Make a Follow-Up Date or F*ck Off

Summary

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U Up? Podcast: “Make a Follow-Up Date or F*ck Off”

Hosts: Jordana Abraham & Jared Freid
Release Date: February 26, 2025

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Episode Overview

Jordana and Jared bring their signature wit and honesty to the realities of dating, debunking old tropes, sharing personal and listener stories, and providing practical advice for “first-date sex anxiety,” follow-up etiquette, and the hilarious pitfalls of modern romance. Throughout, they emphasize self-worth, clear communication, and the freedom to walk away from mismatches.

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Key Discussion Points & Insights

1. Super Bowl Hangovers, Suburban Ubers, and Adult Friend Groups

[03:00 – 09:00]

• Jordana discusses the logistics of social drinking in the suburbs, leading to a playful debate with Jared about the Uber-vs-drive dilemma.

• Jared jokes about moving through adult life, doctors' appointments, and the burden of being a single adult:

  “Men need wives… I think I need an assistant. I think I’m in the market for assistant to help me through.” (07:47, Jared)

• Conversation detours into feeling intimidated (or not) by friends with “real” jobs (lawyers, doctors), setting the stage for later conversations about professional pride and comparison in dating.

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2. YouTube Millennials vs. Gen Z Support

[16:10 – 18:22]

• The hosts discuss the different ways generational cohorts support creators online, noting Gen Z’s enthusiasm for liking, commenting, and sharing.
• Jared:

  “They were raised on the idea that a like, a comment, a share matters maybe very little to you, but it means the world to us.” (16:51)

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3. “Women Aren’t Funny” Dating Trope & Texting Faux Pas

[20:02 – 26:49]

• Jared shares a Hinge dating story where a woman, after playful banter, texts: “By the way, I’m just as funny as you. Not famous though.”

  • He found this off-putting and saw it as insecurity masquerading as a compliment, leading him to stop responding.
  • They discuss the perennial stereotype of men being “intimidated” by funny women or those with thriving careers, and how these dynamics play out in dating.
  • Key quote:

    “It’s my life. …The ultimate insecurity—someone’s profession, that they go to every day, that is part of who they are, that you couldn’t just let them have that.” (27:19, Jared)

• The discussion frames broader advice: “Just be you.” Don’t try to match or one-up someone’s defining trait—especially as a strategy to get them to like you.

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4. Listener Email: First-Date Sex & Commitment Anxieties

[30:11 – 41:43]

• Listener writes: “We hit it off… spent the night together. How do I say I’m not just looking to hook up but for a committed relationship? Or did I mess up by hooking up on the first date?” (30:11)

• Jordana and Jared reassure: first-date sex is not disqualifying.

  • Jared: “Let’s take the win… and let’s just sit in the now for two seconds.” (31:47)
  • Emphasis on standards—communicate your needs as they arise, and don’t live in fear of “messing up” your chances by having sex.
  • Jordana: “If it doesn’t work out with this person, it’s not because she slept with him on the first date. It wouldn’t have worked out anyway.” (39:42)

• Practical Advice:

  • Don’t frame sex as bait or a “card” to control the relationship progression.
  • Focus on how the person treats you after. If their behavior changes (cancels, stops making concrete plans), express disappointment honestly.
  • Standard check-ins: Are your needs being met? If not, speak up.

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5. “Shooting Your Shot” & When to Reach Out

[52:52 – 59:35]

• Listener describes making the first move with a man at a concert. They hit it off, make out, exchange numbers, but she hasn’t heard from him.
• She’s hesitant to reach out again, worrying she’ll “do all the work.”
• Hosts clarify:
  • “Sometimes shooting your shot misses. That’s why it’s called shooting.” (54:44, Jared)
  • Encourage sending a low-pressure check-in text—then move on.

    “After that decision’s been made, you don’t know what’s going on in his life… It’s really easy to be your boyfriend for a night… The minute you’re put face to face with your time and energy, you make decisions differently.” (56:41, Jared)

  • If you don’t get a direct plan to meet (instead of endless chat), it’s a sign to move on.

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6. Awkward Encounters: The Birthday Cheese Grater

[44:41 – 51:05]

• Listener recounts a boyfriend gifting her a cheese grater for her birthday via a scratch-off ticket game—then putting the other wrapped gifts back in his car and refusing to give them to her, leaving them untouched for months.
• The hosts are baffled by the strict “rules are rules” attitude and speculate:
  • Was there ever more than a cheese grater? Was this a “Saw”-level mind-game?
  • “You’re just another toe to him.” (70:35, Jared, about the foot guy, but it fits this segment’s vibe!)

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7. Red Flag or Dealbreaker?

[61:00 – end]

Selected Highlights:

• Legally Married but Not Divorced:

  • Listener’s mother dates a man who is separated (both dating others) but has “no plans” to legally divorce for financial reasons.
  • Context matters: If you’re looking for marriage, dealbreaker; if not, maybe just a red flag.
  • “So many people at this stage of life… a lot of assets.… you want companionship, someone to travel with.” (63:29, Jared)

• Foot Guy:

  • A date takes off his shoes and socks in a bar and pushes her to do the same. Ultimately, he’s evasive on plans, but is “being foot guy” a dealbreaker?
  • Jordana: “It depends what the bar was. …I wouldn’t be able to take him anywhere. …I don’t want to date foot guy.” (69:04)

• Flirting via Bot:

  • Hinge match confesses he used a chat bot to talk until they traded numbers.
  • Jordana: “Unless the conversation was the best I’ve ever had and now it’s all a lie… but he told me before the date, gave me a chance to go out.” (76:26)

• Hair Tie with Hair:

  • Jordana presents a hair tie tangled with hair and asks if that’s a dealbreaker.
  • Jared is grossed out in the moment, but admits he’d barely notice while dating—“Men are like bees; we only see the shape of.” (80:00)

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Notable Quotes & Moments (with Timestamps)

• “Men need wives… I think I need an assistant.” — Jared, 07:47
• “If you are funny, you are funny.” — Jared, 21:43
• “I want to be funny with my partner, not at my partner.” — Jared, 23:44
• “It’s not my job to teach you.” — Jared, 27:41
• “You don’t even know if you like him.” — Jordana, 37:42 (on post-hookup anxiety)
• “Sometimes shooting your shot misses. That’s why it’s called shooting.” — Jared, 54:44
• “Big text with no plan is buying time… for a weekend text to hook up.” — Jared, 59:35
• “Rules are rules.” — Repeated throughout Cheese Grater story, 46:20+
• “You’re just another toe to him.” — Jared, 70:35 (on foot fetish date)

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Timestamps for Important Segments

• Super Bowl/Drinking/Life Logistics: [03:00 – 09:00]
• Millennials vs. Gen Z Online Support: [16:10 – 18:22]
• Funny-Bantery Hinge Faux Pas: [20:02 – 26:49]
• First Date Sex/“Did I Ruin It?”: [30:11 – 41:43]
• Awkward Gift Encounter: [44:41 – 51:05]
• Shoot Your Shot & What Next: [52:52 – 59:35]
• Red Flag or Dealbreaker (Married/Separated): [61:00 – 66:14]
• Foot Guy Date: [66:16 – 72:57]
• Flirting via Bot: [72:57 – 78:06]
• Hair Tie Hygiene: [78:06 – 81:58]

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Tone & Final Thoughts

Playful, honest, at times raunchy, but rooted in a desire to empower listeners—especially women—to honor their standards, trust their gut, and approach dating as a two-way street. The show delivers laughs, group therapy energy, and genuinely useful advice:
Make the follow-up date, or f*ck off.

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Transcript

[A]

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[B]

A ticket and scratch to reveal my gift and he gives me the wrap present. I open it to reveal a cheese grater. Thinking he was being cute, I asked for another gift and he said no and proceeded to take the rest of the already wrapped gifts and put them back in his car. This guy is a monster. This is like out of like Saw, like.

[A]

Hello and welcome back to the UF podcast. I'm Jordana Abraham.

[B]

And I am Jared Freed. It is so good to be back here with you, Jordana. How are you? It is. I mean, it's already passed because we're getting ahead. It's a little weird. I am in Australia right now. If you're there, this comes out on February 26th. So I am in New Zealand doing my first show. I mean, that's pretty crazy to be in New Zealand. You're.

[A]

You're. It's yesterday now, right? What day is it?

[B]

I don't even know where I am. Yeah, where I am. What day? I will have done my first show in New Zealand. So that's done. But if you're a subscriber in New Zealand, like the show's tonight and then I'm gonna be in Melbourne. Melbourne. Melbourne, Sydney. We're almost sold out at this point.

[A]

So it's probably incredible. That's very, very.

[B]

That's incredible. Newcastle, Brisbane, Adelaide, Perth, they, they say, I'm not doing. I'm not big in.

[A]

If you're a Perthian.

[B]

All you Perthians out there, get, get off your, get over here. Yeah, open up that Perth and get your tickets.

[A]

Look at that. The jokes will be that good.

[B]

That's how good they are. And then. So if you're out there and then I'm in Rochester, Nashville, I've just added. And Morristown, New Jersey. But jaredfree.com for tickets. Yeah, it's very cool. This is very exciting. But we tape this ahead of Super Bowl. Super bowl weekend. Are you doing anything for Super Bowl?

[A]

Going to a friend's house. Neighborhood ready to go the night before. I'm going to. I'm going to dinner with the batches and our husbands.

[B]

Okay. How does that go? Is that. So it's you, Sammy and Elaine and then the, the first men of.

[A]

The first men of badges.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

The founding fathers.

[B]

Yeah. So how does that go? Is that fun?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Do you guys get, like, hammered?

[A]

That's our plan. We wanted to do, like, steak, steakhouse, martini, like, drunk night. Like Uber.

[B]

That really get away from you quickly.

[A]

Well, it's funny when you move to Long island or the suburbs or whatever suburb you live in, it's like you have to decide before the night if it's going to be an Uber night or a driving night.

[B]

Oh, okay. Yeah. Do you know, see, to me, like.

[A]

You can't just see how you feel. You've got to, like, commit.

[B]

Right. I mean, I understand. Like, because you pay for a car, the Uber feels like it's this, like, exorbitant thing.

[A]

Like, just because, like, you can drive everywhere, right?

[B]

I, I guess, like, I have. No, to me, it's Uber or nothing.

[A]

Right?

[B]

So, like, I, I guess I can get hammered any night.

[A]

But if you were in, if you were in Boca, right. I assume your parents have a car.

[B]

I, I, so they have a car for me. I, I use the car and I. And that weighs on me.

[A]

Like, using the car. Yeah.

[B]

I just don't want to be drinking and driving. Like, and I'm, it's not like I even one drink. I'm like, no, take the Uber. Like, why would I do this?

[A]

Because it's not yours. Like, you would have one drink.

[B]

Because I don't want to die.

[A]

You have one drink?

[B]

Yeah. Comfortable, you know, like, I'm like, why even. You know, that's the thing. When you hear about, like, Justin Timberlake being drunk Driving, you're like, this guy could have a black car with him at any hour that, like, why would he ever drive again? But I guess driving is like independence and. Yeah, you know, I get that. This is like a. This is way messier than it even seems.

[A]

If I'm going to dinner or something and I'm going to have one drink, I'll drive there.

[B]

Of course, I'm just used to.

[A]

Right. Yeah, because it's also because you're not like, living there.

[B]

Right.

[A]

But yeah, here it's like, we've decided it's an Uber night.

[B]

So this is an Uber night.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And it's got to be one of those things. It's kind of like going on a date where it's like you want to drink. And they're like, I'm not drinking, but I'll get a mocktail. And you're like, okay, I guess, like, takes the wind out of the sails. And if you are like, with going with two other couples, it's like, we're all Ubering. Right. Like, you want to all be on the same.

[A]

It was presented as a drunk dinner night.

[B]

Yes. I love it that I. I'm.

[A]

Don't come if you're not drinking.

[B]

Don't be a loser.

[A]

So that's my Saturday.

[B]

I love it. So you'll be hungover for the super bowl, maybe.

[A]

Yeah, I'd rather drink on a Saturday night than a Sunday.

[B]

I agree with you. But also, great day to be hungover, cuz, like, you go to someone's house or having a Super bowl party.

[A]

Right.

[B]

It's all the foods you want when you're hungover.

[A]

That's true. It's very much not a day where you're expected to be eating healthy.

[B]

Right. Speaking of being healthy or being unhealthy, I got my blood tested earlier today. Okay. I have a question for you.

[A]

Let's hear it.

[B]

Whenever I call my parents, they're like, have you gone to the doctor? Have you gone to the doctor? Do you have this from your mom or dad? Do they always ask you if you've been to the doctor?

[A]

My parents have collectively nine children. They don't give a how I am.

[B]

Okay, so are you still alive? Is that right? You're alive. Good to know. Check.

[A]

Next.

[B]

Next. Yes, my parents, every time I call them, have you gone to the doctor? No matter when I call them.

[A]

And what doctor? Any doctor.

[B]

Well, that's the hard. That's the part that drives me fucking insane because now they basically give me no chance to win a conversation. So it's like, have you gone to the doctor? I'll be like, I just went to the doctor. No you didn't. And I'm like, okay, so then why even ask it all? Or it's like have you gone to the cardiologist? And I'm like, I have an appointment with a cardiologist and it's like they'll just move the goalposts. Like they'll just keep like whatever I say if I. So I go to the doctor and my mom go, what happened? And I go, well to me and please tell me if I'm wrong because sometimes I'm like, am I crazy? Okay, to me you go to the doctor, they do like they take your blood pressure and they check your heart, they ask you some questions and then they go, okay, you got to get like these tests and then come back. So to me, a doctor's appointment is like three appointments.

[A]

Like depends on the doctor.

[B]

But yeah, well, general doctor. Like if I went in there like.

[A]

A regular checkup, like a yearly checkup.

[B]

Yearly. So I went in for a yearly checkup. They're like you've been checked up. Did the weight, did the blood pressure you got? And I'm like, well can we test my blood and you know, my urine and all this stuff? Let me make sure that I'm like doing the right things, right? And they go, yeah, here's your thing to go get the test and then you'll come back, make another appointment to let you know how it went.

[A]

Oh yeah, right. I mean that could be done on a phone call, right? That's like an annoying about the health care industry. Like they're trying to bill you for another visit, which is annoying.

[B]

See, this is annoying. But it's also, that's what everyone's doing, right? Like I, I, I know I'm like now 40 as we tape this. I mean but I'm literally like this is what this, men need wives. Like I, I think like I, I.

[A]

So they can facilitate your doctor's visits.

[B]

Yeah, I think I need an assistant. I think I'm in the market for assistant to help me through. I just like I, I don't know if I'm crazy like, like cuz my mom was like you, you, they didn't say anything. And I'm like we did the first appointment, I'm going to go take the test. I'm sure they'll call you more answers for that.

[A]

I'm sure they'll call you if you're dying, they usually will like call.

[B]

Hopefully I'm there to pick up the call.

[A]

What I think about doctors is if I get a call, there's an issue. And if they don't say anything, I just assume everything's normal.

[B]

Right. That's just what I should go by. Like, I, I don't know.

[A]

I don't know. That's, I mean, maybe. I don't know if that's a right or wrong move. But like, if I'm going, I'm like, for that. Cuz you have to think, like, for them, they don't want to be sued. Right?

[B]

Right.

[A]

So they're going to follow up with you if there's something to follow up about. Otherwise, like, that's on them, I would hope.

[B]

I mean, I, I, I, I, I don't know. I'm, I feel like no one gets.

[A]

In trouble for not calling you if your results are normal.

[B]

Right. That's fair. Like if I just go on living and being fine. Yeah, but who would sue them? I'm not, I'm alone. I have no one to like, take up my cause. Your parents, oh, they'd be like, they blame it on me. They'd be like, he should have gone to the doctor. We asked every time we called.

[A]

But are you healthy? All good.

[B]

We'll see. I gotta go. I did the test.

[A]

Send me your results.

[B]

I'll send the results to you.

[A]

Yeah. You said last time you, you, There was no one to send you results.

[B]

Well, I never got it.

[A]

I never got any results.

[B]

I now. What are you, my mom now?

[A]

I've been waiting.

[B]

I did an mri. I did a ultrasound mri.

[A]

That's like a legit one.

[B]

I had to get an MRI. They told me to get an MRI. I mean, I'm 40. I'm an old man now.

[A]

Is it 40 you get?

[B]

All right, I don't, this is what they.

[A]

I know at 45 you get like a colonoscopy.

[B]

I've gotten a colonoscopy.

[A]

Oh, you already got one. Oh, wow.

[B]

Look at you.

[A]

Ahead of the game.

[B]

Not. This was. I'm ahead of the game. I'm good. This was actually a crazy. This was one of the moments. I don't know if I told you.

[A]

This story before about your colonoscopy.

[B]

I went and got a colonoscopy when I was like 28.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Because I had. Not to be too personal, but I had blood in my stool.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

I also didn't have a doctor here. So like, I went home to Boston to, like, go to like, a doctor. My dad went to, to like, go check out why? And. And it was really to have a physical. And they were like, make sure you say something about blood in your stool. So I was like, okay. And she was like a teaching doctor. So she, like, taught at, like, the local school, college, you know. So she had. So she walks in and she's like, do you mind if one of my students, like, does the run through with you? I'm like, no problem. And it's like a guy my age, like, he, like, he walks in, like, basically familiar. So it's like this like, frat guy. And I like. And he walks in and she, like, goes away for a second. She's like. He's like, you live in New York? I'm like, yeah. He's like, oh, my God, I love this bar. And this bar. And it was like, all bars I go to, he's like, off the wagon down there.

[A]

This is your surgeon.

[B]

I was like, this. No. And I'm sitting there like, we're like, vibing, you know. Like, I'm like, love that bar. You should go to this bar. I love going to this place.

[A]

We're like, chitchat, having a good time.

[B]

She comes back.

[A]

Growing out.

[B]

Growing out, just big time. Like, yeah, dude, like, high five. She comes back in and she's like, did you ask the questions? And he goes, oh, okay, yeah, sorry. We got carried away talking about how awesome New York City is. And he goes, you know, any short of breath, do you smoke? Do you? And I'm like, I. And then we high fived. And then he actually, so. But that's how like, bro, it got, right? And. And he goes, and any blood in your stool? And I go, well, actually I do. And you just as I'm like saying, well, I just saw, like, he turned to fear, right? Because he knew he was going to have to do something. Like, we just had this, like, interpersonal relationship. And I just saw him, like, his whole energy changed. And she's like, okay, well, we're going to have to check that. So turn over. So now the guy that I was just broing out with is sticking his finger up my ass.

[A]

Oh, my God.

[B]

In the. And I'm like, I. This is what you do, you know?

[A]

But like, are you guys still friends?

[B]

We talk every day. It was. It was so funny. It was like the moment you realize, like, people our age have adult jobs. Like, right, well, you know, what do we do? We. We're class. This isn't a dumb job.

[A]

Like, I don't know what we're doing.

[B]

But then you meet like a Lawyer your age. You're like, excuse me, let me sit up. Totally a doctor. When I meet a doctor. When I meet someone our age who's a doctor, I am so impressed. Like, that's why this whole idea of, like, men being intimidated, like, go yourself with that trope. That is so stupid. I hate it so much because I meet a woman doctor. A woman doctor, which.

[A]

Which apparently is allowed now.

[B]

I can't even believe it.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And I am, like, so impressed just by doctors.

[A]

Almost, like, honestly, almost like, anyone with, like, that kind of job. Like, I had dinner with my friend who's a partner in a law firm. Even corporate partner in a law firm.

[B]

How? Introduce me.

[A]

Now, she's married with two kids, but I'll take. Yeah. And I show up to dinner, and I'm like, oh, my God, look at your little work outfit. Like, right? You have on your little heels and, like, your blouse.

[B]

Right. We work with all these media children.

[A]

I mean, I'm like, there in, like, my. My hoodie.

[B]

Sure, right? You're a hamper woman pulling up to the dinner, right? She's got, you know, the. The shoulder pads.

[A]

She's had a day like Aaron Brockovich going over briefs. Multi million dollar corporations.

[B]

If she even said the word briefs, I'd be like, I. I gotta get out of here. I don't even know if we're on the same level. You do have these moments where you're like, people are, like, doing. I mean, we have listeners who have jobs with real jobs. Right now, they're sitting there listening to this stupid garbage.

[A]

They're not out.

[B]

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[A]

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[B]

Let's get into the episode. What are we talking? Listen, you might be a doctor, but you can't handle your love life. So you came to the Doctors of Love.

[A]

Dr. Love.

[B]

So if you have an email uup betches.com send in your emails. Also, we are pushing YouTube big time. We want you to subscribe to the YouTube channel because we have nothing else. Okay? We have nothing else. We have no doctorate. We have no lawyer. You know, we've never taken the bar we just have this YouTube channel.

[A]

We don't know where our next dollar is coming.

[B]

We have no idea. Here's the thing. If you are a YouTube person, here's what Gen Z gets. They get how to help in a free way. When I see a Gen Z influencer, the likes, the go Queen. Yes, Queen. There is support. They're all lying.

[A]

They understand the currency they were raised on. The currency they were.

[B]

You're absolutely. They were raised on the idea that a, like, a comment, a share matters maybe very little to you, but it means the world to us. So we want you to just touch it, play with it, get a little, you know, flick our bean on YouTube.

[A]

Okay. Millennials, though, it's interesting that now that you say that, now that they get it, because you think you ever go back to, like, the first Instagram post you've ever posted? I know you don't like to look in the past.

[B]

I don't go to the past.

[A]

But, like, in the beginning of Instagram.

[B]

The only way I go into the past is if I'm talking about a random guy who stuck his finger in my ass.

[A]

Otherwise, you don't look back. We only look forward. I've looked back up, like, because I don't have that many Instagram posts in the beginning, you would post, like, five stupid pictures and they'd get like, one, like. And you were the. No shame, right?

[B]

No shame, no nothing. And we just didn't.

[A]

That's not how we hyped each other up.

[B]

No, I don't think we ever hyped each other up. I think we were thrown into the cauldron and told, you know, go to.

[A]

Every man for themselves.

[B]

Right. I. I think it's. It was a lot of distrust and a lot of, who the do you think you are now? If you said, who the do you think you are to, like, some Gen Z person starting a food blog or food, like, tick tock. You'd be like, excuse me, don't shame me. You know, it'd be like. It'd be horrific. You know, like. And I envy that. I actually think that's wonderful. That encourages creativity. I would also say that if, like, their video pops off, they're kind of stuck in that creative bubble that they've created at a young age, but whatever.

[A]

So a golden cage. So what they call.

[B]

Right? Golden. Yeah, yeah, yeah. There's something to that.

[A]

Something like that.

[B]

Something like that.

[A]

I have to ask the doctor friends what the actual phrases.

[B]

Our poet laureate listeners, what are we talking about today? Is there anything else to Talk about you got over sharing.

[A]

We're a lot. We are, we are up. We are live on video. So you can also watch over sharing on video. Also, we have a new subscription offering. Check it out. Two extra bonus episodes a month ad free a day early. Our first bonus episode, which is out, has been out for over a month right now has a voicemail from Jared. So if you like this show, you're interested in hearing that, check it out and you've got your shows.

[B]

Basically. I generally just. I already did my shows. I, I talked about. I'm in, I'm in New Zealand right now. I'm flying to Melbourne. Yeah, I call in randomly to the oversharing voicemail every now and again and just, you know, talk with them as if I have.

[A]

It's like a, your version of, you know, Creed thoughts in the office where they just open up a like a Word document and make him think he's posting on a.

[B]

Right. He thought it was Twitter.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah, that's me. I have no one to talk to but the oversharing voicemail. So we love hearing it. Yeah. Thank you. It was a Taylor Swift rant, right?

[A]

One was a Taylor Swift and then was the other one. There was two. There was two. You called in again.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

And the second one was your react, your reaction to the triggered where someone was at your live taping and her parents said she wasn't funny.

[B]

She inspired a bit, so I appreciate her. Yeah, she is funny. I, I actually she's your muse now that you bring this up. I have a dating thing that happened recently.

[A]

Let's hear it.

[B]

Okay, I'm, I'm messaging with what better place? Right? Where I guess this is the venue. Right. I'm messaging. Here's the thing. I'm gonna sound bad, but it's just.

[A]

This is the place to do it.

[B]

Okay. I think this, it's because of men. Can I blame men?

[A]

Yes. People you love when you do that.

[B]

It's these men, girl like chicks, chicks, chicks. The whole women aren't funny thing for men is so stupid. Like it just like I, I've always thought it's stupid. It doesn't make sense. There's a trope that like there's men on the Internet, like women aren't funny. I, I, I, the, the premise is fraudulent.

[A]

It's just as in like the premise of that there could not be a funny woman or many funny woman is crazy.

[B]

It's absolutely crazy. And I'm not even saying that again. You can call me a hero. I'm not asking for that. I do think that there's some women that are obsessed with the idea of letting you know they're funny. But I think when men dating, you're saying, right and dating.

[A]

But you're also a comedian.

[B]

But I do understand that I kind of present that to most people who meet me. Like, they just by the nature of like, what do you do? I'm a comedian. I get it from men, women, all, all, any background everyone's trying to prove. So you think you're funny. Like, it elicits a reaction. And I, I even saw like, like there was that whole tick tock where everyone was like, why are you funny? And then it was like they were just like telling their stories of like the traumatic thing and they're like, yeah, I remember that. I kind of eye rolled that. Like, I don't know anyone that says any. I've never had someone say, you're so funny. And then maybe like, well, it's, well, it's my grandma passed away and I watched her die. Like, that was like the whole premise of the tick tock movement. I eye roll that because it's like, just show me. I, I, if you're funny, you're funny. Like, and, and I'm saying that as someone who pretty much exclusively has women, you know, open my shows not because they're women, but because they're funny. I wouldn't have that someone who's not funny open my shows.

[A]

One might say, no one has done more for women.

[B]

One might say, jerry, I'm not gonna stop them.

[A]

Yes, that's what everyone says.

[B]

Everyone says.

[A]

Everyone's saying it.

[B]

It does feel like this is like something people are obsessed with, like arguing, which is not an obsession for me, but whatever. I'm messaging with this woman who I met on Hinge and we've moved to text and like, we're taught we're messaging.

[A]

Second base, if you will.

[B]

Second base. And I'm messaging with her and it's going fine. Like, and we're trying to get a date together at some point when, so.

[A]

You'Re in the date planning stage.

[B]

Well, they're away. I'm here. But we'll figure it out. But we're having the in between texting. That happens usually if you listen to our benefits. You might not always. Okay, that happens in between banter.

[A]

The banter in between banter.

[B]

And the banter can go wrong. The ibb, they're messaging with me and I, I wrote, have you already looked up the menu and made a decision? Like, you know that type of thing where they were talking about where they're going to dinner. I go, have you already looked up menu? I did not actually. I said, so it's going to be an adventure tonight. That's me, you know. And then they write back, heck yeah, going crazy. So I ha that response.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

To me, I'm being friendly and cordial. Haha, that's funny. You're playing along with the bit. Then they write back, by the way, I'm just as funny as you. Not famous though. Next text. It's fine, it's fine. I.

[A]

Is she being sarcastic? I guess.

[B]

Of course I. I would. I mean edits at my most empathetic sarcasm. But like, at that point, I'm out.

[A]

Maybe she's thinking of it as complimentary.

[B]

To you that I'm famous but not funny. I just, you know, you're.

[A]

She's calling you famous.

[B]

You've miscalculated what I want out of my life. It was weird to me because like, it's so weird. It's so tough and dating and relationships and especially having not met someone yet. And you're being positive, like I did haha. Or thing. That's me saying, you are funny. Like, you're not that funny. But sure, yeah, but it's funny enough in conversation. And. And it's also like, not me be like, I also don't need. Like, I don't. I want to be funny with my partner. I don't want to be funny at my partner. And I think that's a better relationship. Good relationships to me are improv. Not.

[A]

You're laughing at the same things.

[B]

We're laughing at the same things we're in on the inside jokes, good relationships. I've found the ones that I've been happiest in. No one even gets what the we're laughing at. Like, our jokes don't even matter to other people, but they matter to us.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like. And so do you feel like she's nagging you? Of course. And it's like there was no need to nag.

[A]

Right. Maybe in her mind she thought she was complimenting you again. I'm not. I think it's a miss.

[B]

It is. I mean, in her mind she didn't see that I wasn't. I'll never answer her again.

[A]

Right.

[B]

End of texting from me.

[A]

She's listening. Thank you for listening.

[B]

I just. It's one of those things, I'm like.

[A]

Did you answer or you just.

[B]

No, I didn't answer. Then they wrote back something about like, should we Go to this or this. Like, you could tell it was like a feel out text and I was.

[A]

Like, like, we're going nowhere.

[B]

We're. We're going to. Deleted from the phone. But it's also like, it. It's funny. It's like, what do you.

[A]

She's trying to. Okay. I think that there's a sense and I agree with you, that's like an annoying comment. Cuz also, even just by calling someone.

[B]

You'Re bad at your life's work.

[A]

Even by just calling. I think the. I think she was like, thinking of the famous part as a compliment. Like, you're like telling you you're famous.

[B]

I am. I'm with you. That whatever it came from, it wasn't a bad place. I think it's from a bad place for me to date.

[A]

Right. She's trying to keep up with you, I think is the other thing. Like, you can like.

[B]

But I wasn't even like, going off. Like, I was just like having a con. I. I understand.

[A]

Right. But it's like, also just like, just stay in your lane. Like, we don't have to. We don't have to. You're not judging women by, like, are they funny enough for you? I think maybe people think that they're like, oh, I want someone just like me who is just as funny as me, who can. Like, you'd rather someone just be themselves and be like, normal?

[B]

I think anyone I've been with is funny. Like, I think there's like, different versions of funny. I think there's like.

[A]

But she's probably like, oh, I need to make sure that he thinks I'm funny enough to, like, be with him.

[B]

Well, we'll find out on the date. You know, we'll find out if we match that way, you might be someone could be hilarious and I wouldn't want to date them.

[A]

Right.

[B]

You know, like, I know many people like that. I. It's just one of those things. I was like. I was like, it's so funny. Like, you know, we talk about this on the podcast a lot. Like, when do you. How much do you put up with? How much do you. What's. What's appropriate? What's the right answer? Icky or picky? This is an icky or picky situation to me. You know, you go, is that my ick? Yeah. Do I. Do I garner, like, bigger things from that? Like, do I think. Could I make. Am I making it bigger than. Maybe it should be? Yeah, probably.

[A]

But it's. It's your.

[B]

But it's my Life.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

You know, like, it's. And it's funny. Like, I. I bring this up because.

[A]

I hope she said it on the date. Would it be the same?

[B]

No, maybe not. Because I would feel it in conversation if she just said it randomly or that was the first thing. You don't. Yeah, right. If we got the date, hey, great to see you, and had a hug. And she's like, I just want to let you know I'm funnier than you. I'd be like, yeah.

[A]

What would be off putting.

[B]

Right.

[A]

In the right context, it would. It would be okay.

[B]

I don't know.

[A]

Like, it's a weird statement to make about any profession. Like, if I had dinner with my law friend, right? And I'd be like, I just want you to let you know, like, I'm just as smart as you.

[B]

Right. I could have been a lawyer.

[A]

Right?

[B]

Yeah. The bar.

[A]

I'm not a partner.

[B]

Right. But. Right. You would come off as insecure.

[A]

Right.

[B]

It would come off as. To me, this is the ultimate insecurity, Right. That someone's profession that they've put their life into, that they go to every day, that is part of who they are, that you couldn't just, like, let them have that.

[A]

That's fair. When you. When you put it that way, that makes a lot of sense.

[B]

Right. I just.

[A]

I agree. It's an annoying comment.

[B]

I saw that and I was like, it's funny because I was just like, I'm out happily.

[A]

Right?

[B]

Good luck to you.

[A]

What if she, five days later said, hey, I was thinking about that comment I made. I don't know why I said that. That came off really stupid.

[B]

I don't know if it's my responsibility to, like, do that for someone.

[A]

What if she said that? I'm saying if she's.

[B]

No, I'm saying, like, if she didn't.

[A]

Answer and then she was like, hey.

[B]

Like, I would feel weird because, like, you are what she is. Like, not even. Like, it's not my job to teach you. And you know, like, you know that speech. I was like, no, it's not even that. It's just that you're a fine person. Like, you're not a bad person. It's just we're not the match. Like, I don't know if it's like, who am I to. Like, we're not going to go out from that. Like, I'm never going out with you. So. So it's over. So. So who again, like, to teach? Like, this is when we get into the conversation, like, some People are like, the guy who won't make the date, like, he knows how to make the date. He will make the date with someone. It's just not going to be you.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And that's. Okay. Move on. You being like, well, you know, I do like a date. Oh, really?

[A]

He knows you want to do.

[B]

Yeah, he's saying.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Okay, what are we talking about today? I'm sorry to get.

[A]

No, I get it.

[B]

I get it. Interesting.

[A]

Yeah. No, I. I think I.

[B]

For the show.

[A]

Yeah, I agree. Because I think, like, it could have. It could have been interpreted differently. But I can see as that's your job, as that's how she's coming in before she even has met you. Same comment in a different circumstance. In a. In a sense where it actually was, like, funny or she said something almost even funnier. Might have even also made more sense. I know it doesn't matter to you.

[B]

But I had it. I gave you the haha.

[A]

Sure. Yes. You need to prove yourself.

[B]

Right. Like, you. I'm. I'm being fun and flirty with you.

[A]

Yeah. And I remember dating and getting that. Also, like, the person kind of almost feels like they need to, like, oh.

[B]

I'm sure women tell you I'm on.

[A]

I'm. Are you gonna write about this?

[B]

Right, Right. No, I mean, this does not compare. I. I actually bring this up more because we have such a female audience.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like, I think women get this more. Way more in their profession. Like, totally female comics. You kidding me?

[A]

I'm sure. Yeah. Because that's probably intimidating. I feel like it would be intimidating to. To date a female comedian as a man.

[B]

I mean, if you feel that way, you get out of the game, dude.

[A]

Like, just because I feel like there's like a male sense of, like, oh, men should, like, women love funny men.

[B]

Of course. I mean, that's. But too bad for him. Someone's profession. I'm always just like, that's. Again, if I met a doctor, I'd.

[A]

Be like, yeah, just be you. That's the advice you get from the show. Just be you.

[B]

We got a great show here. Listen to the email.

[A]

Riveting.

[B]

I like this. Riveting. I'm gonna really sound like a feminist now.

[A]

Let's do it. All right. Hello, beautiful people.

[B]

That's you and me. Easy.

[A]

It's you and me. We're okay.

[B]

Are we the beautiful ones?

[A]

We're all right.

[B]

All right.

[A]

I love your podcast. I can always count on it to make me laugh every day. I have a first date question. I went on A first date. Last week, for the first time in four months. We hit it off.

[B]

Good for you. Hey, let's. First out. First date in four months. You did it.

[A]

In February, no less.

[B]

In February, you're out of the house. You did it.

[A]

Okay. We hit it off. To say the least. We spent the night together.

[B]

Hey, there we go. We maybe came.

[A]

Yay. How do I say to him that I'm not looking to just hook up, but I'm looking for a committed relationship? Or did I already mess up.

[B]

Hooked up and haven't won a big relationship?

[A]

Or did I already mess that up by hooking up with him on the first date? We have our second date planned for next week. Thanks. A committed batch. Good question. We've touched on this before, and I think you've had a really good take on it. And I'll let you know that.

[B]

I think, like, I'm proud of this person. They went out. They had a. Can we. This email is so funny because it's, like, negative. Like, you went out for the first time in four months and you fucked like an animal. Get it, get it. Get it, girl. Good for you. I'm happy for you.

[A]

You're back in the game.

[B]

You're in the game.

[A]

Back in the game.

[B]

You like the guy. Like, let's.

[A]

Let's.

[B]

Let's take the win.

[A]

I get it. She's feeling a little. She's feeling protective over her future self.

[B]

I think if she changed her perspective, she could be happier.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And I think the idea that you went out, got some drinks, you met someone new, you like them enough. Like, let's. You weren't coerced into this. I hope not. I hope this was all done again, consensually, all beautiful. Like, isn't this beautiful? You met someone new and you like them enough to spend the night together, and you trusted them enough. And let's just sit in the now for two seconds.

[A]

Yeah, two seconds. You had a nice night, right?

[B]

Sit here and let's remember the night together. Remember his touch, his breath on your neck, his tongue. We're gonna need your licking the inside of your legs.

[A]

We're in your Christmas erotica, right?

[B]

Get a little wet thinking about it. Like.

[A]

Like.

[B]

Like, let's have that moment, you know? Like, and then let's. And she even says we have our second date planned for next week another way. And he's still into you and he's making plans.

[A]

Look at that.

[B]

Let's just. Again, we will get to the horrors of the future in a second.

[A]

I like you. Know positivity. We need this, this dark, cold winter.

[B]

I again, I. We do need it. Like I understand there's a lot of things that could happen from. We'll get to those. We will get there. For now, you have a second day plan with someone that you liked enough to go home with.

[A]

Right. And in the. And right now. That's nice.

[B]

That's really nice. Now have relationships started when someone has had sex on the first date.

[A]

Never. I'm just kidding.

[B]

Never. Right?

[A]

Yeah, of course.

[B]

Yes. Okay, there we go. So to say that this is a black and white thing. You slept like, that's why we can't go negative. You don't know what's going to happen. Let's take the win and let's keep it eye focused. I had a great time. I went home with someone that I was really attracted to and trusted and liked and found interesting and had a great night. And had a great night. And I want to have a second date with them. And I do. Okay.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

This is where we get to the advice part. Just because you have doesn't mean you will now. Just because you've had sex doesn't mean you will have sex. Just because you had a great time doesn't mean you will have a great time. Just because you got off the first time doesn't mean he will be able to achieve an erection. These are all things that you don't know. And it's called your standard. The standard you have. I think the best part that she has is she knows what she wants. She wants a committed relationship.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I don't think like saying it to them. To me it's like a show me versus tell me thing. Like if I were her, you go on that second date, let's say it gets canceled. Hey, what? What happened? So when are we going out again? I'm a little disappointed you canceled on me. I think like in the same way sex allows anyone to go, oh, that's all I wanted from this. It also allows you to say when you're upset with someone's actions earlier.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like you have a concrete thing. We had sex because I trusted you and I liked you. And then we had the second date plan because I trusted you and I liked you and I wanted to have a nice time again. And then what happened? We didn't have this date. It got canceled. I'm really upset with how that went.

[A]

He didn't even cancel though.

[B]

Right. I'm just saying. Right again. Why am I going negative?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Do you know what I mean? Like we haven't even gotten there yet.

[A]

I think it's more like, okay, I think there's a fear. And I'll give you her fears from her side is okay.

[B]

Now that I've given a 20 minute speech about how she should be happy that she.

[A]

We went out like an animal. We went out, we had sex on the first date. Has he placed me in this hookup category? Does he, will he take me seriously as someone who he could date seriously?

[B]

Yes, it could. You know, again, I don't think like, I believe in like making someone chase your standards. You know, what is your standard? That you want to get to know someone, that they'll negotiate with you, that they'll make a plan with you. They're doing that, you know, and if that standard doesn't get met, you should let them know that, hey, I'm a little disappointed that you're not doing the things that I would like to do.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And then if they're working with you, they can go, well, here's five reasons I haven't done those things and pitch it back to you. And that's called like getting to know someone.

[A]

Right? So let's say she want, let's say she goes on the second date and she doesn't want to have, have sex again. This. She felt, she felt it was a little early for her.

[B]

Right. Okay, you go on the second date. This is a great time. I gotta go home tonight. I'm not really feeling it tonight. It's just not the night for me. I just hope you know that, like, this isn't like me saying that I didn't have a good time the first night. But this isn't like what I'm looking. I, I guess you do have to like, I don't know, I would almost.

[A]

Think she, she was like not into him.

[B]

If he was right, you have to let him know.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Again, the conversation.

[A]

I mean, I think you could say like, you know, I had a great time the other night. Don't regret, don't regret it. But I, you know, I sometimes prefer to move a little slower.

[B]

But you didn't.

[A]

Yeah, I know.

[B]

So you could say it's a different, this is different for me. I, you know, I was so into what we had going on that like, this feels a little different for me.

[A]

I never do this.

[B]

Yeah, I never do this. Gets eye rolled just because it's like.

[A]

Dude, yeah, you know, I never do this to me.

[B]

This is a constant check in with yourself and your standards and are they being met or are they not? You Know, like. And when they're not, you have to let that person know. And it's easier when it's smaller than when it's bigger, right? And I think, like, the sex is.

[A]

Almost bigger than you've built a case. And the person's like, what's going on?

[B]

And then maybe the whole way, if.

[A]

It'S all along the way, you're finding out at each stage how the other person responds to your feedback, right?

[B]

And it's like, this is why, like, if you change the perspective of, like, I had a fun night, not I ruined my chances, right? Like, she's writing in, fuck, I screwed it up.

[A]

You don't even know if you like him, right? That's the other part of it.

[B]

This is the part that, like, you know, can you imagine having sex in the. Having, like, sex with someone that you really like? And you're like, I messed it up. That people do that all the time. And it's like. And I. I get it. I get why they do it. Because you go, well, I took. You know, I. I took away my one thing, my. My bait. And I'm like, that's not even like, a fun way to meet someone, right?

[A]

Or a fun way to, like, sort of think about sex, right? As it's like, card you're holding over someone to, like, force them to advance to the next phase.

[B]

I think this is where the trouble comes, because everyone has a different relationship with sex. And that takes sex to figure out, right? You know, your relationship with sex doesn't really get learned until you've had sex. And then you go, oh, I don't like how it feel feels to go home with someone that I don't know yet. And then you have to let that person know, and then it goes the way it goes. And that's why we get into this. Like, did I mess up?

[A]

Right?

[B]

Like, I. I can even say at 39, for now, 40, as this comes out, oh, my God, Like, I have a different understanding of myself. Like, it takes a lot for me, I'm sure, to just feel trusting and comfortable, different than when I was 29, 25, you know, whatever that is, you know?

[A]

Right.

[B]

So I.

[A]

So it's more serious to you now, even?

[B]

It can be.

[A]

Or it's more, you know, it's more serious to the other person, or you feel like it's more serious to the.

[B]

Other person, or I need a different level of comfortability that I may have needed in the past.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And comfortability doesn't mean that we're gonna end up Together it could mean that just we have this like really good interaction that like goes that way and we're able to say things to each other that maybe I wasn't able to say to someone else. You know, like, I, I, I think that, but again, it's a feeling and.

[A]

I think it's important for her to know that if it doesn't work out with this person, it's not because she slept with him on the first date. It wouldn't have worked out anyway. She might have found out sooner.

[B]

Right. That you, Right. That's the whole thing that's the tough part to like say to someone is like, you didn't mess up.

[A]

The person might just not be interested. It doesn't have to do with that.

[B]

Right. I, you know, especially that's why the first date sex stinks is because it's hard to untangle. Right. You both people don't know what this is.

[A]

Right.

[B]

You know, so you could be on.

[A]

A, you could be on a good first date and then go on a second date and not feel it and, but you've had, you've slept with them and so it's hard, it's hard to not correlate the two.

[B]

Right. Where that person on the first date wasn't sure if they wanted a long term thing anyways.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Sex or no sex.

[A]

Yes. But it's hard to like know that because you threw in an extra factor.

[B]

Right. And, and you're blaming that factor instead of going, this person wouldn't have been right here for a long time anyway.

[A]

Yeah. And if he's someone who doesn't want to date anyone who would have sex with him on the first date, you're not the match.

[B]

Right. I, I just don't, I've never met that person. I think this is like, again, this is like men get kind of like, you know, accused of this. But I've never met the guy who's like sex in the first date. How could I bring that back to my family? Like, I just know, I just don't know that guy.

[A]

Yeah. And I mean, I'm sure that guy exists.

[B]

I'm not saying he doesn't exist. I'm just saying in regular conversation that's not something traded amongst men that I know that like sex in the first day, well, you fuck them and chuck them because you can't put a, you know, the scarlet. You got to put the scarlet A on them. Like, I don't, to me, that's not like a part of my conversation. The trope of, you know, this. This ruined woman.

[A]

Yeah, yeah. That's why, especially not nice, because even though it doesn't exist as much, women still fear it in back of their heads.

[B]

Right? Sex on the first date. Well, get rid of her. You know, that's not a thing. Let's do another email. We love the and again, if it.

[A]

Was, would you want to be with that person anyway?

[B]

I think, but that doesn't help someone who's like slept with a monster.

[A]

You know? I love a good pair of underwear, but it is hard to find. If it's flattering, then usually pretty uncomfortable. It's like riding up, it's digging in. And if it's really comfortable, it's usually makes you look like a grandma and you kind of feel a little self conscious about it. It' really hard to find the medium. And skims has mastered that art. They have some of the most comfortable underwear that I have ever worn in my entire life.

[B]

It is funny that whenever I hear women talk about the Skims product line, they do kind of like glow a little bit about it.

[A]

It's just really hard for women to find stuff that looks good on you and also like is really comfortable. I think that's just a universal struggle by many women.

[B]

I just love when we have a sponsor that helps our audience. It's nice to know Skims is like helping people feel better about themselves.

[A]

Yeah. And I am. I am a believer. I'm a convert. I'm a Skim Sims gal. Recently I got the Fits everybody full brief, which is like their regular underwear which I am wearing all the time now. It's my favorite pair. I get annoyed when I wear it because then I have to wait until I wash all my underwear to wear it again. You just don't think about it. Which is the number one thing for underwear for me. I also have the Bralette. It's a game changer. It lifts, it looks great. Super flattering, super cute, just the right amount of support and also incredibly comfortable. I haven't always loved bras. Who has? But with skims, they are changing me into a bra lover. Shop my favorite bras and [e-mail] after you place your order. Make sure to let them know we sent you select podcast in the survey and be sure to select our show in the dropdown menu that follows. You know those moments when your hands are full or your eyes need a break, but you still want to escape into a great story. That's why I'm such a fan of audible. I listen all the time whether I'm on a walk, commuting to the office, doing chores, or even just relaxing before bed. Audible's app makes it super easy to jump right into thousands of audiobooks anytime, anywhere. I've mentioned before that one of my favorite movies is Pride and Prejudice, and I'm excited that Audible is releasing a brand new audiobook version of the Jane Austen novel on September 9th. Narrated by Marissa Abela, Harris Dickinson, Glenn Close and other stars you know and love, Audible gives me the best of both worlds. I can enjoy a story I love while actually getting stuff done. They have thousands of titles, everything from romance to thrillers to memoirs, comedy and even self improvement. So whatever mood you're in, there's always something fresh and exciting waiting for you. And the app is super user friendly. You can download audiobooks to listen offline, adjust the narration speed, and pick up right where you left off across all your devices. If you've never tried Audible before, I can't recommend it enough. It's the easiest way to bring incredible stories into your everyday life. Trust me, once you start listening, you'll wonder how you ever went without it. Your first great love story is free when you sign up for a free 30 day trial at audible.com UUP so.

[B]

Let'S do some awkwardness encounters. UUP betches.com send them in uup betches.com J&J I have a non sexual awkward encounter for you.

[A]

Love it.

[B]

Perfect. I'll make it sexual. I was dating a guy a few years ago. My birthday was coming up. I love my birthday. That's where I'm out.

[A]

Someone loves their birthday. You celebrate your birthday you loser.

[B]

That yeah, that's I more that person than the sex on the first date person. I love my birthday and was excited to find out that my boyfriend at the time had set up a cute way to give my gifts that included my love for gambling. I'm back in on her. I like this girl.

[A]

Sounds fun.

[B]

He designed these cute little scratch off tickets and I got to choose one of four tickets to scratch and whatever present it revealed was the one I got. So what does he do with the other presents?

[A]

We'll find out.

[B]

Okay, so I choose a ticket and scratch to reveal my gift and he gives me the wrapped presents. I open it to reveal a cheese grater. I had mentioned that I wanted a new one, but not as a birthday gift. A little confusing. Thinking he was being cute, I asked for another gift and he said no. Then I chose my gift and that's what I got and proceeded to take the rest of the already wrapped gifts and put them back in his car. This guy is a rule follower. I was a little taken back by the turn of events and my cheese grater gift, but thought maybe he was joking. He wasn't. The gift stayed in his car for the next three months that we dated before we eventually broke up. It was pretty awkward when people asked what he got me as the gift that year, and more awkward having to look at the forgotten gifts in his car every time we went out after that. This guy is a monster.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Thanks for all the laughs. It was a great birthday. Great sign off.

[A]

I. I was like, what a sweetheart. He's taking her love of gambling right into a game. How thoughtful. He's bought four gifts. He's wrapped them all.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

Like, this is a lot, this guy.

[B]

This took hours above and beyond. What a cool way to do it.

[A]

Right? And then he totally left one part out. Well, part of me is almost like, is he, like, a little, like, off?

[B]

Is it like an OCD thing? Like, he, like, the rule has been made, so I have to follow it to the end. Yeah. I think the weirdest part, there was another way for him to go that is unattractive in another way that he takes the three gifts and he returns them and get his money back.

[A]

Right. I'm surprised he didn't return them.

[B]

Right. That would be like, they're for.

[A]

He'd rather them just sit in his car than give them dirt.

[B]

Right. Is he saving them for the next holiday? And now she can choose one. The of. Of three. And now he's banged out all the gifts that he's got to get for the year.

[A]

Also a cheese grater.

[B]

She did say she wanted it.

[A]

A really nice one. Well, five dollars.

[B]

She up. She should have chosen card number two.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

She would have gotten the I've been.

[A]

Really wanting diamond ring. Yeah.

[B]

Right. It would be funny if one was a wrapped car. Yeah, I.

[A]

It is.

[B]

This is.

[A]

Rules are rules.

[B]

Rules are rule. I would.

[A]

Would you want to be the rules or rules person?

[B]

Well, no, I wouldn't want to be with this person. I also wonder, did she never say anything if you saw the gifts, she.

[A]

Said, okay, I'll take the other gifts now.

[B]

Right. And he said no and put them in the car. And then every time they get in the car, they're just sitting there on the. On. On the dashboard.

[A]

Right. I would be like, what do you plan on doing Right. With the rest of these gifts?

[B]

There are further questions about the gifts.

[A]

I appreciate the game. Really thoughtful, really fun. I Think it's a little weird that you won't let me see what the other gifts are.

[B]

This is one of those arguments that, like, she probably is like, well, he gave me the gift, so I can't really, like, call him out.

[A]

Right.

[B]

But I would be on her side, where I'd be like, this is an argument. This is weird, right? This is weird. This is unattractive.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It's like, especially.

[A]

Okay, what if. What if the first gift she opened were. Was a diamond earrings?

[B]

Like them or not like the gift? It's a matter. It doesn't matter.

[A]

Doesn't matter.

[B]

I have to live with this mystery the rest of my life of what these three gifts are. Get out of here. This. I want to know what they are.

[A]

I think that I want the cheese.

[B]

Grater as much like I need the cheese grater.

[A]

I think if it were a nicer, more romantic gift, I would be like, all right, whatever you need to do with the other ones.

[B]

Here's what I think, and this is dialogue.

[A]

I think it's because it's a cheese grater that I would be like, all right, what else is like. Of course there's something else.

[B]

Well, I have a theory, but it's actually crazy. If he would do it this way. This is, like, out of, like, saw. Like, if all the scratchers, they all go to cheese grater.

[A]

What do you mean the. Oh, every gift.

[B]

Every gift is a cheese grater. There's only one gift. The other wrapped gifts are just garbage that he wrapped. Trapped. So he actually bought one gift. I'm actually. I'm inside the mind of a murderer.

[A]

How'd he know which gift she would pick, though?

[B]

No, she picks the card. She scratches the card. It tells her the gift.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Right. Am I. Am I understanding this correctly based on how she wrote it?

[A]

Something like that.

[B]

She. He goes, 1, 2, 3, or 4. Which card you pick? All the scratchers went to Cheese Crater.

[A]

Okay. He just pretended he got other gifts.

[B]

He pretended he got other gifts and then he put them in the car. That's the crazy part. Heart. It's like some weird kink of his.

[A]

You would have to be like a.

[B]

Sociopath, right, to keep the other garbage wrapped.

[A]

Almost just to show her, to dangle her. Right?

[B]

She is lucky to be out of this relationship. Can you imagine? You're just living in this.

[A]

Like, how could you not.

[B]

The riddler.

[A]

We would have fight about this every day if this was me.

[B]

It's all I would talk about.

[A]

I'd be like, what is going on?

[B]

Show me the gifts.

[A]

And they're in the car every day. You're in, you get in the car.

[B]

I would even say to get those gifts unwrapped. I go, I don't even want them. I just got to know what's in.

[A]

I need to know.

[B]

Right?

[A]

Yes.

[B]

What she would have found out is that there were nothing.

[A]

You think so?

[B]

I think it's just literally a clump of gift wrap.

[A]

That's crazy.

[B]

But that's the only explanation is that he had no other gifts.

[A]

If you're listening and you got these gifts, we need to know.

[B]

I would do anything for a follow up to this. There's no other answer.

[A]

You think he just got a cheese grater?

[B]

And I think he was not happy that she wasn't happy with the cheese grater. And then he wanted to, like, make her feel bad. So not showing her by not showing the other gifts.

[A]

Well, that's why I think that's part of it. If it was, I think this even if even in your idea of all all the cards leave to the one gift. If the one gift was an amazing, romantic, incredible gift, I think it'll be fine. I'd be okay.

[B]

You wouldn't want to know what the other three gifts were.

[A]

I think, I think I would be okay.

[B]

I mean, now I'm thinking you're crazy.

[A]

I think I would be okay being like, like, okay, like, like I'm happy with the gift I got. Whatever you need to do with the other ones.

[B]

This is like the premise to a horror movie. I think it's like goosebumps that they're like, don't. You can buy the house, but just don't go in the basement. And then it like drives the people crazy. Like to me, okay, what if he were.

[A]

What if the amazing gift and he returns the rest of them? You never see them, though.

[B]

I would be. Because that's part of the game. Turned off.

[A]

It's part of the game.

[B]

It's part of the game. But I would also, like, I just want to know, like, who are we having?

[A]

We're having some mystery in the relationship. I think it's only really annoying because it's a cheese grater.

[B]

No, I need to know. I, I, I just need to know what the other gifts are. I need to know that there was actually a chance at other gifts. I don't believe that there was ever a chance.

[A]

Okay, so you don't. So this relationship is not based on trust.

[B]

There's no trust here. This guy is cheap. He's an asshole. He's not trustworthy.

[A]

Why would he go to. Why not just give her the cheese grater? Then why go to this whole.

[B]

Because it makes it cute. Look at. She appreciated the whole gambling aspect. It's actually a cheap. Dude. This guy bought a cheap gift and he put it under this big game. That made it seem more.

[A]

That's why I'm saying if it was a nice gift, I would be okay with it.

[B]

Right, but there was no nice gift. Yeah, this guy was never gonna give.

[A]

Her a nice gift. That's the issue.

[B]

He should live alone for the rest of.

[A]

No, we'll find you and we will not get you anything for your birthday.

[B]

All right, let's do another email.

[A]

Hi, J. And J. Excited to report that I, 31, female, shot my shot for the first time in my life this past weekend.

[B]

Hey, shot your shot.

[A]

Big wins. Big wins. Clocked a very cute guy at a concert. Saw him on my way out of the venue and gave him a little compliment. To my surprise, he was into it once. A little compliment, Little compliment. To my surprise.

[B]

My rap name.

[A]

Little compliment. Yeah, I like that little compliment. It's funny. To my surprise, he was into it. He was at the concert alone and happily joined my friends and I at a nearby bar after the concert. After some great banter and spontaneous planning, we made out in the car and went to my place. Fun.

[B]

Look at that. Good for you. Made out in the car with a guy who was alone at the concert.

[A]

Yay. Hung out for a few hours, making out and talking. Should I add that I have purposely not been dating and off the apps for a few months? Okay, this man, also 31, shared that he also hadn't been with anyone in months. You both never do this. He seemed really genuine. We exchanged numbers before he left. Completely initiated by him. It's been a few days and haven't heard from him. I would love to see him again, but since I initiated this whole contact, it turns me off to think that the only way we would talk again is if I reach out to him. Seeking advice on the next steps here. I felt like being really bold. Worked well when we met, but a bit worried about reaching out to someone that may or may not be interested in seeing each other again. Also, how long without hearing from him? Until I should take it as a sign. No interest. Signed Scared shootless.

[B]

Well, okay. I love this email because it gets us into the conversation of what is shooting my shot.

[A]

Right. I would say this is shooting her shot.

[B]

She's shot her shot. Sometimes it misses. That's why it's called shooting my shot.

[A]

I don't know. Would you call this a miss?

[B]

I would call this. I would.

[A]

Depends what she was looking for, right?

[B]

I guess it depends on what your goal is.

[A]

Like, she wants a date.

[B]

You're right. She. She hit her.

[A]

She made out.

[B]

She made out. They had a nice conversation.

[A]

She had a fun night.

[B]

Right. I. I guess. Like, what is the width when guys shoot their shot?

[A]

That's what they're usually what they're fine with.

[B]

Yeah. I mean, if I shot my shot, I.

[A]

And it ended with a. With a makeout all night in the.

[B]

Car, and then we'll see from here. Great. But I guess the. The ball would be in my court at that point or I would be more. I understand. Her problem is, like, in. If I shoot my shot, we go back and make out. I would not feel turned off by having the text the next day to make a plan.

[A]

Right.

[B]

She. I totally get it. She's like, I've done enough.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I'm a woman who put herself out there. I do want a guy to pursue me.

[A]

I. I agree.

[B]

She is entitled to that feeling. That is a feeling that she shares with many people.

[A]

She's opened the door. She wants him to take it. Right.

[B]

Take the rope and pull on it. And it's not happening that way. So I can understand her disappointment. I do think if she can get beyond that. You send a text, you say, hey, it was really fun to hang out with you. I'd love to go out, just make a plan, and I'm in. That's the text you can send. But that's it. After that decision's been made, you don't know what's going on in his life to. To him, you know, Again, it's really easy to be your boyfriend for a night. For a night when you've already gone out. You know, like all that. Not to say it's easy to, like, make out with you, you know, I just think, like, all that happened in a whirlwind. And it was simple because he was already there. There was no effort really to be made from his end. The minute you're put face to face with your time and energy, you make decisions differently. And we are all fiercely protective of our time and energy.

[A]

That's true. And also, you don't really know anything about him. And so there could be many reasons that he's not reaching out.

[B]

Right. Maybe his girlfriend didn't come with him to the concert.

[A]

Gonna be mine. Right.

[B]

Well, that's like the way to, like, vilify him. So that's why. That's the only reason he couldn't go out with you.

[A]

But maybe. Maybe he's not in a. Not in a dating mode. Maybe he's just doesn't. He's not looking for any. He's not looking for something serious.

[B]

Right. There's a lot more people I'd make out with than I would go on a second date with.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And that's not to say the people I made out with aren't worthy or wonderful. It's just what it is.

[A]

The issue with her reaching out to him, which I get, is like, he could say yes because he's open to that, but then it doesn't feel as good for her when he says yes, she wants. And that's why. That's why we wait. We wait to see, to hope that you'll do it first so we can feel more excited about the interaction, especially when we've already done the opening line.

[B]

I get it. Listen, I'm. I'm. I'm not. Again, I'm not gonna tell her how she should feel.

[A]

I was gonna say, I think the reason to do that is for your own self, is for your own time, so that she's like, how long do I have to wait until I take it as a sign of no interest? It's like you could find that out as. As you could free up your own brain by just asking the question yourself.

[B]

That's why my text that I gave her, the, hey, I had fun, would love to get drinks, make a plan, and I'm in.

[A]

Right?

[B]

That frees her.

[A]

Now she's done. Right now she's done everything she needed to do. She doesn't have to think, what if I sent this? What if I sent that?

[B]

And you've given him the. The tools to build the house.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Make a plan and I'm in. If he comes back with.

[A]

If he's interested at all, you'll know.

[B]

It'S a plan or nothing.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

It's, as you say, boyfriend or off. Plan or off.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

And that's the whole shoot my shot thing. And that's why, you know, again, that can feel good. Like, if he came back, there's redemption. If he came back and was like, oh, my God, I'm so happy you texted.

[A]

God, it's. It's 8:00am I haven't even woken up.

[B]

Yeah, I couldn't even get to this yet. Yeah. I'm so happy you texted. I've been thinking about the night for a minute. I got busy with work and Your number went down the phone and I kind of lost it a little bit. Hey, I'm gonna. I'm free Tuesday. There's a speakeasy near my place. I can make an 8 o' clock reservation. Would you be up for that? I am sure.

[A]

I feel good about that. Yeah.

[B]

Right. That now we've been redeemed and we will see what happens from there.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Just because you have doesn't mean they will.

[A]

Right. And here's the other thing again, and this is the more nuanced version, is if you send that text and then you get a bunch of text texts, not discussing a plan and asking about your day or. Or trying to shoot the shit or talking about something else. That's a no.

[B]

That's him buying time.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Big text with no plan is buying time for what?

[A]

A weekend text to hook up. Sure.

[B]

In a casual way.

[A]

Labor Day savings are happening right now at the Home Depot. So what are you working on?

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[A]

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[B]

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[B]

Let's play some games we love Red flag or Dealbreaker. It is the game that is sweeping the nation. If you don't know it already, you're dating someone, one thing happens. Is it a red flag? You see it and move on? Or is it a deal breaker? You end it completely. That's the game.

[A]

Let's do it.

[B]

J and J. I have a red flag or deal breaker. After debriefing my mother's latest hinge. First date. What a sentence. I love this. I love this show.

[A]

Show her the show.

[B]

I love that we can solve all these issues. She had been talking to this guy for a few weeks as he was traveling for work in New York. Normally, she makes an effort to avoid a prolonged text period predate to prevent the feigned familiarity that comes with that. But really hit it off with this guy and had a lot in common. So put her quote unquote rules aside. First date was all you could ask for. Easy conversation, lots in common, and excitement for a second date. But one thing she told me raised a potential red flag. So I'm bringing it to you guys. He separated from his wife. They are both dating. Other people have apparently even seen each other unhinged, but have no plans to ever get legally divorced, citing financial reasons. So red flag or deal breaker. You meet a perfect match, but he's legally married to another woman for the foreseeable future. Thanks for the break from the weirdness in the world. Signed, is my mom a mistress?

[A]

Okay.

[B]

I love this email.

[A]

Good question.

[B]

You know why it's a good question? Because it could be asked two different ways, the way she asked it at the end. Red flag of deal break. Red flag or deal breaker. You meet a perfect match, but he's legally married to another woman for the foreseeable future. That is not what this email is.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like, that is actually, like, that is.

[A]

How we get into context matters.

[B]

Context matters completely. Because that is as if you're dating. That makes it sound like she's going to be a sister wife.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Like, that's not what this is.

[A]

Right. Or he's, he's, he's married, he's with someone that he's.

[B]

Right. Yeah. My mom's just this guy on the side. Like, no.

[A]

Right.

[B]

This is kind of. This is the, the messiness of life.

[A]

I would say the answer to this question lies in what your mother is looking for. If your mom wants to get married again, this could be a deal breaker.

[B]

Right.

[A]

If that's not something she needs to have, then sure. Why is it, like, who cares?

[B]

I also think I'm with you. I don't think that conversation has to happen now. So many people at this stage of life, I'm imagining they're boomers. They're in their 60s or 70s, a lot of assets. Hopefully a lot. Well, that's the thing. Like, what is the financial situation? Are they, you know, some people are, you know, married, can't get divorced because they'd both be ruined.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Other people don't get divorced financially because there's just such an estate that it's like a complicated thing. I don't know. I don't know the situation financially.

[A]

Yeah, I mean, I think usually the impetus for a divorce is like the idea that you. Again, either someone wants something financially out of the arrangement that they're not getting, or someone would like to get remarried.

[B]

Right. So, so I do think that will happen for one of them maybe. Like, I don't think, I don't think this decision is like laid in stone is my point.

[A]

Right. But I think he, but it sounds like he laid it out like. Sure. Like it's laid in stone.

[B]

I just think you get to know.

[A]

Someone saying I saying we have no plans to get legally divorced doesn't mean I would never get legally divorced.

[B]

Right. I, I think to me this like late. That's why I like the age matters. Like you're in your 60s and 70s, whatever it may be, you want partnership, you want companionship, you're looking for someone to travel with and talk to. And over time you might realize that the person you like might not be able to do all those things because of the divorce or they're just being lazy to it and they'd both be worse off if they got the divorce and have no one to go to.

[A]

Right.

[B]

And then they find you, you guys get together, you have a great time, you connect and then they go, well, I'm going to have you. Plus I'll deal with whatever comes out of this divorce, you know, now we have to deal with it.

[A]

Right.

[B]

I just think like if this was in their 20s or 30s, it's different.

[A]

Than 60s and 70s, I could agree with that. I also think like, I agree no decision needs to be made immediately. She doesn't even know if she'd want to marry him. But I also think I would throughout the course of dating. And again there's those don't need to be immediate questions. I would have more questions about this arrangement. I would, of course, because I would be interested to know like what does entangle you guys financially? How does that look in your like day to day spending? How does that look in like, what does that actually, how, what does that look like in ways that might affect me if this got to a, a deeper point.

[B]

What was the line that Logan Yuri used? It was like, I don't want to be a nurse or a purse.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

There are these women that are in like older state stages of life where they would have to, to financially support or physically.

[A]

Right. They don't want to take care of them or financially take care of them.

[B]

Yeah. And I think all those questions should be asked but like red flag deal breaker scenario if you're like, do I let my mom go on this date? Yeah. I think like if she enjoyed their company. It's really hard to find someone at that age. You'll the, the will. They don't boil it down to this. Is she a mistress?

[A]

I agree. Like, again, unless your mom is, like, your mom's top goal is to get married as soon as possible, this might not be a match for, but I don't think it's, like, on its own. A red flag or deal breaker.

[B]

Right? I'm with you. Let's do another.

[A]

Okay. Hi, jj. Thank you for all that you do. And feather. Feather, longtime listener, first time emailer with a red flag or deal breaker for you.

[B]

Thank you.

[A]

I am millennial woman in New York City. Went back on the dating apps for the first time in a while. For the month of January. I had a successful date and wanted to get your thoughts. I matched with and went on a date with a local millennial male who.

[B]

I want that merch. Local millennial male in your area.

[A]

Air. Was it, like, onion has, like, area man.

[B]

Oh, is it?

[A]

They, like, refer to people just like area man. Like the guy in the area. Local millennial male who quickly messaged a lot about being barefoot, to the point where friends and sisters knew of him as foot guy, of course, but he was hot, so I was down to try most anything for a first date.

[B]

Anything you say.

[A]

Anything. After getting to the bar, we exchanged pleasantries, and he quickly brought up the foot conversation. When asked straight up if it was a foot fetish that was important to him, he definitely did not say yes, but he also did not exactly say no. He did.

[B]

Hey, how those feet doing? Do you have a profession? I don't know.

[A]

He did, however, see being barefoot as the ultimate sign of comfort and pretty quickly took his shoes and socks off under the table in the bar. And when in Rome. So did I.

[B]

He got you.

[A]

He got her.

[B]

He's got a live one.

[A]

One. Spending the day together, toes to the wind.

[B]

Good for her.

[A]

I mean, this is New York City.

[B]

This is in January.

[A]

This is.

[B]

So she got on the apps in January. She's taking her shoes off at the bar.

[A]

She's in Manhattan.

[B]

She's at the Spaniard.

[A]

Not even Brooklyn.

[B]

Yeah, this is not right. In Bushwick. Maybe.

[A]

Maybe. I mean, ultimately, it was a deal breaker when he was evasive on scheduling for several weeks after I asked him on a second date date. But red flag or deal breaker?

[B]

You.

[A]

For you both. He takes his shoes off on the first date and encourages you to do the same. Lots of love, laughs, and appreciation. A barefoot batch.

[B]

This is wild. This is like, he might have gotten everything he needed from this date.

[A]

Just got to see her toes, see your feet.

[B]

And he's like, I Got all I need. I got a good memory. Let me get a picture.

[A]

She gave away the goods for free.

[B]

My way, right?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Well, she made. I hope he paid for the drinks. I'll buy these drinks if you show me a pinky toe.

[A]

I could see it's. This almost feels more intimate than sex. He made her take off her shoes in a New York City establishment.

[B]

It's a lot, right? It is, like, just the idea. I just want to live a barefoot lifestyle. I'll take off mine. Let me kick off these shoes and really live. And you're like, what?

[A]

And he got her to do it.

[B]

I mean, I, I, I like her enthusiasm that she was like, I like, this is what he's doing. Whatever.

[A]

I mean, it depends what the bar was. If this is like the lobby bar at the Ritz, I'm.

[B]

I'll take it off. Yeah.

[A]

Oh, you would take it off.

[B]

Lobby bar at the Ritz.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Is it not nice?

[A]

It's, like, fancier.

[B]

Yeah. But at least, you know, the floor is clean.

[A]

Oh. To me, it's more like, oh, this is like, a nice establishment here. Yeah. I feel like you'd be more likely to take it off at, like, a dive bar.

[B]

Oh, wow. Dive bar. I'd be like, what disease will?

[A]

I'm like, maybe that's the vibe here. To me, it's like, it's a deal breaker because the. But not because I love a barefoot experience as much as the next.

[B]

I mean, imagine this guy on a plane.

[A]

Yeah. I'm saying, I, you know, I, I don't, I try not to judge, but this is like a social norm.

[B]

Right.

[A]

I wouldn't be able to take him anywhere.

[B]

These are the difficult things about, like, right in theory, wrong in practice.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Like, yeah, you. Who amongst us doesn't like to take off their shoes and put their feet in some grass or some sand?

[A]

Raw dog. It. Yeah.

[B]

Just really feel the earth. Earth.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Under their shoes.

[A]

That we live in great society. We're not animals.

[B]

Right. We're not animals. And it just feels like a, A kink.

[A]

Also, friends and sisters knew him as foot guy. I don't want to date foot guy. That's your thing.

[B]

I mean, here's the thing. If he was just like she said.

[A]

He messaged a lot very quickly about being barefoot.

[B]

Right. This is his whole gag.

[A]

Yeah. I get a new trick.

[B]

I have no problem if someone has a foot fetish.

[A]

Sure.

[B]

Like, but it seems as though he has a foot fetish, that he's just trying to collect a lot of feet.

[A]

She's just another toe to him.

[B]

Right. How about you take off those sandals and let me see your heel?

[A]

Just the tip? Just the tip.

[B]

Yeah. This is. Would you. What?

[A]

If a woman did this, would you be into it?

[B]

Here's the problem.

[A]

You would, wouldn't you?

[B]

I would be into it.

[A]

You would?

[B]

Yeah. I, I actually. Just the idea that they're so. If a woman was just so enamored by me, like, I. I do want to be, you know, used for my looks.

[A]

You do?

[B]

Once in my life, you want to.

[A]

Be taken advantage of.

[B]

I want to be taken. I want to be objectified. I want to just be used for my. My toes and my heel and my arm.

[A]

Would you marry that woman?

[B]

I don't know. Maybe. We get maybe. But, like, it does feel good to, like, be someone's foot thing.

[A]

Literally, someone's foot.

[B]

You've always been talking about this.

[A]

It's been your phrase. Yeah, yeah. You would literally be someone's foot.

[B]

I would literally be someone's foot. And there's something. I. I get it. There's probably people out there who, like, are someone's thing and they don't like that. They have to decipher between arm. Am I just a thing to you versus am I a real person that you would date and take seriously? I don't know. I. I kind of like, you know.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

I'd be like, this is something you need. You know, I'm happy. I can do it for you.

[A]

Not that many people have a hand fetish. You hear a lot about foot fetishes. I never hear anything about a hand fetish.

[B]

No, you don't.

[A]

I wonder why that is.

[B]

Because the foot.

[A]

The feet are more covered, more discreet.

[B]

It's one of those things.

[A]

More taboo.

[B]

I. I don't know. Maybe you don't see it unless you get to see it. I mean, he got her shoes off. That. That's controlling.

[A]

Why is that the only body part that you ever hear about?

[B]

There's got to be someone.

[A]

Like an elbow armpit fetish.

[B]

There's. I think there's a fetish for everything, to be honest. Considering.

[A]

Right. Maybe it's just a.

[B]

More hyperlinks on site.

[A]

Fairly common one, though. I feel like you hear a lot.

[B]

About it to me of the fetishes. Feet is pretty much like, like, don't you think that's got to be great to be. Have that.

[A]

To have that as a fetish?

[B]

Right. You just like. It's pretty. It's. It's seemingly a little bit innocent, even though it's a little weird. It is a foot. I don't know. It's not for me. I, I, I also you, I said this before and some people have disagreed with me, but like, you don't meet a lot of women with foot fetishes. Men seem to be out there with it.

[A]

Right. I think they're more likely to fetishize things generally.

[B]

Right. That's fair.

[A]

Might be that.

[B]

Yeah. Let's do one more Red flag or deal breaker. We got one more to go. Keep sending yours in uupetjust.com J&J Feathers for days. I have a very 2025 red flag or deal breaker for you. I matched with a guy on Hinge and after some light banter, I gave him my number. He texted me and we made a plan to meet Thursday. The next day he sends a message sharing that in full transparency. He used a bot to talk on Hinge. He works in tech and has been testing it out. He followed with but it will all be me from here on. I'll explain. Saturday, it was a deal breaker for me, but I already been on the fence about the proposed 9pm date on a weeknight, so. Red flagger. Deal breaker. He flirts via a bot signed. A real life listener.

[A]

I would not be that offended by this. The way he, the way he pulled it.

[B]

Well, why do you say I'll explain on Saturday if they have the date on Thursday?

[A]

Oh yeah, good point. Maybe that wasn't chat.

[B]

He really messed up on that one.

[A]

Right. Maybe he should have said Thursday.

[B]

You wouldn't feel lied to.

[A]

He told me.

[B]

But he all just told you that the whole conversation you had was a lie?

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Wouldn't you have to start? It would depend you when we get to the date. To me, this is fraudulent.

[A]

I think it would depend on what? Like how basic the conversation was. Do you know what I mean? Like, how much I was going on the date based on the conversation versus based on the other stuff that I saw.

[B]

That's fair if it's like two fun lines that turned into I'll see you Saturday.

[A]

Right.

[B]

Fine.

[A]

I mean, you used to, when we started this podcast, you used to do stuff for Bumblebee where you would kind of like make fun of everyone who was messaging you on Bumble.

[B]

My, my, my sorted past.

[A]

Sorry, I had to. Yeah, had to bring up your sorted past.

[B]

Right. So what the premise was because women had to say hi to the guy first. I thought it was funny that they'd be like, hey, how was your weekend? And I would go into like a 10 paragraph soliloquy about how horrible my dating life was. And then I go, what's up with you? And it was like it ended up. I ended up getting hired by Hinge to do it put for them. Like fake ones.

[A]

Right.

[B]

That they would put out on their Instagram.

[A]

So did you ever get, did you ever actually go on a date from any of those bumble.

[B]

A couple times.

[A]

Well, so you kind of like done what this guy is doing.

[B]

At least it was my sense of humor. It wasn't. You know, but you're doing.

[A]

You're kind of like with them for work.

[B]

Sure. At the time it wasn't.

[A]

It turned into a real date.

[B]

Yeah. I used to post them on Instagram. I would take out there, take out their information.

[A]

I'm just saying as someone.

[B]

Yeah. It got me kicked off a bumblebee.

[A]

Okay. Making yourself sound more and more normal.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

But you went out with one of these women, right? So like, I mean did they think that was your actual personality or did you eventually say like I I doing.

[B]

No, I'm a comedian. It would go from like the sad guy joke to like having a conversation.

[A]

Right.

[B]

A lot of times I would unmatch and just be done with it. Like. But then people started to know about it. They're like, oh, I follow you. Like, you know, they knew about the joke. Some people would play along, they'd write back their sad weekend and it was fun. I do I. At least that was my personality.

[A]

It wasn't this guy's is his personality. He's a tech nerd. I guess so he's using tech to speak to you. That's his. That's based on who he is.

[B]

That's what his Rosie the Robot.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

And the Jetsons answering also, he can't.

[A]

See me until nine on a weeknight. This guy probably makes a lot of money.

[B]

He's killing it. It's that tech money.

[A]

I think I would be like, I wouldn't again. Unless I was like this conversation was like the best conversation I ever had and now it's all a lie. Like he told me pretty quick. Tell me before the date. Gave me a chance to go out.

[B]

I guess that's my big issue. He tells you before the date and then goes, I'll see you Saturday. Like, like as if you're locked into this with this. Like, like I would want.

[A]

Okay, well I understand if you're trying.

[B]

Are you really from Duth? You know, like I, I would want to know more about them if. Was it all honest from the from the.

[A]

If you use the bot, how interesting could the conversation have even been? Right.

[B]

Well, how interesting could he be if he needs the robot to speak for him?

[A]

Well, maybe he's like. That's what I'm saying. Maybe he's, like, a little nerdy, but maybe that would be okay to me. A little socially awkward.

[B]

I need to know that we can socially keep up to go on the date. And I would have to go.

[A]

You thought it was. You were socially keeping up enough to go on the day and you were speaking to a robot.

[B]

I guess I can talk to anybody. I'm sitting there talking to the microwave.

[A]

Yeah. I think if all else was great. And that's kind of the game. Right. All else is great. Like. Like the picks. Like the profile.

[B]

Right. That's fair. The picks.

[A]

I didn't even think the conversation was, like, fine. It wasn't like, again, a huge part of why I went on. It wasn't like, a big part of it.

[B]

They checked a lot of boxes. Are you. Yeah, I guess if the first date.

[A]

Yeah. If he. And he told me before even the first date. It's not like he waited until later.

[B]

And, you know this. The correct school, the correct job, the correct age. Like that the only lie is them at doing a pun.

[A]

Right. Or using something to finesse their writing or whatever.

[B]

Changed my mind because I didn't think of, like, I'm already attracted to them. Yeah. It's a red flag for me.

[A]

That's fair. I have. I have one more red flag or deal breaker for you, please. That I was thinking about this morning.

[B]

Oh, is this a surprise?

[A]

Well, not really a surprise, but I was thinking about it.

[B]

If you pull out your hand and then give me the finger.

[A]

Pulling out a cheese grater. No. Okay. So I have these hair things I was gonna rip.

[B]

Like a deal breaker.

[A]

Thank you. Do you ever. Okay. I have so many of these. This isn't even the one I was looking.

[B]

Hair ties.

[A]

Yeah, it's a hair tie, but you've ever seen the hair tie with, like, a lot of hair on it? From the hair?

[B]

Yes. Disgusting.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

Yeah.

[A]

A woman showed up to it. And sometimes I'm like, if I'm home, if I like half my hair in a bunch of. And I'll take one off and it has, like, a lot of hair on it.

[B]

Yes.

[A]

And then I was thinking, like, this is pretty disgusting. And sometimes I just, like, wear it around and I, like, don't even think about it. So then I thought, like, if you. That'd be a good question. For you, if you were on a date with a woman, everything else is great, but you see her hair and these don't have it, but I have one in my pocket that has it.

[B]

Okay, let's see it. You really don't feel that until you're, like, in the relationship? Like, that wouldn't be something I would.

[A]

Like to like on a date. Would you notice.

[B]

I don't even notice a woman having a wedding ring on. Never mind.

[A]

All right, so this is. This is it.

[B]

That's brutal. I don't know.

[A]

I've had worse ones.

[B]

That is like. You couldn't get that off. That is like a rat's nest on the.

[A]

I mean, please don't insult my naturally curly Jewish hair. But, yeah, that's.

[B]

I was thinking from here. I don't know if I would.

[A]

I'm on a date. Like, let's say we're on a date, right? Everything's going well. Conversation. I have my. I have my. My. My sleeves now. I take off. I'm hot. It's getting hot. I take off my sweater. I have this on my arm.

[B]

I'm gonna be perfectly honest. You. I. I wouldn't notice. It is grossing me out.

[A]

Right now.

[B]

Currently being grossed out.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

But it is. I do think men on a date are like, bees.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

Like, we only see the shape of. You do. Like, we don't really know what we look like. Ass. Titty face.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

And we're not like, oh, my God, that thing on the arm, you know? So I. I don't think it would be a deal breaker. I don't think I would notice it.

[A]

Okay.

[B]

The only time I would notice a hair tie with, like, a lot of hair, it would be, like, if it's on the sink corner and like, sitting there, it really. I'm. My dad is like this too. He's like, look at that woman. I'm like, that's a bush. Like, he doesn't even know what he's seeing, you know? So. And I kind of see that in me. So. No, that wouldn't. I'm looking at it. It is a lot of hair on that.

[A]

Disgusting, right? It's. Yeah.

[B]

Not becoming.

[A]

It's not becoming. When I see it and I notice it, I'm like, I should throw this out. But sometimes if I can't find another one, it'll be on my arm.

[B]

That's what it is.

[A]

Kate knows. And sometimes.

[B]

And you'll use it.

[A]

And I was just thinking, like, this is pretty disgusting, but I don't really think about it.

[B]

But I guess if I saw them go from the arm to their hair hair, I'd be like, they're gonna use it.

[A]

I mean, it's your hair.

[B]

I know, but, you know, like putting. If I pick my nose, it's my booger. But I can't lie to you. I'm not gonna lie because it wouldn't gross me out. It wouldn't. It wouldn't.

[A]

You would not go on another date.

[B]

Absolutely. No. Everything's perfect. The premise. Everything's perfect.

[A]

Yes.

[B]

Again, I can't even see myself noticing it until it was pointed out to me. Now I'm noticing it even more. It is like, now I'm really. It's a real. Yeah. You've really.

[A]

Yeah.

[B]

It looks like pubic hair. Hair.

[A]

That's my hair.

[B]

Yeah, well, that's what your hair. That's not your hair. What do you mean?

[A]

That's. That's.

[B]

No, but I'm saying it's. When it's rolling, my hair looks like.

[A]

Now on my head. But.

[B]

But it wouldn't look like that even on your head. I'm saying this is a. I mean.

[A]

The hair in the shower on the wall of the shower doesn't look like.

[B]

Right. That's not your hair anymore. That's shower hair that grows to someone else.

[A]

Well, you probably need to disassociate the two of them so that you can still be with the person that you see.

[B]

The shower hair of the shower hair.

[A]

It's not your hair.

[B]

Right. Yeah. I need that to be that hair.

[A]

Yeah. All right, well, I'm gonna throw this out now that I know.

[B]

Yeah, I think it's time.

[A]

It's pretty, pretty gross.

[B]

Solve dating again.

[A]

We did it. We'll be back on Sunday.

[B]

Boom.

[A]

Bye. Kate McAuliffe is our senior producer. Our editor is Emily Free. Candice Miniga is our senior social producer. Our associate producer is Will Maxwell. Additional production help from Shannon Jimenez Sason. Be to sure to follow us at U up podcast and send us your emails to uupetches.com packages by Expedia.

[B]

You were made to occasionally take the hard route to the top of the Eiffel Tower. We were made to easily bundle your trip Expedia made to travel flight inclusive packages are atoll protected.