unSeminary Podcast Episode Summary

Episode: Who’s the Next You? Building a Gen Z Residency Pipeline with Dave Miller
Host: Rich Birch
Guest: Dave Miller (Leadership Pathway)
Date: September 11, 2025

Episode Overview

This episode dives deep into the urgent need for churches to intentionally develop the next wave of leaders—specifically Gen Z—through structured residency programs. Host Rich Birch welcomes Dave Miller from Leadership Pathway, an organization dedicated to launching, coaching, and consulting church-based residencies. The conversation covers practical insights on how and why churches must evolve their pipeline to engage, develop, and retain emerging Gen Z leaders, drawing on Dave's extensive experience and a forthcoming book, "Who’s the Next You?"

Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. The Shifting Leadership Landscape in the Church

• The church is experiencing a generational handoff, with Gen X and Boomers realizing they’re now “the old guy in the room.” (04:00)
• "I realize I'm increasingly... the old guy in the room. Increasingly, that's my role." —Rich Birch (04:13)
• Gen Z doesn’t respond to the same leadership development models used for previous generations.

2. What Churches Are Getting Wrong with Gen Z Leadership Development

• Many churches approach young adult leadership as they always have: bring them in, throw them in the deep end, expect them to comply and run fast (06:00–11:00).

• Major issues:

  • Overreliance on content/training (sermons, talks, books) as development
  • Lack of “developer mindset” in senior leaders—few see developing young leaders as core to their mission.
  • Organizational pace and structures that do not allow for relational, individualized mentorship.

  "If the goal of an internship or residency is just to get the kids working, let's get them on our page... That’s just not gonna work. It's not working anymore." —Dave Miller [10:39]

3. Gen Z as an ‘Unreached People Group’

• Requires learning their culture, language, and values, not simply assimilating them (07:05)

• Mission work analogy: You don't “colonize” or force your way. You learn with them and work among them.

  "If you can sit with this generation and learn their customs, learn their language, seek to understand...then you're gonna have a shot." —Dave Miller [07:05]

4. Challenges with Middle Management and Systemic Issues

• Most friction comes in the 33–40-year-old leaders; they’re running fast and find it difficult to slow down to invest in rising leaders (09:48–10:26).
• Churches (like small businesses) often lack real systems and processes for leadership pipelines.

5. The Pitfall of 'Dumpster Diving' Hires

• Churches often begin with high hopes for new hires, but months later end up recruiting candidates previously rejected, due to lack of planning/prep and weak pipelines (11:41–12:37).

6. Effective Leadership Development: Beyond Content

• The prevalent church model of "leadership development" is often just content delivery (books, sermons, lectures); real development needs more (16:40–20:39).

  • Seven Ingredients for Real Development* (detailed in Dave’s book):
    1. Training
    2. Spiritual formation
    3. Soft skills development (emotional intelligence)
    4. Best practices sharing
    5. Ownership opportunities (graduated responsibility)
    6. Mental wellness/health support
    7. Developmental conversations (personalized, not just group sessions)

  "If content was the key... we'd be fine. Content is amazing. It's what a world. But…we need something deeper than that." —Dave Miller [20:39]

7. Residency as a Strategic Solution

• Residencies provide intentional, hands-on experience and mentorship, designed to nurture not just ministry skillsets but holistic leaders.
• The goal: 1,000 more churches investing in Gen Z through a residency pipeline.

8. Building a Sustainable System

• Investing in a residency approach won’t solve today’s hiring needs—but in 2–4 years, it transforms the leadership pipeline (33:03).
• Key issue: Getting all church leaders on the same page that residents are not just free labor, but future leaders to be developed.

Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On the urgent need for development:

  "You have to go a little slower so you can go faster and farther. And this shows up big time on this topic." —Dave Miller [12:37]

• On the difference between training and development:

  "Churches for a long time have done really, really well with training... But we have to provide ownership, mental wellness, and developmental conversations. Content alone isn't enough." —Dave Miller [17:15–20:39]

• Ownership & coaching:

  "When the team is losing, we have to own it. Similarly, this is on us." —Dave Miller [19:48–19:59]

• Rich’s challenge to leaders:

  "What if we built a system for building young leaders that sure is not going to deliver somebody today, but two years from now, it's going to deliver some people. Two years after that...?" —Rich Birch [33:03]

Timestamps for Key Segments

• 00:41–03:33 – Dave’s background, calling, and the formation of Leadership Pathway
• 04:00–05:07 – Generational handoff and the Gen X perspective
• 05:07–10:26 – What’s broken in Gen Z ministry leadership approaches
• 10:26–13:42 – Organizational pace, system gaps, and why it’s not working for Gen Z
• 13:44–15:44 – The reality of Gen Z options and why ministry must be attractive
• 16:39–21:52 – Churches’ content addiction vs. true developmental work
• 22:26–24:22 – The 1,000 church vision and progress so far
• 25:28–27:28 – Lessons learned, avoiding common mistakes, and “one size fits one” philosophy
• 28:29–29:48 – Overview of the forthcoming book and what it covers
• 30:21–32:09 – The practicalities of scaling residency in multi-staff contexts
• 32:30–34:39 – Where to find resources, book, and connecting for next steps

Takeaways for Church Leaders

• Legacy requires intentional pipelines: The next “you” won’t be recruited in a panic—start building them now.
• Residency programs, thoughtfully designed and relationally driven, are crucial for both ministry momentum and sustainability.
• It's not about more content—it's about more connection, development, and ownership.

Where to Learn More

• Leadership Pathway: leadershippathway.org
• Book: Who’s the Next You? A Call for 1,000 More Churches to Invest in Gen Z through Residency (Available on Amazon, see Leadership Pathway site for direct links and resources)
• Masterclass Trainings: Information about live and online training for churches considering building a residency pipeline is on their website.

Final Words

"We're just living out of the abundance of now having worked with 1,000+ applicants and 150+ churches. A lot of that learning is in the book. ...If churches would just not make the same mistakes we've made, we'd all be so much further." —Dave Miller [27:28]

This episode is a must-listen (or read) for any church leader serious about the church’s future—and about investing practically and relationally in the next generation.