← Victory Church: Paul Daugherty
Victory Church: Paul Daugherty
THE STORY OF VICTORY & THE MIRACLES THAT LED US HERE | PAUL & SHARON DAUGHERTY | MIDWEEK SERVICE
01:09:14
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- [00:00]
A
Come on, Jesus. Well, mom, you got your mic over there. You ready to talk tonight? Yeah, yeah. Is the mic on? Is Pastor Sharon's mic on? Mom? Check it just for a second.
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B
Testing, testing.
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A
There we go. There we go. It's on. First off, let me just say this. My mom is a hero of mine. And, yeah, not just because she brought me into the earth, but she is literally like the definition of perseverance. And I've said this before. Yeah, you could give her a hand tonight. Can just be a lot of hand claps for Pastor Sharon. She deserves it, but, you know, she'll say that she doesn't, but she truly has been a hero of perseverance, pressing through hard times, pressing through moments where our church needed miracles. And, you know, they say that that phrase, behind every great man or beside every great man is a great woman or a greater woman. And, you know, I think about how my mom was that she was that right by his side, right by my dad's side, helping build the church, helping pray for miracles, helping worship our way through hard seasons. And today, to be here on this stage talking with my mom to hear the stories of victory. We were sitting down talking over lunch not too long ago, and as we were sitting, talking about just the stories of Victor, I said, mom, it's been a while since we sat down and just. You shared the stories. And Psalms 145, if you've got a Bible, go to Psalm 145. But I'll let her do the talk. And I just want to give this verse here of why we do these nights where we sit down and we tell the history. This is what Psalms 145, verse 4 says. One generation shall praise your works to another generation. One generation shall declare your mighty acts to another generation. This is the divine art of storytelling. And in the olden days, they didn't have, you know, moments where they would sit in a big room like this. They would sit around a campfire, and Grandpa Abraham would sit down with, you know, Jacob and Esau and Isaac, and he would sit down with the whole family, and they would begin to tell stories. And Isaac would sit down with, you know, the grandkids of Jacob. And then they would sit down with each generation, talking about when Joshua led his family into the promised Land. He would tell them, let me tell you what we walked through in the wilderness. Let me tell you how we came out of Egypt. And each generation would pass those stories on, the miracles of God. Why? Because they didn't want the next generation to forget what Got us here. And so the title of tonight's message that you're going to hear from my mom is. Is the story of victory and the miracles that got us here tonight. And I'm gonna let my mom just begin. I want you to just talk about that first year that Victory started, how it was for you and dad. And just kind of begin with that first year. Cause so many miracles started this church.
- [03:05]
B
Okay. Yeah. And that scripture is so powerful, that 1 from Psalms 144. But passing on to the next generation, I think about how that in that first year that we started Victory, it really was a. It was. It was the fruit of hearing the voice of God and obeying God's voice. So I would say this would be a point tonight that you write down. Learn to hear and obey the voice of God. John 10:27 says, My sheep hear my voice, the stranger's voice. They will not follow, but they will follow the voice of the. Of the good shepherd. So follow, meaning obey. So I think hearing and obeying God. I remember Brother Roberts wrote a book called Hearing the Voice of God. And he said, I think it's my best book that I've ever written. But he put that in us as students at oru and that got inside of us. I think another thing was, is that when we were starting out, we had heard this message of faith. Faith is our victory to overcome in the world that we live in. Faith, we have to have faith. The Bible says that faith is the substance of things that are hoped for. In other words, it gives substance and the substance is the written word of God. So when we put the written word of God in us, we have a substance for our faith. Faith is a substance of things hoped for, the evidence of things not seen, and how the world was created by God through faith. God used his own faith to speak into existence. This whole world that we live in, let there be. And there was. And so faith is very vital to us as Christians, and particularly in obeying the voice of God. But in that first year of victory, we started actually, I look back and we had been youth pastors at Sheridan Christian Center.
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A
What year did you become youth pastors there?
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B
We became Youth Pastors 1974. When your dad graduated from ORU, he had been offered by two other organizations jobs, but didn't feel to take it. And that didn't make any sense to the natural mind. So many times when God speaks to you to do something, it won't make sense to your natural mind. And so he turned those two down and he said to me, I just really feel I'm supposed to call this church that this looking for a youth pastor and two to let them know that we're going to be going back to our hometown for a week and then we'll be back. And so he called this pastor and told him, you know, we're going to be gone out of pocket if you need to contact us. Well, the pastor said, you know, we're really desperate, and you're the only people that have applied for the job, so why don't you just come on and if we like you after three months and you like us, you can stay. So, and how long.
- [06:24]
A
How long did y' all serve in that role as youth pastors before you?
- [06:27]
B
We were there for a year and.
- [06:28]
A
A half, and then you went on the road.
- [06:30]
B
Right. But during that year and a half, another thing was when we graduated from ORU was we had prayed God put us where we can get our doctrine correct, because we had been raised to believe that, you know, sometimes it's God's will and sometimes it's not God's will to heal people. And so we needed to get our doctrines straight, and healing was a big part of that. So that summer, they had a camp meeting of Brother Kenneth Hagin at that church, and they announced that they were going to have this camp meeting. And so Billy Jones said, well, what's a camp meeting? Are people going to come and camp in the parking lot? No, they're just going to be in meetings day and night.
- [07:18]
A
Let me say something about this, because you're saying Kenneth Hagin started Rhema, which is an amazing Bible church, a Bible school in town out of the same church. You were youth pastor.
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B
Right.
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A
He was a ministry Christian center.
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B
He was attending that church at the time. And he approached Brother Millard and said, I need to. I really know God spoke to me to start a Bible college, but I don't have a. I don't have a building. And so the pastor said, well, just start it here. And so that's what happened.
- [07:49]
A
So you're sitting in one of the camp meetings.
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B
So we were sitting in the camp meeting, and there was a man named Kenneth Copeland that stood up to speak, and when he did, he said, the day is coming when this church is going to burst out of its walls and touch the ends of the world. Well, immediately you're. Your father saw himself instead of Brother Copeland at the pulpit. He saw himself there, and he heard the voice of the Lord say, you're going to be the next pastor of this church. Well, we were in our early 20s and there was another person that was in line to become the pastor. And it just didn't seem like it was a possibility. But, you know, it happened. We ended up later when we traveled. We went out on the road traveling. The pastor told us, well, do you have to leave? Why don't you just stay here and go out every now and then? Well, no. Billy Joe said, God spoke to us. We're to go out full time now. And so he said, okay. He said, do you have any meetings? He said, well, we've got the going away service here and we've got one meeting lined up. It's a two week meeting in our hometown. So anyway.
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A
Which, by the way, during that traveling season, you ministered to churches for about four or five years, Right?
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B
They were all denominational churches.
- [09:10]
A
I had a family come up to me at the altar call this summer who said their parents were in one of your meetings when you were traveling before you started Victory, back when you and dad were in your early 20s, traveling and preaching. And their family was saved at one of your meetings in Arkansas.
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B
Wow.
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A
And now the grandkids and the. They ended up coming here for a week. I don't know if they ended up staying in Tulsa, but they said we were impacted during that traveling season, that your parents were out there ministering on the road.
- [09:38]
B
We pray, Lord, close the ears of the people that don't need to hear what we're saying and open the ears of people that do. And because we would share everything, we would share not only salvation, but we would share healing. We'd share on the baptism of the Holy Spirit with the evidence of speaking in other tongues. And I would turn my piano up at the altar calls when he would be praying for people. And I would think, you know, lord, let the people hear that need to hear and the ones that don't. We stayed in homes when we traveled.
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A
Now because of time, I want to keep us going here. So you stepped out of the traveling season. You stepped into pastoring at Sheridan. And then Victory launched, basically was forced to launch as a church.
- [10:20]
B
We ended up coming back here. The Lord spoke to your dad that he was to go to second year Rhema, and he had never graduated the first year. And so he had attended but not graduated. And so anyway, he came back and went to that. That was when I had Sarah, our firstborn. And also during that time, we were voted in to pastor. So that January of 1979, we started Victory. Are we? Yeah, we started Victory Christian School. Actually, it was Sheridan Christian School to start with and Victory Bible Institute. And so we started both of those.
- [11:02]
A
At that time while you were pastoring Sheridan?
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B
Yes.
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A
And then the board at Sheridan eventually started said, y' all need to go start your own church.
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B
Well, yes, because we were in multi services.
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A
I just know we got to get through 44 years tonight. We're still on, like, minus two. We got to get to the first year here in a second.
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B
So I'm so. No, you're fine. You're fine. That's good. Because during that time, we. We ended up. I just slipped.
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A
No, no, you. You basically had a moment where the church was growing and exploding. And the board said we were in.
- [11:40]
B
Six services on a Sunday. 8, 9, 10, 30, 11 30, and 1, 3, 5, and 7. I would go home in the afternoons with my two children. At that time, I had Sarah and Ruthie. We'd go home and take a nap and eat our lunch, and he would stay there. So, you know, he used to call it the longest day.
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A
And so was that at Sheridan or.
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B
That was at Sheridan. And so out of that, we ended up. We knew we had to move. And so the board just said, you know, we want to keep the location. Y' all just go start another church. So we did. We started Victory Christian center down the road, Easter of 1980, Easter of 1981, with 1600 people showed up. We didn't know who would show up, so it really was very moving. And then at that time, we had 735 or 700 and something kids in our Christian school, so we. We had to have a place for that.
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A
And the same year the church started, Victory Christian School started Victory Bible Institute, which is now Victory College.
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B
And we changed the name from Sheridan Christian School to Victory Christian School School. When we moved into our own facility. Well, we outgrew that location very quickly.
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A
Now. Y' all met in a tent.
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B
Yeah, that first year, which was why we. When we outgrew the location, we. We. We bought this tent and put it up in the parking lot. And when the weather started turning cold like it is right now, and it was rainy, we had to do something. So people were still coming. We had people pouring into the church. We ended up with 2,000 people in a year and a half.
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A
Wow. Yeah, that's a lot just coming into that tent. Coming. And it started out at Tink's Auto Mart. At first on the Auto Mart and.
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B
Then on down the road to the tent. And so the Lord spoke to Billie Joe Seed Faith. This is how we not only go debt free, but we live our lives. And so we sewed the tent to a missionary in Guatemala, Jim Zirkel. And he got the tent. We had to pay for the tent to be sent. So that was another added money to the situation. But anyway, we got it down there. We went down in our first missionary outreach, my husband and I. And when we got down there, I remember staying in this convent that we were staying in, and the light bulb had water coming through it. They said, now just don't put your finger up in there. Okay, no problem. I won't when you shower.
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A
So now, during this season, you know, the church was growing, exploding, and the school was growing. Yeah, the Bible school was growing. And at that time, Victory did not have its own location. We were still bouncing around places.
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B
Right. And because the school outgrew its the location that we were at, we had to move into what is now called Thoreau Junior High. So when you pass by that, just know at one point we were there.
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A
71St memorial. I remember going to school there when I was a little kid.
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B
Yeah.
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A
Now tell the story about how we got in there, because the man that was in charge of it did not want Victory there.
- [15:16]
B
Yeah. The school board of Tulsa did not want us in there because we. We wanted to rent it, and they didn't want any group renting it. And so especially a church. This is before churches used school buildings and secular buildings. And so anyway, this guy that didn't want us in there, I remember they kept turning us down, turning us down. Every time there was a monthly school board meeting, my husband would attend, and he would stand up. They'd say, is there any more business? He'd stand up and they would say, that's old business, and that's already been dealt with. Sit down. So he got shut down six times. So on the sixth time, they put it in the front page of the Tulsa World newspaper. And so anyway, after that time, it was Labor Day weekend, and my husband said, well, I've done everything I know to do. And then the Lord spoke to him and said, make one more offer on a little piece of paper and have your administrator take it to them. And what they did, what people didn't realize, was Billy Joe had gotten where he knew where everybody's address was. So he had sent them all a note.
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A
He was persistent.
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B
He was persistent. And so don't you think that's one.
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A
Of the keys, though, to seeing breakthroughs? And I just want to say this to people in the room tonight that are believing for breakthroughs you and Dad's persistence to just never give up on what God put on your heart.
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B
That's right.
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A
I think too many people stop on the sixth level lap around Jericho when God says, you got to march one more time. You got to go out one more day, one more time.
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B
And so that weekend, Billy Joe presented it to the church congregation. We have this opportunity to rent Thoreau Junior High. It's empty right now, but we need to. But the man told us that we have to come up with $120,000 by Tuesday night. Night. Well, this is a Labor Day weekend. Well, he wanted us to come up with the first month's rent and the last month rent. And so when Billy Joe presented it to the people that day in the offering, we ended up getting $60,000 over our normal tithes and offering. However, that was not 120. And so that afternoon, we got home, and her name was still in the phone book. And so this lady, she calls out of the clear booth, she says, is this the residence of Billy Joe Daugherty? And I said, yes, it is. Well, I want to speak to him. And so I handed the phone to him, and he said, who is this? Or she said, how much did you get? He said, well, who is this? She said, it doesn't matter. How much did you get this morning? He said, we got $60,000. And she says, well, how much do you need? He said, we need 120,000. She said, well, I brought my daughter to Oru this weekend. I'm from out of state. And she said, I will write you a check for the remainder if you and your administrator will meet me at the hotel I'm staying at over here at Sheridan. At that time, it was Sheridan. It used to be. Now it's Marriott. So anyway, they did. She wrote the check, and then that Tuesday morning, it didn't bounce. It cleared. Praise God.
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A
Because we get faith checks in Tulsa, Ruslan, sometimes.
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B
That's right. That's right.
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A
Checks that don't always clear.
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B
Yeah. And so anyway, he brought the check that night, and the guy that had been kind of resistant, he walks up and says, preacher, I knew you'd do it. I was thinking, yeah, well, so, okay.
- [19:09]
A
So during that season, I want you to also mention where you and dad had this conviction to get out of debt because victory was in the early 80s. We were in some pretty strong debt.
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B
Yeah. We had had to borrow money to just start the church. And so we had gone. The banks had consolidated a loan. And so we had. We all. We had for Collateral was our little house, which was worth $56,000. And so they said, well, you know, you never know. These people could be like that. Oral Roberts on the end of 71st street or on the end of Lewis. And so they loaned us the three point something million. Do you remember, Al, what that was? 3.8 million, something like that. And so anyway, we entered into that. But the scripture says in Proverbs, the borrower is servant to the lender. So my husband learned that very quickly and. And knew that we had to get out of debt and stay out. Plus, there were three prophetic words that came to the body of Christ at that time. One was at a Brother Hagin meeting, one was at Brother Roberts, and one was Brother Copeland's meeting that we had attended. And the different prophetic words all said, if you're in debt, get out of debt. Because the day is coming when the church will need to be out of debt in order to handle the last day harvest. Well, so we did. We. We knew that we had to get out of debt. So my husband began to teach the congregation on not being in debt and living that way. And so, you know, we began to sow our seed. Because that's how you get out of debt. You sow seed. And it's like the scripture says in 2nd Chronicles, 2nd Corinthians, chapter 6, and verse 2nd Corinthians, chapter 9 and verse 6, it talks about on down. It compares giving financially to a farmer. He who sows sparingly will reap sparingly. He who sows bountifully will reap bountifully. And so when we realize that when we sow our seed that we're believing God, we're releasing our faith when we give that God's going to supply every need that we have. Are there tight times? Sure. There's times when you don't buy things that you would normally buy. There's times when you withhold yourself or you restrain yourself from buying things. But you know that God's going to work supernaturally on your behalf.
- [21:59]
A
Yeah. And so in 1985 is when we got out of debt as a church.
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B
Right, right. And stayed out of debt. And we built. We felt like God spoke to us to build and buy debt free. So we bought the property that we're living on from Oru. And that's another miracle in itself.
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A
This Property right here, 7700.
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B
And then we began to build the buildings debt free. So everyone was. Each phase was a miracle. God gave your dad the story of David and Goliath, how that David first killed the lion, then he killed the bear, then he killed a giant. And so when we're talking about getting out of financial debt, you start with where you are and you kill the first phase of the, of the lion, then the, Then the. Or, then the bear, then the giant. So, yeah, that's how we.
- [22:57]
A
Come on, Mom.
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B
Yeah.
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A
I love you.
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B
I love you. I didn't know if you wanted me to share anymore.
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A
No, no, I was just leaning in because I was gonna say this. That book that he wrote, Killing the Giant of Ministry Debt, I think you have it with you next to your Bible or you left maybe back there. It's in the Victory Shop over here. I got that book when I was stepping in as pastor because you told me, paul, you're gonna have to believe that one.
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B
And led by the spirit, both of.
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A
Those books and you said, you're going to have to believe God for miracles in your generation that your dad and I believed for. In our generation.
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B
That's right.
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A
And every chapter of that book, I remember underlining that book like tears stains on the book because I was like, lord, I want to see what my parents saw in my generation. I want to see the financial breakthroughs at Victory in this season that my parents saw in the 80s and the 90s. And we've seen that. We've seen God's miraculous provision in our church. You're sitting in the answer to God's prayers for my parents. But our youth, our teenagers are sitting into the answer to God's prayers in our generation in the last four years. That building that's right next door is an $11 million building that God did in the last four years.
- [24:12]
B
And it's why we're able to do all the humanitarian aid that we're doing today. Yeah. You know, I think about that every time that I see these testimonies on the screen, how that it's because we, we made the decision we were going to build debt free, we were going to buy debt free. And so because of that, now we're able to. To sow into so many people's lives that we wouldn't have been able to before.
- [24:37]
A
Yeah, well, and I think too, it's so important for grandparents, parents, to teach your children and your, your children's children to believe, to see what you saw in your generation, what our parents saw in our generation, in their generation, in. In our generation, and to say like, hey, you need to learn to exercise your faith. So I'm teaching Liam, Beniah, Mack, Ellie and Gianna, you know, to exercise their faith for whatever they're praying for. I asked them, hey, are you trusting God with your finances? Which they don't know what that word is. So I say money. And they all are learning to give and to give generously and to believe God for breakthrough.
- [25:19]
B
Yeah, because we taught you guys that. I remember when Sarah and Ruthie wanted a playhouse. And this is many years ago. And so, you know, we were thinking a playhouse, you know, and a swimming pool. They wanted a above ground Donald Duck swimming pool. So anyway, Billy Jones said, okay, y' all are going to pray and release your faith and then you're going to sow seed. So they had clothes that they gave away and things that they could give, toys and stuff. And so then this guy called us while we were gone out of town on a trip with our family and he says, I don't go to your church. But in early morning prayer this morning, the Lord spoke to me that because he said, I build playhouses. And he says, and the Lord spoke to me that I'm to give your children a playhouse.
- [26:12]
A
Wow.
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B
And so not only did he give us the playhouse, but the truck to bring it over and to put it in our backyard, which was amazing. And so they had that playhouse for a long time. And then we moved it out to camp. We moved it up here to the church, moved it out to Camp Victory. It got used by kids for a long time. But yeah.
- [26:37]
A
And another miracle, just as you're talking about the personal side for you and dad, because a lot of times you guys would give everything you had in your savings towards a building project, towards things like Camp Victory or the Tulsa Dream center or this building that we're sitting in or the school building. You would just enter, empty out all that you guys had.
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B
Yeah.
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A
And sometimes you would do it right before Christmas and then we would find out that there's no money for Christmas presents and that we need to pray that God's gonna move on our grandparents hearts to give us some presents. And there was a year that you guys that, that happened and God miraculously tell em what happened.
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B
How God? Yeah, well, we, we didn't tell you. We, you know.
- [27:22]
A
Yeah, I found out later on that's true.
- [27:24]
B
We, we prayed and I prayed for God to give me dollar gifts and I found a store that had things on sale for a dollar for kids toys and stuff. So I went and bought all these different things and wrapped them all up. But then I prayed, lord, let the grandparents come in big time. And they did. And I'm so grateful they did. Yeah.
- [27:48]
A
I still remember Gran Gran giving me a. This little robot that she got me at Walmart. And I think it was one of those years that, you know, like you're describing, but I think it's so special. You never know on the other side of what our church does to buy presents for kids at Christmas. You just never know what families are walking through. And maybe even you're that family right now in the room, and you're like, man, we can't afford it this year. Just to know that there's someone in this church, that God's stirring in their heart to bless your kids, that this Christmas.
- [28:19]
B
That's right.
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A
And God always has a way, especially when you're putting him first in your life. And what you and dad practiced of just trusting in God and continuing to be generous, continuing to live from a place of giving and sacrifice, and God always came through.
- [28:36]
B
That's right.
- [28:36]
A
Maybe. Talk about, okay, the night that Victory got debt free, was it similar to that final last moment or what? What did that happen? Because we had like a debt free freedom praise night, didn't y', all, in that season?
- [28:48]
B
Well, we had. We had services all through that season where we were believing God for the money to buy land or to build and then to rejoice when we had the provisions come. But, you know, I think back those miracles of finances because the congregation would come to us and tell us stories. Every time they would say, every time y' all are believing God for. To pay for this or that, it seems like my job. We prosper. We. We end up making money and, you know, get jobs, give, you know, calling people, calling us for jobs and that sort of thing. So we saw the congregation prosper. Remember this one guy that was 18, he was a plumber, but he had been working for this other guy, and he decided to open his own business. And the Lord spoke to him to go sow his time of plumbing out at Camp Victory. And so he did. And that guy became a millionaire and had a few trucks around the city. And he said, yeah, this house we live in, he says we feel like the Beverly Hillbillies. He said, all these people around us that are wealthy and. And we're just kind of out of the cloth. We're not the normal group. But anyway, they would house missionaries that would come to town and they would keep them in their homes. And I just think, you know, we've seen how God blesses people who want to be a blessing. You know, that's what God said. To Abram, he said, I'm going to make you a blessing. I'm going to cause you to be blessed. That, and I'm going to make you a blessing to the world. And that's really what he wants for all of us as believers.
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A
Well, you and dad used to say, if God knows he can get it through you, then he will get it to you.
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B
Yeah.
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A
If he knows that you're through like a vessel, that someone. That it's not going to be clogged up. If so, if you get something, you keep it to yourself. But God, God looks at that heart of a generous giver, a compassionate person. Jason shared it in the offering tonight. The world of the generation generous gets larger and larger, while the world of the stingy gets smaller and smaller.
- [31:03]
B
That's true.
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A
And I think you and dad modeled that talk a little bit about the 90s because that was a huge decade for victory. Yes, it was the miracles that happened.
- [31:12]
B
Yes, it was. Because in 91, that summer of 91, we went to Lester Sumrall's to preach and minister and found out that he was going to be going to Russia. And there was a woman that had prophesied in our church in 1980, Jean Wilkerson. And she had said, the doors of Russia and the former Soviet Union are going to open and there will be ministries go across it like huge combines, reaping the harvest. And then she turned and had her eyes closed, but she turned and she pointed at Billy Joe and said, and your pastor is going to be one of them. Well, so that didn't come to pass immediately. That's the thing about prophetic words, is many times they don't come to pass immediately. And people think they should, but that doesn't mean it's not like that always.
- [32:01]
A
And so it's like a seed in the ground. You just gotta wait.
- [32:04]
B
God prophesied about Jesus, and it was hundreds, hundreds of years before he came.
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A
But don't give up waiting on your miracle.
- [32:12]
B
That's right. And so anyway, during that time of that summer or that meeting that we were at, he turned. Billy Joe turned to him and said, so you're going to Russia in August. He says, yeah, why don't you go with me? Because brother Sumrall was real rough. And so Bill just said, yeah, okay. And I said, how are we going to do that? We're supposed to go to Israel that week with a group of ministers. And so it was a Oklahoma educational thing that they were going to film different pastors. And so anyway, Billy Joe Called and said, can I. Can we do ours up front? And so we ended up getting to do ours by that Wednesday to be able to leave. And so then we had to believe God for a visa, because at that time, we didn't have a visa, and you had to have a visa. Visa to get in. And so our secretary had tried to get us one and couldn't. And so this guy shows up at our church the week before we leave and says, I just really feel like I'm supposed to go with you to Russia. Phil just said, well, I hope you can get a visa. And so he starts calling around and finds this lady in California, and she's Russian, which is amazing, because at that time, there wasn't hardly any Russians in the United States. United States. And she says. And he says, well, my pastor and his wife, they're wanting to.
- [33:43]
A
I love it when my mom and dad do the Russian accent.
- [33:49]
B
So my hut. My. My pastor and his wife, they're going to take humanitarian aid and to take Bibles and books. She said, I will help you. So, so anyway, she said, I build exposure, expedite the visas. And so that night, she expedited the visas to us. And. And that guy ended up meeting us in Frankfurt, Germany, on a plane. And we didn't even know he was where he was going to be coming from or anything like that. We ended up running through the airport. I said, what are we going to do? He says, we're just going to go ahead and get on the plane. I said, but we don't have a visa. And he says, it's okay. We're going to make it. So we get on the plane, and this guy's on the plane, and he's doing one of these in the aisle. Because Jerry Savelle had spoken that week at Word Explosion and talked about how salmon have to swim upstream. And many times you will feel like you're paddling a canoe upstream in what you're doing. And so anyway, he held up a packet. He said, is this what you're looking for? And so we didn't even know what. I didn't know what he looked like. And. And so he gave us the packet which had the visas in it, and we were able to get in. And so when we went to Russia, that was a change in the trajectory of our church.
- [35:06]
A
It changed the future of the church.
- [35:07]
B
Right, because people started wanting to go with us, saving their money in order to go each month with us to Russia. And I know some of you are sitting out there tonight and you went.
- [35:19]
A
But y' all went for two years in a row. Now, right before you started going on those trips, our family had a house fire.
- [35:28]
B
That's right. Three weeks before we were to leave, our house burned down in the middle of the night.
- [35:32]
A
We were all inside.
- [35:33]
B
We were inside, but we all escaped. Praise the Lord.
- [35:37]
A
Was that October or November?
- [35:39]
B
It was the last week of October. Wow. And so you, you know, sometimes when you're going to obey God, the devil will try to throw blocks in your way. And you have to know that, you know, that you've heard from the Lord and to just press through. So anyway, also right before all this, in 1989, my husband had turned to me and he said, you know, we're too white as a church. We've got to have more ethnicity. And so he said. So he had this friend of ours, George Moss, come and speak to our staff that afternoon. And he said, well, if you want more people of ethnicity, you're going to have to put people like that up in front. So we began to put people like that up in front, whether it was on the worship team or whether it was through testimony or through whatever, you know, however means staff. And so we began to put people up front, and our church changed. We became multi ethnic, international. And then, of course, with the outreach to Russia, we were more international than ever. But that kicked off going to the other nations of the earth.
- [37:00]
A
They started doing crusades all over Sierra Leone and Cambodia.
- [37:05]
B
Yeah, Billy Jo and I had done them personally. I had done some outreaches like that. But that really kicked off going as missions, on a mission trip and taking people. And so we began to go and hold these crusade meetings, and he would sense that he was to go to these places that were dangerous.
- [37:28]
A
Let me say something about that, because Gran Gran was watching us while y' all were away. Oftentimes you could take one of us. Sometimes you would take all of us.
- [37:36]
B
Or two, take one of you with us each.
- [37:38]
A
But I remember just the prayers and this. The. The church was even concerned, like, why are your parents going in the middle of a civil war to Sierra Leone? Or they're going to Haiti right now. But there's, you know, there's. There's witch doctors that want to kill your parents for ministering in these outdoor crusades.
- [37:57]
B
Saved.
- [37:57]
A
Witch doctors were getting saved. What was wild is that Victory was growing globally more than we were growing locally in that season. Our local church was growing. We were growing from, you know, we got into the maybe center, which we didn't even get into that tonight. But the maybe center was a big deal. We were there for 23 years. Mobile Church, renting. Renting the building every week. And Oral Roberts was. He told you guys, I'm not going to give you guys a discount. I want you to practice faith.
- [38:27]
B
Yeah.
- [38:27]
A
Paying for that, you have to use.
- [38:29]
B
That so that you'll have faith for the buildings and the land that you've got to get.
- [38:32]
A
And during that same season in the 90s, God gave us the TL Osborne building at 41st in Peoria, which was a great building for our Bible college.
- [38:42]
B
And I. I remember asking the Lord, lord, why did we get that building when I know there's another ministry in the center city that could really use that building? And he said to me, it's like the Ten Talents. He said, Go back and read that. Matthew 25. And I did.
- [38:58]
A
Those who are faithful with a little will be ruler over more.
- [39:01]
B
Yeah. And so we were able to use the building in all of its fullness for our missions, for our Bible college, our Hispanic church. Hispanic church, yeah. He was meeting there for a long time. And then they got their own building. Pastor Carmen.
- [39:20]
A
Yeah. That we helped him get back in 15 years ago. But I think about all of the miracles. That building. Then we got this building over here at 81st in Delaware. The 247 building.
- [39:31]
B
That's right.
- [39:32]
A
And then that building got destroyed by ODOT on 41st Emporia because Oklahoma Department of Transportation needed to expand I40 before. But with the money from that, we were able to update that. And then we were able to pour into this. And this building was $33 million that. That it took to build this auditorium, the kids auditorium, the expansion of the parking lot. And it was on a cash.
- [39:57]
B
People don't think about the fact that if you're going to expand one building, it's going to affect the other buildings. You know, like with the children's ministry, we knew that. That that was going to happen, that they would begin to grow and explode as well. So we had to do the children's building as well as this building at the same time.
- [40:14]
A
And then we had to update the. The boiler room, the chiller, because we now had to fill more space with AC and heater. And then the fire department came in and said, you got to be in fire code exact. So then we had to change the doors. And a lot of people don't think about the details that goes into expanding a ministry.
- [40:30]
B
We.
- [40:31]
A
But every season of expansion, God provided. And you and dad taught me and my siblings at a young age. To trust God each step of the way for miracles. Now tonight we're talking about the financial miracles, but there were miracle healings, they were miracle testimonies. People that multiple times, people that had literally come back to life because our church was praying and believing for physical miracles. We saw miracles in marriages restored and families reconciled.
- [41:02]
B
The first year we were pastoring, we did a program called Miracles because your dad really felt like we were to have a program on TV that was going to be like aired nationally. So we did that and it was, we had miracles of marriages being healed, of people being delivered from drugs, people being set free in different ways, healed in their bodies.
- [41:26]
A
When you guys in the 1990s came back from the Russia and the crusades overseas, you kept doing them, but God put it on yalls hearts to reach the low income apartment housing and the crusades here in Tulsa.
- [41:38]
B
Well, we were actually right before we were to go to Russia, we had been going to the apartment crusade outreaches and, and on one occasion when your dad was on the, on the platform in Russia, the Lord said to him, you would not be able to see this influx of people being saved if you weren't willing to go to the Tulsa apartment complexes and reach out to the people in those apartment complexes to get saved. And so, you know, many times we'd go into these tent, we'd put up a tent and we put the kids in the clubhouse and the kids would have 150 or 200 kids. You know, we would have maybe 25 or 30 adults show up and we would have people, we would tell our congregation that went, we would say now stay with a person. And if they say they got to go to the bathroom, you go with them. And if they say that they got to go pull some stuff out of the dryer, you go with them. And so that was what happened. And when they would go to these apartment complexes, we saw people that were in these low income apartment complexes change in their lifestyle. Like, you know, maybe they were so poor they couldn't afford to put their kids in college or to have a car or whatever. And, and they would start to prosper, they would start to get a car, they would start to put their kids in college. Different things would happen to them.
- [43:13]
A
One of the kids ended up going to Oru with me. That was reached in the apartment complex crusade in the 90s. Jose Rodriguez, he rode the bus to.
- [43:24]
B
Victory and he became a youth pastor.
- [43:26]
A
Grew up in a very broken home. Major addictions. His parents had a lot of domestic violence, abuse in the home. But he ended up going to Oral Roberts University. And he said, I never would have graduated ORU or even my high school. He said I'm the first one in my family to graduate high school and college. Then his sister Lucretia graduated. And now Lucretia works at the Dream Center. Jose's a youth pastor in California. I just saw her reaching hundreds of youth pastors and churches. But you and Dad's obedience to build victory. To build victory. What then became out of that ministry to the low income apartments, started the Dream Center. And God gave us the land through Mary and Martha, which were two sisters that ended up blessing from another church, from another denomination that wanted to bless victory because they saw we've been faithful with a little bit. And God makes you ruler over more. The multiplication, the stewardship. And then we built that building, and then we got the West Tulsa Dream center three years ago in 2022. And, and again, it's just God's faithfulness, just trusting in God every step of the way. Mom, as we're coming to the end tonight, you also were the worship leader all through those seasons, many seasons, and when you stepped in as pastor in 2009 when dad passed away, many times you would flow into song and, and, and preach. Tonight I want to just hear from you. What were two or three of your most and, like, memorable songs that you sung through the years that helped shape victory?
- [45:00]
B
Well, you know, I think back, your dad turned to me one day and said, I want you to write this song that I'm getting. And so I sat down and he said, this is what it's going to be in the beginning. Da da da da da da da. And then he says, we can build.
- [45:17]
C
A dream with love.
- [45:22]
B
So I got to thinking, and later I said to Miriam, I said, I think that's the beginning of say a little prayer for me, Rosemarie.
- [45:30]
A
Say a little prayer for you forever.
- [45:36]
B
But, but anyway, I wrote this song. I wrote this song. We can build a dream with love.
- [45:43]
A
Sing it for a second.
- [45:44]
C
We can build a dream with love Love we can do it if we'll take hands together Reaching out to love.
- [45:53]
D
This world oh, we can build a.
- [45:58]
C
Dream of God with love.
- [46:02]
A
Come on.
- [46:04]
B
And then the, then the verses, you know, he. He wanted me to put in some of the verses. He says we can build a place.
- [46:10]
C
To mend the broken heart. Give those who are fallen a brand new start. A place where the sick can be healed, families restored, and God's glory revealed.
- [46:24]
B
And then the chorus, and then another verse.
- [46:27]
A
He Said she's not done, y'.
- [46:28]
E
All.
- [46:28]
C
First the lion and then the bear.
- [46:31]
B
Now it's the giant and we are prepared we'll put Jesus first in all.
- [46:35]
C
That we do the word of God in prayer is what will take us.
- [46:39]
B
Through we will we can build a.
- [46:42]
C
Dream with love we can do it if we'll take hands together Reaching out.
- [46:48]
D
To love this world oh, we can.
- [46:53]
C
Build a dream of God with love Come on.
- [46:58]
B
So that. That song became a real theme through the years, and then when we.
- [47:02]
A
That song made victory. That song. I think when I look back over the years, the last. Growing up, my childhood, teenage years, we would go back to that song often.
- [47:11]
B
Yeah, your dad wanted us to.
- [47:13]
A
Well, I love it. I wanted to tonight. What's another one?
- [47:17]
B
Well, when we went to Russia, there was a song that we would sing every month, Celebrate Jesus.
- [47:52]
A
Okay. That's incredible that you remember the Russian words 30 years later. Okay, y', all, can we give Pastor Sh. Sharing a hand just for remembering Russian. Russian. Don't act like you can speak Russian. And she can do the accent now.
- [48:11]
D
Mom.
- [48:12]
A
One thing I'll say about her. Y', all, do you guys got 10 more minutes? Okay. My mom would memorize. I don't know what camera to look at. Like, I feel like it's all over the place. But my mom would memorize the songs that she wrote or the songs that she would sing in every country. If we were in Uganda, we would do a Uganda cruise. She would sing in Ugandan language. If we were in Russia, she would sing in Russia. If we were in Czechoslovakia, she would sing in Czech. If we were in Haiti, she would sing in Creole. I remember just watching my mom get up there, and she was just singing in Creole, and I was like, john, did you know mom can speak Haitian language? He was like, no, she just. She was a CIA agent. She had a lot of hidden talents.
- [48:58]
B
Well, I couldn't speak the languages, but I felt like that the people would appreciate if I could sing in their language. And so I would learn little choruses in their language, and then sometimes we would have it on video. I remember one time meeting with Terry Hinshaw and a group of businessmen, and I said, if I could just have a video behind me that showed the miracles. The miracle of Jesus. Of Jesus. And so these guys got moved, and they purchased a screen for me for us to show videos behind me as I sang. And I'm going to be having this guy Sunday night, David Stearman. He wrote the song Somewhere it's snowing that I do every year. And he also wrote a song that I do, I did overseas quite a bit, called I'll Never Be the Same Again. And so I would learn it in their language, I will never be the same again.
- [50:01]
A
Is that it?
- [50:01]
B
No, it's the one.
- [50:02]
A
Okay, my bad.
- [50:03]
B
Yeah. She's like, no, he wrote a different one. That's a good song, too. We used to sing that here, too, a lot. But there's certain songs that would come to my heart.
- [50:14]
A
Okay, well, how does that one go? How does the one that you're thinking of? Cause I'm trying to remember it.
- [50:19]
C
I will never be the same again I will never be the same I have touched the hem of his garment and I know I am healed In Jesus name I'll never be the same.
- [50:39]
A
And watching you sing, that is Mexico and the healing testimonies. I remember we showed it in service a couple weeks ago. I remember that man walking towards this stage with his cane. He got out of the wheelchair, and.
- [50:55]
B
There was a man. One of those miracles that really stands out to me was in Albania. This. When we went there after Infer Hoxha had been killed. But he had said that the. There was no Christians in Albania all through those years. But there were people that had hidden their Bibles in the ground and dug them up. And one man came and brought his to us. But I think back, and this guy in Albania was brought by his family members. Carried. Carried him. He was 28 years old. His legs were like broomsticks. You know, if you've seen a broom, the stick on a broom. And so he sat with his legs folded on the ground, and I was singing, rise and be healed. And he all of a sudden stood up, and he started walking toward me like a Frankenstein, you know. And so I thought, what do I do? I just kept singing. And as I kept singing, he kept walking up and came up on the platform to me, reaching out like this. And his mother was just. She was Albanian. She was just, you know, screaming and crying and in Albanian. And so I said, well, what happened? And the interpreter told me, said, well, he's been. He's not been able to walk all through his life. He's 28 years old, and he had a brain defect. But anyway, God healed him that night, and he came up on the platform, and his mom was testifying. Now, he wasn't totally healed in the brain, but he was healed in his ability to walk and his ability to do other things. And so, you know, I think about that. That miracle, and I think about There was a lady in Russia that she was. She. She had her legs kind of wrapped around her wheelchair. And when we gave the invitation for healing, she. She began to pop. All her bones started popping. And she started walking out of her wheelchair up to the platform, and she testified. And there was another lady from. From Siberia, and she had come by train, and she'd been in a diabetic coma, and she came. She had knots on her head and she had tumors in her body. Anyway, she was miraculously healed. She went back to where she was from and started a church.
- [53:33]
A
Still to this day has a church in Siberia.
- [53:35]
B
Yeah. And her daughter started a church about an hour from the town that she was in. I mean, just. There's so many of those kind of miracles. When I think back, there was a group of young men that would come from Kiev, Ukraine, and they would come and get boxes of books and Bibles to take back with them, and they would then share them with other people. And they started churches that became the largest churches in Kiev.
- [54:05]
A
So, mom, let me say something, because everyone here tonight honors you and respects you. But you know, we wouldn't be here tonight if it wasn't for you and Dad's faithfulness, obedience, and trusting in him every step of the way. And then the night that you passed the baton off to me to pastor this church, it's a miracle that Victory has come through now, dad and you and me. And it continues because some churches stop after a generation, and it doesn't end up lasting or the school shuts down or the camp shuts down. And I look at all of the things that God has done at Victory, and I'm just so thankful for you and dad. And I want you, like, you need to give mom flowers while she's still here. She's not going anywhere for another 30 years. But, you know, we say these things like, give me my flowers while I'm still alive. Don't bring it. And, Mom, I just want. Want you to hear. Everyone here is so grateful for you. You are so honored, and you are so loved, and the world has been impacted by you and dad. And there are people meeting in Siberia tonight for church, because you and dad. There are people meeting in St. Petersburg, Russia. There's people meeting in a hut in Africa. There's people meeting in a mud hut in Juarez, Mexico. There's people meeting in, you know, the farthest places you guys went to the farthest countries and in Sierra Leone and your faithfulness. One last song that I think really impacted me when I was younger Was this song, turn it around, and you would sing it specifically in seasons where we needed to see God turn some things around. And I just remember one time you started singing it on stage when. When we were in a season where, you know, you were singing it by faith. Turn it around, turn it around. Don't let the devil get you down. And it really ministered to me. And so, I don't know. Could you just sing that just for a moment?
- [56:11]
C
Turn it around, Turn it around? Don't let the devil get you down. You can turn it around.
- [56:19]
B
We used to do this in other countries, and. And they would start turning around. Oops.
- [56:24]
A
Here, let me help you.
- [56:25]
B
Sorry about that. I got you anyway. And they would all start turning around.
- [56:29]
C
Turn it around, turn it around? Don't let the devil get you down. You can turn it around? Turn it around? You can turn your troubles around.
- [56:41]
B
And then I'd go into.
- [56:42]
C
There's a story of a couple of men who were thrown into a prison cell when they could have had fear, they could have had worry. They could have really been uptight. But Paul said to Silas, brother, let's sing and rejoice in the Lord, our God. If he delivered the children of Israel, I know he will deliver us. We can turn it around. Turn it around. Don't let the devil get you down. You. You can turn it around. Turn it around.
- [57:17]
B
I used to could dance a lot better than I am now. I'm not really dancing.
- [57:22]
A
Stand your feet, y'.
- [57:23]
E
All.
- [57:24]
A
Oh, how many Just enjoyed hearing my mom share some stories, some miracles, some testimonies.
- [57:30]
B
Thank you.
- [57:31]
A
Thank you for letting me mom tonight. I was thinking, even before we came out here, we were praying, and I was thinking, there's people in the room that need a miracle in their family, their finances, their health, maybe a loved one that needs a miracle that they're connected to. And I thought it would be good tonight if you prayed for people at this altar tonight that are standing for a miracle. And so here's what we'll do. If you're here tonight and you need a miracle, I want you to just leave your seat and just come and find a place at this altar. We're going to pray for you. We're going to sing the song that this is a house of miracles. But I want my mom specifically to pray for you. And if you're here tonight, you say, man, I need to just get right with Jesus. I need to repent of my sins and surrender. You come and join us. Tonight is the night of salvation. Tonight is a Night of miracles Tonight is a night of breakthrough. Tonight is a night of healing, restoration. And so all around this room, if you need to surrender to Jesus or you just need a miracle, we're just going to worship for a little bit. Mom, I'll let you just start off praying over them tonight. And then, Ben, y' all go ahead and lead us out of this prayer.
- [58:39]
B
Father, tonight we thank youk that we can come to youo boldly to youo throne to find you'd mercy, you, Grace to help us in our time of need. And Lord, we come in the name of Jesus Christ and we bind the spirits of infirmity. We bind the demonic spirits that that would try to oppress and we loose right now the power of the Holy Spirit to overshadow and prevail in every life here tonight. Lord, you know what each one needs. And I pray for miracles, miracles, signs and wonders. Lord, in the name of Jesus, we release our faith right now for your power to be released in each life as we touch them in Jesus name In the name of Jesus.
- [59:33]
E
God, I believe you're working all things for good I fix my eyes on heaven God, I receive your vision God, I believe you're working all things for good and I still believe you're moving I still believe you're speaking God, I believe you're working all things for good and I fix my eyes on heaven Thought I I receive your vision God, I believe you're working all things for good.
- [60:25]
B
So.
- [60:25]
E
Come alive in the name of Jesus Come alive in the name of Jesus this is the house of miracles we bring everything to to the feet of Jesus every day in the name of Jesus this is a thousand miracle so come alive in the name of Jesus Come alive in the name of Jesus this is a thousand miracles we bring everything to the feet of Jesus every day in the name of Jesus this is house of miracles and I still believe you're moving I still believe you're speaking God, I believe you're working all things for good oh, I fix my eyes on heaven God, I receive your vision God, I believe you Lord all things for good and I still believe I still believe you're moving I still believe you're speaking God, I believe you're wor all things for good I fix my eyes on heaven God, I receive your be God, I believe your wor all things for good to come alive in the name of Jesus Come alive in the name of Jesus this is a house of miracles we bring everything to the feet of Jesus Everything in the name of Jesus, this is a thousand miracles. Yes, it is. So come alive in the name of Jesus. Come alive in the name of Jesus. This is the house of miracles. We bring every name to the feet of Jesus. Every name in the name of Jesus. This is a house of miracles. So come alive in the name of Jesus. Come alive in the name of Jesus. This is a house of miracles. And we bring everything to the feet of Jesus. Everything in the name of Jesus.
- [63:30]
D
This is a house of miracles.
- [63:37]
E
This is a house of miracles.
- [63:49]
D
Jesus Lord, do what only you can do, God. Change what only you can can change. Have your way, Lord. And nothing is impossible for you. Nothing is impossible. And nothing is impossible for you. You hold my world in your hands and nothing is impossible. Nothing is impossible.
- [65:08]
E
Nothing is. Nothing is impossible or nothing is impossible for you. Nothing.
- [65:49]
D
You hold my world in your hands. And I believe that you're my healer. I believe that you are all I need, Jesus. I believe that you're my portion. And I believe you're more than enough for me, Jesus. You're all I need, O Lord. You're more than enough for me, Lord.
- [66:46]
A
Tonight, God, we pray just for miracles in this room, miracles that are online. I pray, God, that you would stir our faith up in this season, Lord, that you would help us to stretch our faith, God. To believe, to take action steps of faith, God, I pray, Lord, even tonight, as we were listening to the stories that built this church, church, the stories that have sustained this ministry, God, that we would remind ourselves, Lord, just to keep our faith in you, to keep our hope in you, to keep trusting in the principles in your word, God, as we're sowing and as we're believing, God, that there's a harvest on those seeds, God. And even if we don't see it, Lord, in the immediate, God, even if we don't see it in the next week or month or year, God, that we, we trust, Lord, that you're up to something even beneath the soil, that the seed is taking root. And God, I thank you right now, Lord, for just miracles in the making, God. In people's stories, in their life, God. Whether it's in the miracles in their body, Lord, or in their relationships or in their finances, God, or in their family, Lord, I just thank you that you're up to something good. You're a good God. Let's just pray this together. Say, jesus, I trust in you. I surrender and I put my faith in you, in your word. I believe that you are able to heal, to restore, to renew, to redeem, to do a miracle in my life and I'm trusting in you. You're my Lord and so savior you died on the cross for my sins and I repent and I receive your forgiveness. You rose from the dead and that resurrection power lives in me so I am not defeated. I've got the victory in Jesus name amen and amen. I love you. God loves you. Be blessed victory. I know you already are. Take some time. Encourage somebody around you before you leave tonight. Talk to that person at the altar. Tell them what God's doing in your life. If there's anything we could do for you, let us know. If you need a bible, maybe need a bag of groceries if there's something we can serve you tonight, let us know. We're here to help you. We're going to continue to meet the needs of our community of our church right here and the world. So let's keep doing it. God bless you.