RuPaul's Drag Race Season 7 Eps 5 & 6: "Wigs, Woe, & Redemption" with Trixie and Katya

Summary

The Bald and the Beautiful with Trixie and Katya

RuPaul's Drag Race Season 7 Eps 5 & 6: "Wigs, Woe, & Redemption"

Date: August 26, 2025
Hosts: Trixie Mattel & Katya Zamolodchikova
Special Guests via Voice Note: Mrs. Kasha Davis, Candy Ho, Max
Main Theme:
A chaotic, hilarious, and deeply reflective episode where Trixie and Katya recap RuPaul’s Drag Race Season 7 episodes 5 & 6. They analyze infamous moments (including the RuPaul/Pearl confrontation), dissect challenge performances, and share insider memories, with brutal honesty about their own journeys, creative processes, and Runway fashion missteps.

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Episode Overview

The queens reunite to dissect pivotal episodes surrounding the Despy Awards, the infamous RuPaul/Pearl showdown, "Death Becomes Her" Runway, and Snatch Game. They provide humorous, self-deprecating, and candid recollections of their own performances, explore what makes Drag Race magic (and misery), and celebrate/roast their iconic season seven sisters.

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Breakdown of Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Catching Up & Season 7: “The Reviled and Beloved”

[02:16–03:13]

• Trixie and Katya, joined by Michelle Visage, frame Season 7 as uniquely divisive and consequential:

  "The most reviled and also beloved, star-studded... Divisive." — Katya

• Shout-outs to the season’s eclectic alumni (from thriving to recluses to porn stars).
• Joke about hosting a “Toni Collette Awards” in Australia.

2. Life after Elimination & Perspective Watching Drag Race

[05:07–06:00]

• Katya: Relates being eliminated to finally being able to watch Drag Race “as a fan, not a participant,” free from self-cringe.
• Both joke about the bizarre thrall and liberation of not having to perform for the camera.

3. The Mini Challenge: Paper Couture

[07:36–08:46]

• Time constraints (30–45 mins) led to surprisingly creative results.
• Highlights:
  • Pearl’s Cher look on Max: “stunning.”
  • Katya & Kasha’s Björk swan dress: “super fun.”
  • Ginger’s Lil’ Kim: “impressive.”
• “I love when mini challenges show creativity instead of just setting us up to flop.” — Katya

4. The Kasha Davis Joan Rivers Moment

[08:47–09:11]

• Loving ribbing for Kasha’s awkward Joan Rivers:

  “There were no jokes.” — Katya
  “Kasha is not funny.” — Michelle

• Sweet acknowledgement of Kasha’s sobriety and enduring character (married, older ‘statesman’ of the cast).

5. Infamous RuPaul vs. Pearl Confrontation

[10:14–17:06]

• (Major Segment, timestamped highlights below):
  • Cataclysmically tense, even more so in person:

    "It was more tense and more awkward than it was on television." — Katya [11:36]

  • RuPaul’s directness stunned the queens; Katya was “pretending to sew” during the drama.
  • Pearl, at age 23, stands up for herself:

    "Well, you kind of just told me I had no personality." — Katya [10:49]

  • Admiration for Pearl’s guts and “James Dean chill.”
  • Trixie notes: Pearl's "chill" was unlike the “drag queen obnoxious” frequency, and credits her for making it okay not to be a showboat.
  • Producer’s perspective: “Nothing’s more interesting than what's really happening.” — Trixie [16:10]
• Reveal: RuPaul admitted on her podcast she wanted to send Pearl home outright—but kept her “because she’s hot.”

  “That was a rare moment of honesty from Ru.” — Katya [16:43]

6. Despy Awards: Behind the Curtain

[20:43–30:31]

• Katya loathes working (or gelling) with partners. Kasha and her didn’t find rhythm: “We just are not that funny together.”
• Reflections on drag style:

  “I don’t know how to do hair. Not interested in learning.” — Katya [23:04]

• Prizes: Katya wins “Media Stuff,” jokes about her infamous “2-inch weenie” [30:22].
• Lip sync: Kasha flubs, Candy Ho excels as a “Terminator” to “Lovergirl,” even though Kasha is a seasoned mic queen.

Memorable Quote:

[13:59] Katya:

“Her balls took up half the room. It was like the Macy's Day Parade with just balls.”

7. “Death Becomes Her” Runway & Rue Hollywood Stories

[39:36–49:09]

• The “Merle Ginsburg” acting challenge is panned as “the worst challenge of the entire series” [39:42]. The only saving grace: “jello wrestling.”
• Insider notes on Runway looks:
  • Ginger's and Kennedy’s “death” outfits: “broken,” “no justification.”
  • Violet’s legendary 18-inch corset; literal pain and drama backstage.
  • Pearl’s “death on the table” look divides the hosts.
  • Max’s bleeding dress: cool but underused on camera.
  • Katya’s own Runway: “I felt like old maiden type of shit bag.” [43:41]
• The runway critique meta: Some contestants’ failures come down to editing (“They repeated Kasha flubbing ‘welcome’ three times.”) and what’s privileged in production.

8. Snatch Game: Triumphs, Disasters, and Discourse

[54:46–64:13]

• Vulnerability, addiction, and sobriety: Katya is candid about the (un)reality of “sharing” on camera, and the complex personal impact of being seen as a spokesperson for sobriety.
  • “I wish this conversation never happened... but it helped people.” — Katya [55:40]
• Performance Recap:
  • Top: Pearl and Kennedy (Pearl’s Big Ang, Kennedy’s Little Richard)
  • Mid/Safe: Ginger (Adele), Katya (Suze Orman), Violet
  • Bottom: Max, Fame, Jaidynn
• Snatch Game wisdom:
  • “You don’t have to look like them, you don’t have to sound like them, just be an idiot. Just be funny.” — Katya [63:42]
  • Donatella impressions are a trap. Ginger’s Adele reduced to just “fat jokes.”
  • Kennedy’s Little Richard: “Life changing,” “the perfect Snatch Game” [controlled repetition, catchphrases, zippiness].

Notable Quotes:

• “Pearl was transcendent.” — Michelle [59:36]
• “If their personality is a 7/10, go to 14/10 for Snatch Game.” — Katya [61:47]

9. Runway Riffs: Leather & Lace Edition

[62:03–69:48]

• Weakest overall runway of the season; critique and self-lampooning:

  “If it sucks, it sucks. I made it, let’s move on.” — Katya [67:18]

• Pearl’s Runway “overlooked” for a win. Violet’s look called fabulous but "not leather or lace."
• Katya’s “twice the price” double-wig hack earns Trixie’s mockery.

10. Max’s Downfall & Drag Race Editing

[70:18–73:13]

• The infamous “Max sings on the floor” moment—how it was a prompt from RuPaul taken too literally, then edited heavy-handedly to seem cracked.
• Both reflect on how Drag Race editing can magnify embarrassment or miss context—most queens have had similar “unflattering” moments cut.

11. Lip Sync & Next Episode Tease

[73:13–75:16]

• Jaidynn vs. Max: No contest. Jaidynn's performance power; Max’s mismatch with song style.
• Hints toward the next episode with a mystery return ("someone coming back").

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Notable Quotes & Moments (by Timestamp)

• [10:49] Katya: “Well, you kind of just told me I had no personality.”
• [13:59] Katya: “…the Macy’s Day Parade with just balls.”
• [29:09] Katya: “Star of Tyler Perry’s Roots, Kennedy Davenport.” (improv: the “straight from Kunta Kinte’s hut” bit.)
• [41:20] Katya: “Had to be saved by jello wrestling. Boobs coming out in jello wrestling was the only way to save this turkey.”
• [55:40] Katya: “I wish this conversation never happened. Although I know … it did help people.”
• [59:36] Michelle: “Pearl’s transcendent.”
• [63:42] Katya: “You just have to be an idiot. … Just be funny.”
• [67:18] Katya: “If it sucks, it sucks. I made it, let’s move on.”

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Voice Note Highlights

• Mrs. Kasha Davis [33:18]: Reflects on feeling she’d won her lip sync, and shares joy in post-show activism and drag for seniors/children.
• Candy Ho [51:32]: Honestly discusses exhaustion from repeated lip syncing, and finding power in her performance ability, if not in "Drag Race" challenges.
• Max [64:21]: “I just, like, blacked out through the whole thing… up in that first corner… not a fun time,” recalling terror during Snatch Game and Runway elimination moment, and fearing disappointing people at home.

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Structure of Recaps and Critiques

• Exposes how classic Drag Race moments happen both by accident (awkward production, editing) and design (deliberate casting for story arc).
• Kate and Trixie continuously stress accepting one’s limits in drag (“It’s okay to not do every part of drag”—Trixie [23:18]).
• Real talk about improvisation, the dangers of over-planning, and finding authenticity in reality TV’s “produced” moments.
• Frequent meta-commentary about fandom, internet lore, and what it feels like to be a Drag Race queen stuck in memes or infamous TV moments.

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Memorable, Unfiltered Tangents

• The imagined “Toni Collette Awards” complete with Tony Soprano, Tony Danza jokes [03:09–04:35].
• Katya’s passionate hatred of drag hair, refusal to even try: “Ask me how to do open heart surgery. You think I’m going to know?” [23:02]
• Discussion of “presentating” on the Runway, with repeated riffing on Violet’s “competence with presentation presentating” [69:48–69:53].

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Listener Takeaways

– If you want authenticity, drama, and the inside scoop on Drag Race production, cast dynamics, and reality TV myth-making, this is an essential listen. – Katya and Trixie’s candor about creative failure, personal shame, and the grind of Drag Race brings both catharsis and comedy. – The episode mixes biting satire of Drag Race with genuine affection for the format, the queens, and survival through “reality TV insanity.”

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Key Timestamps for Major Segments

• RuPaul vs. Pearl confrontation: [10:14–17:06]
• Mini-Challenge Recap: [07:36–08:46]
• Despy Awards & Challenge Bloopers: [20:43–30:31]
• “Death Becomes Her” Runway Looks: [41:53–49:09]
• Snatch Game Analysis: [54:46–64:13]
• Max’s Critique, Editing & Elimination: [70:18–73:13]

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Final Tone

The episode is raucous, bracingly honest, brimming with in-jokes, drag wisdom, and occasional pathos. Katya and Trixie’s chemistry and unique comedic rhythm bring out the underlying absurdity—and humanity—of Drag Race, with loving shade for themselves and the whole Season 7 cast.

Transcript

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

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[Michelle Visage]

So this is this very special episode of the Bald and the Beautiful because we are recapping season seven of Drag Race.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

The most reviled and also beloved star studded. Yes. Reviled and beloved. Controversial.

[Michelle Visage]

Yes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Divisive.

[Michelle Visage]

Everybody from this season has ever either gone on to be a drag superstar or live in the woods or with almost no contact or do porn.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. So we're mama. We're all. We're all thriving.

[Michelle Visage]

We're all separating off.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

We're all surviving. Surviving and very thru vibing.

[Michelle Visage]

Yes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Very interesting way.

[Michelle Visage]

And getting all these voice notes has been kind of good to have an excuse to text like Candy Ho.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Like some of these people I just haven't had excuse to reach out to.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

So people like her, people like Pearl people.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Fame is now a mother.

[Michelle Visage]

I haven't texted her because I just think what time is it in Switzerland?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. And also I don't want like whenever somebody get. Like when Cole won the Emmy I'm like I'm not texting them.

[Michelle Visage]

She went, oh.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

When calling the Tony. I'm not texting them because they probably received 400 texts.

[Michelle Visage]

You and I should have a Tony Awards where we just give out Toni Collette Awards.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh my God. T O N I E. Yes.

[Michelle Visage]

So like what outfits she wore this year, what movie she was in?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Tony. Tony. Tony.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah, the Tonys. The T O N I's. And everyone has an Aussie accent. Would you guys want us to come to Australia and host the Toni Collette Awards?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

That is so the Tony.

[Michelle Visage]

The Tonys.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh my God.

[Michelle Visage]

I love that tone Low could perform ever Tony Soprano.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh my God. Tony Danza.

[Michelle Visage]

Tony Danza to Tony Bennett.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

We could also may throw a curveball. Tawny Catain.

[Michelle Visage]

Who's that?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

A video vixen. Tony contain.

[Michelle Visage]

Oh, drag name. Tony Deaf. That's kind of fun.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Tony Hawk. Tony Hawk.

[Michelle Visage]

Big fan.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

What? No, no, no, no. Sorry. It's the other. The other skateboarder is a huge fan. Well, I was at a diner Park Street. Clark Street Diner. And he's. He had the biggest, most successful collaboration with Nike and he's a famous. What is his name? He's so cute too. I would him.

[Michelle Visage]

I love when real athletes like us. I think it's so flattering.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Baby. It was flatterama and he was like. He. He. My friend walked by and he flagged my friend down was like is that Katya? And then I was with my mom was my birthday and it was so cute. What is his name? What is his name something? It's a super. I mean he's. He had long hair.

[Michelle Visage]

Tony Baloney.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No. Oh, Tony Tiger.

[Michelle Visage]

Tony Chocolate.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Tony the Tiger. Anyways, long story short, this famous skateboarder loves us.

[Michelle Visage]

Wow.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. Also Alex Kinsani loves you apparently and not me. It makes you so jealous, you know. Did you pray today?

[Michelle Visage]

I'm sure she Likes you, too.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, maybe I think she just knows if, like, people just know you because you're more famous, but if you knew.

[Michelle Visage]

You, they would never care about me. Because you could do me, but I could never do you.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Okay, well, let's talk about what you didn't do on Dragon Grace, which is.

[Michelle Visage]

By the way, in retrospect, getting to skip three episodes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And thank God, Mama, these were the episodes to skip. Well, let me be dolls.

[Michelle Visage]

I don't want to be a hater, because what you might think is that if I'm not in the episodes, I'm like, snooze. Boring. But I'm so cringed out by myself that once I was eliminated, season episode five started, and I thought, oh, good, now I'm just watching my friends.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Which is true. I wasn't gone.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I know I would have enjoyed. I enjoyed watching that episode after hello Kitty so much more than yes. Than anything else.

[Michelle Visage]

Once you're not in it, you're like, this is great.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Especially when you suffer humiliation.

[Michelle Visage]

Well, t. So I remember I was at home. Why don't you. You. We're going to get through the despies. We're going to get through.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, no. Merle Hollywood Sword.

[Michelle Visage]

Merle Hollywood Sword. And we're going to get through Snatch Game.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

This is a mega episode.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So, first of all, top of the show. I feel so shocked and betrayed right now.

[Michelle Visage]

Full body chills.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Full body chills. So you're gone. We do have a very fun mini challenge.

[Michelle Visage]

Do you remember my mirror message?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I don't remember.

[Michelle Visage]

It just said whore like Black Swan. And remember, you knew it was directed at you, and you came up and you said, did you suck his claw? And then you started wiping it, and.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Then I just cut myself.

[Michelle Visage]

How is no one just written whore like Black Swan on the mirror? Drag Race?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Because nobody is good. Nobody's any good.

[Michelle Visage]

I think I wrote, like, love yourself, girl. Who fucking knows what I wrote?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

1-800-Go suck your mom's cock.

[Michelle Visage]

That's what. That's what people should be writing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I know. It's crazy. It's crazy.

[Michelle Visage]

Next time I do Drag Race to get a limited, I'm going to say, is Pepsi okay? Full body chills. A single drop of blood. It will just be really deep cuts. You're terrible, Muriel. You know, it'll just be something out there that makes. That leaves everyone concerned.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You know what people should do when.

[Michelle Visage]

They leave Drag Race to the girl who knows what she did? Yours will be coming to you very, very.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Your next bitch. Tokyo.

[Michelle Visage]

Tony Tokyo. Very Tokyo Tony Awards.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

We should have them in Tokyo.

[Michelle Visage]

With Tony. With Tokyo Tony. Have you ever seen that Tokyo Tony clip where she's like. It's a lot. When it comes to the LGBT community, it's a lot of issues going on. And Michelle Obama. I wouldn't want to be. No. She says Hillary Clinton. I wouldn't want to be in your shoes right now. That's like the whole TikTok.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Have you seen the one where she's trying to rent out her front yard?

[Michelle Visage]

Yes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Okay, enough of Tokyo Tony. We got work to do. We got.

[Michelle Visage]

Okay.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. We gotta get through it. So we. Fabulous, fun mini challenge. Creating iconic red carpet dresses out of paper. Love this. Fun.

[Michelle Visage]

How much time did you have?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And you know what this was. This is a great, fun, relevant, good, entertaining mini challenge.

[Michelle Visage]

Yes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Because it shows creativity. Everybody's dresses were incredible.

[Michelle Visage]

They actually were pretty good.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Pearls share on Max, I believe was impressive. Stunning. Stunning. And that's what Pearl is so good at. Me and Kasha make Bjork swan dress super fun.

[Michelle Visage]

Yes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And then little Kim. I think Ginger's little Kim.

[Michelle Visage]

That's what I'm saying.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So I don't know how much time.

[Michelle Visage]

You guys have, but the fact that these are head to toe.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Look, we have a 30 minutes, I think maybe. Maybe. Maybe a little more. Maybe 45.

[Michelle Visage]

I mean, you guys are. You guys have jewelry.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Some of you have dragged.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was so fun. It was actually really, really fun. And that's like. I love when they set up the mini challenge to, like, to really just have fun and to show creativity, rather. I mean, also, stupid's great too, but.

[Michelle Visage]

Like, and the time constraint means we're gonna be set up for a little bit of flop, but in a fun way.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

But it's a fun way. And I don't. I don't like it when they just set you up to fail or it's boring. I don't know.

[Michelle Visage]

Right?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So that was fun. Me and Kasha win. Whatever. And then we are.

[Michelle Visage]

Kasha gets to do her Joan Rivers.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, yeah. She does her Joan Rivers.

[Michelle Visage]

Which.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Very funny.

[Michelle Visage]

Isn't great.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, it's not.

[Michelle Visage]

I watched it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I was like, it's not great. It's not funny.

[Michelle Visage]

I was like, kasha is not funny.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Also, there were no jokes. There were no jokes.

[Michelle Visage]

It was just her going, like, address this paper.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. Oh, my God. Okay. Wow. Yeah. That was it.

[Michelle Visage]

And Kasha.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Love you.

[Michelle Visage]

Love you. You know what? When I'm watching it, Cash is one of those people. I think her. I don't want to like, government name her.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

But Ed Popple girl.

[Michelle Visage]

I watch it and I go, come on, Ed Popple.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, but I work Ed.

[Michelle Visage]

Papa work Ed, by the way, Kashi Davis. Sober now and married many, many years.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Mr. Mr. Davis. Mr. Davis. Yeah. Who is lovely.

[Michelle Visage]

But at the time, that made her seem so old to me, that she was a Mrs. And she was married. I was like, oh, there's a grown up here.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Was she.

[Michelle Visage]

None of us were married.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Also, she was at. Yeah, but she. At this point, since Tempest is gone, she's. She is the elder statesman. That's right. Yeah. Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

So you did a great job. And I guess technically, the first time you did Bjork on Drag Race.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah. So I. I should have taken a page out of this and then done her for Snatch Game, but whatever. So we have to host the Despies. We come up with some banner. It's not great. I mean, it's not great. Oh, but Mary Dugan, my dress.

[Michelle Visage]

No, no. Before we get to the challenge.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Okay. What.

[Michelle Visage]

Not to cut you off.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, yeah. What?

[Michelle Visage]

We get Pearl versus RuPaul.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, my God. I can't believe this is. I can't believe this happened at this time.

[Michelle Visage]

Can I say, at the time, I thought this was. So the whole room had crazy, and I wasn't there. But as a viewer, I was like, this is crazy. But now, knowing that she's 23 and she's on Drag Race, and I know that RuPaul has never encountered a single drag queen willing to talk to her the way RuPaul talked to her. And RuPaul is staring at her at what, eight feet? Paul Pearl's 90 pounds, seated. She's the size of a red M and M just sitting there. And then she just goes, well, you kind of just told me I had no personality.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, it's wild. I remember I was at the table. So they're at the. So we go into the workroom. They're on the left. I was right there on the left table. I was like.

[Michelle Visage]

So you could hear all of it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I. It's. She's right there.

[Michelle Visage]

And you're what, pretending to sew?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I was like.

[Michelle Visage]

Girl, the machine's going, and there's no fabric.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

You're sewing through the hand.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I'm writing. I'm writing with no pencil. No, she was.

[Michelle Visage]

The machine's not on, and you're just feeding the fabric through it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I'm on the phone.

[Michelle Visage]

Background work. You know what it gives. Remember in. Remember in the first season of Rehearsal, the woman eating the fake chicken. That's you.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I'm having a fake conversation with Kasha.

[Michelle Visage]

There's no one. You're talking to a mannequin.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I'm.

[Michelle Visage]

There's something about when something that awkward is going on that you're like, can I become the wallpaper real quick?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh. So it was. It was more tense and more awkward than it was on television. On television.

[Michelle Visage]

Because people don't know during the RuPaul walkthroughs, they're long. Everyone is silent and they're long. You're not allowed to speak.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, they're long.

[Michelle Visage]

They're long. And RuPaul does one for everyone. But they don't show it now.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And. And I think fans have realized, especially at the top of the season, if you get a walkthrough, you're going home.

[Michelle Visage]

Well, if it's because.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You know what I mean?

[Michelle Visage]

But it. But in.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

We all get a walk.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

We all get a walk through. But there's a clue. Of course, the people who get walkthroughs in the first couple episodes are either in the top or the bottom.

[Michelle Visage]

Yes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So, you know, because that's there. We got to see them.

[Michelle Visage]

Yes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

From a story perspective. So. This was so uncomfortable. It was so tense. It was insane. RuPaul was so angry. Like, it was like. It was, like, crazy.

[Michelle Visage]

And the. I mean, I'm sure it was longer in person, but I guess that's moral. Story to me is that I admire Pearl for this moment. Not because I think it's fun to mouth off to RuPaul, but.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No.

[Michelle Visage]

I23. I wouldn't have been able to do that. I wouldn't have been able to do that through RuPaul now, no matter what RuPaul said to me.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No. Well, the next episode, I literally told rup. This wasn't included in the episode. I confessed to her that I'm absolutely terrified of her to her face.

[Michelle Visage]

I've done that, too.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

She refute. She refutes it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She's. She. She with me. She played with it. Oh.

[Michelle Visage]

One time I told her she was so scary, and she said no. Everybody says that. I said, well, because.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And obviously, it walks like a duck.

[Michelle Visage]

Admire someone so much and fear them as interconnected tissue. It's an admiration.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. Yeah. So just sits.

[Michelle Visage]

Is this something in my face? And RuPaul stares at her.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

RuPaul's. And I. I don't remember any other.

[Michelle Visage]

Max was sitting there.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

He's like, Max is sitting there.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Hey, how y' all doing?

[Michelle Visage]

Giving Tim Burton.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Gray, silver and white.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I don't know what's taking place here.

[Michelle Visage]

They cut to Max and she's like, you know, she's got a British flag. She's got a ginger. Yes. And then she. Max goes, I'm very uncomfortable right now. Yeah, it was with the accent.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. No, not no. No accent. It was no accent.

[Michelle Visage]

She put on her Mrs. Doubtfire wig and just left you Vijay. Like, I can't believe. Shout out to Pearl. I would have never had the balls for that.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was huge. Her balls were. Her balls took up half the room. It was like the Macy's Day Parade with just balls. It was crazy. And, and yeah, it was. And then she leaves.

[Michelle Visage]

How long did she leave for?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was a while. It was a while. It was enough to be concerning. It was like enough to be dramatic. It was weird. Yeah. It was strange.

[Michelle Visage]

Do you think she was gonna quit?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I don't know. I don't know. I think she was really pissed off because people were dogpiling on her. Like, you have no. Imagine being told you have no personality.

[Michelle Visage]

Right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

But she does have a person. She's just not like, hey, mom, I'm fierce. She's not annoying, by the way.

[Michelle Visage]

For everyone like us in the world who's obnoxious and up there, there needs to be pearls.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, no, we're not obnoxious. We're obnoxious in a different way. But drag queen obnoxious is a very, very specific kind of frequency. Pearl is nowhere near that frequency. No. In fact, she's an antidote to that frequency, which is often grating.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So she is fierce because she's chill.

[Michelle Visage]

You and I are one brain cell and we're sitting there going like, exactly like, you know, we're not even thinking about other people in that way.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No.

[Michelle Visage]

But a lot of the drag queens in the room were operating at a frequency that you and I were not on.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, Pearl certainly was not on. No. And it was, I thought it. I, I, I didn't. It was, it's refreshing. But at the time it was fascinating because nobody had ever been like that.

[Michelle Visage]

Nobody had been like that. I mean, Max was a little like that. Max kept to himself.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Aloof, though. Aloof is different than chill.

[Michelle Visage]

Yes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Cuz Max was not chill.

[Michelle Visage]

No.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

But she was very aloof and to herself and elusive and, and introverted. But Pearl was like literally James Dean chill. Cool.

[Michelle Visage]

And to say that that person has no personality.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It's Pearl.

[Michelle Visage]

If you sit and talk to. Pearl's as funny as anybody. As much personality. She's just not cheating out and screaming.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. And she's actually quite interesting anyway.

[Michelle Visage]

And gifted.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Whatever. Yeah, yeah, yeah, whatever.

[Michelle Visage]

So I just couldn't believe this. It was so crazy to watch.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

But it was such an easy storyline for the producer, I think, to latch onto. And of course, the. The, like a, you know, the caterpillar in the. In the butterfly. You know, you get the whole story arc of coming out of your shell and bling and blossoming and all that stuff.

[Michelle Visage]

But I think that. That the golden rule of reality TV and I have produced several reality TV shows now, is nothing's more interesting than what's really happening.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

So the truth is, she has this face off with RuPaul.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

But she does good in the challenge. So the story is there's this friction.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

And then she figures it out.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

It could have easily been friction. And then she has weird vibes and it tanks her in the gym.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And then she's out.

[Michelle Visage]

I don't think that's fabricated.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No.

[Michelle Visage]

But the truth is this difficult conversation happened, and then she did. Well.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

What is the connective tissue there? It's about balls.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. And later we would learn from RuPaul's what's the Tea? Podcast that at the time, she wanted to send her ass home. That's right there. I couldn't believe that she was. I can't believe she included that. That was a rare moment of honesty from. Or like, behind the scenes honesty for me. She's like, I want to send that home. But I knew because she's hot or whatever. I was like, damn, Rue. You know? Interesting.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah. Which is confusing because I was also really hot.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I. I know. Like, so you're.

[Michelle Visage]

If we're keeping hot people, why did I go? Did you see my little corn teeth? Did you see my receding hairline? And also, the audience has a right to know, why is my skin so light and my nipples dark brown? What about that? America has a right to know.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

The viewers need to see that.

[Michelle Visage]

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[Katya Zamolodchikova]

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[Michelle Visage]

Do you remember preparing with Kasha? Did you know it was going to be weird?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I. I wasn't. I don't think I was super. Super just. I mean, I'm not super just do anything on drag race stories. Like, I mean, to be quite honest, I don't like working with. I don't like working with people.

[Michelle Visage]

I don't either.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I don't like. Girl, you do your thing, I'll do my thing. Let's meet, whatever. And also, this is really a moment for me to. To where I get to really flex my styling muscles because I reach and reach deep into that ruckusack and pull out the most fetching, incredibly tantalizing non line sequin T shirt dress.

[Michelle Visage]

Okay, I like this dress.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Okay, so get this, though. So. So where I wear these underneath the dress, I'm wearing glitter bordellos.

[Michelle Visage]

So with the chunky glitter, I did see that.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So guess what happens when you have no slit in the dress and you wear chunky glitter heels underneath the dress and no lining. The sequins all rub off from the friction of you walking. Now, I'm a pacer, so I'm practicing while pacing, pacing, pacing. So what happens is that there is a about 2ft of sequins completely sloughed off of the back of the dress. And I lucked out because we did not walk the Runway.

[Michelle Visage]

I didn't clock it at all.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Exactly. Because we never rocked them. We never, we never did a Runway. I would have been cooked a lot. Well, I was cooked alive because they, they never saw the back of the dress, but they saw the flat hair.

[Michelle Visage]

Well, the front was nothing to celebrate either. Girl, let's be honest.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I mean, I like the color.

[Michelle Visage]

It's a beautiful cranberry, beautiful pink.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, no, I love this. It's fisha.

[Michelle Visage]

Okay, well, that shows my brain. I'm just like, love that.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It's, it's, it's.

[Michelle Visage]

The issue is the hair. Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I don't know how to do hair.

[Michelle Visage]

No, no, no. You also don't know how to shop for hair. This came from CVS during Halloween.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, no. It was a 35 wig from Dorothy's. Her name was Jordan. Her name was Jordan.

[Michelle Visage]

Jordan.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She was hair Jordan. She was a hard front, and there was nothing soft about her. She was. And also it had that plastic sheen that right out the back, really plastic. She needed to be tied to the tailpip. You know what?

[Michelle Visage]

She needed a lot of things, I think, like, drag queens caught, like, dirtying up the wig. It needed to be sprayed with hairspray. Combed out. Yeah, spray with hairspray. Combed out like, five times.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

But guess what? Ask me how to do open heart surgery. You think I'm going to know how to do it?

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah. No, no.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So that's hair styling with me. I don't know how to do it. Not interested in learning how to do it. I'm never going to know how to do it. I don't care about hair. I want it to look good from somebody else. That's. I mean, everything else I'd love to learn how to do. I like to learn how to dj, you know what I mean?

[Michelle Visage]

It's also okay to not do every part of drag.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yes. But it's also not okay to not bring something for every occasion or to wear something that is flagrantly unsatisfactory.

[Michelle Visage]

Just knowing what I know now at your hosting look, that dress with an updo with some cool earrings. It could have easily been serviceable.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Serviceable dress. Serviceable. Yeah, serviceable.

[Michelle Visage]

Your body looks great.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, serviceable. And your face looks good. My face looks good. I mean, I'm, I'm. I. I definitely am, like, in the, like, with glaucoma passing, you know, and nothing crazy bad about the makeup. Thank. So I was going home.

[Michelle Visage]

You what?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Until I had the award. Because my. We sucked. We just. We are not that funny. I mean, we didn't suck, but we were not that funny.

[Michelle Visage]

And you guys didn't seem like you had a good rapport rhythm.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, we didn't have a good rhythm. And because she has her stick, I have mine, and I was going to do it in a Russian accent that. But that just did not make any sense with her. And, like. And I was just like, we never really got gelled so much, and it's hard to do that. It's as hard to, like, come up with chemistry with another person because we were kind of going on Tina and Amy.

[Michelle Visage]

Why didn't you want to do a character?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I just thought it was going to be corny. I. I thought it was going to be corny.

[Michelle Visage]

We will get there, but I skipped ahead a couple episodes. There's a part where RuPaul says, why don't you do the Russian character?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

And then your talking head is, I'm afraid to do it because it's the thing I do the best. And if I'm not good at that, then what am I good at?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. Well, if I fail at the thing that I feel like I'm the most gifted at, then you're a failure.

[Michelle Visage]

That made so much sense.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Well, yeah, because also, there was never an oppor. I never felt that I'm good at reading the temperature of the room. Like, I feel like I have that ability. And it just never was the vibe. No, it was like, it was. Because I. It was.

[Michelle Visage]

That character I started was already doing an accent.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

That's what I'm saying.

[Michelle Visage]

There's already one in the room.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

That's what I'm saying. Like, it. Realness was the vibe.

[Michelle Visage]

Realness was the vibe.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I was. And I've never been myself in drag up until this point. I'm either an imposter on the weekends with Bachelorettes or a Russian accent crazy person on Monday. I've never been myself in drag, and I was very feeling that. Like, my personality, but with drag on.

[Michelle Visage]

Right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

In Drag Race. Because I knew that when I left the show, God willing, I succeeded. I'm not traveling around doing the Russian accent, because I don't do that. I didn't want to be, like, a weird Russian person, fake Russian person. So I had to, like, negotiate that. And so I. We did our thing. It was, like, forgettable.

[Michelle Visage]

I thought Pearl was really good with Max.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Pearl was good.

[Michelle Visage]

Pearl does the. When Pearl does the ginger impression.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

What did she say?

[Michelle Visage]

Come on down to Gatorland, girl. Like, love that shit.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was cute.

[Michelle Visage]

And I love Pearl's outfit.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Max looks great, too.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Violet's dress, so. So in person. So it looked. It was all stone, so it was so heavy. It was so. It was a. A mesh dress, deep V, deep neckline, solid stones, and the most beautiful ombre effect. So heavy. Which it was like. Like 50 pounds or something. And it was dragging along. It looked gorgeous in the person. It still looked nice on tv, but.

[Michelle Visage]

It Was these stones didn't quite read.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Stones don't read.

[Michelle Visage]

Fame's dress was amazing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

The cap sleeve with the long glove.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, I loved it. I was one of my favorite outfits she's ever worn.

[Michelle Visage]

And then instead of crying, she makes a joke about, like, I was gonna cry, but damn, Botox will get you every time, actually. Funny. She was good.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. And the man upstairs. Thanks for the light, you know.

[Michelle Visage]

Thanks a lot. I look gorgeous.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Fame did a great job.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She did a great job. She did a good job. And I. This was the only point in the show where I was actually able to tell, Ru, like, this is the kind of funny I am.

[Michelle Visage]

Right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And she was the only one that laughed.

[Michelle Visage]

And I was like, oh, that's all you need.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

That's. That was, like, the most special moment up at that point, because. And I didn't. I had no idea what I was going to say. So when I got up there, I was, like, freaking out, and I was like. And I just said that. It was like, I had no idea. It wasn't planned or anything. And. And I was like. Because that's how I do it at the show in Boston. And, like, just improv. And I just. That came out of my mouth. And she laughed very, like, she laughed a lot. And I was like, oh, thank God. I'm not going home.

[Michelle Visage]

No, you did great.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. It was just I.

[Michelle Visage]

That really landed.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It landed. And it was like, Bob Ross was so random, and she was the only one that got it. She was the only one who knew that was right. And. And it was like. It was like, oh, that was great. And Isaac Mizrahi got it. Cause he's like. He said, I have a core of iron. I have a core of irony. I was like, that's what you need to recognize in a drag queen. Do you know what I mean?

[Michelle Visage]

A core of irony.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Like, you operate from a perspective of irony.

[Michelle Visage]

Sure.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Like, you know what? Like, Candy Ho is not ironic. Neither is. Neither is. I mean, ironic. Irreverent. Like, we're not. I don't think Jaden operates from a point of irony.

[Michelle Visage]

She's a fierce showgirl, I think, operating from a place of, like, you know.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It'S all a joke.

[Michelle Visage]

But what's funny is that you act like it's not.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

That is what makes it funny.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

That's why the joke of drag queen saying, I'm just a young woman. Whatever.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. The apparent truth is different from the obvious truth.

[Michelle Visage]

Yes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. So that wasn't.

[Michelle Visage]

I wasn't there, but As a viewer, I also thought that Kennedy and Jaden did okay.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

I mean, Ken, I love when Kennedy said, we look like a number 10.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. In a. Would she. Something in a wall clock and made her do that.

[Michelle Visage]

She said, stand over there. Go like this. She goes, my point.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Very funny. And all I said from the star of Tyler Perry's roots, Kennedy Davenport.

[Michelle Visage]

You said this?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yes. Completely improv. I had no idea. It just came out of my mouth. Came out of my mouth. And she said, straight from Kunta Kinte's hut. It's so funny. She's so good. She's so good.

[Michelle Visage]

Kennedy is great. She's great, everybody. Ginger's good in it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

It's. Ginger performs with Candy.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Right.

[Michelle Visage]

I think they kind of do this.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. In Ginger. Yeah. And it just steamrolls.

[Michelle Visage]

It's so hard. It's hard to perform with Ginger because she's so good.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Candy didn't stand a chance.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So. But Ginger could have done her a favor. But that's not her responsibility.

[Michelle Visage]

It's not a responsibility. But I mean, you and I go through this when we work together. I usually, I think, end up setting up the joke and then you usually have the punchline when we do our stage show. But if you both do a good job, it's everyone's life. Yes. It doesn't have to be. The straight man never does. Well.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Right.

[Michelle Visage]

Because setting up the joke can also be very funny.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Well, it's. You don't have a joke without a setup.

[Michelle Visage]

Right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You know what I mean? So it's. Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

It's a lot of responsibility. And you, You. It's so one on one. But you. If you make it about liking each other, look good. You both look good.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Like when I do pit stop, it's actually more about setting the other guest.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Up for their day, for their moment.

[Michelle Visage]

Really about you.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. That's a really good point. Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

It's a fun challenge, though. I liked it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I. And I'm shocked that they haven't done well, they probably have, but I think they should have another despise.

[Michelle Visage]

I love the fact that you guys really voted for each other.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yes.

[Michelle Visage]

And you won.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Media. Stuck with my 2 inch weenie. 2 inches hard.

[Michelle Visage]

Congratulations on the media stuff.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Great.

[Michelle Visage]

Does that. Did that kind of come up when you were touring and hooking up where guys like. Well, I heard.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, no, no. I was from. Because in tucked, I had my whole outlet.

[Michelle Visage]

The whole.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Well, you had the cage.

[Michelle Visage]

It was the people saw the cage and it was the Size of, like, a bingo cage. One of those, like, turning.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, it was the lottery.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah, it was one of those bingo cages. And.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, 27.

[Michelle Visage]

Oh, 27. Yeah. And you just spin it and it was to hit the clit.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No. I don't know. I don't know what that was.

[Michelle Visage]

So then there's no Runway.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Okay. So there's no.

[Michelle Visage]

But they do talk about your looks.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Jesus H. Christ shone down on me on this day because I truly. I was. Now, you have to understand because the sequins really do make an impact. When I was looking in the mirror at my dress, it was dazzling to me.

[Michelle Visage]

Are you talking about the.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

My. My pink T shirt?

[Michelle Visage]

Right, this.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

The. When the. The stage lights hit or the workroom lights hit my dress, the. In the mirror, it looked beautiful. Because sequins look beautiful.

[Michelle Visage]

Right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

But so I didn't even see the hair. You have to understand, Mama, I'm no hair person. Mama. I'm like, Brooke Hogan. Like, I don't do hair.

[Michelle Visage]

Pearl introduces that great joke.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Hysterical. Hysterical comb.

[Michelle Visage]

And then you tell Mich. I think you tell Michelle this hair's from the Brooke Hogan collection.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, love. Yeah. She was. She's like, your hair's too flat. Whatever. And then. But that was really the only criticism I got. It was basic dress. And also, I was, like, not that great in the challenge, so I think I was in the bottom. But no, I was safe. Safe. It was safe.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah, it was safe.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

But Kasha didn't deserve to be in the bottom, I don't think.

[Michelle Visage]

Well, our bottom ends up being Kasha and Candy Ho.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. And it's a bummer because Kasha flubbed one word, and they repeated that three times.

[Michelle Visage]

Three times. Yeah. It's like she said welcome.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Wrong. She just flubbed over welcome. She's like. She stuttered.

[Michelle Visage]

And anybody who knows Kasha knows that that whore is fine in a microphone. She's not a flopper.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She's not a flopper. She would have done a great job on her own.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Like. And I think I would have done much better on my own as well.

[Michelle Visage]

Unfortunately for Kasha, lip syncing is candies.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. She's a Terminator.

[Michelle Visage]

Berries.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She's a Terminator. Yeah. Also, it was to Ariana Grande.

[Michelle Visage]

I know.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And no, no. What was it?

[Michelle Visage]

That was. That was.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

That was. That was Death becomes.

[Michelle Visage]

It was Lover Girl.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, yeah. Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Great song.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Great song.

[Michelle Visage]

Actually, that little birdie told me that you feel. That wasn't even.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

That wasn't in anybody's. Like, that was fair for both of them, I feel.

[Michelle Visage]

Well, because Kasha probably knew it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. And also, like, when. When J was it When Max had to do.

[Michelle Visage]

Oh, what was it? No more lies.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. I was like, good luck, whitey girl.

[Michelle Visage]

It's really. It's really rough.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You know what I mean?

[Michelle Visage]

Let's move on. Shout out to Kasha.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Okay, so Kasha, love, love, love you.

[Michelle Visage]

Oh, do we have a note from Kasha?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Let's see.

[Michelle Visage]

Shout out to Kasha. It's. Listen, I never got to do. Go ahead, Snatch Game. I knew. I kind of had this intuition that it was headed that way. And so when we got to do the little fashion Runway Bjork, I was like, okay, great. I can create this stuff out of paper and have this fabulous. And the teamwork with Katya was terrific. And so I threw in Joan Rivers because I was like, you better throw something in to show people. And I thought that that was kind of headed in the right direction. And then, you know, elimination station happened. And honestly, when I was lip syncing, I thought, well, I won this.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Damn.

[Michelle Visage]

Not so much coming back.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Okay. Yeah, yeah. So we'll. We'll get back. We'll get back to that in a minute.

[Michelle Visage]

Shout out to Kasha. Love.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She has been so great to keep in touch with over the years, and she's so fabulous, and she's just great.

[Michelle Visage]

Her sobriety is. She's very inspiring with that.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. There's always time for a meeting.

[Michelle Visage]

She does activism with, like, drag queens. We needed children. She does this series where she reads dad jokes in drag in succession. So she has a bunch of slips of paper, and they're all like, Laffy Taffy jokes. And she sits and reads, like, 10 of them at once.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Fierce.

[Michelle Visage]

Love that. Oh, yeah, I saw her lip sync it at a senior center.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Palliative princess, Mrs. Kasha Davis.

[Michelle Visage]

Maybe they're doing some kind of enrollment special and she gets a deal.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. This episode of the Bald and the Beautiful is brought to you by Wayfair. Ah, late summer. The time of year when the sun still kisses your skin, but there's a hint, a suggestion, a slight crisp whisper in the breeze, like nature itself is turning the page of a well worn book. You feel it too, don't you? That ache in the cockles of your heart to cozy up, clear out, and craft a nest for the autumnal season ahead. And darlings, when that itch hits you, go to Wayfair, because Wayfair gets it. They have bedding that makes you weep with tears of joy at its softness. Towel so plush you'll never want to get dressed after a shower. Office chairs so comfy and stylish that they make your home office feel like a Parisian publisher. And cookware. I got this coppery dream of a Dutch oven that makes me feel like I'm on a haunted cooking show in the woods, hosted by me and the ghost of August Escoffier. And let's talk fast. Free delivery. My chaise lounge arrived insanely fast. And it was gorgeous. A jet black velvet beast that tied my entire bedroom together like a warm hug from Morticia Adams. Whether you're storing away the summer madness, reviving the guest bedroom, or just emotionally preparing to hibernate with a stack of romance novels, soft tacos in a lava lamp, Wayfair has everything. Literally everything. So don't mourn the end of summer. Romanticize the hell out of fall. At Wayfair, you'll find just the thing to help your home fall into place. Find all your must haves, from furniture and decor to appliances and cookware all in one convenient place. Get organized, refreshed, and back to your routine. For way less, head to Wayfair.com right now to shop all things home. That's W A Y f a I r.com Wayfair Every style Every Home this episode of the Bald and the Beautiful is brought to you by BetterHelp. Let's be honest, we all do it. Every morning I wake up, pick up my phone, and scroll past a man in a yurt screaming about cold plunges, a blonde woman whispering about gratitude while holding a quartz egg to the moon and 12 different reels yelling at me to drink chlorophyll or detach from screens with my eyes closed while sitting in darkened ruined with my ice in my underwear. It's like an idiot's parade of enlightenment, and I'm stuck in the back seat next to a charlatan selling mushroom powder that will make my fart smell like pineapple. But in this glittery avalanche of wellness and healing, how do you know what's actually going to help you? What if instead of Constant scrolling in $99 be semen smoothies? It was an actual conversation? A real one, with a licensed therapist trained to cut through the chaos and help you find clarity, not just more content. That's what BetterHelp does. With over 30,000 therapists and 5 million people served globally, it's the world's largest online therapy platform. You can connect right from your phone, switch therapists if you need to, and actually fit therapy into your life. No crystals or pelvic Floor Jade Eggs required I am here to say that therapy can really help. And with an App store rating of 4.9 out of 5 based on over 1.7 million client reviews, BetterHelp is a great, convenient option. Whether you're dealing with burnout boundaries or just trying to find your footing in a world that thinks lavender oil can fix your repellent personality, BetterHelp is here to help you make sense of you. Because the best version of yourself, it's not curated, it's created one session at a time. As the largest online therapy provider in the world, BetterHelp can provide access to mental health professionals with a diverse variety of expertise. Talk it out with BetterHelp, our listeners get 10% off their first month at betterhelp.com bald that's BetterHelp H E L P.com bald hi, it's your girl Monet.

[Monet X Change]

X Change and I'm here to tell you about Google Gemini. College students, listen up. Girl, have you ever been staring at your notes and you feel like they were written in ancient Greece? You wouldn't know what the heck the Temple of the Parthenon went to the Pantheon, to the Leaning Tower of wherever the hell. Well girl, with Google Gemini you can take the most complicated class topics and turn them into snack sized ideas. Hours of research, girl, done in minutes. And those never ending class notes, Gemini helps you turn them into practice quizzes that actually help you get it. And get this, Gemini can turn long readings into audio. So yes, you can literally y' all turn an entire textbook into a podcast. So check out Google Gemini and let your brain breathe, girl. Recently I used it because y' all know, years ago I talked about about when I went to ancient Mesopotamia and you know, it got me to thinking where exactly was ancient Mesopotamia? And I want to learn more about the cultures and customs there. Like the Euphrates, the Tigris. I wanted to learn about all them and I just plopped that into Gemini and Gemini gave me a breakdown, girl, and I felt smarter for it. The great news is Students get Google Gemini's Pro plan free for one year. Sign up by October 6th to get free access to Gemini 2.5 Pro, unlimited image uploads, deep research notebook, LM2 terabytes of storage, and more. Visit gemini.google/students to learn more and sign up. Terms apply.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Okay, so next episode is this is.

[Michelle Visage]

Whatever Happened to Baby Merle Ginsburg.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

This is Rue Hollywood Stories Whatever Happened to Merle Ginsburg? This is by far the worst challenge of the entire series. I'm gonna. No, I'm gonna. And I'm gonna fly by this because it doesn't deserve a lot of airtime. It really doesn't. So there's three tones in three points of view to these scripts. Merle Ginsburg, who is a judge on seasons one and two, was. Was replaced by Michelle Visager on season three, I believe. And so they do this whole. They bring her back and they create this, you know, storyline of what happened to her from the perspective of Rue, the perspective of Merle, the perspective of Michelle, and we have three groups doing that. It's. It sucks. But what's interesting is that there's. Merle's tone is straightforward. Michelle's the villain. Michelle's story is pretty straightforward. Merle's the villain. Rue's story is absurd.

[Michelle Visage]

Yes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So it's absurd in theater of the absurd, to be honest.

[Michelle Visage]

The flashback elements are the only really funny parts of this.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yes. Yes.

[Michelle Visage]

Where the girls are doing voiceover.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yes.

[Michelle Visage]

And then they're doing the crazy.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

The security camera footage. I was like a human poker table. Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

That was funny. How did you do that then?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Fame copied me.

[Michelle Visage]

She did.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. She did it back then, too.

[Michelle Visage]

What?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I think maybe she didn't copy me, but she did it, too. But was the mis. Money.

[Michelle Visage]

You're like, oh, no, I copied her.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Sorry.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

That actually could have been the case. No, it was so.

[Michelle Visage]

Or maybe it was written in.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, it wasn't. It wasn't. It was. This was very, very, very bad. And, you know, because it was. It had to be saved by jello. Rest wrestling. By boobs coming out in jello. Wrestling was the only way to save this turkey.

[Michelle Visage]

And I have a vivid memory of Pearl telling me that, you know, the air that's frozen in there.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

And you're covered in jelly. Pearl said her teeth were chattering.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, you're cold. It was not good. It was. I was so forgettably bad and. No, no, not bad. I was, like, serviceable, but completely forgettable. Ginger was so funny. So funny. She was even funnier. They cut out some stuff, and Kennedy was fine. She wasn't that great, but we had a great time doing it. We knew we were not going home. All of our runways were terrible.

[Michelle Visage]

Is this Britannia 45? Is this Brittany?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

We had the toy section and. And then she. And then. Yes. No, no, that was Snatch Game.

[Michelle Visage]

Okay.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

This was. Death becomes her.

[Michelle Visage]

How did you die again?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, shark on the foot. It was so.

[Michelle Visage]

These were so bad. The vampire Candy. Love candy.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Okay, we're go down on the List. But. But first, let me say this about the Rue Hollywood Stories. Nobody understood that. That it was theater of the absurd from Rue's point of view, because it would. They were non sequiturs. They were absurd non sequitur lines.

[Michelle Visage]

Right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Like, here's a muffin from Mars. I love a strong female. Like, it didn't make any sense on purpose.

[Michelle Visage]

Right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

But. So they never got that. And it didn't.

[Michelle Visage]

They didn't get that.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

They didn't get that. And. And even if they did, it wouldn't have worked well. Again, like shakes queer. Terrible writing.

[Michelle Visage]

Just. I would say anybody competing, act really big. Huge. Let them tell you what to.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Let them tell you to turn it down. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Make strong choices.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Huge. Big.

[Michelle Visage]

Because they'll tell you what doesn't work.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. So Max was terrible.

[Michelle Visage]

Max is terrible.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Max was terrible. That whole group sucked.

[Michelle Visage]

Fame was terrible.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Fame was awful. And because fame got sad. She's the worst person. Get settled with theater of the absurd.

[Michelle Visage]

I. I kind of liked Ginger as, like.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, Ginger was amazing. She should have won.

[Michelle Visage]

But what she did with Michelle was Tony Soprano was not even Michelle. She made a strong choice. That totally was great.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was. She made her an ultra villain from Sopranos.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah. I think I liked Kennedy. Was Kennedy RuPaul?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She was fine.

[Michelle Visage]

She was fine.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

I liked Pearl as. I mean, I. I like all these Michelle Visage costumes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

And they're all doing like, Violet was 2012 Michelle.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. Well, we were given the costume. Yeah. Violet was not great.

[Michelle Visage]

What did you think of your little Merle Ginsburg? How'd you feel in that pussy little wig?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I felt like old maiden type of shit bag.

[Michelle Visage]

I felt the beret with, like, a scarf.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

My brown bob. My thin brown bob. And also you look like you work.

[Michelle Visage]

At the library, mama.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Not even like I'm. Look, it's.

[Michelle Visage]

It looks like you use the computers at the library.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, it was bad. It looks like I'm like, voting against gay rights. Rights is for sure. You know what I mean? She. Which is what Merl does. Yeah, yeah, yeah. So it was. And also, no offense to Merle, but she was a very milquetoast, lukewarm guest judge anyway.

[Michelle Visage]

To be honest, I think the way you played it was the only way to play it, which is to make her very Sally simple. Just like, goody, goody.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I was like.

[Michelle Visage]

Because Michelle is written as like, this. Who's stealing her job?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. So I. I get a note to, like, Ross is like, really? Really? Go, go there and so I. This is my opinion, because Ginger's won so many challenges, and they want to throw me a bone.

[Michelle Visage]

Right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

They throw me a bone. I did not deserve to win that challenge. And it's just an objective fact.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So. And Ginger should have won. Ginger should have won. I mean, I think maybe because her Runway was so. It wasn't bad, but it was.

[Michelle Visage]

Yes, it was.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was okay.

[Michelle Visage]

It was really bad.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, it was so bad. And mine was so stupid. It was real stupid. Did.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Like, it was just dumb. Oh. So Kennedy. So. So here's what I think they decided to do. They gave it to me because they couldn't. They had to dismiss Kennedy.

[Michelle Visage]

It was crazy.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

They had to get rid of her. There was no way she could. There was no justification for that outfit. I Even. How. That outfit was broken. I sewed a new zipper onto it because the. The zipper was broken. Nothing. And while I'm doing that, this is before the Runway, I was like, like, girl, what is this? Like, what is this outfit?

[Michelle Visage]

This is the thing, too, Obviously. Obviously. She didn't have it made for Drag Race.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, no.

[Michelle Visage]

But the question is, then, what was it for?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It's so iconic.

[Michelle Visage]

It's giving Thanksgiving.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It's.

[Michelle Visage]

It's giving chicken drumstick. It's giving.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It's.

[Michelle Visage]

It hand turkey.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It's so wild.

[Michelle Visage]

Enough blood coming out of the boob.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Stones all over the stones all over the face. And also the. The bizarrely horrendous, like, abusive storyline. Well, I was out there hooking, and I would. A trick had gutted me and then threw me in a dumpster. But I didn't die. I survived. Yeah. Crystalized. Very strange. I love the mythology of it, though. The three of us then are dismissed. Everybody else is on the. On the. On the chopping block. And we had. We had such a great time in Untucked. It was so, so, so fun. It was the first time, actually. We got to lay out, like, let our hair down. And the three of us who had the fucking Kiki of all. Kiki was so fun and untucked. But I didn't deserve to win that challenge at all. Ginger should have won it, but I just. I like, again, I think they just. They needed to just.

[Michelle Visage]

At least your outfit showed that you died.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Like, Kennedy's was not a death.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, it was not.

[Michelle Visage]

And Ginger's. Yeah, it was so terrible.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Terrible. So then let's go down the list. Fame. Stunning. If she was just model. Enough with the. The mugging and the hands and stuff. If she had Just walked, like Karen Mulder down the Runway. Yeah, that makeup.

[Michelle Visage]

I wish I would have got to do this Runway. This is one of the only ones I think would have been 10 years later. Okay, what did you do? It was that little dress that looked like a hair.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You were electrocuted.

[Michelle Visage]

Yes. And I had a hair dryer that shot smoke, and then one side of my wig was completely black and blown this way, and it wasn't that great, but it was certainly better than some of the other garbage I had.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. Candy. How unforgivable. You're a vampire. No. Yeah. I mean, like. And then I hated pearls. I'm sorry.

[Michelle Visage]

Plastic surgery. I liked it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Did. What about that said death.

[Michelle Visage]

She died on the table.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

On the table.

[Michelle Visage]

Classic surgery.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Death down on the table with bandages.

[Michelle Visage]

I don't know.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It doesn't make any sense.

[Michelle Visage]

Oh, yeah, I guess it doesn't. But I love the makeup.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She died of sepsis two weeks later.

[Michelle Visage]

I like the look. I like the makeup. I like the hair slick back.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I don't like it.

[Michelle Visage]

I like the bandage around the middle. I like.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I thought she was so. I thought. I just thought she was capable, and I know she was capable of something so much good. Cooler. A violet.

[Michelle Visage]

Max's was cool.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. And people didn't ever get that. The first time she walked, it bled.

[Michelle Visage]

It bled in real time.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Bled in real time. But I can't believe they didn't use that clip.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah, she walked. And the first time she walks, it bleeds down the dress.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was very cunty. It was very.

[Michelle Visage]

She looks amazing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Gorgeous.

[Michelle Visage]

Max, we'll probably never watch Drag Race again.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

She looks so good on Z7. It's crazy.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. It's all of us.

[Michelle Visage]

Look, Max looks like timeless porcelain. Beautiful.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Hunty. And then violets, of course. So what did she die of?

[Michelle Visage]

Oh, asphyxiation.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Asphyxiation from core.

[Michelle Visage]

From too much corsetry.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Which she did have to. Which she did have a moment, actually. I don't know if people know that. That between Runway walks, she started to get like. And had to, like, take a moment.

[Michelle Visage]

It was 18 inches, wasn't it?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was really intense, and she was very in pain.

[Michelle Visage]

It looks great.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It looks cool. Yeah, it looks cool. Oh, she was, like, painted herself kind of bluish.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah. I don't know if today you could use an oxygen tank on Drag Race. Is it Ableist? I don't know.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

But she also had the thingy. It's, like, well within. It didn't make any sense. It's like, why don't you loosen the corset.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Like you're going to carry an oxygen tank when you could just do your corset. You know what I mean? Yeah, I don't. I thought it was cool, but it literally made no. No sense.

[Michelle Visage]

It did make sense. I did like it, though.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, no. I mean, it's. It was legendary, but again, it just didn't make any sense.

[Michelle Visage]

It's really cool. Jaden is Jaden so bad? Ariana Grande is the guest judge.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Which is very cool.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And she was. It was a big hubbub. Like, it was a big hubbub. Like, it was a big deal.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She was a huge star and I think she had a huge entourage, but.

[Michelle Visage]

She fell off now.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. She's a nobody.

[Michelle Visage]

She's a nobody.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. Frank. It's all about Frankie. Of course. Who else?

[Michelle Visage]

And it was Break Free is the lip sync. Great song.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. Which I was hoping to lip sync to because then I could wrestle with the shark.

[Michelle Visage]

Oh, right. You were hoping to be in the bottom just to wrestle shark.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I knew I had a point of view during the lip sync. This is when I famously said, it was a long battle with leukemia, but at least I was surrounded by friends and family.

[Michelle Visage]

Explain that.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was a non sequitur about my death.

[Michelle Visage]

Who'd you say this to?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

RuPaul.

[Michelle Visage]

So what did RuPaul ask you that? You said.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She said, do you have anything to say?

[Michelle Visage]

And you said, it was a long.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Battle with leukemia, but at least I was surrounded by friends and family.

[Michelle Visage]

And did anyone laugh?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Not one. And not even a chuckle. Not even a snicker. It was.

[Michelle Visage]

It Paul just said, thank you.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She's like, thank you, Katya. It was like. It was. It was unbelievable. I thought it was hysterical.

[Michelle Visage]

It's hilarious.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Hilarious. I mean, I obviously died of a shark attack.

[Michelle Visage]

Right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

But it's so funny to me. That's so funny. I guess it just didn't.

[Michelle Visage]

Do you know what? That reminds me, if you've ever seen not another teen movie.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No.

[Michelle Visage]

There's this part where this girl Janie is painting, and she's like, it's my mom. And they cut to the painting and it's a stick figure.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

And then the guy goes. She goes, oh, my mom died. She was driving fast, the roads were wet. And he goes, oh, my God, Janie. A car accident. She goes, no, cancer.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. It's great. It's great.

[Michelle Visage]

It's not that cancer's funny. It's not misdirecting. Yes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It's like it's cold. Looking at a picture of George Washington.

[Michelle Visage]

I love that. I wish they would have aired it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I know it. It was so. It was so bizarre, though.

[Michelle Visage]

Very norm core. Gay people would have been in a gay barman, like, yes, yes. And then you would have said that. It would have been like.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

They would have been like, yeah, no, is she okay? I know three people who I admired that would have laughed at it. That's why I told it.

[Michelle Visage]

I would have loved.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Okay, so then that's it. And then they. Candy. And shout out to Candy.

[Michelle Visage]

Great lip synchro.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Fabulous, beautiful. Assassin. Assassin.

[Michelle Visage]

Let's hear from Candy. Candy Marie Ho.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Candy Ho]

Time at that time, when I had to lip sync for the third time, I was like, like, literally over it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I was.

[Candy Ho]

I was done. I was so exhausted mentally. Like, at the. At that time, I didn't know what was going wrong. Like, why was I doing so bad? But. And that really drained me. That really drained me. And just having to be with all these amazing drag queens with these big personalities, and I'm over here just being this showgirl and entertainer and performer. But I didn't know I was missing so many other important things that make a drag queen.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So.

[Candy Ho]

Yeah, by that time, when I had to do Break Free, I was like, I was ready. I was like, okay, great song to go.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, yeah, fabulous.

[Candy Ho]

This song was everything.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was a fierce song.

[Candy Ho]

When they told us Ariana Grande was gonna be there, that was even more of a like, okay, I gotta slay this song. I remember, like, they gave us that song maybe like two days before the lip sync to learn.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Damn.

[Candy Ho]

We really didn't. We hadn't heard the song because it was new. And I remember just being in my hotel room, just listening to the song over and over and over and over and dancing, Dancing in my hotel room. I was like, ah, I gotta slay. I gotta do this. But I don't know, for some weird reason, I always felt like, okay, I'm on the bottom, but this is my moment. I was always feeling myself so much when I had. When I was tea.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

That's good, right?

[Candy Ho]

But for me, it was a great moment that I was showing my talent.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I mean. Yeah, like, especially because her, she got to show her her forte three times.

[Michelle Visage]

That's the thing. When you're a good lip syncer, it's a huge gift to be able to lip sync.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Because club owners are gonna hire you to do just that. They're watching and because sometimes, you know, they're not hiring fame to do that.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You know, they're hiring her to do something else.

[Michelle Visage]

Sometimes they did.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, sometimes they did, but they're hiring her to do something else.

[Michelle Visage]

Right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You know, so that so great. Blah, blah. Moving on. Snatch Game. This was a really hard episode for me to watch because it's so not cringy. It's just like, oh, God, like, ugh, being, like, vulnerable. But this is when I told Rue.

[Michelle Visage]

This is the addicted to anxiety conversation.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And also this is when I said, I have to confess something to you. I'm terrified of you. And this is the way we had that moment that didn't make the cut. But that's what, that's what kick started the anxiety thing. And then we got into it, a big, long conversation, because at this time, I was like, I really need to go to a meeting, because I hadn't, I hadn't. I had been going to meetings five days a week for about two years.

[Michelle Visage]

Well, I watched this episode. I did some Googling about meetings, and the Internet says that if it's you and one other addict, it counts as a meeting. Do you feel that way?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No. Not when there's cameras.

[Michelle Visage]

Right. Right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was, it was a tough thing for me to do because I was like, okay, I know this is fake. Like, but I know I need this. So is it even possible to be authentic? And it actually kind of was.

[Michelle Visage]

Mary, you're sobbing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, I know, but I mean, like, it's still not real.

[Michelle Visage]

I've never seen you cry like that in my life. To this day.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It's. It's. But it's. I don't know.

[Michelle Visage]

I don't know why you won't cry like that.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Because when you pork me, it feels so good.

[Michelle Visage]

Do I have to wear the fake eyebrows, like, fame to get you to open up a little bit?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I mean, I was like. Because it's, it's, it's staged. You know, they say, like, why don't you go talk to. To. And I was like, I mean, I, I wanted to. And we did, but. And we. I got over the, the inauthentic part of it pretty quickly because I, I, I actually felt that way. But it's just a weird thing. I'm not really comfortable with that on reality tv. It's not my, it's not my gig.

[Michelle Visage]

I get it. You know, I get it because you're there. There's a discussion coming up, I think, in this season, about my boyfriend's family not liking drag and that. I feel like there's some things looking back, really, like, I didn't have to.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Say all that I wish. Yeah. I wish this conversation never happened. Although I know for a fact, because I have all the messages that it. People say all. Even now, they say, like, I. Your conversation with Ms. Fame, you know, so it was very impactful for a lot of people. I do not in any way, shape or form. I've never wanted. I don't want and I will never want to be a spokesperson for sobriety on. Obviously. But, like, it did help people.

[Michelle Visage]

Right. Because you're. You're also almost. I don't know. I would perceive that you are taking something that's a personal journey that we all know has ups and downs, and you're inviting the world to be critical of upholding you to that.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You're inviting the world to. To microscopically to participate in your sobriety, to monitor it.

[Michelle Visage]

Right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Evaluate it, whatever. And so, like. Like, me and Kasha are very, very different experiences of this. Her. Her going, like, public about it has been very helpful for her.

[Michelle Visage]

Sure.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And. And has. I think that that that provides some. A layer of accountability. Me. Not at all. In fact, it actually makes me. I don't think it's Makes me. It makes it worse, but it makes.

[Michelle Visage]

Me lie more, to be honest. I've seen people know that you're an addict and then come up to you and ask you if you want drugs.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Girl. I was in Texas. I was in Texas. I was offered cocaine three times by the same person.

[Michelle Visage]

Love it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And I was cocaine people.

[Michelle Visage]

They don't remember what they're saying, and they talk a lot.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So crazy. So. But then we do. I.

[Michelle Visage]

Did somebody say something about cocaine?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No. Champagne. So let's, like, zip through Snatch Game.

[Michelle Visage]

Because, well, there's some highs and some lows.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Everybody is garbage except Kennedy.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yep. No, Pearl.

[Michelle Visage]

Oh, Pearl.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So here's my top. Here's. Here's my. This is my. This is my top. Bottom. Safe. Okay. Ready? Top. Pearl, Kennedy for sure. Okay. Pearl, Kennedy, top for sure. Safe. Ginger.

[Michelle Visage]

Ginger, You.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Me. Ginger, me. Violet.

[Michelle Visage]

Love it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Okay. Bottom. Jaden. Max. Max. Fame.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Story closed. Case closed. That's the truth.

[Michelle Visage]

Agreed. Pearl was amazing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She was.

[Michelle Visage]

She pulled that out.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Very excited. A medical mystery. Everything was great.

[Michelle Visage]

The makeup. She looks like a different person.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She looked nuts. Exactly what you want to Snatch Game.

[Michelle Visage]

She.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And she got me excited.

[Michelle Visage]

The makeup dialed it up to, like, madam.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Also.

[Michelle Visage]

She was, like, doing that level.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She literally came out of her show.

[Michelle Visage]

She was amazing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Like, she. That was so funny.

[Michelle Visage]

It was hard to believe that was Pearl doing that.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

As you realize how many times I do this in my head since, for the last 10 years. I'm very excited. And the little dog, it was so.

[Michelle Visage]

I've never even seen that show. And I was just like, didn't matter.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

That's the whole success, you know that the success of your character depends on having no knowledge of that character. Is it funny?

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She was hysterical. I didn't think Adele was that funny. No shade to ginger. It was just fat jokes.

[Michelle Visage]

Adele was fine.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

We're not doing fat jokes.

[Michelle Visage]

We're not doing fat jokes. It's fine.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, it's fine.

[Michelle Visage]

I. Kennedy. Kennedy, the way she took him, first of all, did a man.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Huge risk.

[Michelle Visage]

And I watched the Little Richard documentary a couple months ago. Little Richard did dragon. Little Richard performed with drag queens. Little Richard wore makeup and wigs.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was like Liberace.

[Michelle Visage]

Yes. And so at the time, it was like, wow, you're doing a man. But now I'm like, not really.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, no, no. It's like doing Boy George. It's like doing, you know, whatever. David Bowie. Like a kiss. You know what I mean? That kind of thing.

[Michelle Visage]

It'd be like doing Timothy Chalamet.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. It'd be doing, like, Josh Brolin.

[Michelle Visage]

Rosie. Rosie.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

But she was so. I mean, and if she was funnier, like, so.

[Michelle Visage]

Kennedy was unbelievable.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And she was so. She was. She was much wittier than she had previously been. We knew she was funny, but she was quick and witty and fabulous.

[Michelle Visage]

There's a part where I wrote one of my notes. Is Pearls Transcendent?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Shut up.

[Michelle Visage]

Pearls Transcendent.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

I don't like when people do. Other drag queens in general.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No.

[Michelle Visage]

But don't do Alaska. Don't do RuPaul. Don't do drag queens.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Don't do Laganja. Don't. But she. It would have been better than Donatella. And thank God we didn't have dueling, boring Donatellas.

[Michelle Visage]

Well, I wrote that Donatello's hard. I wrote that Susie is serviceable. Donatello is hard. But I love Donatell. Me. That was your best Snatch Game impersonation.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Donna, tell me that was your best celebrity impersonation. I.

[Michelle Visage]

It howled. It ate.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I howled.

[Michelle Visage]

It's amazing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I, I, I, I. I howled on the main stage. That was so funny. So they. There was some weird production stuff going on. I was not funny. I really did not kill. And Tamar did not think I was hierarchical. So there was some weird things going on there.

[Michelle Visage]

Right? Tamar, the girl, every time she throws her head backs and laughs, her nose looks like a light switch.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Also, like, she, like, no, no, Shade to her. She is on another planet. I don't know what she's on or not. Not drugs, but, like, she's just not on the same wavelength. It was very.

[Michelle Visage]

She's one of us, though, for sure.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Is she?

[Michelle Visage]

I think she's one of us.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

What?

[Michelle Visage]

Dragoon.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, yeah. She's a dragon.

[Michelle Visage]

She's Dragoon.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, I guess so.

[Michelle Visage]

She's Dragoon. I wrote down this. I wrote Kennedy's life changing. There's a part where RuPaul asks her a question and she says, well, Rue, it was a bathhouse with a dark room and glory holes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, shut up. Like this first. Shut up was so funny. Like, it was idiot funny.

[Michelle Visage]

How did she think of that? And how was she so sure it was going to be so good?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I don't think she was. I mean, I think she. She. I think she was legitimately. She was incredible. She was. And she really, really, really was. Just like, everyone needs a tight screw.

[Michelle Visage]

It's amazing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It was the perfect. Like, she. It was. She unintentionally followed the formula catchphrase, zippy. Like, have a repeat one thing three times. You know what I mean? Like, it was the Shut up.

[Michelle Visage]

Perfect. And she was doing a very even more heightened version of it, which is the key.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

You're not all that. I hate when the queens are like, I'm going to do the most unclockable illusion. It's not that at all.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I know.

[Michelle Visage]

And obviously I'm a master of Snatch Game, so you can ask me anytime.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You got to do something. You got to. If the. If the person has a personality, that's a seven out of ten. You got to go 14.

[Michelle Visage]

Right, right, right, right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

So. And then. So, leather and lace Runway. This is to me by one of the very. The weakest runways out of all the girls. Oh, yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

I've had one option, really. I was going to do Lana Del Rey.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

That would have tanked.

[Michelle Visage]

I was really into that album Born to Die.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

And my.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I did that for my audition.

[Michelle Visage]

Okay. Yeah. I had a white button up shirt, a brown wig with flowers in the hair.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oof. Baby. That would have been.

[Michelle Visage]

It would have been awful.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

That would have been hard.

[Michelle Visage]

I have never been able to do an impersonation of anyone.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

One down.

[Michelle Visage]

I don't have any.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I mean, I was going to do Spit Line of Horina, but that just doesn't. I don't. I don't. I just don't think Russian accents are funny.

[Michelle Visage]

I disagree.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I mean, they are, but, like, you have to, like, from My point of view, I'm like. I don't know. I just. It. It's low energy. Like, it's like. Like, you know, Russian people talk like this. It's really low energy. I don't know. It's just.

[Michelle Visage]

But fame did it. It or no. Fame plane did it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I don't think that was funny.

[Michelle Visage]

Oh, is. Isn't that artist Ukrainian as well?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Serbian, but it was Slavic. It was Slavic Slavic.

[Michelle Visage]

I thought that worked. I don't know. I was gonna learn all the way. I'm sure it also would have been bad. I'm not a. I don't have an impersonation Mama.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

We gotta talk about Max's Sharon.

[Michelle Visage]

Oh, no. When did the hurt begin?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, and you know what? In the. In the horrible thing. And people got to realize that position. The worst.

[Michelle Visage]

Did it. You know, did it dress.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

First one.

[Michelle Visage]

Did it dress as Raymond?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

First one. You have the girl Ginger had about four hours to come up with her.

[Michelle Visage]

And by the time. If you're last, you can just make jokes about other people's answers.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Hello. And then you. And you quickly realize you don't even have to answer the question.

[Michelle Visage]

You don't.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You just have to make her laugh. Doesn't matter. You don't have to follow any rules. Just be funny.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You don't have to look like the person. You have to sound like them. You just have to be a. Idiot. It.

[Michelle Visage]

I mean, look at Bob doing Carol Channing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

She doesn't look like Carol Channing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No.

[Michelle Visage]

Or whatever.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, it doesn't matter. It just amazing. So. Oh, God, Max was so tough, and I think I was.

[Michelle Visage]

Looked like Sharon.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

The. See, that's what happens with people. They get caught up in the look. Yeah, they look. She looked exactly like her. She kind of sounded like her, but there was none of the. The Elvira Punny. Funniness.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah. Because, I mean, Drag Race, Sharon, everybody teak.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You know what I mean? Like, she. She said what she would have answered to those questions, and it's not that funny.

[Michelle Visage]

Max sent us a voice note, and she does touch on Snatch Game. So let's skip around a little bit.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Okay. Okay. I'm pretty sure I just, like, blacked out through the whole thing. And I was up in that very first corner where I had absolutely no time to terrifying. To terrifying. Think or change my little. My little quips and my improvisations. So that was definitely a hard, hard, hard thing in the whole freaking episode where I got eliminated and had to sit down on stage because I couldn't breathe. And all of that. Not a fun. Not a fun time. I was mostly just thinking, oh, God, I'm gonna disappoint people at home. I'm gonna get broken up with. Is okay. Jesus Christ.

[Michelle Visage]

We have to. Can we just do a little bit of a. The thing is, you and I are here watching season seven. Honestly, I'm gonna tell you something. I spend very little time thinking about how good you and I are. I spend a lot of time thinking about how good all these other people are. People like Max should not have anything to be ashamed of about what they did on Drag Race.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I'm invisible on this season. It's what I did after the show.

[Michelle Visage]

I worked in catering.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, yeah, I know.

[Michelle Visage]

Okay.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I mean, this was like I was telling people, you Want to go 10 one girl?

[Michelle Visage]

Yes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

These are. There's so much. Just so much to be proud of. She's still one of the most. Still unique girl.

[Michelle Visage]

Go watch, like, a YouTube Max Runway compilation.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Show me another drag queen who looks who. Who gives the same essence. There still hasn't been one, so that is such a feat to be proud of.

[Michelle Visage]

Good in glamor airways.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Everything she made was cool, fabulous, and shakes queer.

[Michelle Visage]

Shakes queer. She was one of the only good parts of it. Max, you were great.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Her entrance look was incredible.

[Michelle Visage]

Max is from Wisconsin. I'm from Wisconsin. Max and I went to college together, and it's never addressed on the show. Max and I went to music, both went to Oxford beauty school. We both went to Paul Mitchell off the Freeway. We went to. We went to school together. We did two musicals together. We went to ballet together, and we both did drag, but never really around each other. He was under 21.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, my God.

[Michelle Visage]

I was 21, working in clubs, and I. So when I showed up on Drag Race and he was there, it was so freaky, I couldn't believe.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And also, he's talking in weird.

[Michelle Visage]

That's the other thing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

My accent from Wisconsin is a little different than his. Different angles.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. I do Drake. Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

But, Max, you are absolutely incredible. It's crazy.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

One of a kind. One of a kind.

[Michelle Visage]

Well, can we skip ahead? I mean, we do have a bunch of critiques, including before Max's corset comes off, Tamar says that you look like Brittany, 45. Which, honestly, now that we're seeing Britney at 45, I'll take it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

I mean, and by the way, the. The Britney people would be, like, at 85, 105, still eats, you know, Britney fans.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Delulu, take it.

[Michelle Visage]

Okay. I also just had some Quick critiques. Your Runway.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Look, I don't want to talk about it. I. I mean, there's nothing. There's nothing to talk about. It. It sucks. Sucks. I mean, it's. And it's okay because it sucks, and that's okay. I made it. It sucks. Let's move on. Okay, I made it. It sucks. Let's move on. But I did make it.

[Michelle Visage]

My. My main takeaway of this is that.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I have no taste.

[Michelle Visage]

No, no. My main takeaway of this is that if it was a double win, it should have been Pearl and Kennedy. Sorry, Ginger. Love Ginger. She did great.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, a hundred percent. It was. It was baffling. I mean, it was not baffling. That's. That's. That's. No offense, Ginger. No, Ginger, she was great.

[Michelle Visage]

Pearl was really great.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Was overlooked. And I think that they sent Pearl. I don't know what the rationale is. I don't know. Whatever. Because it would have been a great moment to have her come out of her shawl then.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah. You know, I loved her Runway. It's a pink leather lace with the waves in the hair. This is my Pearl. It's pink.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

This is my favorite Ginger Runway. The white leather.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She looked fabulous. I think maybe that has something to do with it. She was. It was her best.

[Michelle Visage]

She looked really great. White lace is cool and different than everyone else.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it was a nice, cool, like, Christian rocker chick kind of thing.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I. I didn't like Fame's look.

[Michelle Visage]

I didn't either.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

The corset over a dress thing. Give me. Bring a book.

[Michelle Visage]

It wasn't good.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I. Who else?

[Michelle Visage]

I wrote that. You have. You have a plastic wig on.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I had mama get into this. You're not gonna believe all this.

[Michelle Visage]

What is it?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Remember that despi wig? I stacked another one on top of it.

[Michelle Visage]

You said, oh, the girls aren't ready.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Why have one? We can have two twice the price.

[Michelle Visage]

Well, they did give you a critique that it was too flat.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yes. So maybe you would put another one on top and literally, I.

[Michelle Visage]

Two wrongs don't make a right.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I safety pinned it. Didn't tease it.

[Michelle Visage]

You said, I will not give you a C cup, but I will give you two A cups. What about that? I wrote that Jaden Dior fierce is so pretty.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

I wrote that. Max's look is basic for Max.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

The spider look.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, I hated it.

[Michelle Visage]

It just was basic for Max. But I love the red context sex.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. And then Ginger was great.

[Michelle Visage]

I couldn't believe Pearl didn't get the win with Kennedy or just Kennedy.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It should have been just Kennedy.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah, yeah.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It should have been just Kennedy.

[Michelle Visage]

Pearl had a great Runway and a great big end. So I don't know who else.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Oh, Violet, lovely. That's an M, mama. No leather, no lace.

[Michelle Visage]

That was vinyl.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

That was vinyl.

[Michelle Visage]

Is vinyl. But I love the bondage. I love the.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I mean, it was literally that John Willie pinup. Like, it was a picture perfect rep. I mean, she really, for 21, had so many references. It's crazy. It's crazy. She looked fabulous. Fabulous.

[Michelle Visage]

Her competence with presentation presentating on the Runway was presentating higher than all of ours.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. Her comfortability with presentation presentating.

[Michelle Visage]

She was Be presentating.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She was. It was fl. I mean, again, she's just, like, for. Again, no Google, no nothing. She had these fully realized looks with clear points of view.

[Michelle Visage]

She was really special and good presentation. It wasn't just a look. That's. She had a good presentation. Now I have to, like, record scratch everything and ask you, because I was not there. What happened with Max? Okay, so in your memory.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

It. In my memory, it was cringe. So she said something was going on with her corset, which she became uncomfortable. And I. Okay, I. Maybe I'm gonna try to not just make things. It was not good for. It was not a good look for her. She. It was kind of like wasting time. Like, she needed to take a break. Like, okay, that's fine. She. I guess she was maybe feeling something really uncomfortable with her corset, and I guess she. She took a little break. She took a moment, but then she started singing, and it was like she.

[Michelle Visage]

Was taking off her corset. All of a sudden, you guys heard, no, no, no.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And I think Rue made a joke, or Rue was taught there was some kind of prompt about Judy. I don't know.

[Michelle Visage]

Okay. Max told me. I think I remember max prompt that. RuPaul said, While you're down there, why don't you sing a few bars?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, yeah, yeah. As a joke.

[Michelle Visage]

And then Max did, I think, as kind of a joke. And that didn't play that way on tv.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No. And also, it was like.

[Michelle Visage]

Like, it made her look on him.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I think that the. I think that the subtext of that comment was, hey, why don't take all the time you need down there? It's not like we're just filming something. Oh, that was the. That was the vibe. Because she was like, mary, we're filming a show here.

[Michelle Visage]

Max said, don't make me sing. And they throw A cape or they throw a cane and a top hat. It was like.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, because we're standing in five inch heels. Uncomfortable waiting critiques.

[Michelle Visage]

Like, critiques.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Like, it was. No, it was inconsiderate and it was a little self indulgent, but I don't think that it was intentionally. No, no, of course not. But. But it. It would just look nerve. Yes, it was nerve to be.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah. And honestly, this is not any weird thing to any editor. That's a weird way to edit that. I know it's a weird way to edit that. And you have to know that you're making someone look, to be honest, cracked.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I have had moments not exactly like that that have been completely edited out.

[Michelle Visage]

Right. And we'll do again.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. No, but I mean, I've had humiliating moments. I dropped the fan in Reggie Rochu on the second take in All Stars. They could have included that and made me put me in the bottom or whatever.

[Michelle Visage]

In All Stars 3, I had to pie someone in the face. And I. The first time I dropped it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

There you go.

[Michelle Visage]

And I remember dropping and thinking, I'm gonna lose.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah, exactly. Like, I mean, I. I've said really bad. You know, whatever. Like, there's a lot of choices that the editors have to do, and they make their choices. And the Whatever. But it was not a good look for her, I think.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah, that's the end of the. But honestly, as far as Runway looks, if this is your weak one, Max really is Gorgina and polished and with.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

The point of view at that age is truly spectacular.

[Michelle Visage]

She was about Violet's age, like, 22. 21.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I was 32 with that wig.

[Michelle Visage]

Love it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Boop.

[Michelle Visage]

No, both wigs.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Both of them.

[Michelle Visage]

There was two.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

So the lip sync starts. It's Jaden Dior fierce, our sister, who lands in the bottom again. Three, Max. This is Jaden's third time lip syncing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

This is like.

[Michelle Visage]

No, second time lip syncing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

This is like. Why would I describe the. The. The imbalance of power here?

[Michelle Visage]

Jason, Kelsey turning to Taylor and saying, go long.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

I don't understand any of that.

[Michelle Visage]

Jason, Kelsey. Oh, okay, so it's Travis Kelsey, the football player, turning to his girlfriend, Taylor Swift. Go along.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yes, yes, yes. And she's like, yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

And Taylor, you know, she has the guitar on the sequence. She just.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

She jumps down in the stage, right?

[Michelle Visage]

She's like, I don't have time for this. I'm going to someone house to surprise him with Christmas gifts. I'm re recording my own music. I can't do this. Right now, you know?

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. Apples and oranges.

[Michelle Visage]

So it's just not the song for Max. And Jaden's a Prof. Jaden was a play. Nashville girl.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yes.

[Michelle Visage]

They do what, eight numbers a night? Sweetie, baby, darling, Jaden is a great lip syncer. And that song, you say I love me, you love me. But I want you to know it.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Was a sister tune.

[Michelle Visage]

Tune.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yes, it was the sister tune.

[Michelle Visage]

I wouldn't pick it for Max in the clubs.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

No, not. Not for that tall, gangly white.

[Michelle Visage]

For Max, I would pick from the shining midnight and the stars. And you. You know, I wouldn't pick that or even batter up.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Hear that? The time has come.

[Michelle Visage]

Yeah. Or like a Gaga ballad. Or I don't know.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

And Jaden will be grand. Will be great. Gonna have the whole world on a plate. Y.

[Michelle Visage]

Totally. Totally.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

We gotta go.

[Michelle Visage]

We gotta go. Okay, but shout out to.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Shout out to Max.

[Michelle Visage]

Jaden lives another day.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yes.

[Michelle Visage]

And Max, honestly, for seven episodes.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

Great run. This is her first time in the bomb.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Nothing to be ashamed of. Boo. Of course, the. The. The episode ends with the bomb. That r bringing someone back. I'm like, I had no idea who was gonna be. All I know is that that means that it's going back in time.

[Michelle Visage]

You have to understand from a competitor point of view, you realize that you're.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Now three steps back.

[Michelle Visage]

Because when Morgan came back on all Stars, I remember being on receiving end of that and being like, now we're staying another day.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Yeah. No, and I was like. I was like, okay, so now I'm definitely number whatever. Now that could be. You know, I mean, it's like you don't necessarily advance, but you didn't know.

[Michelle Visage]

That I was behind that curtain holding in a big mess of diarrhea, ready to squirt. And you didn't know that I was back there.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

They had me in one of those fisting dirty diapers. Yeah.

[Michelle Visage]

They had me in one of those beauty pageant isolation headphones because I couldn't hear you guys, but I knew had big potty and it was wet. And I was standing back there clenched, just waiting to walk out on that Runway and just flood the girls.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

You're coming through the curtain butt first.

[Michelle Visage]

Butt first. Blowing, just blowing.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Bye.

[Michelle Visage]

Blowing. Bye.

[Katya Zamolodchikova]

Sam.