Part Two: Psychic Ability, Energy Healing & Remote Viewing: Her 100% Success Rate | Lisa Kudrow

Summary

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Mayim Bialik's Breakdown: Part Two—Psychic Ability, Energy Healing & Remote Viewing with Lisa Kudrow

Date: July 23, 2026
Guests: Mayim Bialik (host), Jonathan Cohen (co-host), Lisa Kudrow (guest)

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Episode Overview

In the second installment of their conversation with actress Lisa Kudrow, Mayim Bialik and Jonathan Cohen dive deep into intersections of consciousness, psychic phenomena, healing, and creativity. The trio candidly explores intuitive experiences, energy healing, the ongoing role of creativity in aging, and the porous boundaries between science and spirituality. With wit and vulnerability, they also touch on the creative process behind The Comeback, women in media, and the lived tension between rationality and enchantment in a skeptical world.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

Exploring Psychic Phenomena and Intuition

• Lisa's Remote Viewing Experiment
  • Lisa shares an anecdote about trying to "be with" her husband while he was away, focusing her attention during a bath. Afterwards, her husband described being in an Adirondack chair by a fire pit—details Lisa had visualized.
  • “I had an experience once with my husband… I decided he was in Joshua Tree with friends...just focus all your attention on being with Michel...I thought, okay, so I didn’t do it. He comes home. I said, ‘I actually tried to be with you.’ He said, ‘Was that Friday night?...we were sitting outside on Adirondack chairs at a fire pit.’” — Lisa Kudrow [00:10–00:55]
  • Lisa jokes she has a 100% success rate at remote viewing, describing the effort as “exhausting.”
  • Mayim and Jonathan reflect on synchronicity and the boundary between imagination, coincidence, and actual psychic ability.

The Life of Fictional Characters & the Actor’s Psyche

• Do Characters Live On?
  • Jonathan asks whether actors ever “visit” the characters they’ve played, as if they still exist in some way.
  • Mayim and Lisa admit to feeling characters return when recreating them but struggle to embody them outside their original comedic settings.
  • “It’s almost like I didn’t know how to make her exist outside of set up, set up, joke.” — Mayim Bialik [07:20]

Creativity, Reality, and Aging in Media

• Rebooting and Women's Stories

  • Discussion about the desire to reboot Blossom and how the industry resists stories about women aging.
  • “What are we being told? As women…we have a harder time wrapping our head around what happens when cute kids grow up.” — Mayim Bialik [08:24]

• The Comeback as a TV Time Capsule

  • Lisa details the impetus and structure behind The Comeback, seeing it as a metacommentary on fame, reality TV, and the shifting TV landscape.
  • She shares how later seasons integrated timely themes, like AI-written sitcom scripts and industry strikes.
    • “The only way you don’t feel devastated for this person [Valerie] is to make her an actress… and the studio’s so panicked, they’re hedging their bets… let’s have a companion reality show to go with it.” — Lisa Kudrow [10:09]
  • Valerie’s journey explores boundaries between delusion, coping, and agency—how perception can be either survival strategy or denial.
    • “What’s the difference between that and coping?” — Lisa Kudrow [29:16]

Reality Creation and Healing

• Mind-Body Connection and Placebo

  • The trio discusses Ellen Langer’s studies, which demonstrate how mindset changes physiology (e.g., hotel staff losing weight after being told their job was exercise).
    • “Because they were told it was exercise, actually lost weight.” — Mayim Bialik [41:04]
  • Lisa reflects on her husband’s belief that “we are creating our reality”—sometimes met with resistance, especially regarding illness.
    • “Why do you want to get sick?...The worst is, why did you want to get cancer?...It’s not that you wanted it, it’s just what had to happen, that’s all.” — Lisa Kudrow [43:38–44:13]

• Reiki & Energy Healing

  • Jonathan shares his entry into Reiki through family tragedy and a formative experience where his burned hand appeared to heal after his sister used Reiki “cupping.”
  • He describes Reiki as “tapping into that universal access,” channeling healing energy rather than manipulating it.
    • “You become a channel for it and it just flows freely through you.” — Jonathan Cohen [49:21]
  • The group contrasts anecdotal and clinical evidence; Mayim playfully insists on a skeptical, scientific side.

The Cosmic and the Mundane: Spirituality Meets Science

• God, Quantum Physics & Uncertainty
  • Mayim and Lisa trade insights on how quantum physics and Jewish ideas about God’s name (was, is, will be) blur boundaries between science and spiritual awe.
  • “In Judaism, there’s no word for God… All that is, all that was, all that ever will be. Holy cow.” — Lisa Kudrow [32:48]
  • “Is there anything more incredible than…you can’t know something when you try and pin it down? Unless you let the wave function collapse.” — Mayim Bialik [34:05]
  • Jonathan references former guests who advocate for “Re-Enchantment” as an antidote to a crisis in meaning—finding magic in noticing the world.

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Notable Quotes & Memorable Moments

• On Perception and Agency:

  • “We are creating our reality. We can control a little more than we thought we could. Ancient religion, spirituality, philosophy, quantum physics. It all bumps into each other.” — Lisa Kudrow [00:00]
  • “Sometimes being able to just be relaxed enough to notice the things around us, to be amazed, has such an empowering and magical influence on us.” — Jonathan Cohen [35:27]

• On Boundaries and Empathy:

  • “The hardest thing, I think, is knowing what’s yours to take on and what’s not yours, what’s somebody else’s thing.” — Lisa Kudrow [60:13]
  • “If your name’s not in the sentence, it’s not your problem.” — Mayim Bialik [61:03]
  • “It’s a boundary. Yeah, that’s an energetic boundary, too.” — Mayim Bialik [63:45]

• On Synchronicity and Psychic Experiences:

  • “You had three facts. You didn’t have one… Adirondack chair… a structure… a fire pit... there was an extra person and it was a guy. No, there were a lot of things that were right.” — Mayim Bialik & Lisa Kudrow [71:28–72:13]

• On Belief and Meaning:

  • “Why shut it down? That’s the stuff I’m more suspicious of. Why shut it down? What’s at risk?” — Lisa Kudrow [78:16]
  • “That's why, to me, I don't care whether your father is coming back, not coming back as a hummingbird represented by a hummingbird. For your mom, it's what she's thinking about him.” — Lisa Kudrow [77:18]

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Timestamps for Key Segments

• [00:10–00:55]: Lisa’s remote viewing anecdote
• [03:44–08:24]: The lived lives of fictional characters, show reboots, and women in media
• [10:09–29:16]: The Comeback—themes, Valerie’s journey, TV as time capsule, and AI in entertainment
• [29:57–32:48]: Reality creation, reframing, acceptance, and spiritual-metaphysical overlap
• [41:04]: Ellen Langer study on mindset as exercise
• [45:01–53:48]: Jonathan’s Reiki origin story and discussion of mind-body healing modalities
• [60:13–61:56]: Boundaries, empathy, and codependency; Al-Anon approach
• [71:28–72:13]: Parsing psychic ‘hits’ versus intuition and anomaly
• [77:14–78:00]: Imagination, meaning-making, and the role of belief
• [78:16–80:07]: Skepticism, shutting down inquiry, and the freedom to explore psychic phenomena

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Tone, Language & Flow

• The conversation is warm, playful, and at times irreverently intellectual.
• Lisa’s blend of skepticism and openness grounds the expansive topics; Jonathan plays reflective facilitator, while Mayim oscillates between scientific rigor and spiritual awe.
• The trio’s willingness to share vulnerable experiences—both mystical and mundane—make the episode relatable even as it delves into big questions.
• Humor, especially about awards show anxiety, “liquid courage,” and Lisa’s “100% success rate” at remote viewing, keeps the tone accessible.

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Closing Reflections

• The episode culminates by affirming the value of curiosity, non-judgment, and the playful side of not having all the answers.
• Lisa, Mayim, and Jonathan agree that both scientific and mystical modes of knowing have their place—and that the best approach to “unexplained” phenomena is open curiosity rather than closure.

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Where to Watch The Comeback

• All three seasons are available on HBO Max. [86:20]

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Summary Quote

“Well, look, it’s create your own. Choose your own adventure. I mean, it’s whatever you want.” — Lisa Kudrow [82:36]

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This episode is immensely rich for listeners interested in the intersections of science, spirituality, mental health, and creativity—offering not just insights but evocative stories, gentle challenges, and encouragement to keep seeking wonder in the unknown.

Transcript

[Lisa Kudrow]

We are creating our reality. We can control a little more than we thought we could. Ancient religion, spirituality, philosophy, quantum physics. It all bumps into each other.

[Mayim Bialik]

Correct?

[Lisa Kudrow]

I had an experience once with my husband. Not remote viewing. I was with him. I decided he was in Joshua Tree with friends where they were camping, sleeping out under the stars. I was home and I take a bath and I thought, just focus all your attention on being with Michelle.

[Mayim Bialik]

You were not on mushrooms.

[Lisa Kudrow]

No. Remember me?

[Mayim Bialik]

That's right.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Too afraid. Really focused my attention. I am with Michelle, but am I forcing it? Because I know he's at Joshua Tree. There was sort of a structure, but he's outside on sort of Adirondack chairs and a fire pit. I thought, okay, so I didn't do it.

[Mayim Bialik]

Finish the bath.

[Lisa Kudrow]

He comes home. I said, I actually tried to be with you. He said, was that Friday night?

[Mayim Bialik]

Stop it.

[Lisa Kudrow]

We went to a restaurant. We were sitting outside on Adirondack chairs at a fire pit.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Wow.

[Lisa Kudrow]

And I went, okay, so I did do it.

[Jonathan Cohen]

So you have the ability.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I did it once.

[Jonathan Cohen]

But you have 100% success rate.

[Mayim Bialik]

I could be in my bedroom tonight and you might be in my bedroom with me.

[Lisa Kudrow]

But I won't be. I promise.

[Mayim Bialik]

You like me too much. I do.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Best thing that's ever happened to you.

[Mayim Bialik]

Financially.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Go easy.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Sold my car on Carvana. Amazing offer.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Really. I hit 200 on a scratcher.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Did the scratcher come to your house and hand you a check?

[Mayim Bialik]

No.

[Jonathan Cohen]

How many scratchers did you hit to get that? I hit a button on Carvana.com once.

[Mayim Bialik]

Okay, that's fair.

[Jonathan Cohen]

It's like the lottery, except you always win.

[Mayim Bialik]

Not like the lottery at all, actually.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Exactly. Inexplicably good offers worth bragging about. Sell your car today on Carvana. Pick up fees may apply. My MB Alex breakdown is supported by Helix Sleep.

[Mayim Bialik]

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[Jonathan Cohen]

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[Mayim Bialik]

Hi, I'm Mayim Bialik.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And I'm Jonathan Cohen.

[Mayim Bialik]

And welcome to part two of our conversation with Lisa Kudrow, the multi award winning actress. Star of Friends, she played Phoebe for a decade as well as so many other things. She is also the star of the Comeback, a series in three seasons told over almost 20 years. Turns out she's a huge super fan of Mayim Bialik's Breakdown. Reached out to me, slid into my DMs on Instagram and told me that she's a huge fan and just wanted to talk about her favorite episodes. I asked her if she would come do it in person and she agreed. It's an incredible conversation. We cannot wait for you to hear part two of our conversation with Lisa Kudrow. Break it down.

[Jonathan Cohen]

There's something that I have tried to ask other actors before and I've been shut down and it sounds a little crazy, but I really believe it.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Okay.

[Jonathan Cohen]

If I were, if I had your experience with a variety of characters that I had had a long relationship with, I believe that those characters would still exist somewhere and that I would visit them sometimes because I would be like, know them so intimately for so long that in a quiet moment, if I was by myself tidying my bedroom, I could sort of close my eyes and be like, where is this character right now? And like not only do they exist because like so much of their energy was created, but so many people have a relationship with them. It's like they can't just be closed off in a box and like discarded. And if I was the person who had the relationship with them as them, it's not like I would be having a. It would be like I was having a conversation with a friend in, in some way.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right?

[Jonathan Cohen]

I've tried to ask that question and everyone's like, oh yeah, I just kind of move on with the rest of you Know my career. But I don't believe that.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Well, I mean. But I do. Do you have the same answer? Like, did you think about Blossom?

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah. Like, I played. I was thinking I played a character for five years, then I played a character for nine years, then I played a character for three years.

[Jonathan Cohen]

But if the circumstances arised where you were by yourself, could you close your eyes and bring that character back in a way and be like. And if you were to have sort of like a curious investigation or like a conversation where you're like, hey, what's been going on? I think that character would sort of speak and be present with you.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Interesting. I mean, look, I. You know, I might have to bring a character back soon because they're talking about Romy and Michelle, and I played Michelle Weinberger. I'm 60 something. Okay. So I don't.

[Mayim Bialik]

Do you know where she is?

[Lisa Kudrow]

I've seen a script, so. But that's the story.

[Mayim Bialik]

But in here, do you know where she is?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right. I mean, I do. From back then. Yeah. And I'm trying to rationalize. I mean, there are women in their 60s that still have vocal fry or, you know, sound like a Valley Girl and are innocent and try to sound.

[Mayim Bialik]

I guess it's interesting because I think also when I brought back Amy for the finale of Young Sheldon, Jim and I were asked to recreate these characters, but not in a sitcom format.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Mayim Bialik]

Meaning it was. It's a single cam.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Mayim Bialik]

That was actually very strange because my character lived with not just a laugh track. It's not about that.

[Lisa Kudrow]

No, I know.

[Mayim Bialik]

It lived with the energy of hundreds of people, and a lot of the things that all of us would do were something we didn't rehearse all week. But when the audience is there and you can ride that laugh and you can get a second laugh and you can give a turn of your body and get. Like. That stuff only exists in this, you know, dynamic of a live performance.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Mayim Bialik]

So it was very strange. And the voice came right back to me and, like, the posture.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Right.

[Mayim Bialik]

Like, what would amy be, like, 15 years later?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Mayim Bialik]

Or whatever it is. But there was something about the rhythm that. It's almost like I didn't know how to make her exist outside of set up, Set up joke. Tell me, Chuck, Lori, what to do. You know.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right. No, I would be plagued with. This is gonna be very disappointing just because. Right. I mean, it's a different. It's a different energy level and. Ooh. It's just. This is. I don't know how this is gonna

[Mayim Bialik]

work, I'd be very nervous and actually.

[Lisa Kudrow]

How'd it go? I guess, well.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah, I mean, it went well. And, you know, for me, the fun was also like, what would Amy wear? What would she wear as a grownup? Right. She's not gonna wear exactly the same thing, but, you know, we still kept with a pencil skirt. It was like a sensible loafer instead of an orthopedic shoe, you know, And I, I. The. The jewelry I chose, I chose a single pearl hanging because I thought that's what Sheldon would buy her, that if she said, buy me something nice, he'd be like, one pearl. Right. Like, it just seemed.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Oh, there was also a tiara.

[Mayim Bialik]

Right. That's true. You know, we've talked about Dawn Rio, who created Blossom. We wanted to reboot Blossom, not as a sitcom. We wanted to bring it back as a single cam. And not to say, like, it's a drama, but to say, what would it look like when someone grows up?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right. Very different energy.

[Mayim Bialik]

And life is not always a sitcom. There's not always a laugh track to what happens in your life. And we thought that would be this really interesting way also for women of a certain generation to say, yeah, what's it like when you're out of junior high and high school? We have been told there is not interest for that character, not in a sitcom format. And I thought, what an interesting statement. And, of course, I have to make it philosophical. What are we being told? Right. What are we being told as women? Right. This is how we want you. We want you perky and dancing and smiling and fun. And we have a harder time wrapping our head around what happens when cute kids grow up.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Mayim Bialik]

When we all grow up, like, what is this next phase of life like? And it almost feels like this strange irony. That's something I wanted to do creatively. I can't, because the exact reason that I want to do it right. Well.

[Lisa Kudrow]

But it might be an interesting movie. Or, you know, as I call those, a one off.

[Mayim Bialik]

That's what. Yeah, that's what we've talked about.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I don't think it's women and don't want to see women. I think it's. Don't want to unravel a happy ending. Cause you would have to if you're now going to explore. Really, there's a fantasy about when something's over. Like, oh, good. So hopefully everything just went well, you know, just, like, end of everything.

[Mayim Bialik]

That's a perfect setup for. Can you talk about the comeback?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Oh, right, yeah.

[Mayim Bialik]

Can you talk about something that is spanning.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Oh, I'm never leaving. And we'll order lunch, whatever you need. Then we'll go into dinner.

[Mayim Bialik]

No, but I wonder if you can talk about, you know, creating something that is spanning not just time, but phases of your life.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Cause the comeback started right after friends friends wrapped January 2004. We shot the pilot November 2004, which meant Michael and I were writing it in the fall, so. And that was the beginning of reality tv. There were no housewives yet. There was Survivor, there was Amazing Race, and those shows to me were the end of civilization. I thought, you know, these people are signing up, I think, because they just want to be seen and get attention or be famous. The five of us, the six of us, wow. Me and five others went through that and that was hard. And we had each other, you know, to try to ground us and support with that. I don't know if they know what they're in for. It's not good. Also Survivor, that ending, they all voted the most despicable guy for being despicable, made him a good player and got the reward.

[Mayim Bialik]

Sounds like capitalism to me.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Well, I don't, but I mean, historically this country has always been merit based and if you can be decent about it, you win the prize. And that woman was decent about it. And that was the most depressing thing I'd ever seen.

[Mayim Bialik]

It was a real shift, kind of

[Jonathan Cohen]

a signal of what was to come.

[Lisa Kudrow]

What was to come? Yeah. You didn't ask for all this.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yes, we did.

[Mayim Bialik]

No, but that's a great framing, though.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah. And then Amazing Race first season, and there's a married couple and the challenge was eat spicy soup. It's so spicy that they're vomiting. They can't choke it down. So there's a bucket next to them. And it's the first time I had ever seen people crying, choking and vomiting while the husband is screaming at her, get it down so we can move on.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And this is entertainment now.

[Lisa Kudrow]

And that's entertainment. So to me also it was, oh, this is the end. This is terrible.

[Jonathan Cohen]

It's only divulged from there. That was the high point.

[Lisa Kudrow]

But it. No, because there were guidelines then. This was. There were unions, weren't involved. There was no duty of care, if that's what that is called. So, yeah, I mean, but anyway, and. And there were no housewives yet who seemed to have a plan and knew what they were doing. I guess they do. I think they do. Anyway, so I just thought this would be. This is something. This is something to do. And and the only way you don't fall, feel devastated for this person is make her an actress who's gonna be on a sitcom. But the studio and Michael Patrick King and I then worked out and the studio is so panicked, they're hedging their bets, they'll do a sitcom, but let's have a companion reality show to go with it. And this actress who has tunnel vision about like just, this is great, another opportunity gonna be back in the spotlight. Okay, here we go. You know, she's just. That's all. It's sort of like a narrow focus and not seeing that the producer, played by Laura Silverman phenomenally well, is there to manipulate her and get footage and just try to make it the best entertainment show. Entertainment show, yeah. And then you have the showrunner, played by Lance Barber, who played the father of young Sheldon. And that's why I'm here. And he is so abusive and punishing and in pain because he wrote a show about four sexy single women in their 40s that the network said make it more like Friends. Okay, so they do, but you got to keep the 40 year old woman somehow because that's the reality show. We need figure it out. So, yes, of course his head is going to explode. And the other writers in our writers room knew that abusive showrunners were in abundance. Okay. I was not drawing on Friends. I have to say this because it keeps coming up so close to when I finished. If anything, the only thing that was like about Friends to me was Juna and Valerie, the young, beautiful actress. And that there wasn't really competition, you know, and that she was sweet. The only person who was really sweet to Valerie was that person. Because that was my experience on our show. I swear to God, we really loved each other.

[Mayim Bialik]

So.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah, and I didn't really know about. There was a lawsuit with the friends from writer's assistant. And I didn't know the details. I just knew that there was one and I wasn't sure. And at the time I honestly thought, yeah, that's a writer's room, you know.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah. The lawsuit, just to frame it a little bit, there was a lawsuit regarding language and behavior in a writer's room, which unfortunately was ruled. It went to the Supreme Court, was ruled, you know, par for the course

[Lisa Kudrow]

essentially for that job, the state, maybe

[Mayim Bialik]

that's what I meant.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah, that, you know, well, that's what it is. And that is how we felt like, okay, just looking at the world, Here are the rules of engagement. And this is what society is. So this is what you have to work with and it's hard to navigate. Okay.

[Jonathan Cohen]

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[Mayim Bialik]

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[Jonathan Cohen]

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[Mayim Bialik]

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[Jonathan Cohen]

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[Mayim Bialik]

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[Jonathan Cohen]

Oh my gosh.

[Mayim Bialik]

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[Jonathan Cohen]

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[Mayim Bialik]

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[Jonathan Cohen]

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[Mayim Bialik]

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[Lisa Kudrow]

Boy, fascinating. Yes, it would be.

[Mayim Bialik]

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[Lisa Kudrow]

Yes.

[Mayim Bialik]

But anyway, go ahead.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right. Well, I think thank God because it, I mean ultimately people had to treat people with respect in a workplace, so that part's great. Sorry about the fallout from other things, you know, that everything got really sensitive and almost impossible. But it's a time capsule of how much abuse, discomfort. And we deliberately had Valerie just determined to get what she wants. So she would speak up and say, you know, that joke might be offensive. You know, you're saying Korean barbecue. Don't think the audience is going to like it. You know, you see a basket of puppies, I see Korean barbecue. So, you know, and she's saying, you're not going to like it. And Jim Burrows plays Jim Burrows, the director and he's, and he says, you can't tell a bunch of 30 year old writers that their joke's not going to work. Let the audience tell them. And at the time it's, yeah, he's right. What's wrong with her? Doesn't she know to keep her mouth shut? And that was our joke.

[Mayim Bialik]

You were ahead of your time though.

[Lisa Kudrow]

We were kind of just reporting what was. There was no laugh trap. There's no music to tell you, you know, this part's funny. This part is serious. You know, we weren't doing that. So it just became sort of a time capsule of this is how it was and ended up making people feel really bad watching it. Really uncomfortable. It was cringe, which shocked me. It just, I didn't know why until later. Bill Maher was commenting, someone made a joke about someone, you know, and it wasn't fair because the person was disabled. And you know, you can't, you can't make fun of a victim. And I went, women are victims. Is that what happened? Because women are still victims. Oh, that's depressing. I thought we were all the same. Shoot. Yeah.

[Mayim Bialik]

Can you also talk about what it's like to do three seasons this many years apart? Because I don't know that I've ever known a show to do this and to do it so well.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Thank you. What's fantastic is 10 years later when we're asked to do season two cause we got canceled, right Immediately. Someone at HBO really uncomfortable. But it's a different time. The TV landscape is completely different. There aren't as many 22 episodes of a multi camera show. It's single camera dramedy comedy because the concept is funny, but they're no jokes. And so, yeah, so we're setting, we're putting it in that setting. And by the way, the number of writers you need just got cut in half because you don't need 12 to 15 writers in a writer's room for 22 episodes. This is 13 episodes. And then we have our Valerie. This time we're looking at her marriage and this reality. She's back on this now it's a doc series going to be or a document that Jane's doing. And she's on an HBO show. So it's very meta. Yeah. And this time we have her confronted with actual personal. Her hairdresser, who's her big support and closest thing to family next to her husband, has cancer and he's sick and she's at the Emmys. That's how that one ends. She's at the Emmys, which is everything to her. She gets nominated for an Emmy. Come on. And he can't go because he wasn't feeling well. And she's kind of separated from her husband right now at a big fight. And she sees, she gets a text that her Mickey collapsed and is in the hospital. And she's sitting there at the theater and she can't sit there. She said, let me just go call and see if I can find out. And she leaves the cameras. That's the first time we're seeing Valerie without reality cameras on her. She leaves the cameras and realizes she can't go back in that theater because she can't not know what's going on with him. She just can't. And goes to the hospital. And it felt to people like, oh, she like Pinocchio became a real boy. You know, she became an actual human. So third season. And it's daunting to do this third season because people thought that was the best ending for the thing.

[Mayim Bialik]

Like, oh, okay, there's more.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Okay, well figure it out. But Michael Patrick King said, okay, we couldn't think of anything, you know, I don't know what would be big enough now it's like an event. It has to be. And Michael said she gets the lead in a multicam. Her favorite thing, which is great. But it's the first one written by AI and went perfect. That's exactly the meat grinder she would throw herself into.

[Mayim Bialik]

That's hilarious.

[Lisa Kudrow]

It's good. And we had to do some research and talk to people. Keeping it just to entertainment for the most part. Keeping it to writing because yeah, could easily happen.

[Mayim Bialik]

So I've heard.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I mean, commercials are probably especially non union commercials, you know, things I'm sure are being done. And it's Valerie. So she's not looking at the big picture. What does this mean for humanity? She is just against it at first because the writers are gonna hate me. That's what that whole strike was about. And her husband, who's you know, a business guy. He's like a finance guy. Well, about a little more than that. It was about streaming. She's like, no, I was there. I know. I spent a day with them on the line. And, you know, that's the villain. AI's the villain. So I can't have a meeting about a show like this. And then she realizes, well, I better. Because she just did a film she thought was going to be terrible experience on an indie film. Like, all right, someone's offering me something, so let's go at least see. And the head of the studio, played by Andrew Scott, he's the best actor alive, I would say, right now. He lets her know, oh, no, we have writers. Doesn't tell her, as beards have to have writers. Yeah. And it's okay with. And, you know, Valerie's just looking for. It's okay. Like, someone's giving her permission. Good, done. But because the writers are beards, they're not going to participate in the writing. Jim Burrows agrees to direct. He just wants to see what this thing is. Okay. And the end. He wants to see what this is. And then says, yeah, it's never going to be great. They're not engaged. Too bad. Good part for you. And it's also, yeah, an AI picked her to do it. So, yeah, so there are practical issues with AI. It still hallucinates. So there's that. And she's realizing one reluctantly, she's now the only one in charge, and who cares? Number two, she realizes we need human writer. We need two or three human writers. Because, yes, it might be fast and spit out a bunch of jokes, but you still need the human to decide which joke is going to be good. And then if anything goes wrong, as it goes along, there's a studio paywall that it hits because they're doing too much with AI. And so, yeah, now you only get to use this much of it. So we need a human writer, and no one will listen. And so it becomes about, like, that's the message. It's not pro AI, it's not anti.

[Mayim Bialik]

You know, it's the reality, though, of what we're dealing with.

[Lisa Kudrow]

That's what we meant it to be.

[Mayim Bialik]

I think in each of the seasons, as you're describing them, that you've been able to touch on what's in the zeitgeist. Where are we?

[Lisa Kudrow]

It's a time capsule.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah, for sure.

[Lisa Kudrow]

But every show, it turns out, is a time capsule.

[Jonathan Cohen]

I just don't know that there's ever been a show that has had the ability to touch time in such a unique way because of how spaced out the seasons are, which is unbelievable.

[Lisa Kudrow]

So it's a time capsule for the television landscape. And then what we also wanted to do was show that the Valerie that you felt so badly for saw her as a victim or some witless victim, isn't. She was creating her own reality the entire time. That's how she was able to keep going. And it looked delusional, or she's in denial. And what's the difference between that and coping? Yeah, unless you're headed for something very dangerous. Actually physically dangerous. But what's the difference? It doesn't matter.

[Jonathan Cohen]

There's also a through line, both in the comeback and in your experience on Friends and through many of these episodes, about the creation of our own reality. Right. It's like when you talked about your comeback character, maybe describe the end and that end scene that you shared with us at the beginning. Because there's a reframing of what everyone else's expectations are. Right. Even with your son, if you had said, well, the doctor knows better than me, and so I'm gonna just accept whatever they say, that is a frame of your reality.

[Lisa Kudrow]

And let me be fair, though. With my son, there were moments where I went, okay, shit, I guess, oh, my God, watched Rain man and went, is that what's gonna happen? No. And it wasn't. But, you know, sure, yeah.

[Jonathan Cohen]

But taking even what she said and then just being able to evaluate with a grain of salt versus this is what I have to do.

[Lisa Kudrow]

But I think it's important for people to know that even if you are pretty clear on something, it's not every second and every minute for sure. It's just that luckily the doubt is momentary, so don't feel too bad or

[Jonathan Cohen]

that there's another way of seeing something. Even getting fired from Frasier, you can see that in one particular way, or you can start to say, wait, there may be more information. And I think all the podcasts are like, maybe there's just more here than

[Lisa Kudrow]

we're actually realizing after something unpleasant happens. Right. And then it turns out okay. Just remember, it turns out okay is the thing that you don't need to fret, butcher yourself too much. You don't need to suffer too much. It's gonna be okay. And I really. I don't know if this would be again. Here I go again. This might be really stupid, but even you embark on some creative endeavor that maybe I'm not paying enough attention to this aspect of it or going over the script with a fine tooth comb. Sometimes you're compelled to, sometimes you're not. Sometimes it doesn't work out, sometimes it doesn't thank God when it hasn't worked out. I have to say, and how nice when things did work out. But just trusting, it's okay. Like, you'll know when you need to put the effort in there. You'll know when you need to put the effort in there.

[Mayim Bialik]

So God has two answers. Yes and not. Now I've got something better.

[Lisa Kudrow]

The thing that struck me the most with truth was, I think it was like, James Glatfelder, oh, my God, I love him. Yes.

[Mayim Bialik]

That was an amazing speaker. That was an amazing conversation.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Other things, talking about ancient religion, spirituality, philosophy, it all bumps into each. And then quantum physics, it all bumps into each other. And it reminded me, in Judaism, there's no word for God. There's no hashem. You can say. You can't. There's no name because it's nameless, which sounds a lot like a field of information. Also, a lot of times it's translated to all that is all that was. All that ever will be. Holy cow.

[Mayim Bialik]

I've brought that up. I've said that.

[Lisa Kudrow]

You have?

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah, I've talked about it. That. The fact that one of the most common names for God in the, you know, that we use in, like the Old Testament, you can't pronounce it right. You're not allowed to pronounce it right. And so even the initials, you have to, like, break them up. Or when you write it, we don't write it. And it's an acronym for was, is, and will be. And that, like this whole. This notion that even when you try and understand something that's bigger than you, you. You can't pin it down, which is a lot like a particle and its wave function. Right?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yes.

[Mayim Bialik]

You cannot pin it down.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I'm saying yes, which I understand.

[Mayim Bialik]

No, but. But the collapse of the wave function gives you one point. But you know the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle, you can't know the location and the speed of a knot like that. To me, like, that's divine. And when people would say, how are you a person of faith and a person of God? I'm like, look at the Heisenberg Uncertainty Principle. Is there anything more incredible than. Then you can't know something when you try and pin it down. Unless you let the wave function collapse.

[Lisa Kudrow]

You know, one's belief in. Or faith isn't in the story of Sodom and Gomorrah, you know, like, and lot.

[Jonathan Cohen]

The other thing from the Gladfelder interview that has stuck with me and we sort of reviewed as we were prepping for this conversation is his notion that the crisis of meaning that so many people are facing, the solution to that is actually in Re Enchantment. And this idea of Re Enchantment actually I think connects back to childhood, to the play to play, to creativity, to recognizing that there are many ways towards an end goal doesn't have to be so serious. And again, I'm not saying we don't have to work hard, we do. But sometimes being able to just be relaxed enough to notice the things around us, to be amazed has such an empowering and magical influence on us.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And we realized that, you know, Dr. Ellen Langer loved. She actually has the same idea, right? Yeah. Redefining mindfulness as being aware and noticing literally the little moments of Aha. That we can get by simply like I never noticed something in my yard before on my walk before that had the impact on our physiology is very similar to what Gladfelder is talking about in terms of Re Enchantment. Mind Bialix Breakdown is supported by Superpower

[Mayim Bialik]

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[Jonathan Cohen]

After you sign up, they'll ask you how you heard about Superpower. Tell them Mayimbialics Breakdown sent you to support the show Mind Bialix Breakdown is supported by Shopify.

[Mayim Bialik]

How many times have you heard now's the best time to start your business? But also it's summer and that feels like the most overwhelming time of all. We get it. It felt completely overwhelming when we got our podcast off the ground, but it turned out to be a great decision. And the next great decision we made was to use Shopify for our merch. Their expertise, easy to use platform and so many helpful tools makes the process simple and stress free. Making that leap is possible when you've got a partner like Shopify on your side to help. Shopify will simplify your checkout process so more customers finish their purchase or if they need more time when they come back, their details are saved. One tap and they're done. Shopify handles the setup and checkout so you've got more time to focus on growing your business. And like you don't want to spend your time fixing mistakes, you want to be spending your time in the sun, enjoying those precious summer moments with the people that you love. Shopify powers millions of businesses worldwide, from household names like Gymshark and Mattel to small businesses just getting started to our podcast with Shopify. Nothing stands between your idea and a real business, so go make it one. If you're ready to stop putting off your business and start hearing, then you're ready for Shopify. Start your free [e-mail] breakdown today.

[Jonathan Cohen]

That's shopify.com breakdown.

[Mayim Bialik]

You heard that right? Start your free trial [e-mail] Breakdown My

[Jonathan Cohen]

imbialics breakdown is supported by no CD.

[Mayim Bialik]

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[Lisa Kudrow]

Yes.

[Mayim Bialik]

And that, I mean she's one of the strongest cases. And this was in the 70s also for a woman at that time. Right. To be doing this kind of research. One of the experiments was the chambermaids, which is what we used to call people who worked in hotels and changed the sheets and stuff. And they did an experiment with these chambermaids where they told, they told they had half of them as a control group where they just changed the beds and did the things and they had to weigh themselves and see how much they weighed. And the others, they said, guess what? The work that you do as a chambermaid, it's basically exercise because you're like putting the sheets and that's like doing a squat when you're carrying things and you're carrying things. And those women from doing nothing more than their job when they were told it was exercise, actually lost weight.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah.

[Mayim Bialik]

And it was statistically significant. It was published in like a peer reviewed journal and blah, blah, blah, all the things. But she also did this study where they brought, I believe older men right in their 80s to a setting where they made it look like basically they

[Jonathan Cohen]

brought them to a hotel.

[Mayim Bialik]

A hotel and they designed it like it was 30 years prior. It was the music, the food, like everything, the style, the movies there, tv and they, I mean all their physiological markers for blood pressure, like all these things, weight, fitness, everything improved. It's unbelievable.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Alex Graham, who created who do youo Think youk Are? Did that.

[Mayim Bialik]

Oh.

[Lisa Kudrow]

As a show.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Wow.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I Think it was a one off. He also did Colonial House, and those are. Those were fantastic experiments. I mean, you know, but yeah, he. He first told me about that because he said, yeah, we're doing really interesting, incredible. And said, and on our show, too, you could see there was improvement. Yeah. Like, he documented. That's amazing version of that.

[Mayim Bialik]

That's amazing.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah.

[Jonathan Cohen]

I mean, that opens just like this rabbit hole. Right. Like, what is the intention that we bring to everything that we're doing?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yes.

[Jonathan Cohen]

If we have that self consciousness, if we're terrified of speaking up, what is that going to do to our physiology? What does that do to our ideas? How open and creative can we be?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right. Yes, exactly. I mean, I don't know what to say other than it's true.

[Jonathan Cohen]

I'm telling myself that podcast is great exercise.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Well, it is. I mean, and I'm telling myself that, you know, I can have some chips if I'm so busy, and then guess what? I can. And I haven't gained weight. And if I tell myself, oh, you've eaten a lot of chocolate today. But I'm so happy. But I've eaten a lot of chocolate today and two pounds more on a scale.

[Mayim Bialik]

That's right.

[Lisa Kudrow]

And like, two pounds, I didn't even eat two pounds of chocolate. How did that happen? You know, it's true, all that stuff. It's. So we are creating our reality and physically, too. Yeah. And I mean, people have always. It's kind of annoying when someone. My husband used to say, because he's always been like, what we're talking about. Okay. He's always been aware that we can control a little more than we thought we could, and there's impact and thoughts have impact and all that. And he would say, if I got sick, why do you want to get sick? And I would want to punch him.

[Jonathan Cohen]

When you're sick, no one wants to hear that.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right. And the worst is, why did you want to get cancer? You know, he didn't say that. He didn't say that. But that's the thought that no one dares say that is the most punishing thing. And so what I say is, it's not that you wanted it, it's just what had to happen, that's all. And he's always said, and I never believed him. I thought it was so stupid. When it's your time, it's your time. And I've come to honestly believe that.

[Mayim Bialik]

Do you mean in life or in death?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Both. All of it. All of it. I mean, when it's your time, to figure it out. You'll figure it out. If there's something you need to do, or you need to wake up from something or release yourself from something you've been punishing yourself over. When it's your time to do it, you do it, or you don't. I don't know. It doesn't matter.

[Mayim Bialik]

It's a very peaceful perspective. It really is.

[Lisa Kudrow]

It is. I try to remind myself of that. But you. But here's my. I have two questions.

[Mayim Bialik]

I was going to say, do you have any questions for us before we say goodbye?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Oh, well, you should at some point. You might have something else to do.

[Jonathan Cohen]

I have nothing. I'm just exercising through the podcast.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Me neither. Okay. Where do I start? Okay, you're a Reiki practitioner.

[Jonathan Cohen]

I am.

[Lisa Kudrow]

How and when did you start that?

[Jonathan Cohen]

So this is. Look.

[Lisa Kudrow]

No. What? Yes, yes.

[Mayim Bialik]

It's a great question.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And you know what has been amazing about this conversation for me is your openness about feeling uncomfortable about specific questions. And Reiki has been one of those topics that I've always been almost ashamed to talk about because there are so many different versions of it. And when I was growing up, it was this, like, weird thing that wasn't publicized or talked about. And, like, when I tried to explain it to people, they were like, you know, this again, is almost 25 years ago. Oh, in, you know, suburban Toronto. Suburban. You know, not. Not overly open Toronto.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And people are like, what are you talking about? Like, this is so weird and strange,

[Lisa Kudrow]

what happened to you.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yeah, exactly.

[Lisa Kudrow]

You're so smart and promising.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yeah. And it was, like, weird. And, you know, I'll. Anyway, so the short version of how that happened was it was family tragedy. My. My sister had extreme health problems from the time she was very young. At, like, 11. She had had back surgery. She had a ski accident, a water ski accident. And her level of physical pain after that far surpassed the actual accident itself. And over the years, she had fibromyalgia. She couldn't walk up and down the stairs for a while. My brother, like, when she came down for dinner, she would, like, come down on her butt and, like, scooting down the stairs, and then he would have to piggyback her back up, up the stairs. And she was very sick and saw every different type of specialist at the same time. Years. You know, she's six years older than me. My brother is three years older than me. My brother was injured in a car accident and left with a traumatic brain injury. And at that point, she.

[Mayim Bialik]

He was in a coma.

[Jonathan Cohen]

He Was in a coma.

[Mayim Bialik]

Extensive injury.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yeah, very extensive injury.

[Mayim Bialik]

It was your desire to see your brother heal in a way that doctors were basically saying, we don't necessarily know if he's ever going to walk, talk, communicate.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yes. And that was a little bit past, but sort of the way I got to Reiki was that I saw my sister have a drastic transformation in her health after it cratered after my brother's accident. So, like, the stress and the family stress of my brother being in the hospital only made her physical condition worse. So, like, there was these parallel tracks of two injuries. And years after my brother's accident, my sister dropped out of business school and, like, started changing her life and worked at a health food store and started doing yoga and started basically looking at all the psychosomatic stress aspects of her disease and eventually started to get out of a wheelchair and be able to walk and ended up backpacking around the world. And, you know, she caveats that story by saying that, you know, she walked cautiously. You know, she wasn't, like, running up mountains, but, like, her body was strong enough to be able to do that. And so one day she's at the kitchen table while my parents are away, and it's like, I'm throwing parties as I do, and I'm 17 years old, and I go and reach into the toaster because I've made myself a snack, and I singe three fingers on my right hand on the toaster oven grill. I go to put them under cold water, and she's like, why don't you let me cup your hands for you? And I don't know what Reiki is at this time, but I see the blister starting to form on my hands, and I. She's. And I'm like, what are you talking about? She's like, just sit down. So she puts my fingers in her hands, and I'm, like, joking with her because we knew something, she was up to something. You know, she was a vegetarian, and we thought that was crazy, right? And we didn't know what yoga was. And I'm like, do I have to chant? You know, what do I have to do? She's like, just sit there and be quiet. And I could feel my fingers pulsing and throbbing. And 10 minutes later, the blisters were almost gone. And I was like, well, that's pretty cool. Like, how did you do that? And she's like, well, she tells me it's Reiki. And I'm like, cool.

[Lisa Kudrow]

But is there an intention she has while she's cupping or. I know, now I'm asking you to explain Reiki.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Well, I can explain Reiki, which is. And I think this is true with all different forms of energy healing. You're kind of tapping into that universal access and you become a channel for it and it just flows freely through you.

[Lisa Kudrow]

That on one, an early podcast where. And that's how it can be remote.

[Mayim Bialik]

That's the idea. Yeah.

[Jonathan Cohen]

So that's why it's pulsing. And. And the body then is, you know, the recipient is basically doing what it's the natural function of the body, which is to expedite whatever healing process it is.

[Lisa Kudrow]

But that's a big idea.

[Jonathan Cohen]

It's a really big idea. It's like, well, if you take away the limits of whatever the issues are, then it has its, you know, our natural want is to sort of come back to some form of equilibrium.

[Mayim Bialik]

I don't mean to be a party pooper, but the, the pulsing may have also been from the injury and not necessarily the Reiki, but I'm not supposed to say that.

[Lisa Kudrow]

But.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yes, that's true.

[Mayim Bialik]

I'm just saying.

[Lisa Kudrow]

You've never felt pulsing. I've never felt waves.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

In exchange.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah. But I'm saying in this case, we can't necessarily say Reiki caused those sensations that he was feeling because it could have been that he had singed his hands and that was the throbbing.

[Lisa Kudrow]

It could have been.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And the scientist in the room will say that this is an anecdotal account. The blisters may not have been as extreme as I remember them. I remember them extreme. I remember them being decreased after that happened. What was the mechanism? All I know is that a week later I'm in a basement of the woman who taught my sister because there happened to be a class and he's a teenager and I'm a teenager.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yes.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And she's. It was a level one Reiki class and I had to agree to finish the class if my parents agreed to pay for me to go because I had a history of signing up for things and then dropping out. And I thought I was going to learn some sort of secret spell that I could say that would create miraculous healing. And it turned out that that is not the case at all.

[Lisa Kudrow]

God bless you.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yeah, that's what I thought at 17. And I'm like sitting there being like, they're talking about energy and this and clearing yourself and this is so slow and boring. And this woman talks a lot. And it was a four day class and on the final day, I'm doing. And you receive and you give sessions as a practitioner learning how to do this. And on the fourth day, I'm treating a woman who's lying on a table. My hands are over her head, and there's this pulsing in my hand that I don't understand. And it's extremely strong, and it's kind of undeniable. And my hand is sweating and pulsing, and I'm like, maybe this is what, for the last four days, this woman is talking about. About energy. And I'm like, that's weird. How does that happen? Because if everything she just described about, you know, this system of healing and this energy flowing through us and the body doing the thing, and I'm like, well, that isn't explained in anything that I've grown up understanding. And so I left that that weekend, and I was just extremely curious. And for the next four years, I just did as much of it as humanly possible.

[Lisa Kudrow]

That's starting at 17. Wow. Okay. Oh, you started that early?

[Jonathan Cohen]

And I became an assistant to her. And I started pretty much twice a month, was assisting classes that she was teaching. And I just saw all these people. You know, some of the classes were 20 people, some of them were smaller. And then you have, like, multiple tables of these people who are, like, they're lying down, and all of a sudden there is something that emerges from them that is usually highly emotional, highly cathartic. Screaming, crying, sweating, pain that starts and then dissipates. And all of a sudden, you're starting to map that everyone is holding something that you would otherwise not know. And your hands can have an intelligence to sort of go to those places and find those things, and then you start to incorporate. Well, distance is also possible. You can tap into the same stuff from a distance.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And as you start to work on people, you can also start to, like, the things that they're carrying emotionally in their body are also available in the field around them.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And so, you know, then it's like, starts to get wormholey where you're like, well, what is this information? Where is it coming from and who's providing it? And. And then it's really hard to go to high school parties and, like, talk about things that are, you know, not that.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yes, that would be hard also. I mean, like you were saying, going to certain venues, it's hard. And for me, same. I can't go to concerts. I never could. And I mean, one part is the emotions are gonna get too. It's too much. Everyone's just gonna get worked up and,

[Mayim Bialik]

oh, my God, you Can feel that.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah. Too much.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Also too loud.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

And then where are the exits? Cause then something happens. Everyone panics. Trampled.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

You know, that's from forever.

[Mayim Bialik]

Was this your experience? Like for me, it's lovely to be nominated for Emmys, but it terrified me. Oh, wait, do you have this experience? And I was like, supposed to be happy and everyone was like, that's amazing. And every time it happened, I was like, uh huh.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Cause now I have to.

[Mayim Bialik]

Now I have to go too many parts. I have to get dressed and I have to put things.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Forget it. I don't know how to dress.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I mean, if someone dresses me. Okay.

[Progressive Insurance Announcer]

Yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yes. But I've somehow figured out some of that. Like that's now a little easier. Yeah. But a party. I can only do a couple.

[Mayim Bialik]

No, I can't drink anymore. That was how I was able to at least get through a party. Like just like a little liquid courage.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Mayim Bialik]

You know, like after a glass and a half of white wine, I'm delightful. You know, like I could manage it. It's still not like I won't be staying late. But no, I started not being able drink without having allergic reactions. And I was like, they took away my liquid courage.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Do you know what I just learned? And maybe it's not right. So I'll check with you guys that things like alcohol and I think. Yeah. I don't know, other things. Actually there's gaba, which is the filter. And it increases the amount a filter. So it's not releasing inhibitions.

[Mayim Bialik]

Correct.

[Lisa Kudrow]

It's actually creating more of a filter. So you feel a little safer.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah. You feel like the smartest person in the room or the. Yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Maybe just let go a little more because.

[Mayim Bialik]

Correct.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Good.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yep. Wow.

[Jonathan Cohen]

I didn't know that.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah, I didn't know that until recently.

[Jonathan Cohen]

You had two questions.

[Mayim Bialik]

That was your question for Jonathan about Reiki.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yes, Reiki. Yeah. I'm all in, by the way. And same as you talk about, like placebo, nocebo. My father used to say, everyone ignores placebo. It's real. It's 40%. A lot of medications are only 40% effective, so what's the difference? And no one's looking at it, but that's really interesting to me. So that's why I keep saying, what does it matter what the exchange is and whether you can just decide I'm going to eat chocolate because it'll make me happy. Maybe norepinephrine and chocolate, you know, certain neurotransmitters. So you feel better. Right. Or you just did it yourself because you made a decision and you made

[Jonathan Cohen]

the association with that action that. That's going to cause whatever result that you're looking for. Right.

[Lisa Kudrow]

But what. You know, what if it doesn't anyway? I don't know now. I don't remember what I was going to ask you. Oh, well, sorry, Mayim, you'll have to come back again. Oh, sure. You've got another six hours by the time I batch out a sentence. So, Mayim, no, my question for you was about. I've heard you talk about Kundalini, Yoga, meditation.

[Mayim Bialik]

It does. We talked about Kundalini Rising. Yeah. I have had some experiences. We had. I'm trying to think who we spoke to. It was Sue Warner, Sue Mortar, who talked about being a total materialist. I think this was her story. And a skeptic also. Federico Fagine talked about this, that sometimes you are struck by something.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Mayim Bialik]

And the Federico example was he was just, like, going about. He was in the kitchen in the middle of the night, like, getting a snack, and all of a sudden was struck by a light that pierced through his soul and made him feel connected. Right. So this is. There are poses, postures, breathing, all these things. And this is the Kundalini Rising. That's the energy that, you know, certain branches of yoga have described for this place. I've definitely felt things. And the thing with Kundalini, there's a lot of repetitive movements we do. So there's like a lot of somatic stuff that gets kind of activated. There's a pulse that you can start feeling. I mean, to me, it's kind of like it's all the same. Right. It's all these different ways to try and get at the same thing. The same, like, connection with source or that awe. Right. That sense of like. Yeah, right. That feeling, that knowing in some way.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah, yeah. But I mean, does any of it help? Like, can you use it to sort of. If you're having anxiety over something, can you use it to.

[Mayim Bialik]

I've found. I mean, I think breath work of a variety of ways can be helpful. I think it depends. I mean, I think. And this is one of the reasons also we talk to so many different kinds of experts and people. What works for one person doesn't work for another. Right. There's so many different ways to get at that. For some people, like, box breathing is it. For some people, walking meditation is it. For some people, transcendental meditation is it. And like Thomas Campbell, they're like flying in the, you know, stratosphere.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And I think for other people, it's like being able to be reminded that there's some sort of guidance, that we have a purpose here, that everything isn't random. That just because I experienced something challenging doesn't mean that I'll never work again or my relationship. I'll never love someone again. I think that also can different for each person.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah. The hardest thing, I think, is knowing what's yours to take on and what's not yours, what's somebody else's thing.

[Mayim Bialik]

I think most people don't know the difference.

[Jonathan Cohen]

You've actually taught me the most about that of anyone.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Oh, me? Yeah. Why?

[Mayim Bialik]

Because I have so many things that you want to make yours that you know are not yours to fix.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Well, the notion of Al Anon in the rooms and that level of like, well, people have chaos in their lives and you can love them and really care for them and want so much for them, but actually what is your role in helping them?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And being supportive and what is just going to entangle you into whatever thing that they're in?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right. That was my first big one and it was an Al Anon one time. One person who just talked about someone.

[Mayim Bialik]

If your name's not in the sentence, it's not your problem. That's how we say it.

[Lisa Kudrow]

That's interesting.

[Mayim Bialik]

Like if you say any given problem in a sentence and your name's not in it, it's not your problem. It doesn't mean you don't care about it. It doesn't mean you're not engaged with it or that you can't be loving and supportive, but in order to do that, as you said, without it becoming yours. And I've experienced this, you know, as a parent, your children will experience things and sometimes it's very, very hard to tell the difference between they're upset and you're upset. Or what is it like to feel empathy, Right. For your child, for a friend, for your parent, and not have it consume you.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Right.

[Mayim Bialik]

It's a huge challenge. And what's interesting is, you know, there's a porousness to our physiology as well.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Mayim Bialik]

When we let things in that are not ours, they can have an impact as well on our immune system, on the way that we heal.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

For me, the big. The one where I need it the most is things that make me angry. And if someone. I'm thinking, I really hate being everyone does lied to everyone, hates being manipulated without skill. I don't Manipulate me all you want. If I don't know what's Happening fine with me. Also, talk behind my back all you want because it's not happening. As far as I'm concerned, that's fine. But that stuff. Oh, boy, that could really get me going. It starts a whole circuit.

[Jonathan Cohen]

What does it look like for you to get angry like that?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Well, it takes different forms, but, you know, a lot of bad language and then. Yeah, just. How dare. Wishing them ill and how do I let them know that that's not, you know, like, how do I slam that shut? Hard? And that's never the way to deal with any of that. It always has to be. You know, just. It's not yours. It's their thing. They don't mean harm. They're trying to help themself and they think they're protecting themselves. They think they're advocating for themselves, and they're not. And so. And that way you can just sort of. I got really good for a while, and then, you know, I got knocked off balance, you know, but really good for a while, being able to just say, yeah, okay, yeah, I can't help you with that, but I understand.

[Mayim Bialik]

It's a boundary. Yeah, that's an energetic boundary, too.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah. It's important.

[Mayim Bialik]

I have a very hard time with other people being wrong. And not, like, even being wrong, just factually wrong. No. Well, sometimes. But that's just, you know, I was raised by English teachers. We can't help it. No, but, like, when someone speak really well.

[Lisa Kudrow]

So that's good.

[Mayim Bialik]

No, like, if someone believes something that. That is not rational, I have a really hard time just letting them believe that. Like, I want to fix it until they're.

[Lisa Kudrow]

How do you know what's rational and what isn't? After what we've been talking about for 12 days just now, why are you so happy? Well, I'm so happy because someone's acknowledging his point.

[Mayim Bialik]

I've never seen him happier in his life.

[Jonathan Cohen]

No, I'm very happy because there's other information. Sometimes it's, like, so obvious, but then you're like, well, actually, if you see it from this other angle, it's not obvious at all what's wrong.

[Lisa Kudrow]

For example, what would be wrong. Although I can think of some things that are wrong that would be wrong and irrational.

[Mayim Bialik]

Okay, I'll just give an example. Like, I don't know if this is a good example. If someone's in, you know, an abusive relationship, like a really damaging abusive relationship, and they, for, you know, their own good reasons.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Mayim Bialik]

Don't want to leave.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Mayim Bialik]

And they might say something like, oh, well, you know, I. I can't leave because I don't. I don't think I can afford it, so I'm just gonna stay. And my response, if I were allowed to, would be, have you looked into it? There are ways that if you need to escape an abusive relationship, that you can get that help. It's very hard for me to be like, oh, well, that's their path. They're not gonna.

[Lisa Kudrow]

That is not hard for me at all. That's their path, really. That is not hard.

[Mayim Bialik]

No, it's not that you don't feel the pain or, you know, I understand.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I completely understand. Yeah. Yes. But I'm not being asked. They're not seeking help to get out of it. They're just saying, basically, here's why I'm still in it and it doesn't even matter. And here's why. All they're saying is, I'm still in it.

[Mayim Bialik]

And take people at their word.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Well, yeah. Also, when they're ready, they'll be out of it one way or another. A horrible way or a healthier way. A healthier way.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And yeah, it's hard for you to see them actively in it because, you know, the pain that they're going through.

[Mayim Bialik]

Well, and also the. I don't like. I don't like, you know, if there's a reason that they're, you know, making up that is, like, not true. Then, yeah, you're right. That's just what they need to say. Because they're not ready to leave.

[Lisa Kudrow]

They're not ready to leave.

[Jonathan Cohen]

But sometimes you just can't see that other option.

[Mayim Bialik]

Right. And sometimes people are asking, you know,

[Lisa Kudrow]

because, I mean, the only thing I think you could say to me is, oh, did you want to. I wouldn't even go there.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yeah, you would wait for them to sort of more formally say, do you know of any ways? Cause then that indicates that they have a willingness to seek alternatives.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Although that's rationally what I'm saying would be the thing to do. But I know me, and I know I would say, oh, if you really want to change something, I could tell you a couple things that maybe would work for you. You know, I mean, I. That person. And then I would say I'm very excited about them, so I'm going to tell you about them anyway, you know, and see if it sparks anything. Right. Yeah. So while I'm saying. But I don't. I don't get worked up over it, because it's not mine to get worked up over.

[Jonathan Cohen]

You're very good at Solving problems, though.

[Mayim Bialik]

Me?

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yeah.

[Mayim Bialik]

Oh, well, my brain was made for that.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Puzzles.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I love puzzles. Me, too.

[Mayim Bialik]

I love a puzzle. Really?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Well, what kind of puzzle?

[Mayim Bialik]

I love puzzles.

[Jonathan Cohen]

What kind of puzzles do you like, if not jigsaw?

[Mayim Bialik]

You like word puzzles?

[Lisa Kudrow]

I like word puzzles.

[Mayim Bialik]

Like crossword puzzles?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah.

[Mayim Bialik]

You like wordle?

[Lisa Kudrow]

I. I do.

[Mayim Bialik]

Okay.

[Lisa Kudrow]

It's all right.

[Mayim Bialik]

Okay, but. Okay, but what kind of puzzles do you like then?

[Lisa Kudrow]

I like. I don't know, on my.

[Mayim Bialik]

Oh, yeah, yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Thought puzzles, matching things.

[Mayim Bialik]

Oh, yeah, Yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I do like some thought puzzles. And then I don't want to give it too much time.

[Mayim Bialik]

That's. Well, yes. No one should.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah. Because I want to relax.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Do you feel like your path was redefined?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Oh, I do to a degree. Only because of some of the things I told you that I kind of heard, saw on some level, even as a kid. I mean, I could. I. There are things I knew.

[Mayim Bialik]

Have you ever considered doing any healing arts yourself as a practitioner? Because if you're tuned into receiving this kind of information, I'm curious if it ever occurred to you that that's something you might be able to, you know, channel, for lack of a better word.

[Lisa Kudrow]

It takes so much effort for. I mean, I did. I. I had an experience once with my husband. It's like a. Not remote viewing. I was with him. I decided I'm gonna try this. He. Okay. I didn't. Yeah. Of course I didn't tell you that, so. And I haven't done it since because it was so exhausting. But he was in Joshua Tree. I knew he was in Joshua Tree with friends where they were camping, sleeping out under the stars and taking mushrooms. And I was home, and I take a bath every night because I like being in the water, and it's calming and all of that. And I thought, ooh, this is a good place. Just focus all your attention on being with Michelle. Just be with Michelle.

[Mayim Bialik]

You were not on mushrooms.

[Lisa Kudrow]

No. Okay. Remember me? Yes, that's right. I'm too afraid and really focused my attention and started. Oh, okay. I'm with Michelle. I am with Michelle. I'm with Michelle. But am I forcing it? Because I know he's at Joshua Tree, so don't impose. No, I'm with him. Oh, yeah. This isn't right. And I didn't get it. Right. He was outside. There was sort of a structure, but he's outside. Sort of Adirondack chairs, Joshua Tree, camping and a fire pit. No. Okay.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I thought I got. Okay, so I didn't do it. Got it.

[Mayim Bialik]

Finished the bath.

[Lisa Kudrow]

He comes home. I said, I actually tried to be with you, but somehow there was a structure. You were in a fire pit on, like, Adirondack chairs. He said, that was, what? Friday night, we went to a restaurant.

[Mayim Bialik]

Stop it.

[Lisa Kudrow]

And we were sitting outside Adirondack chairs at a fire pit, smoking cigars.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Wow.

[Lisa Kudrow]

We didn't camp.

[Jonathan Cohen]

We didn't camp fully.

[Lisa Kudrow]

That was one night. We treated ourselves. Okay, so I did do it. All right, Good to know.

[Jonathan Cohen]

So you have the ability to.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I did it once.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah. But, like, I could be in my bedroom tonight, and you might be in my bedroom with me.

[Lisa Kudrow]

No, but I won't be. I promise you.

[Mayim Bialik]

I don't believe you. You like me too much.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I do. I'm in awe of you. But I won't.

[Jonathan Cohen]

You have 100% success rate.

[Mayim Bialik]

But also, that's like. I mean, on the scale, when Julia Mossbridge talks about, you know, precognition, when she talks about remote viewing, when she talks about this kind of synchronicity, you had three facts. You didn't have one.

[Lisa Kudrow]

That's right.

[Mayim Bialik]

Because if you had said, like, oh, Adirondack chair. Like, you had a structure like a building. You had chairs, you had a fire pit, which, like, people might also say, like, well, what are the chances? Like, you're camping. Of course there's gonna be a fire pit. So that's kind of a common thing.

[Lisa Kudrow]

But the Adirondack chair, there was also laughing. There was also the fact that he

[Mayim Bialik]

wasn't supposed to be in a building.

[Lisa Kudrow]

A number of people around also sitting in them. And there was an extra person and it was a guy. Yeah. No. There were a lot of things that were right.

[Jonathan Cohen]

New reality show. Mayim and Lisa learned to become remote viewers.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Mayim and Lisa try to debunk each other.

[Mayim Bialik]

But, I mean, maybe I want to

[Lisa Kudrow]

hang out with Michelle, but it was exhausting.

[Mayim Bialik]

And you mean you felt physically like

[Lisa Kudrow]

it took a lot, and I don't. I'd rather focus my attention on being here.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And I will say that as you do things like that, maybe not going remote in that way, because it sounds like you were traveling. There are ways to do it with less effort, and it becomes less exhausting as you sort of lean into it a little bit more.

[Mayim Bialik]

Did it scare you?

[Lisa Kudrow]

No, not at all.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Because it's a creative imagination. And so I. I make up what I'm about to say next. Just. It sounded like you were, like, really trying to go there versus kind of going into a state and allowing it to Come to you.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And the going is very taxing, but the coming to you is actually quite pleasant.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right, that's interesting. But you're saying practice it.

[Mayim Bialik]

In theory, you. It might not be as exhausting.

[Jonathan Cohen]

I'm gonna suggest a book which is. I have to check the name of the book. I think it's called how to read the Akashic Records. And when you asked about, you know, the readings, finding that place and the access to that is an interesting exercise because once you know how to access it, you can kind of go and it's, you know, like wandering around a little bit. Instead of going, you're just kind of like seeing what presents. Okay, so imagine, you know, this huge library of information, just like we talked about, that everything exists and it's available. Well, if you go to the place where the information exists and you. You make it intentional and you kind of open that space, you can kind of stand there and see what is brought forward and just becomes a little bit of a.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Why not? Yeah, why not?

[Jonathan Cohen]

A little curious. Wandering into the records.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Okay, but have you never had an experience like something you can't explain?

[Jonathan Cohen]

Her house has been haunted.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Oh, God. Knuth and the five year old when his. What the. That. What?

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah, Henry. With his son. Henry. That was not. That was.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Well, Henry just corroborated what he experienced, correct?

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yeah.

[Mayim Bialik]

We're talking about when Kevin Knuth saw a man in his child's bedroom. No, it was. That's right, it was. Sorry. It was a child. That's right. I'm sorry.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Five or seven year old. His son was not that little.

[Mayim Bialik]

No. And then his son was terrified and said that there was a boy in

[Lisa Kudrow]

his room and the boy looked terrified.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yes. When something happened. Yeah. Something happened that he could not get out of. I haven't had things like that.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I don't think.

[Jonathan Cohen]

You haven't had things like that.

[Mayim Bialik]

My mom thinks my dad is a hummingbird. Like, you know, it's.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Oh, sure. No, no, sure.

[Mayim Bialik]

She's. She, you know, she's got a whole thing about that.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Something. In that vein, though, the Tara Swart episode where she saw her husband at

[Mayim Bialik]

the foot of her bed after he died.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Oh, right.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And, you know, she didn't say it exactly, but she said something to the effect of. I used to be a part of teams who would recommend institutionalizing people who would claim to have the experience that I had.

[Mayim Bialik]

I mean, her whole worldview had to change.

[Jonathan Cohen]

So, you know, how do we, as people, both be open to that type of information, but also as you Explain. Be here and now and present and available and not, you know, driving in our cars saying, ghosts are guiding me to, you know, the wrong exit.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah. My. My younger one, we used to joke he sees dead people. He's got some special perceptive abilities, I

[Lisa Kudrow]

would say, but they scare him. They don't scare him.

[Mayim Bialik]

Well, when he was younger, he would say. He would say, like, yeah, there's a darkness in the house. And I kept buying lights because I thought that's what he meant, but that's not what he meant. There was something that he was, you know, picking up on.

[Lisa Kudrow]

By the way, I also think with children, we throw a lot of symbology at, you know, oh, they said this. They said it wrong. They meant this. What if they knew exactly what they were saying and it was the wrong word for a reason? And all the things that they invent

[Mayim Bialik]

that we think, oh, isn't that cute?

[Lisa Kudrow]

That's so cute. And. Aw. Yeah. I don't know. I just. It makes me like, what if that would be an interesting experiment to me.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Yeah.

[Mayim Bialik]

That creative imagination is something also that, you know, Jung worked with and, like, when people do shadow work and, you know, I've done some hypnosis work where. Yeah, you. You conjure aspects of yourself, different parts of yourself, and you tell stories. Right. But it's. Nothing's accidental that we say and think. It's all rooted in something that has either truth or resonance.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah.

[Mayim Bialik]

It's some very, very interesting work can come out of that.

[Lisa Kudrow]

But that's why, to me, I don't care whether your father is coming back. Not coming back as a hummingbird represented by a hummingbird. For your mom, it's what she's thinking about him. Feeling him or needing him and deciding that he's there and he is there. I mean, what does it matter?

[Jonathan Cohen]

How much happier would people be if more of life was an improv game where we were meeting people where they are. Right. Instead of trying to convince someone that the hummingbird isn't the association they made, which just puts us against each other. What if it's like I'm gonna just put whatever I think down for a minute, long enough to enter.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yes.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And enter your world. And maybe I'll walk around that world and I'll make a connection with you, and I'll either agree or I'll go back to my own world. But your world doesn't have to terrorize or. Or invalidate whatever world I'm gonna go back to.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yes, but I feel like that's what all this is Right now, for me, I am. Especially telepathy tapes. It's a big yes. And because it doesn't matter if. If none of it is real, how's that possible? You know, then, you know, I'll. I'll know. I'll find out. You know, we'll all know. But why shut it down? That's the stuff I'm more suspicious of. Why shut it down? What's the problem? What's the problem? What's at risk? And I have a feeling I don't go all the way to deep. State doesn't want us to know because it's their domain and. Maybe. But there's some institutions that shut it down, especially academic institutions. And, you know, I don't know. Everyone's so afraid.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

To be shunned and shut out. And someone was brought it up. It was.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah.

[Lisa Kudrow]

A neuroscientist that I know, who had a revelation while meditating. But also. And so everything flipped, but was saying. Or someone was saying. I can't remember what it was like. Yeah, but it's, you know, it's a lot of women and older women that are doing this work. And like men too, I said, but it's because once they retire, they are free to say they're not dependent on their job or getting a grant or

[Mayim Bialik]

publishing or just like, I'm too old to give a shit.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah. So in some ways, you not had Rupert Sheldrake on, have you?

[Mayim Bialik]

No, not yet. We've talked about him. Because we talked about him with DT Young and we talked about him also regarding telepathy tapes, because it comes up in one of the episodes with animal communication.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right. Come on. I mean, come on.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Anyone who has had a very deep connection with an animal, a smart animal, know there's something going on.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yes.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Especially as they get older because they're kind of oblivious as puppies and they're just exploring and you can't really get their attention the same way. And as they age, they become more and more attuned to and, like, things are just exchanged without any form of communication.

[Mayim Bialik]

That was one of the things we had. Vinnie Todd Tolman, one of the NDE experiencers who we had on he died in the bathroom of a Dairy Queen and watched himself be zipped up.

[Lisa Kudrow]

That's a recent one.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah, yeah. You haven't seen that one.

[Jonathan Cohen]

It's an unbelievable episode.

[Mayim Bialik]

It's an unbelievable episode. But one of the things he said is he always liked animals, but after his NDE and he was dead for about two hours, zipped up in a body bag. And then an EMT literally was like, I think he's not dead, and brought him back. It's a whole thing.

[Jonathan Cohen]

DMT was like. The people in the front were like, don't mess with the body, you're going to get fired. And he was like, no, I. Something. He's not. I want to say.

[Mayim Bialik]

Anyway, what Vinnie said was that before his nde, he liked animals. But after his nde, he came back with a way to communicate. And he was here with our dog, who historically does not do well with men. And the dog went right up to him and looked him in the eye and he said. He said to the dog, oh, you were hurt and so you're here to heal people. And I was like, what's happening? He said he just. After his nde, he came back with an ability to experience their consciousness, their communication.

[Lisa Kudrow]

That's what this dog was communicating.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah. And he was. He was a traumatized dog.

[Jonathan Cohen]

We didn't tell Vinnie anything about this dog.

[Mayim Bialik]

No.

[Jonathan Cohen]

This dog was tied to a telephone pole in the desert and left for

[Mayim Bialik]

dead and abused very badly.

[Jonathan Cohen]

When we got him, he was pulled out of a kill shelter where they spray the concrete floors down every night. He had respiratory problems. He had a big scar across his face. He had been starved and he was

[Mayim Bialik]

terrified of men in particular. Anyway, he walked right up to Vin and Vinny was like, yes, I see you. It was amazing.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Oh, yeah, no, yes, of course I believe all that. Why not?

[Mayim Bialik]

All that and more, but why not?

[Lisa Kudrow]

I believe. I mean. Yes, let's see. Sure.

[Mayim Bialik]

That's the title of the episode.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Let's see, why not. It also makes life a lot more fun, right?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Yeah. Well, look, it's create your own. Choose your own adventure. I mean, it's whatever you want.

[Jonathan Cohen]

All right, my real last question for you. Have you been shown what's next for you in a way that you were shown what has already happened?

[Lisa Kudrow]

That I've been shown what's already happened.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Meaning when you were younger, you got intuition.

[Mayim Bialik]

Oh, when you're on Letterman, don't do that. Have you seen more about what comes next?

[Lisa Kudrow]

Oh, it's glimpses of things that it's like maybe, or maybe not is how I feel about it. And then once it comes to pass, I'm like, oh, all right. So I guess that was a thing.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah, well, we look forward to seeing what's next.

[Lisa Kudrow]

And everybody has that. I'm not letting you get that clever last line, but I guess everybody has that. I'm not the only one do you have that? I just don't pay attention.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Oh, yeah.

[Mayim Bialik]

I think it's the not paying attention.

[Lisa Kudrow]

You just don't pay attention.

[Mayim Bialik]

Yeah. Or you're not, like, tuned into it, or you're too busy with, you know, the things that take up our attention.

[Lisa Kudrow]

When I was little, very little, like, I didn't speak really clearly till I was still not three. And I remember watching people talk. Grownups, my brother and sister, six and eight years older. And just watching them going, oh, my God, you're not even listening to each other. That's not what. That's not what he meant. And now you're really mad and, oh, this is all getting out of hand. Just because you. Oh, wait, no one listen. You're not listening. And I just thought, oh, you get dumber as you get older. Like, you can't see people's intentions anymore anymore. You get dumb. Lisa, it's going to happen to you, too. I guess I can do. It's going to happen to me, too. But just please remember this. Just remember this thought. So I have certain things that just remember this.

[Mayim Bialik]

Wow, that's so special, isn't it?

[Jonathan Cohen]

That's a very, very powerful realization to have then and now because, I mean, I feel like my role here is English to English translation. And yours is to help translate what I'm saying to other people.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right. But part of it, to me, looking back, feels like. Right. Because spoken language is so primitive. I mean, it's like fire compared to what communication probably can be.

[Jonathan Cohen]

That's the thing we hear about telepathic communication. And when I've heard or felt like I've received messages from someone else is that you feel. Feel their intentions so much more than what actual language conveys.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Right. Like, I could see. Oh, I know exactly what you just heard. And that's not what they meant. But, wow, you're coming with a whole bunch of, like, a stack of information that's coloring.

[Jonathan Cohen]

And, you know, that's a. I don't want to call it psychic, because psychic has a bad association to it, but it's. What were the other four Claires?

[Mayim Bialik]

There's clairvoyance is the one that people know, but there's clairaudience. There's claircognizance.

[Jonathan Cohen]

That's claircognizance.

[Mayim Bialik]

Claircognizance is what it's called. This has been an absolutely delightful conversation.

[Lisa Kudrow]

I know. I said I know.

[Mayim Bialik]

She had delightful.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Me, too. All three days of it.

[Mayim Bialik]

Where can people find out all the things about Comeback or anything else you want to direct people to the Comeback.

[Lisa Kudrow]

All three seasons is on HBO Max or whatever it's going to be called.

[Mayim Bialik]

Thank you. Thank you so much.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Thank you. I love your podcast.

[Mayim Bialik]

Thank you.

[Lisa Kudrow]

Everything I get to hear about on it.

[Mayim Bialik]

Jonathan I really didn't know what to expect when we decided to have Lisa on. I had such a wonderful conversation with her, completely off the record, and she really wasn't sure what she would talk about. Turns out she was a fantastic guest and reviewer of some of our favorite episodes too.

[Jonathan Cohen]

I said to her as she's walking out hour three, we're getting more information. Unbelievable stories that what she describes about seeing how people misunderstand each other as adults. It hit me so hard because I could remember being a kid and looking at people being like there's such a mismatch. And as we get older, we rely more and more on our rational minds and less and less on our felt sense. And like when you can't feel someone, all of a sudden there's conflict.

[Mayim Bialik]

There was actually a lot you have in common with Lisa Kudrow. I think you're from the same village.

[Jonathan Cohen]

Maybe we're cousins.

[Mayim Bialik]

You probably are cousins. Jonathan this was really, really terrific. So, so glad we got to do this episode. It was so special.

[Jonathan Cohen]

We talked to Lisa so long that there's actually bonus material not in either one of the episodes we've released online that you can get only on substack.

[Mayim Bialik]

Go to bialikbreakdown.substack.com or just look up MayimBialik's breakdown on Substack from our breakdown to the one we hope you never have. We'll see you next time.

[Jonathan Cohen]

It's Mayim Bialik's breakdown.

[Lisa Kudrow]

She's going to break it down for you.

[Jonathan Cohen]

She's got a neuroscience PhD or two.

[Mayim Bialik]

Non fiction.

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