Podcast
Always Be Testing
Hosted by Tye DeGrange · EN
Always Be Testing explores the experiments, insights, and growth stories shaping the future of affiliate and partner marketing in B2B SaaS. Hosted by industry veterans, the show dives deep into real-world lessons from the people driving measurable impact at companies like Google, HubSpot, Ramp, Webflow, G2, and beyond.
Each episode uncovers what happens when today's most innovative marketers challenge assumptions, run smarter experiments, and build programs that scale revenue through meaningful partnerships. If you’re in affiliate, partnerships, or SaaS growth — this is your front-row seat to how the best do it (and what they’ve learned along the way
70episodes
Episodes
Newest firstAll episodes
EP 125: Less Traffic, More Sales: Wyze's Counterintuitive Paid Media Playbook | Logan Dunn
Yesterday00:40:56Summary readyLogan Dunn, Head of E-commerce at Wyze, ran 100 ads at once, cut traffic, and watched conversions go up. In this episode, he breaks down the counterintuitive paid media playbook behind Wyze's D2C growth — including why narrow targeting beats broad reach, how in-house creative unlocks faster iteration, and what most brands get wrong about scaling paid spend.
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SaaS Clas EP2: From Single Digits to 25% of Pipeline: The SaaS Partner Playbook | Nancy Harnett, Guy Yalif, and Tye DeGrange
1w ago00:46:44Summary readyNancy Harnett (Instantly) and Guy Yalif (Webflow) break down exactly how SaaS companies can grow their partner programs from single-digit contributions to 25% of pipeline and revenue. They cover partner ICP alignment, building a best-in-class partner experience, and why most programs stall before they ever scale.
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#124 Why Authentic Content Beats the Algorithm | Yoray Halevy
2w ago00:28:07Summary readyYoray Halevy joins Tye DeGrange to dig into why brands can't rely on Vogue-style coverage to build credibility — and what they should be doing instead. Yoray shares how his company creates authentic content that speaks to specific audiences, why last-click attribution misses the full picture, and how a paid media distribution mindset unlocks the true value of content. They also explore how AI is changing the content-to-distribution relationship, and why experimentation is the key to knowing what actually works.
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CTV Measurement Unpacked: Incrementality, Attribution & Holdout Testing | Tom Rathbone
May 1900:37:58Summary readyTom Rathbone joins Tye DeGrange to break down the real challenges of measuring CTV — from probabilistic Nielsen-era methods to where the industry stands today. Tom shares how TVScientific approaches measurement, why holdout testing is still underutilized by most brands, and how to build a test media plan that actually generates signal. Plus: why single-touch attribution fails in a multi-channel world and what it takes to move from vanity metrics to a long-term growth strategy.
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Horse Lessons from Mom | Ginger DeGrange
May 1200:39:01Summary readyFor Mother's Day, Tye DeGrange hands the mic to his mom — Ginger DeGrange. Rodeo queen. Horse trainer. Summer camp founder. 36-year instructor who's taught 10,000+ students the art of horsemanship at Santa Rosa Junior College. This one's full of great stories: the OJ Simpson trail ride, a student who went on to dine with the Queen of England, competing at the Grand National, and the old reinsman who taught Ginger that quiet confidence beats loud energy every time. Plus real lessons on building confidence, earning trust, and leading with feel — on and off the horse.
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#121 Zero Platform: 10 Great Partners Beat 100 — The Future of Local Marketing | Adam Dewer, Soci.ai
Apr 2900:28:48Summary readyAdam Dewer leads partnerships at Soci.ai — an AI-powered platform helping 800+ multi-location brands manage their local presence across social, listings, and reviews.In this episode, Tye and Adam get into the "zero platform" future of local marketing, where AI agents replace dashboards entirely — handling updates, review responses, and social posts through a simple SMS conversation with the business owner. They also dig into Adam's approach to building and measuring partnerships (he tracks just two numbers: net new revenue and expansion revenue) and why he'd take 10 incredible partners over 100 mediocre ones any day.What you'll learn:• Why "automagically" is the most dangerous word in AI marketing• How to identify your AI strength areas before trying to scale• Why agency partners are Adam's #1 channel play right now• The early signals that tell you a partner is going to scale• How to tee up a partner for success without making it transactional• What the "zero platform" future looks like for a local business ownerConnect with Adam: linkedin.com/in/adamdewer | soci.ai
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SaaS Class EP 1: AEO is the New SEO — How HubSpot & Webflow Are Winning AI-First Discovery | Nancy Harnett & Guy Yalif
Apr 2100:34:37Summary readyThe first episode of SaaS Class tackles one of the most pressing questions in B2B marketing: how do you win when your buyers are finding answers on ChatGPT and Perplexity instead of Google?Tye sits down with Nancy Harnett (Head of Affiliate & Offsite AEO at HubSpot) and Guy Yalif (Webflow, formerly CEO of Intellimize) to break down what's actually working in the race to become the most visible brand in AI search. Nancy reveals how HubSpot generated 200K+ AI citations in 6 months and became the #1 most visible CRM across AI search. Guy shares how Webflow appears in 67% of the AI answers they care about — more than any other CMS including WordPress.What you'll learn:Why AEO is a natural evolution of great SEO, not a replacementThe 4 pillars of AEO: Content, Technical, Authority & MeasurementWhy affiliate marketing is now the "new backlinks" — driving top and bottom-funnel AI impactHow HubSpot used Reddit to go from ~100 to 146K AI citations in 7 monthsContent depth and localization: what actually moves the needleHow to build a closed-loop measurement system to iterate fast
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90% of Media Buying Workflows Are Still Manual—Here’s What’s Broken | Lacie Thompson
Mar 2400:30:14Summary readyIn this episode of Always Be Testing, host Tye DeGrange sits down with Lacie Thompson, an experienced agency leader, affiliate and partner marketing expert, and former operator at brands like Expedia and Blue Nile. After successfully scaling and exiting her agency, Lacie is now building Media Pack—an AI-powered platform designed to modernize and streamline how brands buy media.The conversation explores Lacie’s journey across brand-side, agency, and startup environments, highlighting how real-world frustrations led her to build solutions rooted in efficiency and transparency. From the broken workflows of flat-fee media buying to the lack of standardization across the industry, she unpacks the core problems that still slow teams down—and how AI is now making it possible to rethink the entire system.Beyond product and tech, the episode dives into the mindset behind building and scaling—from making decisions beyond data, to taking risks before feeling “ready,” to focusing on what truly creates differentiation. It’s a grounded and insightful look at what it takes to build in today’s AI-driven landscape while staying anchored in real customer needs.
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#119 Why 70% of Affiliate Programs Fail Before They Launch — and How AI Can Fix That | Kyle White
Mar 1000:32:39Summary readyKyle White is the CEO & Founder of Refinery, an AI-powered affiliate technology solution. He brings a rare blend of experience across affiliate management (Overstock, Uber), product development, and data-driven experimentation. He previously built tools at Impact, led global affiliate/ambassador programs at Uber, and now focuses on making affiliate programs smarter, more automated, and more profitable using AI.In this conversation, Kyle breaks down how AI is transforming affiliate marketing, how brands can adopt product‑led growth principles, and why relevancy—not payouts—is the strongest signal in partner matchmaking. He shares lessons from scaling Uber’s Ambassador Program from a 7% to an 80% activation rate, what most brands get wrong about affiliate recruitment, and how to design tests that actually produce meaningful insights.The episode also covers trends shaping the future: the threat of AI search bypassing the affiliate channel, the rise of pay‑per‑performance TV & audio partners, and why the next era will require filtering through more noise to find true value. Kyle also shares personal stories—building a company with a newborn, being featured in South Park, speaking Russian from missionary service in the Baltics, and his love of film photography.
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#118 Why Most Marketing Teams Miss 95% of Real Buyers | Doug Bell
Mar 300:41:39Summary readyIn this episode, I sit down with Doug Bell — Fractional CMO, former leader at Automation Anywhere, LeanData, and Searchmetrics, top‑40 Substack writer, and co-host of Cannonball GTM — to unpack why modern go‑to‑market playbooks are breaking… and what the next generation of GTM looks like in an AI‑driven world.We go deep into the new patterns shaping high‑growth companies — and the uncomfortable truths most teams don’t want to face.
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