Ep 1336 | The Robertson Family Attorney Spills His Guts!

Summary

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Unashamed with the Robertson Family

Episode 1336 | The Robertson Family Attorney Spills His Guts!

Date: May 19, 2026
Guest: Gary “GG” Osborne

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Main Theme and Purpose

In this episode, the Robertsons welcome long-time friend, family attorney, and church shepherd Gary “GG” Osborne. The episode explores the deeply intertwined histories of the Robertson and Dasher families, with a focus on friendship, faith, and carrying the mission of sharing the Gospel beyond church walls. A major segment centers on intergenerational discipleship—how spiritual formation is lived out, the challenges of teaching young people to share their faith, and the fruit emerging from these efforts. The conversation is warm, nostalgic, and practical, full of personal stories and wisdom from decades of walking with Christ and with each other.

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Key Discussion Points and Insights

1. Robertson & Dasher Family Dynamics

• Long-standing Connections: Gary grew up close to the Robertsons through Jep Robertson and has deep ties to the Dasher family via Zach.

• Household Hospitality: Both the Robertson and Dasher households have open-door policies, often serving as gathering places for a revolving door of guests, strangers and friends alike.

  • “The chaos of Phil’s house…people in and out at any time—you walk in and there’d just be someone there you’ve never seen.” (Gary, 07:12)

• Nicknames and Community Banter: The crew laughs about Gary’s many nicknames (“Oz,” “nervous duck hunter”) and their habit of giving each close friend a label.

• Inter-family Mergers: Discussion on the union of family lines (Dasher/Robertson) and how this has shaped their circle’s dynamic.

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2. Faith Journey: From Friendship to Brotherhood

• Shared Conversions: Gary, Jep, and Zach became Christians within the same month as college students, forming transformative bonds.

  • “It wouldn’t be sufficient to say me and Zach are friends. I mean, it truly is closer to brothers and family.” (Gary, 12:11)

• Mentors and Spiritual Influence:

  • The Duck Commander household was pivotal in Gary’s conversion.
  • “Literally, you just kept loving me, kept bringing me in, and through the course of, I’m going to say, six months or something, literally, you loved me into Jesus.” (Gary, 14:19)

• Reciprocal Impact: Gary describes how lessons in work ethic and purpose flowed both ways between their families, stretching back generations.

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3. Shepherding and Discipleship Among Young Adults (18-19 years)

• The Mission: Gary and his wife Erica, with two other couples, are discipling a group of young adults navigating the faith transition out of high school.

  • Focus: Community, Bible narrative, application, and real-life sharing of the Gospel.

• Teaching Evangelism: The group recently asked for practical guidance on “how to share the Gospel.”

  • Gary recounts bringing Jase in for an informal, real-life session.
  • Jase’s approach is relationship- and curiosity-driven rather than formulaic.
    • “I’ve evolved…I’m introducing Jesus to people. So I spend way more time on who Jesus is than anything else.” (Jase, 25:14)

• Three Foundational Questions (Jase’s Method):

  1. How did you get here? (Origin)
  2. What are you doing here? (Purpose)
  3. What happens next? (Destiny)
  • “At the core of every human being, those three questions strike at what it means to be an image bearer of God.” (Gary, 30:58)

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4. Real-Life Gospel Encounters: The Waffle House Story

• Testimony of Application:
  • The young adults, after Jase’s teaching, encountered a man at Waffle House sharing a “new age” message. In response, they confidently shared the Gospel for hours.
  • “It culminated in [one of the students] giving her marked-up Bible to this man, which really disarmed him.” (Gary, 43:12)
• Theme of Boldness: Gary and the hosts emphasize that authenticity and willingness matter more than polish or fluency when sharing faith.

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5. The Power of Authenticity and Mission

• Clunky Beginnings are OK:

  • Everyone’s first attempts at evangelism are awkward, but God grows our effectiveness as we step out in faith.
  • “It’s going to be awkward, it’s going to be clunky, but it’s worth it. And you keep doing it.” (Gary, 44:21)

• Authenticity vs. Performance:

  • The importance of sincerity in testimony, rather than slick arguments.
  • Parallels drawn to contemporary figures who speak from experience (e.g., politicians like the LA mayoral candidate).

• The “Forever Family”:

  • Choosing eternal, Christ-centered relationships vs. merely worldly success.
  • Jesus’ own short, impactful life as the ultimate example.

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6. Kingdom Living: Not Just Sin Avoidance

• The Fullness of Christian Life:
  • Gary critiques the view that the Christian walk is only about “sin avoidance,” arguing it’s about joining Jesus’ mission, which brings passion and fulfillment.
  • “A mentality of ‘don’t do bad stuff’ is not big enough to live for.” (Gary, 38:54)
• Purpose and Transformation:
  • Living out kingdom purpose naturally leads to less sinful behavior, as lives are occupied with godly pursuits.

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7. Retreats and Intentional Encounters

• The Power of Retreats:
  • Gary highlights local men’s and women’s retreats as avenues for deep transformation and the Holy Spirit’s work.
  • Four to six weeks of anticipation allow God to prepare participants.
  • Servant leadership, community, and shared vulnerability make these weekends life-changing for both newcomers and seasoned church members.

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8. Personal Courage and Next Steps

• Overcoming Fear:

  • The guys encourage listeners: even if public speaking or sharing faith seems intimidating, God can use anyone, even the shyest.
  • “My biggest fear as a kid was public speaking…And to fast forward that through what God has done, it’s pretty amazing.” (Jason, 45:06)

• Practical Encouragement:

  • If you feel ill-equipped, invite people into your home and share what Jesus has done for you.
  • If you don’t know the answer to a question, admit it honestly—people respect authenticity.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On sharing faith:
  “Jesus is the source of life…the Scriptures, you don’t find life in the Scriptures, you find life through the Scriptures because it shows you Jesus Christ.”
  — Jase (26:52)

• On the three big questions:
  “How did you get on the planet?...What is your purpose?...What happens next?”
  — Jason (28:28-30:09)

• On living for eternity:
  “He has set eternity in our hearts. Like, it takes a lot of re-education to beat it out of somebody and they still can’t get it out of them.”
  — Gary (30:58)

• On ‘clunky’ evangelism:
  “It’s going to be awkward, it’s going to be clunky, but it’s worth it. Persevere—God’s going to develop you as a worker.”
  — Gary (44:21)

• On authentic testimony:
  “When something has impacted you to such a degree that it changed your life, then you can’t help but be authentic and talk about it.”
  — Jase (47:02)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• [03:25] - Gary’s first appearance and on being the “nervous duck hunter”
• [07:12] - The merging of the Dasher and Robertson families
• [12:11] - Shared conversion experiences and the birth of deep Christian friendships
• [14:19] - “Loved into the kingdom”: How the Robertsons discipled Gary
• [19:41] - Gary’s work with young adults at church; why discipleship matters
• [25:14] - Jase’s approach to sharing the Gospel (relationship over method)
• [28:28] - The three core worldview questions for apologetics and evangelism
• [42:05] - The Waffle House evangelism story (impact of the teaching in real life)
• [44:21] - “Clunky” beginnings and the perseverance needed in sharing faith
• [48:44] - Importance and structure of spiritual retreats
• [52:55] - If you’re willing, God will use you; practical encouragement for listeners

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Final Thoughts

This episode weaves together humor, warmth, and deep spiritual insight. By sharing family history, spiritual journeys, and mentoring stories, the Robertsons and Gary model how living openly as followers of Jesus transforms communities and ignites new generations. The recurring encouragement is simple: no matter your comfort level or skill, God uses willing hearts to build His “forever family”—one authentic, sometimes awkward conversation at a time.

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Transcript

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[Jason]

I am unashamed. What about you?

[Jase]

Welcome back to Unashamed, Jase. I don't know about you, but it was weird because we in our ears, instead of having the melodic tone of Maddie counting us down, it was the gruff low tone of the Swiss army knife Josh, who's back in studio as our producer today. Matty is out on assignment. She is a. She is out there doing the her thing. But it was kind of weird to me. Was that weird to you?

[Jason]

Yeah, it was a little weird.

[Jase]

So we, so but we're still functioning. We're still rocking. So, so here's, here's what's happened. So we have a guest on today, which I'll introduce in just a moment, but this Zach is actually in town.

[Jason]

Yeah, he was supposed to be here as of five minutes ago. We realized that even though Zach made it from North Carolina, he's not going to make it to this studio. And what's so funny is our last podcast, which was in our time a couple days ago. Yeah, Maddie, who's not here also, she said what everybody was thinking. It was a real awkward conversation because on our next podcast we have another guest who is flying in. And Zach said, oh, I'm going to pick him up at the airport. So I might miss the first podcast, which is this one. And so Maddie hesitated. We all did. I thought I was, I was thinking what Maddie then said. She said, well, Zach, couldn't anyone pick him up from the airport.

[Jase]

It's exactly what I was thinking. I was like, are you the boss? Are you the Aaron boy? Are you the coffee person? I mean, what are you in this organization? I thought the time Zach was running it. But if you got to go to the airport and pick people up. No.

[Gary]

Well, I think that tells you where I rank in Zach's order of priorities.

[Jason]

I well, y' all are friends and been friends for years. Why didn't he come pick you up at your house?

[Gary]

Yeah, I was. I would have loved to ride Zach.

[Jase]

Fay, I appreciate. Let me introduce our guest since he's he's now interjected into this Throw Zach under the bus segment. So this is Gary. Gary, Glenn Osborne or GG Some. Some call him that. Gary. Welcome back, Gary. If memory serves. And I say that not like I know and trust my memory, because it's not very good as I get older. But if memory serves, back when dad was still on the podcast, we had you on back in the Old Lair because we were in the book of Romans, and you do a especially particularly good job on Romans 9. 11. I'd heard you teach, and so I want you to come on the podcast, and you did. That's when you. Is that the last time you were on the podcast? Does memories hurt me?

[Gary]

Well, yep, down to the layer. I think it was Romans 8 and 9. That's what we were on.

[Jason]

Wow. What a memory. So I'll give you the other nicknames for you. I don't know if this is a nickname or a phrase, but my dad used to say, no. Oh, Glenn. He'd call you Glenn. He said, he's the only lawyer that I would trust. You know what my response was? I said, well, what about Jesus? He went, yeah, you got a point there. I thought that was funny. And then J. Stone has dubbed you. I don't know if you are aware of this, because you duck hunt with us some, because your uncle is neighbors with us. So to keep the peace and love your neighbor, we hire you to be the gap to bridge that gap. And we love your uncle. He's funny. But he calls you the nervous duck hunter.

[Gary]

I have not heard that.

[Jason]

Oh, he does. Every time. He said, we'll have. So he'll have the list of people who are going. And one day I looked at the list, and it said, the nervous duck hunter. So I had text back, I said, who's the nervous duck hunter? And he went. I was like, he's a nervous duck hunter. He's like, well, you know how he is. And when he described it, it made sense because you're intense, you know, right there.

[Jase]

Whoa.

[Jason]

You know, cut your. Your. I don't know if nervous is the right word.

[Gary]

No. So I think that the way that works is usually when. When I go with y', all, it's later on in the second split.

[Jason]

That's true.

[Gary]

And y' all are just wore down from the grind of duck season. And so, like, you're not attentive to anything. Well, like, I'm not hunting as much as y. And so, like, yeah, I'm like, there's

[Jason]

ducks, you know, and, no, you're Excited that, that we had that conversation, me and Jay, I was like, he's more excited. And he's like, well, it makes me nervous that you're that excited about every sighting of ducks. So I thought that was kind of funny. But anyway, so now that we've gotten to know you, the bottom line is, Al, you have to have thick skin if you're going to hang around us because somebody's going to label you something.

[Jase]

Oh, yeah, well, and another one is Oz. There's some people that call you Oz as well. So you do. You do have many nicknames and. Which fits perfectly in our realm.

[Jason]

So.

[Jase]

So here's my question. I've got the perfect lead in. We've already thrown Zach on the bus. We're not sure what he's doing, you know, but. But you and Zach are friends. Your family and Zach's family, as well as cousins, brother, sister and all that are very close. And. But at the same time, you grew up with our family because you were one of Jeff's closest friends. So we knew you from when you were very young. You were at the house hunting and with dad all. Everything you mentioned. So I think I hadn't. I thought about this when, when I knew you were coming on. So you have a unique perspective because a lot of our unashamed audience is trying to figure out the dynamic between Robertson and Dasher. Because, you know, Zach and Melissa and Grant obviously are half Robertson. We had a podcast recently. We talked about the merging of Famil and the merging of names, so. But the Dashers have a unique thing going on. But when you combine that with Robertson, it does something else. So you are the only man I know, once I thought about it, that would have the perspective on the difference between Dashers and Robertson. And yet the combination of the two, what does that create? Because you, you know us all the way through, you've been around the Robertson slot, you now know the Dashers. Well, explain to our audience because they're trying to figure it out. They don't know if Jason, Zach, hate each other, love, other, or somewhere in between.

[Gary]

Oh, no, it's love. But the love of the Robertsons and the Dashers expresses itself in a way that most people have not run into in their life. Exactly. I will say too, like the chaos of Phil's house. Like people in, out at any time, you walk in and there just be someone there. You have no clue. Always, always. No one have I seen that is like that outside of Zach and Jill. Like, literally, I was up in Black Mountain with Them. This has been a couple years ago, and me and Zach had been running an errand or something. It may have been Layla's wedding. And we were coming back in and we walk into his house or toward his house, and we walk by his pool and there's somebody swimming in his pool that you've never seen, that he's never seen. Oh, much less than I've ever seen. And like. And he was actually a little frustrated at Jill because I guess it was somebody Jill knew. But that is the dasher. What Phil and Kay's house was with just a magnet of people. That is what Zach and Jill's house is.

[Jason]

That's why he got so offended when I drove by his house. I didn't stop. I just blew the horn. And he was like, why didn't you stop? I thought I was busy. I was headed towards somewhere. I blew the horn. I thought that would be an act of kindness. And no, he got offended.

[Jase]

Gary, he blew the horn. He blew the horn from i40. Not right. Not at the house. He blew it from out of my

[Jason]

40 within a mile. I calculated how far horn would travel because I'm a hornblower. I actually blew it this morning. There was like three people up. The light turned green. There's a guy on his phone, but I'm three deep. And we're just sitting there. I just. So then everyone turns around, including the guy with his phone, cuz he had his window down and he's looking back at me like, why are you blowing the horn with his phone in his hand? And I went, move. I did it in love.

[Jase]

But my favorite line, Jazz, is when you did that to the woman in the roundabout that was sitting there on her phone, stopped in the roundabout and you stopped and said. Do you remember what you said?

[Jason]

You said, I'm like, you stopped your life and everyone else's. No. And now she was eating a double cheeseburger while on her phone in a roundabout with her legs on. On the steering. Steering wheel, looking around like, yeah, I'm going to stop right here, finish this burger, finish this text, and then I'll get back to going. I mean, real life story. Can you believe that?

[Gary]

Yeah, that's. I mean, partially. I'm kind of impressed. Like, that's a new level of multitasking there.

[Jason]

This phone epidemic has brought out that in people because they're somehow managing to travel and not just have a wreck every 50 yards because you're seeing it, I would say 1 out of 10, there's someone holding up traffic somewhere right now, 1 out of 10 cars on their phone because they just stopped their life.

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[Jason]

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[Gary]

I will say on on Zach specifically to kind of bridge the gaps. Yeah, me and Jep grew up. We were best friends from second grade. And then what happened was Zach moved here in College. He's about 19, I was 19. And neither of us were Christians and there was a crew of us guys, and me and Zach were among them, Jep too, who all became Christians within a month of each other or so. And it was like the most formative friendships of my life who we then got Married and our wives became best friend, and then we had kids and our kids became best friends. It wouldn't be sufficient to say me and Zach are friends. I mean, it truly is closer to brothers and family. To the. I mean, to the extent, like, we're going up. We vacation together most years, although bigger families, older kids are changing that. But, like, we're going up for his kid's wedding, Max's wedding this weekend. Every big important life event still to this day, even though we're states apart, I mean, it's not friendship. It really is family on that.

[Jase]

Yeah.

[Jason]

Well, I asked you even before we started the podcast, how did you even get here? But you said, y' all just love me into the kingdom. Which I thought was a strange way of putting it, but I liked it.

[Gary]

So I came in. I was Jep's best friend. I had been raised up around Jesus, but had never really devoted myself to Jesus. But I was playing the part. You know, I was trying to look like I was, by all appearances, while still maintaining authority over myself or whatever, doing what I wanted to do. And basically, and I said it, it was you, K, Phil, W. Bill Phillips, primarily those guys, because I started working for Duck Commander back at K and Phil's house during this time frame. And y' all just, I mean, like, you continued to share Jesus with me. You kind of saw through the lines that I wasn't a Christian, regardless of what I was saying.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Gary]

And literally, you just kept loving me, kept bringing me in, and through the course of, I'm going to say, six months or something, literally, you love me into Jesus. Like, you showed me Jesus and how you were living. And by your words, both. And destroyed some misconceptions I had. Like, I didn't believe, like, walking with Jesus could be full of life. Like, that's one of the things that you guys particularly, like, destroyed. Like. And I. I told W. Bill Phillips this just a couple of weeks ago. Like, I don't think he understood how big he was for me. Just in displaying for me that Christianity isn't like a settling, like, okay, I'll have Jesus, but I have to compromise on life. No, like, this is the most life. And he was big for me in that. Just being a big brother, essentially.

[Jason]

That reminds me of that John 10, when Jesus said, I came to give you life.

[Gary]

I just happen to have it right there.

[Jason]

There. Have it to the fullness. Or more abundantly when I think that's

[Jase]

one of the interesting things about our families. Jace mentioned about the farm community, that your family has that connects to our hunting property. And when I look at the, you know, so there's always been this like combination of that with your family and our family that go way, way back. And you may not know this Gary, but so your grandpa and your great uncle, they. When I was just not, I think I was even pre teen, I don't think I was even a teenager. But when I was a pre teen, around 12 or 13 years old, they gave your family, gave me an opportunity to haul hay in the summer. It was a chance for me to make some money. And it was really interesting because I spent a lot. Those guys were overseeing everything. Of course there were other people there as well and there were other young bucks, us out there doing the hay. But they taught me a lot about work, about work ethic, about what it takes to earn a dollar. And you know, I mean, these are life lessons that I got from your family that have, have stuck with me my whole life. And so I mean to think how it all kind of worked out that then it was a quid pro quo in terms of some spiritual things that we discovered that then you were a part of in our family and our life in this forever family. But your family has already contributed to me, even things outside of what we're talking about today, just in the idea what it takes to work, to accomplish something. Because these men were your grandpa and great uncle, were of the greatest generation, like my grandpa. They were the ones, the builders of things and the producers of things. So, you know, I mean, our families go way back is what I'm saying, because I'm 61 years old. So this is 50 years ago when these guys were impacted.

[Gary]

It's crazy how God just intertwined us. Another aspect, my uncle Wendell, which y' all have talked about numerous times, he's

[Jason]

one of the most fun human beings. Now we have a nickname for him. We call him the 360 shooter. Oh yeah, because. Which means like in a duck hunting situation for you non duck hunters, we have a rule and I usually go over it. You shoot in your lane, but you get some of these old timers, they size another one 360. So when they go up, most people go down because they're going to shoot because they justify it by shooting up. They're like, oh, well, I didn't shoot over your head. I was shooting up. But they'll shoot in any direction.

[Gary]

So Wendell, what I was going to say there, Wendell and Phil work together at an. In an early job as like park rangers or something. So it's just crazy how that culminated in, like, ultimately all those things work together. And I found Jesus through that, you know?

[Jason]

And can you imagine being in a park and having Phil and Lindell come up, have a conversation with you? With their little hats? With their little hat.

[Jase]

There's a. There's a picture. I wish I could find it. It's out there some. I mean, it's somewhere. It's probably somewhere in mom and Dad's house of Wendell and Dad in their uniforms with the Smokey the bear hats as park rangers. And I wish I could find it because it would be such people would be shocked by the way they look, you know, in this era. Also, one other connection. So Wendell's grandson, which I guess would be your cousin Gary, is the producer for the Duck Call Room podcast, which is just another connection. Young Hunter. So it's a lot of back and forth. So one of the reasons we want to have you on. So Gary, just to let our audience know, is one of the shepherds at our church. And, man, he. He and his wife Erica, along with a lot of, you know, their family, do amazing work shepherding, teaching, training. And so one of the things we all try to do, even though we're involved in this podcast, Jason and I, I mean, we still like to do local things. We still like to connect with individual people when we can. And, you know, you just get these different opportunities. Our lives have kind of taken us. God's taken us in a different direction, but we still love that. And so Jay's talked about recently on the podcast about being with you, Gary, with a group of people. And so we want to talk about that today.

[Jason]

You said you had breaking news about how that was. Because I haven't talked to you since.

[Gary]

We need to set it up. And then I'll come to the culmination of what has happened.

[Jason]

Set it up, because it's. I've done a lot since then. So it was blurry. That was a blurred. I was. I had something else going on. I rolled in and rolled out.

[Gary]

Well, so this group, it's. It's. I guess you'd call it a young adult group or college group.

[Jason]

They're like, what, 18 to 25?

[Gary]

Yeah. But really they're all 18 and 19 years old.

[Jason]

Okay, 18 and 19. I wasn't sure.

[Gary]

Yeah. And so basically, we had some changes at the church within the church body on the college ministry stuff. And so about a year ago, we had this big high school class coming out, and I was like, we have to help them find a Place and a community to walk with in Jesus. And so for the last, I don't know, near about a year, three couples and it's me and Erica and Josh and Katie Patrick and Colin and Kristi Dunn have just, on Wednesday nights just kind of been with them and just trying to give them a place to, you know, maybe some guard rails or some wisdom. Yeah. As a group. And we just had a little Wednesday night group. We eat together and then we have some form of Bible study. Well, most recently, I guess a little while ago, we had just walked through basically kind of a survey of the Bible where, you know, our aim was giving them a whole picture of the Bible, the narrative arc of what God was doing throughout all of it, putting it together. Scott Caldwell had done that. But as we finish that, we kind of ask them, what do you guys want to do next? What did you all have? Anything that's on your heart, you know, whatever. And it came up, man, we would love if y' all would teach us or kind of help us understand how to share the gospel.

[Sponsor Representative]

Yeah.

[Gary]

And so for, I don't know, three or four weeks, we had been walking, we had been doing that. The first one, we just kind of individually talked about ourselves, how we go about doing that kind of our approach. And then we got into kind of like they were, they were wanting. Yeah. But we want to understand like the structure of it. And so Josh. It's kind of funny, Al. Josh is the grandson in law of old Bill Smith, who. That's a whole other connection.

[Jason]

Well, he. And he's the guy that brought our dad to the Lord.

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[Jason]

Well, right now in the back of my truck, I have many boxes. And I was asking my wife what is in these boxes? And she said, well, I got bubble cuddle blankets for everyone in our family.

[Jase]

Well, I think the only, the only thing I have, Zach, are my pajamas. And the reason why is because it's the only thing that's left just for me. Everything I bring into my house from, from Cozy Earth gets hijacked by my wife and children and grandchildren, but they love it.

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[Jase]

Yeah. And also Josh, who, who was at the time very young. He and Katie had not been married super long. And he was the last guy that Bill Smith who mentored me for 20 years, who led dad to Christ and mentored him in his first years as a Christian to mentor. He mentored Josh. He, he basically took him in, he taught him, he, he trained him. And now Josh is, is one of the guys that are church. So I always think the last guy is always special because that's the last imparting gift that Bill Smith gave to our church family was his grandson in law.

[Gary]

So Josh had a stack of these and we've just used this as kind of a tool to walk through I don't know some of the mechanics or the verses on having a Bible study. Yeah. Like here's a structure of how you might share the gospel. Now I'll say there's nothing like it doesn't have to be that way. It was just this was an easy structure to try to show them. So within that, we've been doing that three or four weeks. And then Jase had come by because he was doing something special for W. Phillips, which we mentioned before. And I just mentioned to Jace. I was like, jason, we're doing this class, if you have time, it'd be really cool if you just came and talked to them about like how you share the gospel. And I'm not, I'm not wanting you to prepare anything. I'm just talk about how like your heart, how you think through this. And so Jace came and I'll kick it over to you. But it felt like when you got in, it was like, I'm pretty pumped about this.

[Jason]

Oh, I was pumped because I'm getting asked that question with young people more than any other thing. It's like, here we go again. It's that age group. And it may have, you know, what happened to Charlie Kirk might have contributed to that or because it was, he was really doing those Q and A's with young People, which I've been doing that for the last few years. When I do Q and A, it's the young people that come up and they. Some of them are, like, combative. They're trying to get around it. Well, I like a good scrap for Jesus. So that was so interesting to me when I was researching Charlie Kirk a couple days before he was murdered, that I was like, well, this guy, now, he had a political side to what he was doing, but because I was just mainly having these kind of debates with young people. But it was just all about Jesus or whether there's a God. So. But here, ever since that's happened, it just seems like there's a movement. So I thought, well, here we go. It's in my hometown. I would love to do that. And I've evolved in. Because I used to use this same track, probably the first seven or eight years. I would use that as a guide. But I told you, I was like, prepare yourself. Because I have evolved in sharing Jesus with people. I don't really use a formula, but what I then shared was how I do it. And the main thing I think that came across from that. I'll get your take on it, was that I'm introducing Jesus to people. So I spend way more time on who Jesus is than anything else. And I kind of went through how I go about doing that with impending questions.

[Gary]

Oh, absolutely. Like, your. Yours was a. The way you said like, or you taught them or. This is how I typically do. It was just like, I. I askew formulas. What I'm trying to do is introduce somebody to Jesus. Because Jesus is the source of life. Yeah, like the. The scriptures. You don't find life in the scriptures. You find life through the Scriptures because it shows you Jesus Christ.

[Jason]

That's it. And I read that in John 5, which is where that evolved. Yeah, that was. But like, you did. I didn't realize y' all had gone through kind of showing that narrative of the whole Bible, which is what I do about Jesus. So I start in John, and then I go backwards and forwards on what that means that he came to earth and what he did and how you should view that or in any kind of impending questions. And then I had a little part of it that was like probing questions. People don't believe in God because a lot of people you study with, well, they don't believe in God or the Bible. So that becomes tricky because if you start reading scriptures, they're like, well, I don't believe that. I mean, I don't believe this is the word of God. So then that's when I use Acts 17, which they don't know what I'm saying is in Acts 17. I'm just asking them probing questions as a human.

[Gary]

And it's funny, your three questions that you presented them with that like, that's where you hit people. I remember when I was 19 and 20, me asking those three questions, those same three.

[Jason]

Oh, I've been asking those three questions for 40 years. I taught junior high at same church for 11 years. And the first year, besides the first year, because the first year I would try to plan a lesson and go. And I realized these people are in junior high, that they're incapable of holding a thought for longer than 10 seconds. So I thought, you know what I'm going to do? I'm going to do one thing until they get it. So for 10 years, I gave the same speech every Wednesday night for 10 years. And here's what's fascinating. They loved was simple. We talked about what those three questions meant and how Jesus answered them, which the three questions are, how did you get on the Earth? I've given it many times in the podcast.

[Jase]

Keep giving.

[Jason]

First time. How did you get on the planet? And there's different ways to ask that in depending on the context. But where's the origin of life? What is the Earth doing it? How did we get here? Because that's an important question. Because whatever your answer is, your life will dictate that. If you believe it was just random chance, what they teach you in public school, well, no wonder your life is pretty miserable, because what does that all matter anyway? It was just random luck. And here we are. So how did I get here? What am I doing here? Which goes to the purpose. These are all interesting to any human being, whether they believe or not.

[Gary]

What is your purpose? Is your life aimless? That's right, exactly.

[Jason]

And third is what happens next.

[Gary]

And so you've reformulated that one. When I was 19, 20 years old, it was, how are you leaving? Where am I going?

[Jason]

Yeah, where am I going? Or how are you leaving? But I think what happens next is more. I've just noticed that people. Because it's like, what happens after death? Or what if there is a God and he comes back? How are you going to feel then? You know, it's such a frightening question.

[Gary]

Or it's just pure hopelessness, because nobody wants to believe this is it. And after this there's hopelessness. Nobody wants to believe that.

[Jason]

Nobody wants to believe that. And it's almost too hard to believe this, this just all happened by random chance and then all of a sudden you just die and that's it.

[Gary]

And I would say that goes to God has set eternity in our hearts. And so all three of those questions, how did I get here? I don't care. Look, you can train yourself out of it, but at the core of you, you know, there's something behind how I got here. This wasn't chance. What am I doing here? No, there's something in every human being's heart that says I'm not irrelevant. Like, I was made for a purpose, I was made to matter. And then what's next? Like, again, he has set eternity in our hearts. Like it takes a lot of re education to beat it out of somebody and they still can't get it out of them. Like at the core of every human being, those three questions, like, strike at what it means to be an image bearer of God.

[Jason]

Well, I was just going to say the reason I was so excited and passionate, because what they don't realize, which they will quickly realize, is I've had so many people in these combative situations where like cussing me, saying I don't believe in your blankety blank God and all this kind of stuff. And to me that doesn't make me nervous. Or I just wait till they get finished and then I say, well, how did you get here? Then I asked those, especially in combative situations. Well, it's amazing. They look and they're like, what do you mean? How did you get on the planet? I mean, I get it, you don't believe in God, you hate God, you hate me. I want to hear what you're into. Maybe I'll go with you.

[Gary]

What's your origin story if mine's wrong?

[Jason]

And all of a sudden since they don't have an answer or they're embarrassed to say what they really believe because most people then say, well, I don't. I'm really not sure. It's like, well, what's appealing about that? You're not sure how you got here. I'm confident how I got here. Maybe you should look into what I'm saying.

[Gary]

Maybe consider.

[Jason]

What are you saying? Well, now we're back in, we diffuse that. Because I think that when you're doing spiritual warfare, that's what happens. They're going to put you to the test. You ask a simple question and all of a sudden they're put on the defensive because they got to think in their mind, what do I believe about those three questions? And they don't have we know? I've never heard an answer that's anywhere close as fulfilling and joyous as what I'm.

[Gary]

Let me just kind of give some props here to you guys. Zach just did a podcast with Mac and Mary. I normally don't listen to any of these podcasts, not because I don't like them, I just don't have time. But that one popped up and I listened to, and one of the things Zach and Jill really told them was like, y' all don't understand how much of our DNA of who we are and how we serve Jesus is founded on y'.

[Jase]

All.

[Gary]

And I'm telling you two guys and your dad posthumously, I don't think y' all understand how formative it was for me and Zach in particular when we're 19 and 20 years old when we came into Jesus to see especially the two of you and your parents, like living that out, reaching out to people to share Jesus, the hope in Jesus with them over and over. I know now it's like Duck Dynasty and people see y' all in a different way. When I was 20 years old, you had people in your house nonstop sharing Jesus with them. You led a house church forever. Al was the exact same way out on Wellspring Road in Calhoun. People in his house all the time, leading them to Jesus. And even it rubbed off on guys who maybe weren't naturally like that. I remember we was that way. And what I'm saying is the way y' all love people and showed them Jesus, that was formative for me and Zach to the extent where it's like, I think both of us feel a. Like a responsibility almost, because how y' all walk that out.

[Jase]

Well, and I wanted to say something and thank you for that. I wanted to say that you said something earlier that sparked the thought of my head when you talked about eternity in us. And when you were describing your young life, you had the same experience we did when we saw it, is that we wanted to get in on forever family as quickly as possible. Because that's what we're talking about. We're talking about eternal relationships that we choose to be a part of because we decide we're going to follow Christ, which then puts us in with other people that are like minded, that then gives us this mission. And what I thought about when you think about this idea of eternity now is that that takes away the idea from a. From a strictly worldly, earthly point of view of what a life lived. Well, looks like, because think about if you took out the eternity if you took out the God part of it and you just said, what would a successful life look like? So, well, you'd make a certain amount of money, you would have, you know, success, you would have a family, possibly, if that's what you were into. And you would, you know, live a long old life and see the world, and then you would die in your sleep, you know, without any suffering. And even then, at the end of the day, you'd still be gone. But the idea was, well, that said, that's a life pretty well lived. But think about it. If that's what it took, then how do you describe all the comets of lives that come through that are short in a short burst? As you mentioned, Charlie Kirk, mean, 32 years old, but the man made the most out of his adult life. I mean, from when he was 18 to 32, he impacted tons of people and tons of young people for good. And then he was gone. And I was thinking about a dear friend of ours, Gary, that's a mutual friend of ours with Josh and Allie. Taylor and Ally, you know, battled cancer from 24 to 37, and she just crossed over within the last couple of weeks. And you say, man, what a tragedy. You know, they had four girls, and now Josh is left with these girls. But. But Josh doesn't look at it that way, and neither do we. That was a short burst of an amazing life that impacted people for eternity. And we. We look at. We look at that in a completely different way. By the way, J. Josh is coming on the podcast next week, and so I can't wait. His perspective. But that's the idea. Jesus Christ, the son of God, came to earth and only lived to 33. You think about, if you're the creator of the universe, you get to live as long as you want. But he only lived to 33 with three years of ministry that we even can read about in the scripture. And yet I would say he made a huge impact in the three years that he was here, in the 33 years he was on the earth.

[Gary]

That's something I've been. And me and you kind of talked about this a little bit last week. Something that I've been passionate or, I don't know, God has hit me across the face with recently is how a lot of times we as Christians settle that we think that the Christian life is essentially just sin avoidance. Like, I just don't want to do bad stuff. And what has became really clear to me recently is if that's. If that's the totality of what The Christian life is for you. One, you're going to be miserable and two, you're going to fail at it because the Christian life is about, it's

[Jason]

about you in that context, that's the biggest problem.

[Gary]

If that's all it is. If you're not bringing the kingdom. John 10:10. I mean, you said it. The enemy comes to steal, kill and destroy. I've come that they may have life, life worth living or life to the full or qualitative good life that's like this is going to stir the passions within you. And what I'm saying is a mentality of don't do bad stuff is not big enough to live for.

[Jason]

Oh yeah, so good.

[Gary]

And so we get back to this, like the burden to tell people about the hope in Jesus. Yeah, we should be doing that. But more than that, man, that's where the good stuff is.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Gary]

Because if you're like to be, to do that, you're going to be involved in people's lives, you're going to be serving people, you're going to like, there's not going to be isolation, there's not going to be aimlessness. Like through pursuing that mission of I'm sharing the hope of Jesus in a lot of different ways. Like it's going to fill up your life with good things and good people and mission and purpose and excitement and connection. And that's the Christian life.

[Jason]

Yeah, right. And then not doing bad things or sin avoidance, as you said, you'd be surprised if you're imaging God, which is. Well, I think you just described what that means. You're reflecting how good God is in your life and there's a sense of purpose that comes along with that, which is the answer to that second question. But then you'll look up because you're more offensive minded, as in God's using me to do this. And a byproduct of that is less bad things that you're doing because you're actually doing things that are right. And I mean, I tell the story all the time because people find it fascinating that I would wait till I got married before I had sex because I read the Bible, I was like, oh, got to wait till I get married. Well, what's the best way to do that? Well, the best way to do it is, is to make a speech at the beginning of the relationship about that's the goal. Then pray about it and study your Bible along the way and then go get your friends together and share Jesus with them. It's amazing. If you're focused on those things, the less you're focused on that. That just is like a byproduct of it.

[Gary]

I agree completely about that.

[Jason]

Well, I was going to say, so you told me you had, because I never heard the report. So before we run out of time, I want what happened, because I literally walked in. It was like somebody pushed a button. And I was real passionate about it. I probably talked an hour, about three minutes in that everyone was looking bewildered. And I didn't know if it was my passion or. But I think I stopped and said, you are going to need to write this down.

[Gary]

And then everybody went scrambling for scratch paper and pens.

[Jason]

But now, Gary, I don't know if you noticed that this. But about 30 minutes into it, I realized that they. Which is really excited me. It was like they were just right. They was writing. It was like we were in a class or something. There was a lot of writing going on. I thought, oh, they're liking this.

[Jase]

So.

[Jason]

And then I left. And so now here we are.

[Gary]

So. So you had that last week, and we Message and things like that about the class during the week, but I hadn't thought anything about it till I come there Wednesday, two days ago.

[Jason]

So this is the week after.

[Gary]

That's right. And they said as we're getting started, they're like, we have to tell you the Waffle House story. And I was like, well, we're going to do this, you know, we're going to get back on this. They're like, no, no, we need to tell you the Waffle House story. So Sunday night, a crew of those same 18, 19 year olds that were in there go to Waffle House after their small group or house, church or whatever. And there's five or six of them. And a guy comes up and is like, hey, can I share something with y'?

[Home Depot Announcer]

All?

[Gary]

And it was like a new AG message. And they were like, yes, but we get to share something with you, too.

[Jason]

Oh, it's working. It's working.

[Gary]

The five of them proceed to just like, in their. In their best way, you know, the best way they know how to share the hope that they found in Jesus. And they literally were there for three and a half, four hours talking to this guy. And it culminated in. I don't know if you remember the. The girl that was sitting there, Clark's girlfriend, two seats over from you. Her name was Bri.

[Jason]

Oh, yeah, I do remember her.

[Gary]

Okay. It culminated in this. It kind of got to loggerheads with the guy, you know, and she went out. She just got up and walked out and went to her car and got her Bible, like her Bible with the notes and the highlights and the, all this, and brought it to him and asked the guy would, would you take my Bible? Would you read it if I gave it to you? And it like in, in a way that hadn't disarmed him before.

[Jason]

That disarmed?

[Gary]

Yeah, that disarmed him.

[Jason]

Oh, and good. That's powerful. I got chills on that. And so how that girl's what, 18? And she just. The reason I remember, I just liked her personality. I like, I liked her hunger for the word. I liked everything about her. So that's exciting.

[Gary]

And so like one thing I would say like, I guess to the unashamed audience is, look, I guarantee you those 18 and 19 year old kids trying to share Jesus with that guy were clunky and like, it wasn't smooth but they just did it.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Gary]

And like the courage to step up and do it, if you just persevere, I guarantee you, because you told your story the first time you shared the gospel with somebody that was on the telephone, I guarantee it was clunky.

[Jason]

Oh, was it clunky? Yeah, I was losing pages out of my Bible because I was nervous.

[Gary]

It's going to be awkward, it's going to be clunky, but it's worth it. And you keep doing it. And if like I have this burden on my heart, God's going to refine me in that and he's going to make me into whatever he wants me to be if I'm just a willing vessel, participant in that. The fields are white, the workers are few. If you're a worker, God's going to develop you as a worker and like it's going to use you in ways that you can't forecast at this point.

[Jason]

Exactly. Well, that's why this is such a transformational thing. God makes you a new creation. And for me, I've shared this so many times, but it's just true. I mean when, if you'd asked me what my biggest fear as a kid was, it was public speaking. Now just think about that. That was the number one fear. I don't mean standing up in front of people, that's obvious. I mean publicly speaking to anyone, I just seen, not say a word. So. And to fast forward that through what God has done, it's pretty amazing. So you're right. I think most people, and I've had so many people come to me and they think, well, I just don't think this is for everybody. Like sharing Jesus, because I'm shy, but I'm like, well, that was my biggest fear. But when I've zeroed into what the problem is, what I found was most people don't feel confident because they're like, what if they ask me a question they don't know the answer to? I've heard that hundreds of times. And I tell them the same thing every time. I say, you tell them, I don't know, but I'll find out. I'll try to research. I mean, it's okay. You're being authentic. And I think what you're calling clunky people see, which is true. But there's an authenticity there.

[Jase]

Jason, I got a perfect illustration for that. I was watching this. There's a guy running for mayor of Los Angeles, and he had a debate with two, I mean, politicians, typical, you know, politicians from California. And this guy, his whole thing is his house burned up along with a lot of other people's bad fire last the Palisades fire. And his whole deal is the city wasn't there for me. And listen to this guy talk, his authenticity. I mean, he was talking about. I mean, he wants. He's running for mayor of Los Angeles, I mean, one of the largest cities in America. But it's all because of an authentic moment where his city government failed him. And it's so amazing to listen to him and watch him, because he's not a politician. I mean, you know, he's been eat. A lot of people are comparing him to Trump and all that, but it's just. When you said that word, that's what I thought about. When something has impacted you to such a degree that it changed your life, then you can't help but be authentic and talk about it. And I think that's part of what we're talking about here and how you get there and the different way it looks for different people, it'll all be a little bit different. Jace is describing sort of the evolution of what happens across your spiritual walk as you go through the years, of how you share and how you impact people. And it should get, you know, better and easier and different as the years go by. But I want to mention this because we just have a few minutes left because there are, from my perspective, been in ministry a long time there, the Holy Spirit will bring about these waves that happen that are different ways people impact people. And you'll see them come along and you'll know it's the Holy Spirit doing. And it may not last for a period of time. And Then we're on to some other way to try to show people Jesus. But the last few years, at least in our community, and I think it's happening around the country, Gary, and you're a big and a part of it, we've had these kind of weekend retreats for men and women where there's this introduction of Jesus to people. And I just wanted you to speak to that because I think people out here listening may get an opportunity to be a part of something like that. And so why do you think that's successful, number one? And how does it show people Jesus? I know you can't get into all the specifics of it, but just, just generally.

[Gary]

So a lot of this we have a rule we're not going to tell, but there are some things that I think I can say. One, I think the biggest, one of the biggest pieces of magic in this is when, when guys or gals sign up to go on a retreat, it's generally, you know, a month, six weeks out before they're even going to go. So they have no idea what they're getting into. And for one month to six weeks, God is just, they know at the other side of this, I'm going to have a weekend full of. I don't even know what, but it's going to be explicitly Jesus. And for four to six weeks, God is just whittling on them, just working on them because they know that date is coming and it's getting closer and God's just working on them so that most of the time when they walk in, they know what it is, how God is working on them.

[Jason]

Yeah.

[Gary]

Could be a million different things. It could be a hurt or unforgiveness or sin or whatever, but they know how God's working on them. The other. Why is it so effective? And so I think it's just one. It's a ton of men or women, in the case of a women's retreat, that are just serving their tails off. And when you, like when you look in the, in the face of goodness, like, it marks you. It's kind of like Romans 12. If your enemy's doing something bad to you, repay that with kindness and it will heat burning coal. Like the goodness of God lived out in human beings marks people's soul that you can't. And so, like, you have this weekend where God's been whittling on you, and then you get there and you just see the, the goodness of God through the servanthood of his people. And then you realize too, in a lot of ways. Whatever I'm going through, I'm not alone. It has just been powerful. It has changed lives from the folks who are on the retreat. It has gotten men and women who have been shower uppers at a church body who never stepped up and done anything. It's given them a Kickstarter to take their first step. And it was like a flywheel or a snowball running down the hill. And they get momentum and they just find life in Jesus.

[Jason]

Don't you think it's like conversations and you're stopping your life? I always call those stop the chariot moments because that Philip and the Ethiopian eunuch, he's studying, he's reading a book, and he's like, who's the guy talking about here? And it was Isaiah, and he was talking about Jesus. And Philip shares. And it's like, the next part of the story is like, well, here's some water. Why shouldn't I be baptized? You know, it, like you said, whittling on him. And Philip's like, stop the chariot. I mean, but I think we all have to have that moment in our life. I wanted to share this. I know we're out of time, but when you were talking about that confrontation and the Waffle House stories, because that guy had no idea what had just happened a couple days before. I mean, they're fired up, but you're like, well, how are we going to do this? And then somebody comes up. So I remember the first time I was newly married, and I remember Missy coming in there. She's like, you're not going to believe this. There's some Mormons or Jehovah Witnesses or something on bikes, and they're coming toward our house. Will you handle this? Well, she was thinking that. However she thought I was going to handle it when. When they knocked on the door and they said, we would like to share something. And I said, oh, I've been waiting for y'. All. Y' all come in. The look on their face. And I looked at Missy and she. The look on her face was like, what? And I said, here's how this is gonna work. I'm gonna hear what y' all have to say, and then I'm gonna share something with y'. All.

[Jase]

In the words of spongebob. Two hours later, two hours later, Ed

[Jason]

out the next week, they said, because they left the first session saying, we're going to need. We're need. We need to go get our leadership to share with you. And I was like, bring them. Let's do this.

[Jase]

And sure. Going up the table.

[Jason]

We had a good conversation.

[Gary]

That is just the thing, man. If. If. If you are willing and you step out, God's. God's going to find a place to use you. Yeah. I mean, and so, like, if you're a guy, like, I don't even know how to do this. Just get people in your home and just tell them what Jesus has done for you.

[Jase]

And that's. And that's the idea of service, which I love. We're out of time, Gary. It's always a pleasure to have you on. We need to do this more often. Thank you for coming into Unashamed Nation. Thank you for what you're doing for our church, for our community, and also, you know, for us, because we're way back bff, so.

[Jason]

And for these young people, I mean, they're just hungry. So let's us, as older individuals, give them some firepower.

[Jase]

Yeah. If you find them, teach them. Thanks for listening to the Unashamed podcast. Help us out by leaving a rating and review on Apple Podcasts. And don't miss an episode by subscribing on YouTube. And be sure to click the little bell and choose all notifications to watch every episode.