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- [00:00]
T Mobile Advertiser
Go almost everywhere with the podcasts you love on T Mobile's network because T Mobile helps keep you connected from the heart of Portland to right where you are on America's largest 5G network. Switch now. Keep your phone and T Mobile will pay it off up to $800 per line via prepaid card. Visit your local T Mobile location or learn more@t mobile.com keepandswitch up to 4 lines of your virtual prepaid card. Allow 15 days qualifying unlock device, credit service support in 90 plus days device knowledgeable carrier and timely redemption required. Card has no cash access and expires in six months.
- [00:30]
Sophia Bush
Hey, everyone, it's Sophia. Welcome to work in progress. Hey, Whip Smarties. I am so excited to sit down today with a woman I have known and admired for so long, not only for her incredible career, but as a human who was one of the very first people I met when I started work as a little whippersnapper on the wb. Today's guest is none other than Joanna Garcia Swisher. She has an undeniable range as both a comedic and a dramatic actress. She's one of those people who is so naturally vibrant that you're drawn to her in every room. And she has built such an incredible not only career, but life, from her current role on Netflix's Sweet Magnolias to her beautiful lifestyle destination, the Happy Place, which really explores what motivates us, what makes us feel amazing, how we gather, how we enjoy what it is to be alive to one of my very favorite things. You all know I don't really watch reality tv, but I did get hooked on the Ultimatum Queer Love, and she hosted it. And my goodness, did I love it. She does all of it. She's a mom of two young girls. She is a wife, she is a producer, she is a creator. And I'm just so excited to sit down and talk with her today about the 20 plus years we've known each other, what her career has been like thus far, and what she sees ahead in the next 20. Let's sit down with Jo.
- [02:22]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Hello.
- [02:23]
Sophia Bush
Hello. I'm so excited to see you. And your family's well and everyone's good.
- [02:30]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah. The girls are getting so big. 11 and 8. It's wild. I know. I was just talking to Nick last night and he was saying something about a car and he's like, well, Emmy, I'll be driving in like four years. And I thought, what did you just say to me? I felt. I felt like it was an assault. I mean, granted, she's 11, almost 12 but I thought, don't say that to me. Don't point that stuff out.
- [02:51]
Sophia Bush
That's too big a leap.
- [02:53]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
I was like, no, sir. Because you know how quickly four years goes by, God willing, by the way, in this. But I just thought, oh gosh. But you know, we're just good. It's good east coast living.
- [03:08]
Sophia Bush
Yeah. And you're loving it.
- [03:09]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
We are. I mean, we're back home and so it feels right. After I lost my dad and then my mom and then my grandmother, well, my grandmother two weeks before my mom, it just felt like the right thing to be home. I needed to be by my brother. My in laws had moved to Tampa, so we came back. And also I've been working in Georgia since 2019, so it's like a hop skip. So we're kind of splitting our time between there and it feels, feels like the right spot. But every time I go back to la, I just, but I kind of just miss what we had. Like, you know, that era, that time where things were just a little bit more simple, a lot more simple and, and it was fun and stuff. So I just, I'm, I'm nostalgic for that.
- [03:51]
Sophia Bush
Me too. Me too. It's interesting though when you talk about your girls, because one of my favorite things to ask people is, is to rewind and talk about childhood. And I realize in all the years I've known you, I've not really asked you this question either. And I find that it's so interesting when I get to talk to parents about this because they can look at their own childhood and also see these sort of themes reflected in their children in present day. So when, when you look back, you know, at the age your younger daughter is at, at nine, if you could go and hang out with nine year old Joanna, would you see the woman you are today in her? Would, would you be like, oh my God, she's friendly and gathers people and is so communicative and is a total performer. Or was she like a totally different kid?
- [04:46]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
I think there was probably all of that there and this sort of just like knowing that things were going to be okay. But I was really picked on at that time in my life, you know, And I feel like I still carry those scars to this day of just I was so emotional and one of my friends has a daughter who's like this and I see it a lot in her and I always kind of talk to my friend through it and people call her dramatic and all of this stuff and I'm like, yeah, but that's what makes her so unique and special and she feels so deeply. And so, yeah, I think I see a lot of that. I probably a little bit more graceful now. I was a little bit of a bull in the china shop, which I am now still in certain ways. But I was like, I know what I want to do with my life. I knew I had this utter sense of just faith that everything was going to be okay. But it was hard. It was really hard. And it definitely affected, it still does to this day, that sort of need to kind of like please and fit in and all of those little insecurities that creep up naturally. And then we choose to do what we do for a living, which is so forward facing and up for a million opinions. And Lord knows we didn't even know back then when we started this that the world would be like this, that this there would be so much access and conversation about us. I mean, I feel like when we started on the wb, it was like message boards that you had to like log into aol about it. Just like you think about how much the world has changed. But yeah, I think that when I look back on my childhood, I really felt now that I'm really just kind of digging into it. My mom was just such a. She was like a get her done. She was like, what do you want to do? We. She was so supportive. And I feel like I have a lot of that, like, feral mom energy in me where I'm like, you want to do this? Let's go in. Like, let's figure it out. Let's go. My husband has a little bit of that too, which is not a great balance for us. So we tend to kind of like go all over the place. But yeah, I just, I felt, I felt like it was tough, but I knew it was going to be okay. And I kind of feel like that now. I guess I just said that earlier when we got on the phone, I was like, we started talking. I was like, this is a hard moment. Yeah, but we're gonna be okay. And my dad really talked a lot about that too. I mean, my dad was an immigrant, you know, he came over when he was 13 years old from Cuba and he saw a lot, a lot, a lot of things in his life. And what I feel like, I. I know, especially now having like my parents on the other side, that I can endure a lot more than I feared. A lot of things that I just now know, I say to my daughters. My daughter asked me if childbirth was painful. I said, well, yeah, but she's like, I'm so scared of it. And I was like, you're eight, and by the time you decide to have a baby or if that's what your choice is, like, you'll be ready for it. You can handle the pain. Put that. Let's bench that one for now. But it is true, because I was so afraid of the idea of, like, God, what happens the day I lose my mom, my dad? It's going to be the worst. The worst. And it is. But I'm still here, and I'm still living and still thriving and still navigating life.
- [08:21]
Sophia Bush
Yeah, well. And I think there's something really interesting to, you know, the. The point that you make about sensitivity because it is hard to be sensitive to cruelty, to be sensitive to the suffering of others, to. To feel the weight of things in the world. But I think it also can be such a. A leading force. It's the thing that allows you to say, oh, this suffering is an injustice. Oh, this is a person I could show up for. Oh, I wish. I wish someone had shown up for me during X. And so when I see someone going through it, I'll. I'll show up for them.
- [09:06]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Absolutely.
- [09:08]
Sophia Bush
I think that's. It's a gift. It's not always easy to be, you know, informed, unconscious and tapped in and all the things. But I think it's the only way that things get better. And so maybe that's why so many sensitive people wind up in ways, becoming artists and creating things. Because to tell other people's stories is a. It's a way of showing up.
- [09:33]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah. I mean, not to. I've shared this before, but I had. There was a moment where I was contemplating not wanting to act as much anymore. And I didn't share that with anybody because that actually, even saying it now is kind of a scary thing because I don't feel that way now, just FYI. But I had a healer, this really wonderful woman, and she said to me, you know, what we do as artists and not to make our job so important, but she said life is all about bumping up against each other and honing our stones. And oftentimes people, so many people are just trying to survive right now, and their escape is watching television or their escape is, you know, going to a beautiful museum and, you know, looking at incredible art and learning about those things. And part of what our, I think, gift is and our ability, like the honor of what we do is to be able to kind of make people feel certain things because we are able to hone stones just by allowing someone to laugh or cry or look at the world in a little bit of a different way or learn something. And I think it is really important to. It's not easy to be so raw and in touch and, you know, literally step into the pain and suffering of somebody else that we don't know. You know, those are all, they're great honors, but it's not easy to do. And so. But I also think there's like, value to it more than just entertainment. And I do think that it's like an energy, energetic sort of healing that we have an opportunity to do and to connect. And all I want to do right now is tell stories that are relatable and beautiful. They're not the coolest stories maybe, or the hippest or the one that get the most attention, but they're the ones that make people feel like less alone. And right now I just feel like that's so my. That's where I'm fitting in with my job and also, you know, trying to raise two young women to look outside of themselves and look further than their immediate radius and by the way, also, also settle in and figure out how you can help the person that's sitting right next to you. Such a great honor to connect. And it is a huge responsibility. And so you and I think as we get older, we try to like, protect our energy and our peace and all of that. Yeah, that's a, that is also a delicate dance. What do we have the bandwidth for? Yeah, that's why I'm so grateful to be surrounded by such strong, connected, aware, awake people. Because it's like, I got your back, you got mine, and we'll kind of carry the burden, you know, cover the terrain together.
- [12:26]
Sophia Bush
Yeah, yeah. And, you know, I think I get what you mean. You know, we're so taught to not, you know, praise what we do or what, whatever, but I do think it's important to love it. And I get that it's not rocket science and I get that it's not curing cancer, but I've also sort of had to. I had a friend say this to me when, when one of my best friends paid me a compliment and I did the thing that women are taught to do and immediately, you know, self deprecated. And it happened to be a guy friend of mine and he was like, this is so interesting to me that the difference. He said, do you not get that I'm essentially, I'm giving you a gift. It's like if I handed you a present and you immediately batted it back into my hands. It would be insulting.
- [13:16]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah.
- [13:17]
Sophia Bush
Why. Why do you want to take this compliment and throw it right back at me and immediately delegitimize it? And I had to see that it could hurt someone else's feelings to realize I was actually invalidating my own.
- [13:31]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yes.
- [13:32]
Sophia Bush
And I think about that in terms of our work, and I've. I've. This is such a gift of the experience that I've had with some of the wonderful people I've gotten to meet around the world who watch the things we make and the number of people who've said in one version or another, well, you might not be curing cancer, but I watched your show through my cancer treatment.
- [13:57]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
I was just gonna say that you might not be.
- [13:59]
Sophia Bush
And it's like, wait a second. Oh, my God. Yes, we get to encourage empathy. Yes, we get to step into other people's shoes. Yes, we might get to show audiences people they don't know and remind people that no one is other. But we also do get to walk through things with people that so many others don't. And when I went through my own period of what you're talking about, of going, oh, I love my job, but maybe I'm entering a phase in my life where it's not really for me.
- [14:30]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah.
- [14:31]
Sophia Bush
What brought me back to how much I love my job and what makes me more excited than ever for all the things ahead was actually being reminded of how special and sacred our job.
- [14:43]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Is a hundred percent.
- [14:45]
Sophia Bush
When the making it and the. The things we've all as women been through on set hit a sort of breaking point for me. And I was like, I don't understand. Like, how can all these people stand around and watch and say nothing? How. How can this be acceptable or. Or just the way it is? I think I need a minute. And I gave myself a minute. Thank God. But what the. What the beat taught me was like, oh, part of why I hate when it's not being treated properly. The. The job, the environment, the women on the set, all of it under the it umbrella, me included. I guess it is because this is actually so special. It's such a privilege. We're so lucky to do this thing that connects us to people around the world. And, like, in a way, I had to lean out for a second to lean in doubly.
- [15:38]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
It literally was the exact what I @2000 2019. It's exactly that realization for me.
- [15:45]
Sophia Bush
Wow.
- [15:46]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
It was just. My tank was empty. And then I got Sweet Magnolia as they asked me to do this little show. I had no idea what to expect. I. I knew one of the directors on the show. I admired the women that had already been cast. And it was kind of one of those things where, like, three days. You have three days to decide. And Sailor was a baby. I picked her up out of her crib as I was like, okay, I gotta read these scripts today. And it totally reignited my commitment to what I think will be, like, the next 20 years of my career. And how. And knowing that, you know, telling stories that, like I said, it's a sweet show. It's a show about friendship and women and sisterhood and family, but, like, there's so much truth to it. And it just was like the right. At the right time, the right moment, the right time, and everything kind of came together. And I was like, this is the type of storytelling. And in some ways I feel like I had been putting that out there and like, it was, you know, the law of attraction. Like, I was welcoming it into my life. But I thought, no, this is it. This was an answer to a question that I had had that I did, that I wasn't even articulating correctly, but it was just not settling. I wasn't in my. In the flow. And Now I feel 100%. The clarity is so there.
- [17:13]
Sophia Bush
Yeah.
- [17:14]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
And it makes sense now.
- [17:16]
Sophia Bush
And now a word from our sponsors that I really enjoy, and I think you will too.
- [17:22]
T Mobile Advertiser
Go almost everywhere with the podcasts you love on T Mobile's network, because T Mobile helps keep you connected from the heart of Portland to right where you are on America's largest 5G network switch. Now keep your phone and T Mobile will pay it off up to $800 per line via prepaid card. Visit your local T Mobile location or learn more@t mobile.com keepandswitch up to 4 lines of your virtual prepaid card. Allow 15 days qualifying unlocked device, credit service port in 90 plus days device and eligible carrier and timely redemption required card has no cash access and expires in six months.
- [17:58]
Sophia Bush
It's interesting because even the way you talk about it, you said earlier that you have nostalgia for that kind of beginning era when we all started working and we were all on the WV and you know, all these things so glossy and. And interestingly, my brain was like, God, I get it. But also I missed the era because I was in North Carolina.
- [18:20]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
North Carolina, Yeah.
- [18:21]
Sophia Bush
Like, I'd see you guys like once a year when you would come in again. That's what it's like at home.
- [18:24]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Totally yeah, that's true. That's a good point.
- [18:27]
Sophia Bush
But the way you're talking about the show, it feels nostalgic.
- [18:33]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah.
- [18:33]
Sophia Bush
And I wonder if maybe that's part of why it feels so special.
- [18:37]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
So good.
- [18:38]
Sophia Bush
Yeah, that's so cool.
- [18:40]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah, that's a great point. I'm going to marinate on that a little bit because actually I feel like that kind of touches a little bit on my grief and where I've been and my life is. The irony is that this incredible blessing came into my life at the same time that I experienced the most significant loss that I've ever even could have imagined. It was like, bam, bam, bam. I mean, and talk about being untethered. Mom and dad are gone, grandmother's gone, everyone's there. And I'm just like, okay, I'm here and who's my anchor? You know, it was like really discombobulating. And so I feel like maybe it always kind of meant to be in that. I needed that, like, touch back to where a safer time, an easier time, a special time. I needed the balance.
- [19:33]
Sophia Bush
How interesting that you were going through this seismic shift in your life because I think, you know, I think about this a lot. You know, knock on wood, I'm, I'm lucky. I have both my parents.
- [19:46]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yes.
- [19:46]
Sophia Bush
And I think about, I am aware already that there is a before and an after when you lose your parents and you're speaking, it's weird. We're having this sort of across time conversation in the present. You're, you're speaking from the after. And as I'm listening to you, I'm like, well, no wonder this amazing show about family and friendship came to you in this moment. It saved me for you to be able to be in that kind of arena of love and to process emotion and to just be present. It's like, wow, what an amazing kind of gift it is.
- [20:29]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
And also one of my co stars has lost both. Had lost both of her parents too. And so few of my friends at like my age, our age, like, we don't, we don't know that. Right. And I'll never forget this season. We were on set together. We both had our prop phones, which are obviously not connected at all. But we were talking and we both brought up our dads and we looked down at our prop phone and I said, oh, my God, Brooke. I said, the date on my prop phone is the day that my dad died. Died. And she looked down at her prop phone and her prop phone, the date that her dad died. And I was like, we just started to ball. I was. It was so beautiful. And we just both said, hi, dad. Like, we hear you, we see you, we feel you. But I. It would. Yeah. And everything. I mean, nothing is for no reason. All of every step along the way is a part of the big picture. And my only goal is to be, you know, humble and aware enough to just. Or just, I think just mostly just be aware of the importance of it.
- [21:47]
Sophia Bush
Yeah. Oh, my God, that's so incredible. And for the folks at home, I realize we've. We've gotten. No surprise. Whenever I see you, I don't care if it's like a year or 10.
- [21:58]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
We go so deep.
- [21:59]
Sophia Bush
We just start immediately. Like, how's your heart? But for the. For our friends at home who, you know, there's 1 million streamers and networks and things and whatever. If someone hasn't seen the show, can you tell them about it and like, give us the lay of the land? Okay. I'm realizing I'm not doing my job in like.
- [22:19]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
No, it's fine.
- [22:20]
Sophia Bush
Give me the project details. So I want to do it before. We keep leaning into the surround the surrounding life around.
- [22:27]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Of course. Yeah. Sweet Magnolias, it's on Netflix. It's based on three best childhood best friends. They're like sisters, chosen family. And it's really about life. It's small town. Small town is called Serenity. My husband leaves me for a much younger woman in episode one and you find out she's ultimately pregnant. We go through this divorce, but there's this whole resurgence of, you know, me finding love again. And all of us just sort of navigating. There's, you know, we deal with. With all different real life issues, you know, substance abuse and infidelity and death and financial difficulties, job opportunities. It's really just a slice of life and about how you can be there for one another and really support each other. And it, you know, there is an incredible amount of, you know, empathy and compassion and, you know, we don't shy away from dealing with the. The harder things, but we are always kind of the unity and coming together and that sense of community is always something that is really what I think is a constant theme.
- [23:36]
Sophia Bush
Yeah.
- [23:37]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
And I work with amazing, amazing writers and an incredible crew that has been with us since the beginning. Most. Most. Com. Like the majority of our crew has been with us since the beginning. And. And Heather Headley and Brooke Elliott play my best. Just so special to me. So it's really special.
- [23:57]
Sophia Bush
That's so cool.
- [23:59]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
It's a sweet show. And it's one that I'm really, really proud of. And like you said, I meet people every single day. You know, you got me through my divorce or I watched your show while I was in breast cancer treatments. And I do. I feel a great honor. And I feel like I have just. It does matter to me. It's funny. So many people will be like, is it. Does it bother you? I was at my daughter's cheer competition this weekend, and one of the women was like, does it annoy you that people, you know, talk to you? I said, no. I'm like, I get. I. It's an honor. It really is to just be able to say thank you so much for watching this, but also for sharing that piece of yourself, you know, that. That I'm grateful that I have been able to be a part of some difficult journeys and help, you know, walk that by their side.
- [24:48]
Sophia Bush
Totally. I mean, it's so special. And I think, you know, having people who can help you make sense of your experiences, whatever they're about. Right. Like, if it's a big life change or if it's grief, you dealing with the loss of your parents. I mean, I think about the community that I've had around me in the last couple of years when, like, there's nothing quite so arresting as being like, oh, I've built. I've built the life. I. Like, I made the list. I did the things everyone says I did, the manifestation stuff. I checked off all the boxes, and it's like someone pulls the floor out from under you and you're like, oh, none of it's real.
- [25:29]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah.
- [25:30]
Sophia Bush
Oh, my God. Like, when you start to sort of see things rather than, like, try to make them work, it's so arresting. And to have people go through it, you know, to watch people. Sometimes it's your friends on a show or it's strangers on a show, or someone who writes a book or an article or whatever, and it simply by being familiar, it makes you feel less alone.
- [25:56]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yes.
- [25:57]
Sophia Bush
And that is something I think is so special about your show. It gives me the same nostalgia that, like, my first show I've now learned weirdly, like, as I've gotten to understand it through the fans and then gone back and rewatched it, I'm like, oh, my God, I get it now. Yeah, I didn't get it when I was making it because when I was making it, I was, like, doing script breakdowns and, you know, figuring out how to stay in the two shot correctly. But now as like a viewer, I get it and it is something I think is so special.
- [26:26]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
It is. It really, really is. It's a great, great gift and an honor. Do you feel like. I don't know why I'm hearing, to say this out loud, but just. And this is something that I think that is so special about you. And even just my husband having just briefly met you, he was like, she's such a, like, real human and powerful human. And you're so special. And then do you feel like when you're like, I had all this list, this, These boxes, I checked them all off. Did it. Did it. And it may have not been consistent with what your ultimate destination was, but did it make you feel really powerful and, like, capable and strong? Okay.
- [27:14]
Sophia Bush
No. So what I think I had to realize is that much like. And I know this isn't unique to me, I know we all do this, and particularly when you receive so much pushback for the quote, specialness of your career, people are like, it's not special at all. And, you know, whether they're calling us the Hollywood elite, where I'm like, do y'all know how unions work? Work? And like, it's not what you think it is. Or, you know, they're. They're saying, like, what. Whatever horrible thing they're saying. What I realized is the hypersensitivity and the loneliness and the scars from like, my own bullying and othering and whatever as a kid that I carried put me in a position of being so self deprecating that I actually rejected my quote, specialness.
- [28:03]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah.
- [28:03]
Sophia Bush
I even have to, like, say quote specialness. It's. I'm realizing I'm doing it in real time. My therapist would be like, why are you doing that?
- [28:09]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Why are you doing that?
- [28:09]
Sophia Bush
Don't do that. And so what I think it did was it made me say, oh, if this, if this is like the frequency I vibrate at, it makes people uncomfortable, so I'm gonna, like, need to be here.
- [28:22]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah, I'm gonna.
- [28:22]
Sophia Bush
I got so accustomed to dimming myself that I didn't even realize it made me an easy mark for people who were like, oh, that's our way in. For someone who could say like, oh, that's a way in. Where then I. I can kind of. I can, I can help with the list. But I have, I have an ulterior motive.
- [28:43]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah.
- [28:44]
Sophia Bush
And that's. So the, the gift of the grief is that I finally tore up the list.
- [28:52]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah. You were like.
- [28:53]
Sophia Bush
And it was like, just like your phone and your coworker's phone for no good reason. In that exact moment in real time, not like three weeks later in that moment. Said, here's a sign. It was like the moment I ripped it up, I was suddenly surrounded by people ripping theirs up too.
- [29:11]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah.
- [29:12]
Sophia Bush
And it absolutely saved my life.
- [29:16]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah. Yeah.
- [29:18]
Sophia Bush
And I think when you can get on the other side of something and say, like, oh, I'm. I'm actually grateful for even what was bad.
- [29:25]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah.
- [29:26]
Sophia Bush
Because it gave me the future. Good. Well, that's.
- [29:29]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah, that's the thing that. It's like it was all part of the journey, but God, it is. Yeah. I mean, you. You have to have gratitude for every. All the steps. You have to. Because. And. And also a commitment to just staying awake and aware. I think that's the thing, is that you can have the 20, 20, have the. The gratitude for all of that and also the forgiveness. I feel like I really struggle with that, with. I hold on to these things that I are just such a waste of time. I'm tough on myself. And I think as of late, I've been like, just speak easy on yourself. Hold myself so deeply accountable that I would never do that to my husband or my children or my best friends. I would be like, give yourself a break. But I don't. I don't do that well enough. That's. I think, something that is in the present happening for me right now.
- [30:36]
Sophia Bush
And now for our sponsors.
- [30:38]
T Mobile Advertiser
Go almost everywhere with the podcasts you love on T Mobile's network, because T Mobile helps keep you connected from the heart of Portland to right where you are on America's largest 5G network. Switch. Now keep your phone and T Mobile will pay it off up to $800 per line via prepaid card. Visit your local T Mobile location or learn more@t mobile.com KeepAndSwitch up to four lines of your virtual prepaid card. Left 15 days qualifying unlock device, credit service port in 90 plus days device and eligible carrier and timely redemption required card is no cash access and expires in six months.
- [31:12]
Sophia Bush
I used to sort of. I used to say this thing, and then I realized I was wearing it as almost a badge of honor. That was so sad. I'd say, well, nobody's meaner to me than me. Oh. So it was like, oh, Internet trolls. You think dare ya?
- [31:25]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
I tap you.
- [31:27]
Sophia Bush
I trust me. Like, this is child's play, honey. And then eventually I was like, wait, but. But why? Yeah, but why? And I. And. And my word of the year for 2024 was gentleness. I was like, I have to find a gentleness A tenderness I. I have to. I have to be willing to hold myself the way I hold other people, whether they're my best friends or. Or someone I've barely known. And. And it really has helped me make such a shift, and it. In a weird way, it's made me a more hopeful person. Like, it's made me understand the stories of people that I'm close to, you know, that I might relate to. Like, it turns out there's a reason I related to Love Warrior and then Untamed so much. And then there's a reason that, you know, people I've known in this sphere, you know, some of my best friends who've been with their person since college, or some of the folks out in our world who've always been, like, a safe place to land for me, like you, where I'll watch what your family's doing. And I'm like, I love that I know people where it's worked for so long, because that gives me hope. Like, we talk about the next 20 years of our careers. When I look at certain stories, like yours or the sweetness of a family like yours or some of my other friends, I get to go, like, that feels fun for the next 20 years.
- [32:53]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah.
- [32:53]
Sophia Bush
Like, ah. And I know people I can ask questions to about, like, when it worked, when they knew all the things. I don't know most people who met their person when we were, like, you know, younger, all babies.
- [33:07]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
I mean, you guys, we were 30.
- [33:09]
Sophia Bush
We were working on Gossip Girl, right?
- [33:11]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yes.
- [33:11]
Sophia Bush
Like, it's such a time in my brain, you know, wild. And it's so. I don't know. It's so cool. I'm like, oh, man. It's nice to kind of see that no matter what, whether you've had certain things figured out for a long time or you're just figuring them out now, you've got people to lean on who've been in their own parts of that journey. It's never too late, ever and for anything. Yeah, for anything. And also, there's a million people who've done this before you. So you have. You have people to lean on.
- [33:42]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
I just told my friend this, who just had a baby a couple days ago. I said, I promise you, my kids may have not gone through it, but someone I know has. So just holler. You know, I'd be like, oh, I don't know about that diaper rash, but let me, like, let me. Let's take a picture of it. I think I have a mom friend that, you know, it's. That Kind of connectivity, but also talking about relationships and sharing the realities of like marriage and that type of partnerships and the highs and the lows and, you know, the truth to that. I think that's also really important because, you know, your word was gentleness for 2024. Mine was clarity. I experienced, I had just like there was a relationship in my life that was starting to feel. I was a friendship and it just was starting to feel messy. It was starting to feel blurry. And I hadn't had that in a really long time. And, and I just really needed that like, sense of clarity. And for me it was all just about authenticity. And my husband and I talk about it all the time. Like you could be whoever you want to be. Good, bad, ugly, honestly. Well, it's irrelevant. But just show me who you are so I know what I'm working with, you know, whether. And, and I don't. The smoke and mirrors was just a really uneasy place for me and, and just not living that truth and authenticity. And so clarity for me was my big thing where I was like, let's, let's put things a little bit more in focus. Things felt a little bit blurry for me. But I do think that, you know, I've been with Nick 15 years.
- [35:25]
Sophia Bush
Yeah.
- [35:26]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
And we've had a lot happen. I mean, incredible highs professionally, personally, desperate lows, deep loss, not understanding each other in those moments, grieving differently. You know, him retiring and how we related to each other. Him being a 35 year old man that was used to trotting out on a field. 162 games a year to great fanfare. And all of a sudden it's like, are you gonna make that lunch? The girls lunches need to be made. Can you feed the dogs? Like, not that he didn't do that before, but it felt like that was sort of, it was a huge rock for it. Like it rocked us, it rocked him, it rocked. You know, and so I think just there is such a beauty to be able to connect authentically and with that deep truth and just real and be raw and real and like doing it together and learning from one another, you know, because not one person can fill all, all the holes I have. I'm married to like four people. My girlfriend, you know, like my, my career. In some ways I'm married to Nick. Like I have like, in a lot of ways I have this like deep, genuine commitment to so many things in my life. And so it is, it is nice to be able to just. That's what like doing life together. Is. And that's what I want my children to see. I want them to have those people in their lives that they feel safe with, that can. That they've seen live and walk the walk and do all of those things and be able to connect with and learn from and.
- [37:11]
Sophia Bush
Yeah.
- [37:12]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
You know, not be everything for all. You know, I don't. I can't be everything for them.
- [37:17]
Sophia Bush
Of course. It's really interesting. It kind of hits me as you're talking about this, because 15 years for you guys together is a. It's such an enormous chunk of life. Right. And. And as you said, you've seen each other through so many things. Hillary and I talk about this a lot. I mean, all of us, you know, from. From our first show do, but particularly she and I will talk a lot about how we had all these hunches as young people, and some of them were right and some of them were wrong. And, you know, thank God we've all been able to grow up together. But part of my brain, in hearing you talk about your marriage and all these life stages and parenting and all these life stages and the sort of stages of career is I'm like, oh, my God. Do you think part of the reason that. That you've been so wise in terms of how to ride those waves and. And what a life looks like is because you like, you kind of, instead of growing up just with your peers. Right. Like, we were. We were essentially teenagers on a teen TV show.
- [38:21]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
We were like.
- [38:22]
Sophia Bush
You also grew up with Reba.
- [38:24]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah.
- [38:25]
Sophia Bush
You grew up with an intergenerational mentor, you know, this powerful woman who was older and wiser and had been through all this, the things. And talk about somebody who knows how to navigate, you know, a big life and a public life as a mom now, do you kind of look back on her playing your TV mom and go, oh, my God, she taught me so much that I didn't even realize at the time. Or did you realize it at the time?
- [38:50]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
I realized it, yeah. Okay. And by the way, I don't know, because you would have to ask her, too, because I'm sure there was. There was times where, you know, I was a kid on, you know, her show, like, Steve and I were just bumbling around like Ding Dongs, you know?
- [39:05]
Sophia Bush
Yeah.
- [39:06]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
And every. And Chris Rich, the guy that plays my. The man that played my dad on the show, and Melissa Peterman, too. Like, they. They just always reminded us of how special, like, the opportunity was, because we were. This was our first show. And, you know, he's like, this doesn't come around very often, so just remember that. But Reba, to this day, I mean, we are so interconnected, and we are constant communication, all of us. We have a little group chat. We talk all the time, and we, you know, in many ways, like, I know when I send them a picture of. I'm gonna cry seeing this, but.
- [39:46]
Sophia Bush
I.
- [39:46]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Know that when I send them, like, the picture of my kid at the cheer competition, they're really excited to get it.
- [39:51]
Sophia Bush
Yeah.
- [39:52]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
And that is having lost two people that are really excited to get those things, like the parent, the grandparents, you know.
- [40:00]
Sophia Bush
Yeah.
- [40:01]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
It's really special to have that, and I can't believe I'm crying.
- [40:06]
Sophia Bush
It's okay.
- [40:08]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
But, yeah, like. And Reba, talk about authenticity. Never. There is no heir to her, no pretense. There's no a superstar. Even though she's so undeniably a superstar, she has lived her life with such honesty and absolute. And I'm sure that there were times where. I know there were times, you know, with soul crush, soul crushing grief, and, you know, loss of things, and. But she's so. She is so hopeful. Like, watching her fall in love again with Rex and like a kid, like a school girl, you know, it's like to be able to look back on your life and. And just say, you know, no matter what life threw at me, I. I kind of grabbed it by the horns and made the best of it and also remained, like, excited and exuberant and joyful, and so did she teach me what it was, what it meant to be a graceful leading lady and a powerful businesswoman who knew her worth and a kind icon? Yes, in spades. But what also I thought was so special is so special about her is that she's just so darn real and humble and good, and she walked as a bridesmaid in my wedding.
- [41:43]
Sophia Bush
I was going to ask you about that.
- [41:46]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Come on.
- [41:47]
Sophia Bush
Yeah. You know, how cool.
- [41:50]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah.
- [41:51]
Sophia Bush
So cool.
- [41:52]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
It's very special.
- [41:53]
Sophia Bush
I mean, because you've had such an amazing career. Do you think having mentors like hers and. And the community that you have has that kind of helped you navigate how to do this stuff, how to be in this for the long haul?
- [42:12]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah. I feel really lucky, like, looking at the people that I've come across and the people like that have been a part of my team. Like, my people, they are my family. And so I feel like I have been, you know, on Reba, when we started that show, it was really popular to be, like, super skinny and, you know, all of these Things. And I remember our producers were like, you. They said to me there, joe, you're so beautiful. They were. They were like, please don't change. The only thing they asked is that Steve and I didn't have sex. They're like, it'll ruin everything. Just don't hook up.
- [42:51]
Sophia Bush
I love that.
- [42:52]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
I was like, okay.
- [42:54]
Sophia Bush
Meanwhile, we had producers begging everyone to have sex, fall in love with each other, so that no one would ever want to leave the show or ask for a raise. And our producers were trying to sleep with us at the same time. Time.
- [43:04]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
What a fun zone that would have been. Something to navigate. Talk about grabbing bull by bulls by the horns.
- [43:10]
Sophia Bush
No. So toxic. And by the way, like, how I wish we had been protected by, like, shooting on the Warner Brothers lot.
- [43:18]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
I know.
- [43:19]
Sophia Bush
Being isolated because for us. And again, I feel like she's coming up for me so much. She's. She's my Reba. Hillary and I talk about this all the time because she left the show first, and when she went. Went to work on White Collar, she called me, and she was like, girl, it's different. It is so different. Like, I'm freaking out. And I was like, I'm trying to make it different here. And, like, I'm being told I'm difficult.
- [43:41]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yes.
- [43:42]
Sophia Bush
Because I'm. I'm being like, don't touch the girls at work, boss man. Like, it was so wild. And it really was such a lifeline for me to hear that in other places, it was going differently.
- [43:54]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah.
- [43:55]
Sophia Bush
And like. Like, I don't know. I. I love. I love hearing stories like the one you're telling, that you had such good, protective bosses who mentored you instead of trying to take advantage of you. Like, more of that, please. Good God.
- [44:11]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
I know. But don't you feel now that you've gone on to lead other shows that you can bring that goodness with you? Because I do feel a sense of a huge sense of responsibility moving forward and, like, where I. Where I have been given the opportunity to set the tone and sort of, you know, help create a culture that it's like, for me, I was able to bring what I saw. This extraordinary woman and what she's capable of doing and what she does just so effortlessly. I was able to bring all of that to my jobs and still do to this day. I mean, oftentimes I'll be like, Reba McEntire doesn't even do stuff like that in my head. I'll be like, you know, yes. You can't act like that. You know, don't tell me, don't tell me. You've earned that. Like, this woman has earned all of it. And she literally will, you know, hold your hair if you got a puke, you know, so.
- [45:07]
Sophia Bush
But.
- [45:08]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
But I definitely think that that is a little part of the healing process and a part of, you know, you get to. You get to. And you'll see that, I think, in parenting, too, if that's, like, part of your journey, you'll. You do get to just be like, you know what? I. I kind of sorted through all that crap, so you don't. You don't have to, like, let me just, like, put it in a different light for you.
- [45:32]
Sophia Bush
Yes.
- [45:33]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
And. And let me just kind of make that better for you and in a beautiful way.
- [45:39]
Sophia Bush
Yeah. And I think when those things get mirrored back to you, you know, with your family and your workplace, one of the things that I will carry with me forever, you know, I got to be in every leadership role, all of them at the same time on my last CBS show. And, you know, to lead a big network show, you know how it is. It's like, it's a big deal, and it's wild, and it's an honor, and it's a lot of pressure. And one of the best days I had on set when we were juggling a bajillion things and, you know, on hour 16, and sweet Jordan, my prop guy, sidles up next to me and he goes, you know, to work on a set like this run by all of you women, he said, I see how different it is for all of you. And it just dawned on me. It's been a couple episodes, and I don't think I've told you how different it is for me, too. Having you ladies in charge makes my life better.
- [46:35]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Amen.
- [46:36]
Sophia Bush
And I was like, Jordan, you're like, darn right. That's it. And it was so cool. And it was one of those moments where you go like, oh, yeah, when we. When we make sure we're taking care of everybody who's not normally taken care of, everybody just gets taken care of better. Even the people who are used to kind of being at the top of the pyramid, that I think is so special. And the idea that you got to watch Reba do that and that you learned to do that and that you get to do that on your set and you get to do that as a mom. What an amazing sort of 360 degree view on your whole life, like you said, and all of your marriages, you know, you're married to being a Mom, you're married to your actual husband. Hi, Nick. You're great. You're married to your career. You're married to, like, your mission and your purpose. And they all are in this, like, flow.
- [47:26]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yes. Yeah, they are. And then when one's sort of like Hitchin, you know, you can, like, you're like, okay, hold on. I gotta. I gotta kind of, like, address that. And they're. All. The other ones are kind of flowing, and it's like. It is a little bit of a symphony of just this. You know, it's all about healing. I mean, that's what we're here to do. To heal, to heal, to learn, to grow, to. To connect, to, like, just, you know, experience this classroom together. And. And if we can do that with as much kindness and patience as possible. And that's also something that is not ingrained in me as patients. I'm just kind of like. And I feel like I sometimes miss the details of the plot, and I'm like, dang, that was really cool. And I just didn't even really acknowledge it in the moment because I was impatient in that moment. But I definitely feel like it's. I think it's all I care to kind of be tapped into right now.
- [48:32]
Sophia Bush
I love that.
- [48:33]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Is.
- [48:34]
Sophia Bush
That feels kind of like a deep breath.
- [48:36]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yes, it does. And it's been this year. I write in my newsletter for the Happy Place every month, but this year especially, I looked back on my last year and, wow, my headspace was different. I was really depleted. I was really. I think I actually wrote, like, not, is it the new year yet? Like, it took me a good two weeks to even be like, Whoa, okay, we're in 2024 this year. I was like, let's go. Let's go. And I had the flu. I got. I started the year with the flu. And I was like, let's do this. I'm like, we're gonna. We're not. We're not in indulging this. Like, we're moving forward. We're getting through this. Like, it just. My sense of my. My bandwidth had sort of expanded. My. I wasn't as depleted. And I think a lot of that obviously had to do with grief, but a lot of it had to do with a lot of hard work and. And realization and forgiveness and. And. And reflection that I did last year. And this year, I felt more full.
- [49:44]
Sophia Bush
We'll be back in just a minute after a few words from our favorite sponsors.
- [49:49]
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- [50:23]
Sophia Bush
I love that you brought up the happy place because it's the sort of thing that just brings me joy. I've talked to people, you know, people will say, like, what's something people don't know about you? I unwind especially when we're doing splits, which for our friends at home are like, you know when you work from noon to 3 in the morning on set, But I'll get home and I unwind by like picking a place on a map and then designing like a fictitious house there on Instagram Pinterest. I'm just like, I'm gonna build a house in Albuquerque reminiscent of Georgia O'Keeffe's ghost ranch. Like, totally weird, totally nerdy.
- [50:56]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
You and I could go down rabbit holes together.
- [50:58]
Sophia Bush
Like, I actually can't wait. I'm like, we need a side text. Oh, like, I was like, can we.
- [51:02]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Go on a girls trip and just do this together?
- [51:04]
Sophia Bush
Let's go. Literally nothing would bring me more joy.
- [51:07]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
I'm not even bringing my phone. I'm going to be like, I am unavailable. We have work to do.
- [51:10]
Sophia Bush
Yeah, we'll bring like point and shoot cameras and, and your, your lifestyle site makes me so happy because it focuses on things that bring me pure creative joy. You know, you, you look at home design projects, you look at like beautiful things to cook, you talk to really inspiring women. And I love that instead of starting a bunch of secret Pinterest boards, you actually made that a space that other people can enjoy. How, how did you, A, carve out the time, B, decide that you were really gonna invest the resource of your time and energy into this? Is it, is it pure passion project that lets you just feel creative? Like, like, how. How does it, how does it work?
- [51:53]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah, so it started as that. I mean, I think that it was sort of a part of me that I didn't really share with many people. And it was like, okay, this is going to be super design based because that's what I felt like I should do. But the happy place has saved me in so many ways so many times, because it has. It's almost just. It's funny because you go to my regular Instagram page and I don't share nearly as much. Like, you really get to know me on the happy place, you see a lot more of my life, a lot more of my personality, of my. My family, because it feels so authentic to my story. And it's like my diary. I cook. I'm not a chef, but I cook all the time. I love arts and crafts, so I share them. I love great home design. I love women and their stories, and I think women are the superior beings. Just period and point blank. It's the ultimate place to, like, write. And I love reading, so I share. But you know what funny is? Part of last year for me was forgiving myself for being so hard on myself, because in a lot of ways, I didn't feel like it reflected what it should have reflected. It was sort of like, I don't want to use it. Just for me, it was like I wanted to just give myself the freedom to just be who I am. Shared the smutty romance novel that I. It didn't have to be a book that, like, blew your mind or anything more than just I enjoyed it. And. And so I. I was trying to. I've been trying to give myself permission to just be me. And in that, I've shared my grief, I've shared my anxiety, I've shared my fears, I've shared my excitement. I've shared, you know, my smoothie recipes that feel so trivial. But it's actually, I'm excited to say, like, this isn't a culinary masterpiece, but this is how I'm getting my protein this morning. And, you know, I love avocado toast right now, so we're going to talk about avocado toast. And so I just. It's just allowing me to just be me and the people, the community is so positive and so supportive and so lovely, and I find that it's really attracted that same energy. We don't really have, like, those trolls, you know, And I don't. I'm not welcoming them in. They're not welcome, because it's really just not a space for it. It's like, there's just not. It's not a controversial place. It's a place that you can come to be real, that you can come to just. Just take a deep breath and have a little quick recipe or a cocktail with me or a coffee with me or hear about that. I'm really Sad or that I'm, you know, struggling with my morning routine, and I'm like, let me just show you how it works. Or, you know, it's. It's not highly curated and perfect. It's not. It's just authentic to who I am. And it has saved me in so many ways. And there are times where you can see I'm more inspired than others. Oftentimes it's when I'm in Georgia by the water. We have a lake house there, and I just am, like, like, overflowing with creativity there. And that has been also a learning lesson for me. So in many ways, it's been, like, a reflection of what I need to hear, what I need to know. And it's. I think it's the voice of what, like, I want to continue to kind of explore.
- [55:34]
Sophia Bush
Yeah, I love that.
- [55:35]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
It means a lot to me.
- [55:37]
Sophia Bush
I love that. And a space where you get to be your full self. You know, it's really interesting. My partner says this to me. Like, even in all the years we were friends, friendly acquaintances, you know, whatever you want to call it, it's interesting when someone who knows you so well goes, God, I thought I knew you. And then I realized there's so much more to you, and we're all guilty of that. Like, the Internet has convinced us that we really know everything about people. And, you know, she'll be like, you are so weird and so funny and, like, you seem so serious on Instagram. And I'm like, well, because that's where I'm trying to, like, share the news, to make sure people understand what's going on in the world around them. Like, and I don't know. I don't even really know where I'm going with this. It's not necessarily a fully formed thought. Things are just coming up as you're talking, and I'm realizing, like, part of me wants to hide and do nothing online because people will say what they want, even if it isn't true. People will be abusive. They'll just be so awful. And then on the other side, I'm like, God, it sounds really nice to have a space where you can really be your full self, where you can be incredibly astute and intellectual and also completely silly and say, like, this is the coolest wallpaper I've ever seen in my life. Yes, this is the best pizza I ate this week. Did you read that New York Times article about this tariff? Whatever. Like, we are. We contain multitudes, as the adage goes. And how nice that you have a Space where you get to be all of those things.
- [57:05]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
It really. It has been a gift. And it's not. It's only years in that I, like, really can reflect on it and say, I'm all in. I'm all in. And this is what it is. And I'm not gonna shy away from it, and I'm gonna be who I am and just go for it. But also, I say that in the same breath of, like, it's under the happy place, not my name.
- [57:31]
Sophia Bush
So, like, I have to get out of here.
- [57:34]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
I'm like, okay, Joe, call my bullshit. Just be like, okay, now start to share it over there. But no, it is. It's a. It's a destination, is what I call it all the time. It's a destination to just to come and be and share and, you know, that's nice. It's just a piece of my heart.
- [57:52]
Sophia Bush
Well, and I think community is the thing that always saves us. And so to build a space for community is so important. And I hear it's expanding into production.
- [58:03]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
What does it mean? We are actually in production now with three movies that are based on a book series. And it's really happening. It's really happening. So we are just, you know, in the process of optioning material and getting it made. And. And. And that is another. There's so many books and things that I read that I'm like, yes, wow, this is so amazing. But then I think to myself, okay, what's consistent with, like, the ethos? The story? What's the story here? What's the. That broad strokes? And so it has been really fun curating that and. And, like, leaning into what my intuition is telling me about what needs. What I feel like we need to, like, spend our time on. And, you know. You know, it's not easy to get anything off the ground. And I also. It's been really a great joy as an executive producer on these movies. I'm not acting in them to just be there for actors, too.
- [59:04]
Sophia Bush
Yes.
- [59:05]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Because I do speak that language, and I do know how important it feels. And I know the process of, like, you could be so, like, I'm so prepared just in general, as a human, and then sometimes things come up, like, in the last minute, and it's funny. People that don't understand our types are like, whoa. It's like coming out of nowhere, and it's like. Well, kind of. It does. Because that's what you want. You want an actor that things come out of nowhere and hit you in a certain way because you Know they're in the moment, and, like, so it's been nice to advocate in that way and. And set up a warm and loving environment for people to follow their dreams. Yeah. It's fun. It's really exciting.
- [59:48]
Sophia Bush
I'm so excited for you.
- [59:50]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Thank you.
- [59:51]
Sophia Bush
I'm also, like, great. I have 17 ideas for some things that I'm just gonna bring to you. Let's go beyond.
- [59:55]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Let's make them. Let's go makeup.
- [59:57]
Sophia Bush
I love it. Well, I mean, I just feel such joy for you and with you and, like, what an exciting moment when you look at. And it doesn't necessarily have to be the year ahead, like, your to do list or what's in the calendar or things with work. But I guess when you sort of look in front of you this year or the big, you know, 20 years we spoke of earlier, when you're kind of looking out at the horizon, what feels like your work in progress right now?
- [60:28]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Oh, no pressure. I know. I want to be a really present mom. That's super important to me. So, like, just the parenting thing is always going to be a work in progress because they change so quickly, and it's like, whoa, that one came out of nowhere. But I think that I have this voracious need to tell, to storytell, and not necessarily as an actor. So I just. I'm feeling extremely creative in my moment and also trying to look back and know that I'm being so wholly supported and protected from the other side. And I actually am understanding that it will inform everything. How I parent, how I live, how I walk in this world, everything that. That loss, but also that there is, like, great creativity and power that's sort of being pushed from the other side for me. And I think the work in progress is gonna just try to remind myself to. To not be so worried about trying to make something that I think people, you know, want. I. I want to just follow my heart and tell the stories that I know without a shadow of a doubt that storytelling will be the next 20 years for me, for sure.
- [61:58]
Sophia Bush
Yeah. To tell the story you want to tell, not necessarily for what people are going to think about it.
- [62:04]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
And that's what Happy Place isn't just. It just hit me when your partner was saying to you, like, there's so much more to you, which, by the way, I would say that, too. Like, I'm like, yes, share that. You know, that's like. It's. Just tell the story. The story changes every day, 15 times a day.
- [62:26]
Sophia Bush
Yes.
- [62:26]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
And there's beauty and power to that. And it's, it's important and we are in these spots to be able to do that so you have a chance to. But everyone should tell their story.
- [62:41]
Sophia Bush
Everyone should.
- [62:43]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Even the ones we don't want to listen to.
- [62:45]
Sophia Bush
Well, I think the more people that do, the more, the more others are encouraged to do it too.
- [62:52]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Yeah, I think people are going to really are awakening. They're, they're waking up to the truth and it's not fast enough because of course we're not. I'm not patient, but I do think that there's going to be less tolerance for the lack of authenticity. And I think it's going to reveal itself. I, I that is my prayer.
- [63:15]
Sophia Bush
Yeah.
- [63:17]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
That is my prayer. This is Dr. Laurie Santos from the Happiness Lab at the Boston Marathon, presented by bank of America. Thousands of runners are raising funds for.
- [63:40]
Sophia Bush
Life changing causes and you can help make an impact.
- [63:44]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Visit bofa.com helpacause to donate and support a runner's fundraising efforts. Together we're making a difference. One step at a time.
- [63:54]
Sophia Bush
What would you like the power to.
- [63:55]
Joanna Garcia Swisher
Do, bank of America?