind of thought I had something to do with it. And that's laughable. You know, it's like, you know, I work real hard and I'm really good, and I improve my craft. And I'm going to add, you know, I'm better now than I was, and I'm a better dad. Dad now than I was. And I'm a better father now than I was and better husband now. Thank. I mean, Sharon will tell you We've been married 43 years. Thank God she's not still married to that guy. And so you got to get better. But our efforts are so multiplied by the great I am. And in a math formula, anytime you multiply something by the infinite, the answer on the other side is infinite other side of the equal sign. And so it's pretty incredible. It's been a wild ride. And I'm so. I'm about as happy and grateful a guy as you'll run into one of.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

The Things you said that I've picked up on. For me, that's been so profound. I've taught this to my kids, too. Not just about money, but there's a principle that I think is so key that I think you say something like, don't trade what you want most for what you want right now. And I've told my kids that. Like, just not just about money, but just about everything. Sexuality, everything. What do you. Don't trade what you want most for what you can have right now. Like, just that. Prolonged delayed gratification is such a rare. That's a rare. That's a rare thing in our culture, but that transcends a lot.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, I mean, you're exactly right. The ability to delay pleasure is a. It's a sign of emotional and spiritual maturity, for that matter. But it always pays off because there is no such thing as good microwave barbecue. There's no such thing. You have to cook it. And a long time till the dog in the neighbor's yard, Alan. Right. You gotta cook it. That's true. And our lives are the same way. Like you said, your sexuality, your careers, your ability to do anything, and certainly saving money is a pretty primitive and basic thing on that. Live on less than you make a concept Congress can't grasp. And that's basic stuff. Right? And so. But I made a living with that, just telling people what they already know. And they go, well, I could have sold a million books. I already knew that. And I'm like, well, you didn't write it down, dude. I mean.

[Willie]

Yeah, really, it's just. I mean, it's super counterculture. I mean, your message is so, like, counter. I often think about this, too. Like, you don't hear. They're saying, like, oh, the economy's dragging because people aren't spending. Like, we need. You know, we need the holiday. So people will spend. And I'm like, are we supposed to go spend? Are we supposed to.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, we're gonna. I mean, even 2008, we're gonna. Or even after Covid, we're gonna stimulate the economy by giving you money to go spend, right? And it's so bass ackwards. It's just. It's just ridiculous.

[Willie]

It's almost like the game is rigged. It's rigged for you to spend.

[Dave Ramsey]

And it's like, right now, the big thing is the. The Gen Z, there's a lot of. And the millennials, which are two fabulous generations, by the way. But, like, your boys are just studs, man. And so just solid. But everybody's talking about affordability. They can't do anything because of inflation, they can't do anything of that. They can't do anything because of inflation, house prices, they're boxed out. Well, bull crap. What happened was this. The. It's pretty simple. We have the highest credit card debt ever this year. We have the highest car debt ever this year. 20% of the people left a car lot last month, took on more than $1,000 a month car payment. And we have the highest student loan debt. So we got people with $300,000, $150,000 in student loan debt to get a degree in left handed puppetry, right? And it's just. And you put those three things together, put all that junk in your budget and look and see how much is left called disposable income. And there's not any. So the affordability crisis is because the big banks and Congress with the student loan program that they continue talking about how bad it is, but they continue to do it while they're talking about it. And Biden got blamed for 9% inflation following Covid, but, but it really wasn't his fault. It's just everybody came out of their house like a Baptist looking for a casserole after they were trapped, right? And they just, they went nuts, man. So people went, spending and stuff went straight through the roof, you know, and that was supply, demand. And we had, we shut down the world's largest economy in history. And then we're surprised that when we reopened it that it took off, you know. Of course not. That's some basic econ. So anyway, all that to say the affordability crisis is created by these banks preying on these two generations and they grew up with a magic wand in their hand that says I can push an easy button and anything happens fast, easy. I can access all of human history knowledge right here. I can push a button. Stuff shows up on my porch and I keep pushing a button wanting to buy a house. And I can't because I've been trapped by these big banks that have put me so far in debt, they've been victimized by this stuff that's out of control. So that's what that is. That's what that all comes back to. Don't get me started on the villains in my story. The villains are real.

[Willie]

Yeah, we like started fired up.

[Phil]

Oh well, he fired me up. So what do you tell these people when they say, well, I spend it all? I mean, how does this, how what is the normal Q and A? How does this work?

[Dave Ramsey]

Because it they'll just call in and say, you know, I can't. My wife and I aren't on the same page. Or I'm in debt and I'm behind on my car payment. What am I going to do? And I'm like, we used to say that, you know, the subtitle of the show was Sell the car. Because the answer to every question sell the car because you got a thousand dollar car payment, dude. And you make $50,000 a year and you're driving a $70,000 F150. Well, dumb. That's just dumb. You can't do that. Math doesn't work. I don't care. Well, the finance manager and I prayed together. Well, he was on crack. Who makes you that loan? How do you get this loan?

[Willie]

Crack is expensive.

[Dave Ramsey]

I was sitting one little couple and they church counseling him and he said, God gave us this car. And I said, absolutely he did not. And he goes, well, how are you so sure? And I said, because the Bible says the blessings of the Lord have no sorrow added to them. And your car payment is half of your take home pay. And you tell me you can't feed your babies. God did not give you this car. This car represents sorrow. It's 100% a curse. It was from the other side. That's where this came from. So you need to sell the car. You mean I need to sell the car? Yes, you need to sell the car. And that's what it sounds like every day. And it's like, you know, so we tell people to get on a budget, get three extra jobs. There's a great place to go when you're broke, to work and you know, go get, go rake leaves and clean yards.

[Phil]

Which made me think like of that verse immediately popped in my head. It's not like you told him to go sell everything he had and follow Jesus.

[Dave Ramsey]

No, just the car.

[Willie]

Just the car. Just a lesson.

[Phil]

Have you ever used that example? I'm just asking for the car. I'm not going biblical and say sell.

[Dave Ramsey]

It all and follow him. And he went away with his head hung low for his position.

[Phil]

Oh yeah, he wasn't willing to do it. And you see, you probably see the same thing happen in your discussion.

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[Dave Ramsey]

You can hear because the medium is so. It's one sided because it's only audio. Now we've got YouTube and other stuff, but it's only audio. And so. So everyone listening can hear that they're not going to do it.

[Phil]

Oh yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

You can hear the way their voice catches and their syntax shifts and you can tell when somebody the light bulb has not gone on. Or you can go, yeah, that one's got it. They're going to go do it. They're going to charge the gates of hell with a water pistol. They're going to go, they're going to do it, man. And you get them fired up and they're like, yeah. And then they'll call me back years later. And now we take people through a thing called the baby steps to walk through how to get out of debt and how to build wealth. Now we call them baby steps millionaires because they come in eight, 10, 12 years later and they're millionaires because they got out of debt as a borrower, slave to the lender and they lived on less than they make. Because a foolish man devours all he has. And they wrote out a plan because Jesus said, don't build a tower without first counting the cost unless you get halfway up and you're unable to finish and can't pay your car payment. And you know, that wasn't Jesus, but that last part was me. But.

[Phil]

You'Re bringing up a lot of childhood memories, you know, with my children and because we kind of made a deal and this is my wife's idea, she was like, we'll pay, you know, for your college if your character is reflecting that there were some conditions to even that. Well, it was weird that all three of my kids, they were like, well, we want to go to a non Christian university. And so my wife's like, okay, well you're paying for it. But it was amazing that they all changed their mind at some point in that process, figuring out how they were going to make that work. But it was the same thing with a car because I used to tell them, and I've told this to all my kids at least 10 times. You know, we first got married, we had one car. And they always responded the same way. They were like, well, what did you do? And I said, I walked or I got a ride, you know. But they were just like, I mean, how is that even possible? I was like, I tell you what, it made me appreciate when I did.

[Dave Ramsey]

Have enough money to have two cars.

[Phil]

And so if they're. While they were in college, we got each one of my three kids a car at some point just because they were walking with Christ, they were working hard, they were making good grades. But what shocked me was it wasn't like I went and got a brand new car. I mean, they were all clunkers, but they all had the same response. And I'm like. Because they're like, wow, that's quite. I mean, they weren't that excited because it was a clunker. And I thought, look, I'm not here to make your life comfortable. I'm just saying this will be walking, taking the bus and hitchhiking. And then you learn an appreciation to work hard. And one day you might can buy your yourself a brand new car. But it ain't coming from me. You know, we gonna struggle to get there.

[Dave Ramsey]

We had our kids growing up on commission, not on allowance. Allowance sounded like welfare to me. So I want them on. You work, you get paid. You don't work, you don't get paid. And so, and then we told them, save money for the first car and I would match it. We had 401 Dave. So whatever, whatever you save up, I'll match it.

[Phil]

Well, that was Kind of my point. I think we help our kids. It's fine to help them, but you're trying to teach them some things because.

[Jace]

You don't want to be the second magic button, right?

[Dave Ramsey]

Exactly.

[Jace]

I mean, that's because you're going to create the same thing.

[Dave Ramsey]

Exactly. And, you know, my job, I kept telling him, Andy Andrews always says, this hunts with us. He's a buddy of ours. And my job is not to raise great kids. My job is to raise kids that become great adults. And that's a different process. That's a different mindset. And so, yeah, you're gonna learn. You know, like, one of them leaned back. We finally, after going broke, we finally got a decent car. And one of them leaned back, said, we're doing pretty good. I said, we ain't doing nothing. I'm doing pretty good. You're broke.

[Willie]

That's the shack life.

[Dave Ramsey]

You're broke.

[Willie]

Sex that we rich.

[Jace]

He said, we ain't rich.

[Willie]

I'm rich.

[Dave Ramsey]

You got nothing.

[Jace]

You got nothing. I love it. Well, I think there's a. And we were talking about a minute ago from a biblical perspective, because we kind of referenced the rich young ruler. And I always thought that, you know, Luke putting those stories back to back with the rich young ruler and remember having the walking away sad. And then right in the next chapter, we get Zacchaeus, you know, who is also wealthy, we assume, I mean, tax collector, but a pariah, who then, though, has this moment, you know, where he really understands who Jesus is, because he comes to his house and he immediately, without even being prompted, says, I'm gonna give four times what some of my dishonest. I mean, I want to make things right. And I just. I love that picture of the two. But Dave, I love it. I think one of the reasons why people can relate is because of your story. Because last night. So we had a birthday celebration for mom, and Dave came, Was able to join us for part of that.

[Dave Ramsey]

It was an honor.

[Jace]

Thank you for having me. It was so great. And you met Mom. And so I jokingly said. I said, mom, you want to tell Dave about some of those 30% interest loans back in the early days of the business? She said, I don't want to talk about money with him. But you told her, you said, Ms. K, I've had. Had wor. I've had higher and worse. And I. It was just in the moment. I appreciated that so much because I. I thought to myself, that's why God has blessed you to then impact other people, because you're Telling them what you've learned from not only your relationship with him, but. But by the hard knocks, by the. By the humility training. And the same could be said for our family. I mean, we never imagined having a television show or people love us and all these things that happen. We're just living life. Mom was trying to make things work. Willie and Corey kind of came in and took it next level. And none of it was really planned, but it was part of the plan, you know. So I think that's why we relate so much to sort of your approach. And I love it because it's a humility that goes also with strength and the no bullcrap, you know, which go to.

[Dave Ramsey]

Well, you know. Yeah. And the rich young ruler and Zacchaeus and all of that kind of does weave together in a beautiful tapestry. Because one of the things that happened to me because of the way I got saved, because of the way I met God, I didn't have to think about giving or being generous because it's really easy to give away other people's money. So once I met God, it flipped. And the stewardship thing for me was instantaneous. I don't own anything. And once I don't own anything, then I can give away fourfold. But the problem is, if you hold onto it, you have to walk away with your head down. But if you go, it's not just a tithe. It's not a love offering. It's not a generosity or philanthropy. It's just, I don't own it. So what do you want to do today, God? What do you want to do with this today? But then people misuse that sometimes. We had a guy come into the lobby at the office, and he said, God told me that you were going to give me a new van. And I said, no, he didn't. He said, oh, yeah, he did. I said, no, he didn't. He goes, what do you mean? I said, well, if he had told you that he was going to give you a new van, there would have been one sitting out there with keys and had been running when you got here. Because he would have told me, and he hadn't told me. And so all this is, is you're one of these hucksters. And he's like, well, you're bad. Start cussing and screaming at me and running out the door yelling. But, you know, because, hey, it's easy for me. I don't own it. It's very easy for me to give away other people's money.

[Jace]

I love it. But Willie hadn't you said that forward. Somebody come in, say, you know, God directed me to.

[Willie]

Well, he sent me an email. And for the record, and Phil took this story and somehow made it his own. And, yeah, here's Phil stealing my story. I was like, somebody sent an email. Lady said, God told me you were going to give me $32,000 to pay my house off. And. And. And I said, I didn't email her back to say, no, God should have told me and not you.

[Dave Ramsey]

Yeah.

[Willie]

So I told dad. So Dad's like, here's dad.

[Phil]

Yeah.

[Willie]

I got a letter the other day. I don't even know what an email is. I got a letter. This guy told me the whole story. Then he goes, yeah, God didn't tell me. He should have told me. And I'm like, wait a minute. That's my story.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Skip the middleman.

[Willie]

And he owned it so much that.

[Jace]

When I heard him tell it, I.

[Willie]

Thought, she must have sent him a letter and you an email.

[Phil]

That's how much I thought it was.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

I thought that was Phil's story.

[Phil]

Told me.

[Willie]

Totally stole that story. Oh, that's so funny.

[Phil]

I think Phil always just viewed everybody like, well, these are my kids.

[Willie]

So that was a reflection, collective story. Yeah.

[Dave Ramsey]

I own this because I made you.

[Phil]

So, yeah, I did notice when we became famous and had money, there was a lot of people that came forth.

[Dave Ramsey]

You found cousins you didn't know you had.

[Phil]

Oh, just all over the place and just ways to give your money.

[Dave Ramsey]

Oh, yeah, we're cousins.

[Jace]

Somewhere down the line. So you mentioned Rachel earlier. Is that your daughter?

[Dave Ramsey]

Rachel is my middle, and she's one of what we call our Ramsey personalities, which is the next generation.

[Jace]

So how has that been fun to get to work in family and all that? I mean, just been able to share that.

[Dave Ramsey]

Absolutely wonderful. We studied it a lot because it can be really bad, as everyone knows. And so. But Rachel, she's a natural on the stage and on a microphone and on, you know, she's beautiful. So she's on TV and, you know, Today show and Fox and everything all the time. And so. But she. 15 years old, she was on stage.

[Jace]

Wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

She was the she. You know, she's a kid. She came out of Dancing Poodle. I mean, she's ready to go. And so, you know, train up a child in the way he should go in the old test, in the old King James is the way he has bent way he's designed. And when he's old, he'll not depart from it. And that obviously references their Spiritual walk, but also references their wiring and how they're put together. And so we said, this child should be in front of the camera, this child should not. And so, you know, and so we, you know, we encouraged her that way, but didn't say she had to do it. But she came on and then we've got. She's had five, four number one best sellers, I guess now.

[Jace]

Oh, wow.

[Dave Ramsey]

And her social media footprint's just mammoth. It's huge. And so she does a great job and she's a lot nicer, kinder than I am. And so people, they want to get her on the phone. And so she's sweet and she'll tell them the truth, but she's much sweeter about it. I just go straight to it now. I don't have the time. I gotta get to the next thing. She's the middle one. And we've got six people, five of us, six of us total, including me and her, that do the shows and do books and. And you know, you guys were just on, you were just looking at, you said. And you were on Ken Coleman's show the other day, front row seat, which is blown up. It's a long form interview show and he's one of our guys. And so it's absolutely mammoth. So anyway, we all intermingle and do the show, the main show, the Ramsey show together.

[Jace]

Yeah. Which is fun. I mean, that's been probably the best thing about what we do is getting to do, you know, it together, you know, with, with our kids and our grandkids. A lot of people work through different companies and different platforms that we have, which is, you know, very similar.

[Willie]

Yeah. And Dave, what do you think about. You just talking about Rachel made me think about it. We're, we've all worked for this company in different capacities over the years, but even, even as it comes to money and about this idea of fairness or treating every kid the same. I have six kids and so all different types of personalities. Yeah. And so do you think it's a problem when parents go, well, crap, I did this for this. You know, once you start something out and then it's like you're. They may not even say it's not fair. But you, you, maybe you're guilty that you. Maybe you're thinking, oh, I don't want this to seem where something can maybe set someone up great to do something, but it could also destroy another or.

[Jace]

Open doors for jealousy and all this stuff.

[Willie]

Yeah. What's your thoughts on that as far as the idea of fairness Well, I.

[Dave Ramsey]

Mean, we started, of course, when they were being raised. Mom and Daddy were in the real estate business. So I grew up on straight commission. So I knew if you work, you get paid. If you don't work, you don't get paid. And if you work more, you get paid more than somebody that doesn't work. So that's not fair. So actually, technically, equal is not fair because effort is not the same. It's not equal. Intellect is not equal. Outcomes produced are not equal. So if you're penalizing someone who worked twice as many hours, you're penalizing someone who has produced or chose to study something that gave them a tool in their belt to win versus someone who decided they were going to study something useless and they got dull tools in their belt. And so equal. So we told our kids, fair is where the tilt of whirl and the cotton candy is. So we don't have fair.

[Willie]

He's got the one line, how many of these do you have? It's like a never ending. He keeps coming up. I'm looking for the cheap cheat sheet. It's not here.

[Phil]

All my kids in the moment, we get so angry for decisions I'd make based on their personality, like what you're saying. But they've all come back now that they're older and say, I see why you did that.

[Dave Ramsey]

So our kids don't get any pay at our company except for the position that they fill. And if you fill different positions, that position pays more than the other position. So, like Rachel being a Ramsey personality, those guys that. The people that are on air and out front for us get paid on their books, on their. You know, we pay them royalties on their books, we pay them for their speaking, we pay them for other influencer things they get. And you know, the stuff deals like y' all do, we do those same things, endorsement stuff, all that stuff. So if Rachel has that. So the first time we tested the theory to see if it was going to work in adulthood, they're all at Thanksgiving dinner. Rachel's first big book is coming out. I did the first one with her. The second one, she did it on her own. That was gonna be huge. And so we're at Thanksgiving dinner and I said, okay, guys, we don't usually talk business at Thanksgiving dinner, but I wanna take a time out here for a second because this is a test for this family to see if this has worked or not. So Rachel is getting ready to have an incredible financial year. And this is your opportunity to decide if you're going to be jealous, entitled brats or if you're going to be really happy for your sister. And I got to say, I'm very proud of them. They were instantaneously high fiving. Let's lay hands and pray on her. Let's. Yes. And we're happy. We're happy. We're happy. And you know, so you just nip the jealousy in the bud before it has time to grow and go ahead and stomp it out.

[Phil]

Right.

[Podcast Sponsor/Ad Voice]

Of course you did set it up with that.

[Willie]

Yeah, the way positioned it. But yeah, I'll be a bracket.

[Dave Ramsey]

You get to decide which you are, what is you, you know, decide. And so, you know. Yeah. And now with the ownership, what we've done is we've transferred 99% of the company. Now to them, I own 1% and the only voting stock. And so each of them own a third. So out of the profits of the company, when we distribute, they get equal. Right, but the. But they're also paid for their job. And my oldest daughter doesn't work at the company, so she doesn't get paid by the company.

[Jace]

Right, right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Because she doesn't work there. She runs our family foundation. Yeah, the family foundation pays her direct, you know, a regular salary for someone running a foundation that size.

[Willie]

Right.

[Dave Ramsey]

Not 20 times more, not 20 times less. She just gets paid for that job. So stay in your role and you get to decide what your role is. You can do whatever and, you know, and their little brother is now the president of the company and he runs 80% of it. I run about 20% with him. He and I are working together every day. And so again, now they've got this thing of he's now their boss. Right. That's a trip. But they respect him and he's earned that respect because he's a quality world class leader. And so. But like Rachel's role is when she's looking at her brother, she's actually looking at the president of the company that she works for. And when she's inside that building, she better act that way.

[Jace]

Hey, we all work for Willie at some point.

[Phil]

But what a novel concept. It's like if you work, you get paid. I think that's what I'm hearing. You work really hard and you're really good at it.

[Willie]

You get paid more.

[Dave Ramsey]

And if you don't work, you don't get paid. Is that. I think Paul said that.

[Phil]

It reminds me of what Phil used to say. He would name off all these isms. He was like, you know, you got feminism and journalism and Narcissism. He's like fascism. The only isms that I believe in is baptism and capitalism.

[Willie]

He said that off the top of the.

[Dave Ramsey]

That's a good one. I will steal that instantly.

[Willie]

We just added one actually made me.

[Phil]

Go look ism words up. And I'm like, have we missed anything here?

[Willie]

But you know, I'm not sure I found it actually.

[Jace]

I think mom contributed to baptism. He first said capitalism and she said, what about baptism? He said, you're right, Ms. K, we.

[Willie]

Got to keep that one to say.

[Jace]

All right, so we're out of time. Man, that was fast, fast podcast. But I obviously we talked some about money. I know there's a lot of our listeners out there because we have a lot in those generations we talked to. But they're probably in that struggle that you mentioned and so they're going to be looking for help. So where can they go to get information from your organization? Where's the best place for them to go?

[Dave Ramsey]

The website's ramseysolutions.com but let me just say that when we started 35 years ago, 36 years ago, start applying those biblical truths, principles. If you read proverbs over and over, you have a master's degree in finance and applying actually doing them in our lives, not just discussing them as theory. As we know, the word is a two edged sword. I mean it will cut and it will do surgery on you and it will change you and transform you. And you do not have to stay in the soup just because you found yourself in the soup. Maybe you put yourself in the soup. I did. But you don't have to stay there. God has a plan is not to bring you harm, but to bring you hope. And it's real, straight. And when you do, this is his love letter to a kid like me. And when I live this way, it changes everything. I live on less than I make. I give every single week. I'm constantly tithing and giving. And we live on a plan. We're very intentional. We remember he owns it, we're running it. Stewardship issue, lordship issue. And when people start doing that, they understand the borrower, slave to the lender. A lot of people know that one. They've lived in it. They live up to their eyeballs and debt and can't breathe. You start getting rid of that junk in your life and getting rid of the debt that goes, goes with the junk in your life and you get a freedom, a sense of power that comes on you. And that's what scripture and that's what God's you know, God's love will do in these situations. So, yeah, that's what's really important here.

[Phil]

Amen.

[Jace]

I love it. Thanks.

[Willie]

Jace just texted me and said this guy should really consider a radio and podcast career. He's really good. You can do it.

[Phil]

I think he could succeed at.

[Willie]

I think your best days are ahead.

[Phil]

I found you, Dave.

[Jace]

All right, we'll see you next time. Unashamed thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcast. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube. And be sure to click the little bell and choose all notifications to watch every episode.