Why You Can't Stop Over-Functioning (+ What It's Really Costing You)

Summary

Podcast Summary: "Why You Can't Stop Over-Functioning (+ What It's Really Costing You)"

Healing + Human Potential with Alyssa Nobriga
Guest: Dr. Molly Barrett, Clinical Psychologist
Date: March 31, 2026

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Episode Overview

In this episode, Alyssa Nobriga hosts clinical psychologist Dr. Molly Barrett to explore the roots and repercussions of over-functioning—especially among high-achieving women. Together, they delve deep into how unconscious childhood wounds shape patterns in adulthood, from career burnout to relationship struggles. The conversation traverses values identification, the interplay of fear, self-sacrifice, the costs of ignoring your own needs, and the journey toward healing and authentic partnership. Dr. Barrett also shares her personal story of transformative illness, highlighting the invitation—and sometimes demand—to slow down, receive support, and re-align with what truly matters.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Childhood Wounds and Over-Functioning

Timestamps: [00:00], [12:11], [23:15], [28:32], [37:28]

• Unconscious Patterns: We don’t choose partners by accident—it’s often based on an unconscious wound from childhood. Over-functioning can be a survival strategy, especially for those who felt they "had to be the one" growing up.

  • "High achieving women, I can't rely on anyone. They take it on and they desperately want to let go. But they're scared because from childhood they had to be the one." — Alyssa Nobriga [00:00]
  • Over-functioning often masks deeper unmet needs for safety, recognition, or love; success can camouflage relational wounds.

• Life-Altering Wake-Up Calls: Dr. Barrett shares a powerful story of ignoring her physical and emotional limits until a health crisis forced her to pause and receive care.

  • "I was over functioning a lot in my home and even in my marriage, feeling unsafe, believing that I could control everything and doing the most. Until I made myself so sick...And I did have a tumor. I now look back at that time in my life and I think that was the most incredible gift because I had to be taken care of and I had to stop." — Dr. Molly Barrett [00:12], [28:32]

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2. Values: Identification, Alignment, and Misconceptions

Timestamps: [01:02], [02:12], [03:26], [05:12], [07:21], [08:08], [09:23], [10:44]

• Fear vs. Values: Many mistake fear-avoidance for values-driven living. If your motivation stems from avoiding a negative outcome, you’re likely acting from fear rather than genuine value.

  • "It's very easy to confuse your fears with your values...So if you're asking yourself, I don't want to have this experience, therefore I'm going to move in this direction, that's a sign that you're actually working out a fear rather than an actual value." — Dr. Molly Barrett [02:12]

• Identifying True Values: Dr. Barrett suggests imagining a life free of fear to clarify authentic values. Alyssa shares that values can be rooted in fear but don’t need to be governed by it.

• Practical Exercise: The Values Card Sort (from Acceptance and Commitment Therapy) can help people distill core values by sorting through a comprehensive set of options.

• Values as North Star: Living in alignment with your top values supports fulfillment in all life areas. Values can change as you grow; self-compassion is key during the exploration.

  • "Values can change because you are an organic, living, breathing thing. Your values can change. In fact, they should change." — Dr. Molly Barrett [11:21]

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3. Love, Relationships, and Projections

Timestamps: [14:08], [14:39], [15:18], [17:19], [20:38], [23:15], [24:19]

• Aspirational Values & Mate Selection: We often seek partners who embody our aspirational values. The infamous "ideal partner list" usually mirrors qualities we desire for ourselves.

  • "You look on your manifestation list...you need to embody every single thing on that list because that list is just a projection of the person you actually want to be." — Dr. Molly Barrett [14:08]

• Healing in Relationships: Real growth happens as we stop seeking someone to complete us and instead become whole ourselves, allowing us to choose partners from a place of fullness.

• Attachment Patterns: Over-functioners may pair with under-functioners, unconsciously recreating childhood dynamics (e.g., "I have to do it all" meets "I can’t ever measure up"), which perpetuate both partners' wounds.

  • "Their ways of protecting themselves are the way that they're hurting each other in that relationship." — Alyssa Nobriga [24:21]

• Permission to Outgrow Relationships: Courage to grow, even if it means outgrowing a partner, is necessary for alignment and healing.

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4. The Cost of Self-Sacrifice & Learning to Receive

Timestamps: [28:32], [31:41], [32:13], [33:55], [34:04], [36:08], [37:28]

• Burnout and Disease as Teachers: Dr. Barrett describes how her body finally forced a halt to over-giving—and how receiving care (and stopping) became not just necessary but healing.

  • "I didn't take my needs seriously. I kept taking on more and more and more in my effort to be supportive ... But it was...managing the symptom instead of really getting at the root cause, which was truly my over functioning." — Dr. Molly Barrett [28:32]

• Integration Is Ongoing: Even after a wake-up call, the compulsion to do too much doesn’t disappear overnight. Building awareness, daily self-check-ins, and protecting time for passion and rest are essential.

  • "It doesn't just stop because you learned the lesson. I have to confront it every day. But now I have the tools, now I have the self awareness to say, oh, I'm doing that thing again." — Dr. Molly Barrett [00:12], [34:04]

• Intergenerational Healing: Dr. Barrett reframes her own childhood wound, recognizing that seeing a "happy mom"—not just a present one—would have made all the difference. Prioritizing her own joy heals both herself and her lineage.

  • "I never saw a happy mom ... the best gift I can give my children is a happy mother. What a reframe." — Dr. Molly Barrett [38:42]

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5. Self-Sabotage, Red Flags & Compatibility

Timestamps: [40:20], [45:06], [45:44], [47:10], [48:38]

• Relationship Patterns: Repeating the same dynamics with different partners signals internal work to do.

  • "If you keep experiencing the same relationship over and over again, it's not them, it's you who's the common denominator." — Dr. Molly Barrett [40:20]

• Non-Negotiables & Direct Questions: Rather than focusing on being chosen, ask upfront about alignment on core life areas. Five clear non-negotiables can help focus your search for compatibility.

  • "You need to ask the questions that reveal, is this the person for me? Own your power." — Dr. Molly Barrett [44:03]

• Red Flags: Control (not compromise) is a true red flag. Ask yourself if you have the freedom to authentically pursue what your heart wants in the relationship.

  • "If you feel that you are being controlled, that you're not able to be your most authentic self, you're not able to live with freedom, that's a red flag to me and sometimes is a sign of abuse." — Dr. Molly Barrett [45:44]

• Compatibility vs. Wounds: Many ‘ghosting’ or breakups are about lack of wound-matching or basic incompatibility, not personal inadequacy.

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6. Gendered Realities of Marriage & the Need for Self-Prioritization

Timestamps: [47:10]

• Marriage Benefits: Research shows men gain more in health and finance from marriage, while women may experience declines—unless they prioritize themselves.

  • "Women pay a cost when they care for others at their own expense. Right. So there's two ways to avoid this... prioritize yourself and choose wisely." — Dr. Molly Barrett [47:10]

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7. Reframing "Wasted Time" & Embracing Growth

Timestamps: [48:38], [50:01]

• Nothing is Wasted: Every failed relationship is a teacher if you’re willing to feel the associated grief and absorb the lesson.

  • "You don't get to learn the lesson without feeling what it cost you. Those things go hand in hand." — Dr. Molly Barrett [48:38]

• Moving Forward: Allowing yourself to fully grieve frees up presence and energy for new love and authentic connection.

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8. Healing Happening in Connection

Timestamps: [52:23], [52:46], [53:47], [54:26], [54:56]

• Relational Healing: We often need others—loving mirrors, partners, or community—to access and move through deep grief and joy.

  • "People always think like, we have to heal in isolation... It's a privilege to be able to feel all of your feelings and to be witnessed in connection." — Dr. Molly Barrett / Alyssa Nobriga [53:47]

• Parenting & Connection: The core pain of childhood consequences (like ‘go to your room’) is often the withdrawal of love and connection, not the punishment itself.

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9. "You Must Be Fully Healed to Have Love"—Myth

Timestamps: [55:27]

• You Don’t Need to Be Healed to Start: Relationships highlight our wounds but also help us heal—provided we aren't using another as a "fix" for our pain.

  • "If you are actually pursuing a relationship with the goal of just giving love and receiving love, you can do that as a very wounded person, as long as you're not using another person as an object for your sort of healing." — Dr. Molly Barrett [55:27]

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• "I am no longer willing to compromise ease and rest in order to achieve. There has to be a balance." — Dr. Molly Barrett [33:55]
• "Any relationship that is built on self-sacrifice is not a relationship that will maintain." — Alyssa Nobriga [28:07]
• "Nothing is wasted. Every mistake that you ever made is a gateway to the better life that you've been dreaming of." — Dr. Molly Barrett [48:38]
• "The best gift I can give my children is a happy mother." — Dr. Molly Barrett [38:42]
• "We don’t choose a partner by accident. We choose based on an unconscious wound." — Alyssa Nobriga [00:00]

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Key Takeaways

• Over-functioning is rooted in early relational wounds and will manifest until consciously healed.
• Values-based living is about deep clarity, not fear-based avoidance—and your values can (and should) evolve as you do.
• Healing requires feeling into grief, loss, and the costs of self-sacrifice—not just mental understanding.
• Real partnership stems from wholeness within, not from seeking to be completed.
• You don’t need to be fully healed to be worthy of love or partnership; relationships, when approached consciously, are a crucible for growth and healing.
• Self-prioritization, including joy and rest, is a gift to yourself and those around you—not a luxury.
• Failure in relationships is not wasted; it’s the path to self-realization and authentic love.

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Resources Mentioned

• Values Card Sort (Acceptance and Commitment Therapy/ACT)
• Dr. Molly Barrett’s Podcast, Kissing Frogs

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Suggested Next Steps

• Reflect on your top 3-5 values. Are they guiding your major life decisions?
• Notice where you might be over-functioning in your life/family/relationship.
• Give yourself permission to feel grief, frustration, or exhaustion fully—and allow it to guide you toward insight and new choices.
• Ask direct questions early in relationships to clarify compatibility.
• Remember: ease, joy, and rest aren’t rewards for achievement; they’re essentials you deserve now.

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For more, listen to the full episode or explore resources at AlyssaNobriga.com.

Transcript

[Alyssa Nobriga]

We don't choose a partner by accident. We choose based on an unconscious wound. And so high achieving women, I can't rely on anyone. They take it on and they desperately want to let go. But they're scared because from childhood they had to be the one.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

I was over functioning a lot in my home and even in my marriage, feeling unsafe, believing that I could control everything and doing the most. Until I made myself so sick. I went into the doctor and I started crying and I said, I am at the end of my rope and I really need you to believe me because I'm starting to think that I have a tumor. And she sent me for an MRI and I did have a tumor. I now look back at that time in my life and I think that was the most incredible gift because I had to be taken care of and I had to stop. And every single day I have to make choices informed by this new truth. I am still compelled to do too much. It doesn't just stop because you learned the lesson. I have to confront it every day. But now I have the tools, the self awareness to say, oh, I'm doing that thing again.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Welcome to the Healing and Human Potential podcast. Today we're going to explore why we don't choose our partners by accident. How our deepest fears play into who we attract. The real reason you may feel unhappy and disconnected in relationship and what it takes to break the cycles that keep us stuck. Joining us is Dr. Molly Barrett, a clinical psychologist who helps women and couples understand the deeper patterns that influence their lives and relationships. It's a good one and I hope it supports you. So I know that one of the things you talk about is if somebody's unhappy in their life or in the relationship, it could be because they're out of alignment with their core values. And I think values work is really helpful to not only know, how do I make decisions in my life, how do I stay aligned? I'll do it for my business, my relationships, my health. I want to make decisions in alignment with my values. And just to give people like a reference point, I think having three to five core values are helpful. My core values are service, love, truth, growth and connection. And I feel like these are the ingredients just to have a really vibrant, aligned life. But I'm wondering, because, you know, you do a lot of work around values, what are people misunderstanding about values?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Well, I think it can be hard to identify what your values are if you're stuck in fear. It's very easy to confuse your fears with your values because if you're thinking about what you're aiming for in your life. A lot of times what we're aiming for is informed by what we're afraid of. So we're often thinking about what we're not aiming for. So if you're asking yourself or saying to yourself, I don't want to have this experience, therefore I'm going to move in this direction, that's a sign that you're actually working out a fear rather than an actual value. If you're trying to avoid an outcome and that's why something's important to you, it's probably more a reflection of your fears rather than your values. So I like to ask people, like, if you were to wake up tomorrow morning and wave a magic wand and everything that you were afraid of had disappeared, tell me about your life. Right. Getting really into that dream state, letting yourself imagine in a sort of magic world, allows you to kind of step into that place of safety and really think about, if I were safe, if I didn't have my fears, what would I want my life to be? That's where you can find your values.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah. Beautiful. And in my own inquiry, I haven't found values that aren't in some way associated to fear or to a judgment. Like, growth was one of my values, but I don't want to be stagnant or like, if somebody has honesty as a value, maybe they don't want to be lied to or. And so in some ways, I feel like some of the. I don't know that the fear is bad, but the way I'll work with it. And I'm curious if you have a way to coach or work with people through it. I will let myself feel this sensation of stagnation so that I can almost stretch my capacity and my nervous system to be with it rather than run from it, run towards it, so it doesn't have power over me. And neuroscientists have found it only takes 90 seconds to feel an emotion before it moves through the body. So it's like, okay, can I be with this? Can I say yes to stagnation and let myself have greater dominion over it and still say yes to growth? Because it's fun. And why not? Let's play the game consciously. How would you kind of work with people to move away from fear?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Yeah, well, that makes a ton of sense. And I would say if you allow yourself to feel the fear and move toward it and you're still invested in a certain direction, that tells you, okay, maybe your value is related to your fear. Maybe it has a genesis in your fear. Maybe there's something old, something ancient that is informing you, but you're still moving at it from a place of agency and. And power. So there are lots of things in my life that I'm moving toward that maybe were rooted one time in fear. But I think we give ourselves a lot more grace, a lot more freedom when we're able to move organically toward our goals rather than dog paddling toward them because we're terrified of the opposite. You know what I mean?

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

So I think asking yourself, like, what kind of drive and intensity am I experiencing around this? If it's something that you have to have and you're just moving forward with such intensity, that's a sign you might be governed by fear.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah. And trauma.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Exactly. Yeah. But I think if you can let things happen organically, let them unfold, it's more of a sign that you're really rooted in the value.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah, yeah. And as you're saying that, it's almost like we can. If we trust ourselves to be with whatever life is throwing at us and we know that we can develop our range, then we have more trust naturally as a byproduct, like the difference between freedom to and freedom from. Freedom from is like escapism. Freedom to is. I'm free enough to say yes to whatever is arising in the moment, and then we can just kind of flow with whatever's coming forward instead of trying to manipulate and manage life so that then we're okay, but then we lose our power. We have anxiety because we can't control life, but we control how we be with it.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Right?

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah. So that's powerful. And I do know that in this work, you know, a lot of times people talk about purpose and I think living in alignment with our values in every area of our life. And so for me, with these five values, if I align how I spend my relationships, invest time and money. And so that to me is like this reverse engineer way of feeling into living a purpose filled life. And I know that there was a period of time where I wasn't going to the gym and I looked at my five values and I didn't feel connection. And so I was like, what could I do to have more connection? I went to group fitness and I started going naturally again. So it could just be these small hacks that people are like, oh, this feels. And another time I was working as a psychotherapist, then I took my business online, but it was in the coaching space in 2017 and I was doing Better financially, but I wasn't as fulfilled because I didn't have the connection again.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

That's right.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

I was almost like more of an entrepreneur. And I wanted to be with people, so I started doing programs where I could watch them change their life, which was more fulfilling for me. So I love this as this North Star for us to make decisions around different things that come up in our life as we evolve.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Absolutely. And you can find your values that might seem, on the surface, unrelated. You can see them showing up in every domain in life. Like connection can show up in finances.

[Podcast Host/Announcer]

Right.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

It's not obvious on the surface, but if you dig a little bit deeper, you'll find it.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And to give people some time to kind of find theirs. I know for I haven't changed mine. I'm sure they can change, but I haven't changed mine in maybe a decade. But once I got them, it was almost like I loved connection with nature, friends, family. And I was trying to figure out what's the umbrella word that would encompass all of it. And so connection was it. And so to give people a reference point of, like, once you find that, like, it will just be. And if you're. If you're out of. If you're unhappy in one area of your life, you may look at. Once you find your three to five values, what am. What's least expressed? And how can I express that more in that area?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Absolutely. And I think you have to really. The umbrella, I think, is a good metaphor. I also think, like, going down into the basement is a good metaphor too. I worked with a client who, he was telling me that his primary core value was we. Right. And a lot of his choices were informed by this desire for wealth. And in fact, he was extremely wealthy, but yet didn't quite seem fulfilled. Right. So, wow, it really seems like you are living this value of wealth. What do you think is missing? You know, if you had all the wealth that you thought you could ever contain, what feeling would that give you? And, you know, through a sort of shedding process, the client arrived at what I think is true for most people around money, which is safety. Safety. And so it turned out that while wealth was a value, the value, the core value underneath it was truly safety.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

That's great. It's like the deeper desire. It's not the surface level, it's the deeper thing. What do you think that would give you? Yes.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

If you had that, how would you feel? And that feeling might give you a clue into what the value is.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Is there anything else in terms of Helping people identify what their values are that you could share. That would be helpful.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

There's a really great resource called the Values Card Sort, which is free to everyone. You can find it on the Internet. And it was written or produced by the people who created Acceptance and Commitment therapy, which is ACT for short. And what it is is it's like 500 values that are printed out on cards. You can print them out yourself from the Internet. So you can create yourself a little card deck. You can create three categories. Very important to me, somewhat important to me, not important to me. And I have people take these cards and just stream of consciousness without thinking too much about it. Put a card in each category. Once you've got that stack of very important to me, Maybe you've got 30 cards in that deck. I really encourage people. See if you can draw out, and this is just a fun exercise, the top 10. From the top 10, can you draw out the top five? Can you draw out the top three? And I know for me, I can draw out the top value. That is every other value in my life is contained under the umbrella of my top value, which is passion.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

When you were saying this, I was imagining people doing it for themselves or even with their family. It could be a great connection exercise to learn about people that you love, what's important to them. How can we cultivate these values together and then just kind of do this life assessment? How am I expressing this in career, health, finances.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Beautiful. And, you know, that makes me think families could create their own list of family values. You know, what are the top three Burritz family values? That sounds like super fun.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And then how do we creatively, how do we each contribute to, you know, the family vacation or time that we spend together nurturing those values? And so in terms of identifying, you would say, work with that card deck. I would imagine to give people some grace with it, because I think they're supposed to get it right away. And it's something we have to chew on for at least a week, if not longer. And then once you get it, it can be pretty solid. Is there anything else that people should know or they get caught up on values that would be helpful to kind of just demystify?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Values can change because you are an organic, living, breathing thing. Your values can change. In fact, they should change. You know, my values are not the same as they were when I was 25. And these, you know, these goals, you know, picking the top 10, picking the top five, picking the top one. Don't be hard on yourself. Yeah, these are Just guidelines, right? Let yourself create your own rules. God knows there's just enough rules in life. You don't also need to add rules for yourself around your value system.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

I can see people's patterns coming up around how they pick their values. Right. It's like I have to pick the right one. It's like where else does that play out in my life? Just to be compassionate with ourselves as we kind of go through it. But I do think it's a great barometer and North Star as we make decisions and, and navigate our lives so that it feels really aligned. And how would you say these values influence who we choose as partners?

[Podcast Host/Announcer]

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[Dr. Molly Barrett]

One of the challenges I see people having in selecting their values is sometimes they have values that feel aspirational. Right? These are the values that I wish I had. This is the person that I wish I was, but these are the values that I'm actually living out. And when there's a differential between the values that you have and the values that you wish that you had, this is the thing that can often inform mate selection.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Say more.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

We are often looking for a partner that embodies our aspirational values. The things about ourselves that we wish that we were living out that were not. So, you know, you look on your manifestation list of the 50 things that you're looking for in a partner and you need to embody every single thing on that list because that list is just a projection of the person you actually want to be.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Amen.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

And you're looking for someone to complete you. So am I right? Everybody is. But you have the power to be that on your own for yourself. And then you will be shocked what can open up for you in terms of who you're selecting as a partner. Because all of a sudden, oh, I don't need this, I don't need that, I don't need this. What is left that I just actually could be surprised by that I might willing to be sort of in awe about that I never would have assigned to my life. I really think when people are living out their values, they have freedom, more freedom to choose a partner in a

[Alyssa Nobriga]

way that's less rigid because we're not looking for someone to fill us. We are more developed in ourselves to then not put up with anything less than what we're already offering ourselves. I know in 2009 I did this. I wrote this like list of, you know, for me, I wanted to take myself through a nine month journey of dating myself and combing through all of the projections and stories I was taught about what love is, marriage, Disney, all of the conditioning we've inherited. And I really was on this inquiry of what is love and who am I? And both psychologically and spiritually. So who am I to wake up to the truth of my being, my inherent worth and value, but then also psychologically heal? And I wrote down this list of qualities that I wanted from a partner and I started becoming those. And what I found in that. I also did a lot of work on my number one triggering relationship at the time, which was my mom. Usually it's one parent and I got to heal everything that I think I would have played out with a partner had I not done that work on my own. And I was with my best friend at the time. We were living together and we were both single. We're like, well, if we're not with somebody. Let's use each other as mirrors. We're projecting onto each other anyway to see what gets triggered or what I love about you, because it's. The projection is both positive and negative. So let me use you and everybody else as my mirror, as my soulmate, to help evolve my soul. And that was some of the deepest work I've ever done in my life. And it gave me my power back. And then I just didn't put up with things that weren't toxic. But I also didn't recognize my husband when he came in because it wasn't a template of my past, and he just seemed like me. And it was really actually quite great because I allowed the relationship to blossom into what it is, rather than trying to control and make it something that I needed from him.

[Podcast Host/Announcer]

And.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And it evolved into something better than I could have ever imagined. But it wasn't. I didn't recognize it at first.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

I had a very similar experience with my husband.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Yeah. I mean, I had played out very toxic relationship patterns throughout most of my adult life that were rooted in my mother wound. And, you know, I had a lot of shame around this because I'm a relationship expert. I'm a clinical psychologist that specializes in couples. And I was just looking back at sort of the wasteland of lots of failed relationships. And I think that I had not really learned the lessons. I kept repeating the patterns, and I was able to advise other people, but I was stuck in certain ways myself. And I took some time to really, honestly, truly let myself grieve. Multiple relationships, multiple wounds, and really just tried to let myself, you know, let myself feel the feelings. I had some time on my own to do this. While I was doing this, I met my husband. There was no spark for me. My eyes were just not open. You know, I was always looking to date someone older than me who would take care of me. I had had, like, three major boyfriends. One was five years older, one was 10 years older, and one was 20 years older. When I met my husband, he's seven years younger than me. He did not fit the template. He also was so available. He was. Everything was available to me. His feelings, his time, his commitment. And I kept turning him down. I didn't see him as serious in a way. Like, I thought love was something that you had to chase and earn, and he was just there, and I just didn't see it. And one of the lessons that I learned in my relationship with him is that he just kept showing up. There was something about his faith in Our relationship and me that has, we've been together almost 20 years. It has followed every turn of our relationship. When I was afraid to get married, he didn't turn away. When I was afraid to have kids, he didn't turn away. He said, molly, I know you're gonna be an amazing mother. And if you just, I know you better than you know yourself sometimes just take the leap of faith. And I did. And he's been right about all of these major areas where he had trust. That is just harder for me to trust because of so many disappointments. And he' just the greatest gift. He's, he is the best decision I ever made.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah, me too. And it, it's fascinating. There's a lot of parallels with that and in terms of my story as well and with my husband. He was like, I love you and I love loving you. And I'm just using the analogy of jumping in a pool. I want to swim with you. And if you're not ready to swim, I'm just going to have a good time and swim and you can join me if you want. And he jumped in. I'm like, oh, he's having a really good time. And I jumped in. But I'm, I'm, I'm hearing people listening to this, being like, I don't have my person that's like, has faith. And what would you share with them to know? Like it. Because it may seem different because of. And I would say it seemed different. It sounds like for both of us because of the work we did and maybe even try and test some things out that are different to see. But how would you kind of guide people into, you know, kind of knowing when to keep going with someone or when it doesn't feel like a fit for them?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Yeah, well, I think, you know, your audience, these are people that, that are doing work on themselves. You know, you guys are really working hard and I'm proud of you. And I think when you evolve, something that naturally happens is that the pool of people around you who will meet you becomes inherently smaller. Right. And I work with a lot of high achieving women who are having a hard time finding their partners. You know, and that's one thing I say, is that the pool is going to be smaller because you are self selecting and you need to meet someone who is a mutual fit that's going to be a smaller portion of the population. Right. So patience is part of it. Right. And then another piece of it is that I know that this is true for myself. Some people who become high functioning are doing so because they're treating a wound from the past. Right. In my family there was a lot of love, but there was also a lot of chaos and a lot of dysfunction. And I had three siblings, have three siblings. And there were a lot of difficulties in the family. And I felt like it was my responsibility to be sort of the good, easy one that could make my parents proud and would make my parents less stressed out.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Right.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Like at least they didn't have to worry about me. And then what I noticed is that when I started doing things well and achieving is I started getting attention. And a lot of the attention in my family went to the areas where there were problems. And so for a long time I felt unseen. So for me it was like this really unique combination of not only could I sort of ease my parents burden and help them feel like they're doing a good job, they're good parents, right. They've got a successful kid in me, but I could also get attention from them in a family where it was really, really hard to carve out some space and resources. So when you're coming at achievement from a wounded place, a lot of times there's a relational wound that hasn't been healed that your success is covering up. And I really believe in addition to the pool being smaller, that's the other main reason why sometimes high achieving women have a hard time finding their partner. Because their success is masking a relational wound that needs some attention and getting rewarded for getting rewarded. Absolutely everything around you looks great and everyone's telling you great job, but there's a gaping hole that's not being attended to.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And it's sometimes hard to see because it's everyone's rewarding it rather than highlighting the drive from the fear from the wound. And I know in terms of people always ask like, how do you choose a partner? We don't choose a partner by accident. We choose based on an unconscious wound. And so taking high achieving, let's say women, for example, maybe there was an idea another wound could be I can't rely on anyone. And so they over function, they control, they take it on and they desperately want to let go. They want to let say a man, for example, like just hold them. But they're scared because from childhood they had to be the one. Maybe the parents weren't emotionally or physically really around. And so they, they took it on. And then they will naturally match a partner. For this example, we'll say a man who is under functioning who maybe in his childhood was told he's not good enough. Had critical parents. And so he doesn't even try because he's scared that then it'll bring up his wound of not being enough. And they. They match each other like a perfect puzzle piece.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Peanut butter and jelly.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And it's like their ways of protecting themselves are the way that they're hurting each other in that relationship. And so part of it is seeing it. And it could be because, you know, you wanted to be a distraction from your parents. Like, there's different reasons why we might have become really strong or the capable one, and there are different reasons why. But the very thing that would help the couple and individuals heal the relationship is highlighting it. And it's going to be the hardest thing for that couple to do. But it's the deepest work that they could do. As she starts feeling safe, as she even, you know, heals some of this idea that she has to do it on her own, it'll give him space to also feel like, oh, he. He's inherently worthy, independent of what he does. He'll start taking more leadership. But it's. It's requiring them to grow in the exact opposite ways of why they were attracting each other.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Exactly. And this is why I love couples therapy. It's just one of my greatest passions. Because when you have a good resource, someone who can really support you in this work, and both people have to be doing it, if only one is doing it, the relationship will not survive.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And you can see that in a lot of personal development work where one person continues growing. And sometimes people join my experiences. They're like, am I going to outgrow my partner? I'm like, possibly. And that's honest. And you will. And you may find that you are feeling more whole and fulfilled, and it's not a requirement that they. Because you don't need the other person. You don't have to wait for them to heal for. For you to heal, which is also really lovely. And it may be that you want to be met in these ways because you're learning to be met by yourself and other people. And it feels so nourishing. You want that in partnership, but some people have it as a requirement and some don't.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Yeah. And people get afraid to outgrow their partner because they're imagining that outcome from the deep fear place they're in right now. They don't realize that if they do this work, the idea of losing their partner is not going to be nearly as traumatic, because you will be more prepared to tolerate that loss if it happens. And so you're like asking people to like, read the tea leaves and believe in a future that they're not able to see yet. And that's asking for a lot of, you know, you really have to trust.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah. And I'm coming back to say this woman who's really strong and she wants to let go into her partner and she's testing, let's say him, Right. We'll just keep it as that example. She's testing him like, can you hold? Essentially, I'm gonna throw some things at you to see if you really are gonna be there for me. And he's like, wait, what's happening? And okay, I'm still here. And clearly she's craving, letting go.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Yeah, surrender.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah, she wants to be held. But what advice or what. Yeah, what would you want to share with them? A strong woman that's like, I just need a strong man. What do you want to tell her?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

You have to be able to tolerate the experience of being disappointed and let down so that you can have data points to make decisions about your future. If you stay in the stuckness of over functioning and doing everything, you will never find out whether you are safe. First of all, you'll also never find out clearly that you're unsafe and you have to go. So you are keeping yourself stuck in a pattern of dissatisfaction and limbo because you are afraid of the answer. And the answer might be that you are safe and wow, you're keeping yourself from that incredible experience, but the answer might be that you're not. And you have to face that in order to make the choices you need to make. And to do that, you have to tolerate that experience.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Any relationship that is built on self sacrifice is not a relationship that will maintain or not one that I would want to. And so I love your kind of honest truth. And the strong woman is oftentimes also not just doing that in their relationship, they're also doing that at work and with their family and everywhere else. And it can just lead to burnout and dissatisfaction. Do you want to share any of your story?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

You know, I think the most recent example of this is I was over functioning a lot in my home and even in my marriage. My husband for a while was really dissatisfied with his work. He was feeling in a very stuck place. And so a lot of his bandwidth was going to that stuckness. And so I was just taking on more and more and more. I went through a really great grueling process of IVF for my second child. And so at a certain point I got to a Place where my career was thriving. I had two kids, but I was feeling like I was kind of holding everything up. And it really, really took me getting struck down by life to address this pattern. What ended up happening was actually a year ago today, I found out that I had a tumor at the base of my brain in the top of my spinal cord. And I had been through so much pregnancy losses, IVF, a pregnancy at 45, raising two kids, managing three jobs, that the signs that something was wrong were there for a long time. And it became so normalized. I just started telling myself, you know, life is hard and this is what happens. You feel pain, you don't have the energy that they used to. And one by one, I just start experiencing so many more symptoms. And it didn't help that doctors were not advocating for me at all. It had to get to the point where my hands had gone numb and I couldn't lift my left hand above like shoulder level. I stopped being able to handwrite with my right hand. I couldn't control the pen. And I went into the doctor and I said, I changed to a new doctor because I kept getting told, you have carpal tunnel syndrome. And getting sent to physical therapy, which did absolutely nothing for me. And I had no bandwidth for these appointments to do these exercises that were doing nothing for me. It was just adding more stress to my life. So I went into this new doctor and I really just lost it. I started crying and I said, I am at the end of my rope and I really need you to believe me because I'm starting to think that I have a tumor or something. And she sent me for an MRI and I did have a tumor. And when I said that to her, I didn't really think I had a tumor. Somewhere in me knew. Somewhere in me knew. But I needed to say something to her that she was going to take me seriously. And it just. Over the past year, I've realized I didn't take me seriously. I didn't take my needs seriously. I kept taking on more and more and more in my effort to be supportive to my husband who was going through a hard time. But it was. I was just like managing the symptom, you know, instead of really getting at like the root cause, which was truly my over functioning, feeling unsafe, believing that I could control everything and doing the most until I made myself so sick.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And what did you. Thank you for sharing that story. I know it's going to serve so many people. What did you feel like you would have loved to have heard at that Time.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

I don't think there's anyone, anyone could have said. I think that the universe did everything it could possibly do to open my eyes until there was nothing left except to almost kill me. And when I went into the surgery, I knew that if I didn't have the surgery, I was going to die. But I also knew that if I had the surgery, I might die because it was a very, very sensitive, dangerous surgery.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

You know, it took me being in the most, the dark night of my soul. And what happened was they told me this is a year long recovery. This is not a small thing. The nervous system is not plastic. You know, the brain is plastic, but we're talking about your spinal cord here. And it's gonna be a long recovery. And when I came out of surgery for months, I couldn't do anything.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

I couldn't take care of my children.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

I couldn't work, I couldn't feed myself, I couldn't shower, I couldn't groom myself. I couldn't do anything. And that was the hardest thing I've ever been through. I couldn't take care of anyone else or myself. I now look back at that time in my life and I think that was the most incredible gift because I had to be taken care of and I had to stop. And honestly, some of my biggest growth happened in the middle of the night in the darkness when I was in pain and everyone was sleeping and only I could sit with my pain. And I had this epiphany that nobody was coming to save me and that only I could save myself. And it completely and dramatically shifted how I approach life. Because now I know no one is coming to save me. If I'm going to have the life that I want, I have to give it to me. And the life I want is one of ease and rest. And I am no longer willing to compromise. Ease and rest. In order to achieve, there has to be a balance.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And how has that been integrating since that realization? In that moment, I know we're one year from the surgery, which is very serendipitous that we're here.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

This is not a quick fix of now. I know this truth and everything in my life is different. But I can never unsee what I have seen. And every single day I have to make choices informed by this new truth that I know I am still compelled to do too much. It didn't. Ladies, it doesn't just stop because you learned the lesson. I have to confront it every day. But now I have the tools. Now I have the self awareness to Say, oh, I'm doing that thing again. So my life just looks very different. I see many fewer clients than I used to, and I'm doing things that, you know, I'm a multifaceted person, and I'm doing the things that really set me on fire, even if they're an investment. Yeah, my passion. So I started a podcast, which I'm recording now. I never would have done that before because it wouldn't have been lucrative. You know, like, oh, I'm just getting started. Who's going to listen to that? It's going to cost so much money I'm not going to make. And now I'm like, I don't care. I'm worth it. I'm going to take some money from the job that I do very, very well, and I'm going to invest it into this thing that I'm passionate about, whether it ever makes a dollar or not. It's fun. I record on Fridays, and I'm skipping down the street on Fridays, you know, and ultimately, I believe that that's where. Just. Isn't that what we're all doing this for anyway? Like that Instagram trend? I almost forgot. It was the whole point. Yeah, Like, I can skip down the street, and there was no guarantee that I was ever gonna even be able to walk again. And for a long time, I couldn't. So I'm incredibly grateful. And every day I have a reminder that I need to keep living the lesson that I was gifted with. Otherwise, all that suffering was for nothing. And I never want to go through that again.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

I'm curious, was it hard for you to receive? Because I know when we're givers and we especially become therapists and, you know, really kept things together with our family, some of that is deep conditioning. Was there re patterning of letting yourself receive as well?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

It was really hard. And, you know, part of it is resources. I've got two kids, so not only did I need care, but my kids needed care. And, you know, they're small, so someone's gotta take them to school. You know, someone's gotta get them fed. And so a lot of the resources went to taking care of my kids. And so I think that's part of why I did end up having to spend so much time alone with my own thoughts, but it was hard for me to even let someone else take care of my kids. That was so hard because being a mom is such a big part of my identity. I worked so hard to have my daughter. I just, you know, she's two and A half. And like, I did so much to have her, you know, and she was only a year old, and I was faced with not being able to parent her. And so it was really hard to let someone else take care of them, but I just couldn't. But I knew I had to do it in order to one day be able to take care of them again. And now I can.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

I know that this is going to land for people. I think people listening, they're gonna be like, oh, I need to hear this. I need to. To let others help me to receive, to let myself have joy, to give myself permission. Were there any other unlocks or things that were helpful to give to get you there?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

You know, My whole life, one of my big wounds was that I didn't have enough access to my mom. Our family had so much, so many challenges, that even though my mom was incredibly loving and generous and selfless, there just wasn't enough of her to go around, you know, and it was very hard to access her. And I had this idea in my head that all my problems came from the fact that I couldn't be with my mom. And I realized, actually, I think the problem is that I never saw a happy mom. I never saw a mom who took care of herself. And I think that if my mom had been happy, I wouldn't have needed so much from her. I think it was that she was very wounded and I wanted to be attached to her, to almost solve and heal the wound. That was a big thing for me. It's not so much that I didn't get time with her, it's that the time that we had, she was unhappy and stressed out. And I now know without a shadow of a doubt, the best gift I can give my children is a happy mother. What a reframe.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah. And for so many parents to hear that, because I really get that the over functioning came from trying to make your parents happy. And if they're good on their own, then the children don't need to abandon self to care for them. And that role reversal and the work that you're doing to follow your joy and passion now is that healing of your lineage. And even if it doesn't logically make sense to that part of you, there's a deeper you that knows, like, this is for you and for healing it in your lineage.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

And I no longer say to my kids, you know, when they're upset that I'm leaving the house, I no longer say to them, mommy has to go work out. I no longer say to them, Mommy has to go to work. I say to them, honey, I get to go exercise now, and that's really important to Mommy. Or I say to them, I get to go be with my clients. Now, you remember Mommy works with people and help them feel better. I get to go do that now. Now it's how I genuinely feel. And it's nothing in my life anymore. Is this have to, have to, have to. And so much of my life was like, have to, have to.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah. And some of that could be the mom guilt, you know that also, like people play into. You're. You're choosing something totally separate and different from that by claiming your joy and living your value and saying like, this gets to have a space for me in my life.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

I'm so glad this is happening today. I had no idea I was gonna talk about this.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

How sacred. Yeah, I'm really honored. Yeah, thank you. And honestly, this is for me to hear. I run the same pattern. So kind of coming back to relationships, I know that people will have self sabotaging patterns that show up in relationship. Why do you think people do that? And how can they be aware when they're doing it?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

One thing is, if you keep experiencing the same relationship over and over again,

[Alyssa Nobriga]

it's not them, it's you who's the common denominator.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

And you know, I know that sounds really basic, but. But I did that, you know, and I was in a victim mindset, you know, for a while about like, wow, like men out there are afraid of commitment, you know?

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Are there no good men out there?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Yeah, exactly. I had two relationships in a row. It's so funny because they had some, they even had similar names. And really the story that I told myself when I was projecting it onto the man, what I would say is, you know, men don't wanna commit. There are no men out there that wanna commit. Men don't wanna get married. In my quiet moments when I was really in touch with my vulnerable self, I would say to myself, no, they just don't wanna commit to you. What's wrong with you? There's something wrong with you that they don't want to commit to you. And I would vacillate back and forth between projecting the wound onto them, making them the bad guy.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Blame outside and inside.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Yeah, exactly. And the fact is that neither was true. What I learned about that first relationship was that love is not enough. There has to be a level of compatibility, you know, and in that relationship, I remember when he broke up with me, he said, molly, you deserve to be with someone who is just as passionate as you are and is looking for the kind of passionate relationship that you want. That's not. I'm not comfortable with that. He's like, this is the first relationship that I've ever had that feeling in. And it makes me uncomfortable.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Wow.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

And he told me, one day you're gonna see it. That day has arrived.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Bless.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

I am so grateful to that man that he could see what I couldn't see, because he wasn't the right person. And it had nothing to do with men can't commit. And it had nothing to do with there's something wrong with me. It had to do with a basic incompatibility. He wanted a best friend that he could have great sex with.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

You know, and that sounds great, but not for me. I want someone that is a soul connection, deeply passionate, can't live without, you know, best decision of my life type of relationship. And one day I saw it. He was right. And the same in the second relationship, different story. But, you know, another lesson learned, that it wasn't about men can commit. It wasn't about, there's something wrong with me. It's that. No, there's something else that makes this relationship not right. And you need to be open to seeing it so that you can absorb the lesson and choose differently. Ask those questions up front. You can bet your ass. When I was dating and I had found this out, I was asking, what are you looking for? Long term, what kind of relationship do you want? When I was 25 and in that relationship, I was just so focused on getting chosen that I didn't want to say anything that was gonna push anyone away. So I wouldn't have dared ask a question like that. Oh, she's too much. She wants a commitment now. It's like, oh, my God, thank God I'm not dating now. Cause that would mean my husband weren't in the picture, but if I were. And to all those women who haven't found their person yet, you need to ask the questions that reveal, is this the person for me? Own your power. If asking those questions pushes that person away, great.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah. You've been spared.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

You've been spared. Yeah. Don't spend three years of your life with this person only to find out later. Ask in the beginning.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And I love with the compatibility, it sounds like it's a level of maturity. And bless this man that had it to be able to communicate that it's not personal to you. It's not even personal to him. It just wasn't a fit for what you guys were looking for. And I remember when I was learning about non negotiables, I was like, I just came up with five non negotiables. And I felt like that was a healthy number to be like, this is realistic. I don't need these things. But they're, they're like there were some things that were nice to haves, but the non negotiables were like somebody that was doing personal development work with me.

[Podcast Host/Announcer]

Who.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Somebody that could meet me spiritually and emotionally. And everyone's is going to be different. But it's not a long laundry list. It's just like, top five things that are important.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Most important things.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah. And so then it narrows it down. It's less like, oh, they ghosted me. It had something to do with me. It was like, no. First off, it was just your wounds didn't match their wounds. You don't have something to play out, not personal to you. And it could also be just a compatibility thing. Less personal, more just about your programming.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

All I was saying to myself, you know, he was giving me all the answers. He told me the truth about everything. But all I could hear in my head was, why don't you love me? You know, And I just had to get past that so I could really take in the truth of what he was saying. And it wasn't until years later.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah. And the work to really love that part of us that doesn't feel loved. And to also say, I get to be with people who really see me and love me. Yeah, yeah. Like the holding that standard as well. And so online there's a lot of conversation about red flags and toxic relationships. How do you help decipher for people when they're like challenged in a healthy way versus when it's harmful?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

I think one of the main themes is controlling. If you feel that you are being controlled, that you're not able to be your most authentic self, you're not able to live with freedom, that's a red flag to me and sometimes is a sign of abuse, you know, when it gets really, really lived out. So you need to just be asking yourself, do I get to do the things that my heart truly wants to do? If the answer is no, that's a problem right now. Of course, it's maybe hard to discern because in all relationships, compromise is required. You know, maybe I want to spend a little bit more money than my husband and we compromise about what's going on, you know, okay, so I didn't go buy that. That's not What I'm talking about, I'm talking about what your heart truly wants. You know, you need to be able to access those things and if you can't have those in your relationship, it's not though, it's not the right one.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Could be.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Back to what's important, what's the compatible match?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

And your values.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And your values.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Is this compromising my values?

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah. Where you're not, you're not abandoning yourself to try to make the relationship work because that's not a solid foundation. Yeah. And I know there's research that men benefit from marriage more than women. Can you share some of that with us?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Both in physical and mental health outcomes as well as financial outcomes. Men benefit more than women. And in fact, women in marriage actually experience physical and mental health declines overall compared to men. And you know, the sort of underlying theory behind this is that when women get married, their lives become about taking care of other people, including their husband. So the husband benefits from having someone care for them, children benefit from having someone care for them. But women pay a cost when they care for others at their own expense. Right. So there's two ways to avoid this. Right. Because I want to be in a healthy, happy marriage. I don't want to have physical and mental health declines and I really want to be married. I don't want to have to be single to be healthy, you know, so there's two things you have to do. One, you have to prioritize yourself and two, you have to choose wisely.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

So prioritize your own self care and choose a partner wisely and in alignment with you. Is that what you mean by wise? Yeah. That's good to hear. Because obviously people want to be able to, especially even women, be seen and supported in that relationship. And so I love that you just go practical with it. It. I also know that people will say like, God, I wasted years being with that person. What do you want them to know? Or what would you share with them?

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Nothing is wasted. Every mistake that you ever made is a gateway to the better life that you've been dreaming of. But there's two things that you have to do in order to make that time not wasted. And one is you have to be willing to feel the feelings of loss that come with it so that you can too absorb the lesson. You don't get to learn the lesson without feeling what it cost you. Those things go hand in hand. But if you just stay in misery without learning the lesson, then it's hard to move on. Right. It's hard to Turn that suffering into purpose, into your path. Right. There are no mistakes and nothing is wasted. Now there are consequences. Some of the relationship mistakes that I made made it so that by the time I was ready to get married and have kids, I was older. A consequence was that I had to go through IVF to have my daughter. You know, I first started trying to have her, I was 42 years old. That's a consequence. But also that suffering is part of my life and my story and how I help other women as well. I work with a lot of women who experience infertility and pregnancy loss, so that is also not a mistake.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah. And I have a very similar frame that I don't think any of it's wasted. Everybody is a mirror. Showing me how I can love myself doesn't mean I have to be with them. But how do I embrace that part of me, the both shadow and the light. And I remember I was going through leaving a partner who wasn't compatible for me before I met my husband. And I didn't see him as I wasted my time because I really was able to learn from those different experiences. But I had to move through the grief that it was almost like I had a wood for some reason. I have this image of a shed of wood in my heart that I wasn't able to access the grief until I was at a spiritual retreat. I was volunteering. And when you have 350 people doing deep work together, it will amplify anything that's stuck that was lodged that you couldn't access. And there was a moment where this grief came forward and was ready to be released. And I knew it and I jumped on the opportunity and I just got on my knees. He was a musician, so I played one of his songs and I just went there in my grief. And it only took 90 seconds to feel it all the way through. And it was like this wave just washed through my body. And I had so much love and aliveness as a result of honoring the grief. It was almost like I was on the side looking at my. My relationship with my husband, wanting to be fully present with him, but something was lodged in the way. And I didn't know it was this grief until I got on my knees. He was holding space. Bless his maturity and ability to let me grieve him and his and my ex and my husband's present. And it was like in those 90 seconds, it was like I just was 100% all in with my husband face to face and just was like, cannot wait to get Married like, it was a dramatic night and day. And so for people that think that grief is bad, I just want to invite that. There may be more magic when you allow yourself to go there. Not to drown in it, but to feel it as a sensation. Not to get stuck in the story, but to really allow it. But with a therapist or trained coach, as long as it's not big t trauma, have you can have somebody hold space for you to go there and let it wash you through and open your heart. I had never been more clear about something after that moment.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

What a beautiful story.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And it was like. It was the willingness, what you mentioned, the grief. But I'm with you. I don't think that anything was a waste. It's all teaching me, all showing me something if I use it that way.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

And isn't it so beautiful that you came to that healing through community and through the collective unconscious of a large group. People always think like, we have to heal in isolation.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And it's interesting because I think it's. I'm, you know, I. I think there's two schools of thought in relational work. You are 100% responsible on your own. And the other is like, if it happened in relationship, you heal it in relationship. I'm a yes. And like, let's have the tools to navigate because my partner may not be able to hold because they're triggered and I'm triggered. And we need to be able to bring it back to relationships. I'm just recently exploring something where it's more relational work. It's more outside in. And it feels vulnerable to bring the messy, unresolved. And because I have the tools, I know to lean back on, I love an edge. Like, I will go there. And so I'm in this exploration of. Instead of hiding or kind of doing it with a therapist or on my own, like bringing it in a safe space and trusting the intelligence of what is going to emerge. And I just did a week long of the. This I have 3 weeks over a year that I'm doing it with a group where we're going deep and they're all facilitators and lovely humans. But it's. It's edgy and beautiful and helpful.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

What a privilege to be able to do that too. You know, it's a privilege to be able to feel all of your feelings

[Alyssa Nobriga]

and to be witnessed in connection. Like, I. I didn't realize that when I felt scared, I didn't need somebody

[Podcast Host/Announcer]

to take it away.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Just being in connection helps solve some of the weight of it. And I think a lot of the times as kids, we're sent. At least for me, I was sent to go to my room. And part of what I was grieving was the lack of connection. It wasn't that I got, you know, the consequence is fine. Like, I. I understand that, but I didn't want the love removed. And so, you know, we get to parent differently now when we see it. It's like, oh, I can be in connection. And that wasn't okay.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

And this story is the only explanation for why kids don't want to go to their room. Because I don't know about you, but when I was a kid, all my toys were in my room, all my books were in my room, all my stuffed animals were in my room. Why don't kids want to go to their room? It's because they're alone, and they don't want to be alone in their difficult

[Alyssa Nobriga]

feeling, and they're rebelling against the lack of love that was removed.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Absolutely.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

And it's innocent. You know, I can see parents, you know, innocently are just, like, using manipulation or fear tactics because that's what they had.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Or they're at the end of their work.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

But then we'll default to the way we were parented. And there's opportunities to upgrade and investigate. But sometimes it's like, well, I didn't get that when I was a kid, so you can't have that. But it's like, oh, actually you can. And I get to do this differently. Yeah. But this brings me back to a question that's really popular online, or a misunderstanding, which is, I have to be fully healed before I'm in relationship. And we know that's not true. Like, relationships help us heal. How do you want to help people? People shift that perspective.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Yeah. Let's say you're dating and there's something you're getting out of the dating process that is either helping you avoid your pain or you're trying to heal kind of through that person. Right. That is a sign that maybe you want to have a little bit of time to yourself. Right. Like, I'll. Here's a classic example. You know, going in, maybe someone gets rejected, and then they want to kind of sleep around so that they can feel good about themselves again. Right. You're using another person for your own healing. That is. To me, it's like, there. That's a sign that you need to spend some time with yourself. Right. Because there. There's like a. Using another person as an object in a kind of way. Or maybe you're avoiding the feeling of being rejected by getting validation from other people who want to sleep with you, you know? But if you are actually pursuing a relationship with the goal of just giving love and receiving love, you can do that as a very wounded person, as long as you're not using another person as an object for your sort of healing. And I hope that makes sense. Do you think it does?

[Alyssa Nobriga]

Yeah, I think so, yeah. Because we do heal in relationship. I know a lot of times people think like, oh, I'm great. And then they're in relationship. They're like, where did that come from? It's just been dormant. And so. So it's like, there's. I. What I'm hearing you say is not to use the relationship to avoid, but to use whether you're single or in relationship to look at what's left to heal what's left. What's looking to be presence by yourself. Because if you're single, there's. There's gifts in that. And if you're with somebody, there's gifts in that.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

Yeah, absolutely.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

What a beautiful conversation. I just. I adore you. I'm so grateful. And the synchronicity of this day. Is there anything that we didn't cover today that you feel like would be valuable for people that is in your awareness? It may or may not be. But just in closing, if there's anything in your heart that you want to share.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

I think one of my biggest messages is that every failed relationship that you have had is leading you back to yourself. And if you want it, ultimately one day to the person that you're supposed to be with. And the two major things that you have to do are allow yourself to feel the feelings of loss, anger, betrayal, whatever comes up with that failed relationship, don't avoid it. Allow yourself to feel that. And through the feeling, you can have access to the lesson you need to learn from it. In fact, it is our failed relationships that's the gold, right. That is leading us on the path to the thing that we want. That's exactly what I talk about in my podcast that's launching, which is called Kissing Frogs. I have guests on the podcast, and they talk about their failed relation. They talk about a failed relationship and what happened and what they learned from it and how their life, themselves, and the world is different because of this relationship. I want women to stop shaming themselves for their failures and start seeing them as opportunities.

[Alyssa Nobriga]

I love this. And we'll put the links here below for your podcast. And, you know, I think that's a That's a way of looking at life. It's, it is applicable for relationships, but also business. And it's like as we use all of it for our learning, for our growth, for our healing, it becomes a lot more fun, less personal. What a gift. Thank you for being here.

[Dr. Molly Barrett]

My pleasure. It's been wonderful.

[Podcast Host/Announcer]

Thank you so much for doing this work that changes the world, starting with yourself. It truly does make a difference. And if this podcast has supported you, one of the most impactful ways to help us reach more people is to simply press the follow button. It really does help us grow and we are so grateful. You could also leave a review on Apple or Spotify and take a quick screenshot and upload it at alyssanobriga.com forward/podcast. And as a thank you gift, we'll send you one of the most important, impactful tools for transforming your fear into freedom so that you can step more fully into your potential. There is so much more magic ahead and I cannot wait to share it with you. But for now, I just want to say thank you for being a living example of what it means to walk through the world with an open heart and mind. I am so grateful that you're here and I cannot wait to see you in the next episode.